[SixPistons]

Hello everyone. This is my first post here I believe that I am facing a unique set of options to choose from and would like some expert advice.

Note: This will be a long thread!

TLDR Version: I am stuck between buying a beater car - Grand i10; slightly larger version - Elite i20; or going with the Venue SX 1.0 Turbo SX(120hp; fully feature loaded; Really liked the drive) as a second car at home. Original Budget: 4-5L. Will need to take a loan for Venue if I decide to go for it. Only considering used car options and Manual variants. Currently only these cars seem to have made it to the final three.

Background: So April last year I moved to Delhi with family from Bangalore. Courtesy the flexible work culture, I need to work from office only 2/3 days a week. The drive is about 45 kms one side. Mix of City and Highway drive. 1 hour in the morning and 1.25-2 hours in the evening. I take our family car to office as my father travels via Metro (our home and his office each are at a walking distance to a metro station). Other folks in the house who use a car: Mostly my mum uses it, then my dad and finally my brother when he is visiting(he’s in college). With going to office for almost half the week and occasional weekend drive/outing becoming a scheduling problem with the car the case for second car has slowly been made, something I was not planning to do until 2024.

This would be our second car in the family in addition to our existing Baleno Zeta 2016 Manual 1.2 NA which has been doing the job well so far. Since I did not originally plan to buy a car anytime now, I am stuck between buying a basic hatch about 4-6 years old with a plan to buy something new in another 4/6 years or something I would be more interested in for the longer term.

Since I am in Delhi, Only considering petrol vehicles.(Diesel gets only 10 years and manufacturers are slowly stopping diesel engines. The price advantage that used to exist earlier does not exist in Diesel anymore as petrol and diesel prices are not too different now) I am a frugal driver when it comes to a the work commute so not very keen on Diesel anyway. My work commute mileage typically stays in the vicinity of 15.

Broad market analysis suggests I could get a used(only considering Hyundais as I have always found them the most appealing):

1. Grand i10 sportz manual 4-6 years old in around 4.5-5.3L tops in good condition(upto ~30k driven)
2. i20 elite sportz manual 4-5 years old in around 5.5L-6.25L tops in good condition (upto ~30k driven)
3. Venue 1.0 SX Turbo Manual 2019-2021 model in around 8.7L to 9.5L tops in good condition (upto ~30k driven)

Grand i10 falls under Beater Segment. Basic, ok-ish space, will be fine to own for a short period of time, until I can plan better finances in future. Drive experience is quite good for a small hatch. I have driven this in the city and on the highway before at moderate speeds. What works out the most in its favour is that I would not have to take out a loan for it and I prefer not to own a car on EMIs. Also worth mentioning is that folks at home feel grand i10 is slightly cramped on space and looks are not all that great. I find looks to be good though, small and sporty enough to not look boring.

Elite i20 is not exactly a beater. It is an enlarged version of the grand i10 I feel. Definitely premium interior and an overall good driving experience. But since the power figures are similar (if not same) as grand i10 options I currently find, the ride does feel a little underpowered towards the higher gears and while going beyond 60/70 on the highway side. What works out in favour is the better looks, bit larger boot and roomier cabin in the back. It does get a good suspension overall I feel so the ride quality and stability over time as the car ages would still be good overall I expect. What does not work out in i20’s favour is that I feel it feels pricy to get an i20 in around 5.5L-6L bracket and that it has a poor mileage figures(I have seen real world city drive return upto 14 kmpl on the forum itself) Also, this would be a stretch on the budget but at least I would not have to take out a loan for it.

Enter the Venue 2020 Turbo 1.0 SX Manual. I test drove one of these options and it has everything I would need for the next 8-10 years I think. The cabin is good, single tone Black. Has a Small Sun Roof, cruise control, climate control, the Hyundai NAV System, large boot, good drive height, 120Hp Turbocharged mill which felt super awesome to drive after the habit of driving the Baleno that I usually drive. Except the multi dial-like instrument cluster and the smaller rear seats, the overall experience felt very good. Other people are quite satisfied with the package overall but still on the edge considering that its almost 9L for an engine already driven for 30K kms over 3 years. I tend to understand their apprehensions as well. I just felt that the engine has a lot of life in it apart from the 30k it has already seen and feel it should not be a major problem as modern engines are built to last 1L+ easily if cared for.
Problem with Venue is that I will have to take an almost 4L loan and plan to carry it on for only 2 years. That’s approx 20k in EMI as used car loan seems to come at a minimum of 13 percent interest rate.(I saw a post where someone got it at much lower but I can’t seem to find it again)

I have considered some other options:
1. Honda Jazz(not finding very good options and has been discontinued entirely; also, Honda is not very keen on selling OEM parts outside their service center is what I have read and heard repeatedly over the years)
2. Tatas (new Punch: not very good feel and fit and finish, service is usually a problem with Tata still. An area that needs improvement)
3. Honda Amaze/Suzuki DZire/Hyundai Aura/Tata Tigor: Don’t like compact Sedans
4. Tata Nexon: Is a Tank, very safe. Could not find a good deal and new editions are the ones that actually look nice. However Tata after sales is still not there.
5. Maruti Brezza: Old Brezza design got a bit boring. Also, have seen enough Marutis around in the family that I need a change from that design language.
6. Mahindra XUV300: Not approved as low boot space and slightly awkward looking cluster to others. Low Boot Space. Still, I would consider it if I found a good deal for a nearly loaded variant.
Some others were also considered but consensus could not be reached.

The question I am wondering for some time now is whether I should just stick to my original budget of 4-5L and try to get a good deal on the grand i10 itself and use it for 4-6 years/stretch my wallet a bit for an elite i20 and it for next 6-7 years(no disrespect, i expect I will feel the need for creature comforts missing in elite i20 in a few years)/follow my heart and get the Venue but with the loan with the intention of relishing it for next 8-10 years but with a hole in my pocket right now.

Thankyou for your patience.

[JohnDoe]

Stick to your budget and get an i10 grand.

Or else get a new or preowned Alto K10 or Alto 800.

Increasing your budget to buy a premium mass market car on loan when you can purchase an entry level car in cash seems like a financial blunder.

The creature comforts you seek now in Venue are soon going to be obsolete also the 20k EMI @13% will hinder your financial growth for the next 2 years.

[07CR]

Stick to the budget and get a grand i10. Since it's a beater car, it need not be too expensive, when especially you will be taking a loan.
Elite i20 is too underpowered, and grand i10 with same petrol engine, but lesser weight should be manageable. Avoid the venue, IMO there are way better options in CSUV segment.

[shancz]

Some points from my end :
- Elite i20 isn't a beater considering its positioning and the general maintenance costs of an old Hyundai.

- Getting a 30k driven Venue at close to 10 lakhs doesn't make sense, rather get a new one later on if you liked it so much.
Also the long term maintenance of TGDi engines could add some extra costs to maintenance but I don't have enough info on it.

My suggestion, out of your options :
- Stick with the i10 as a beater.
- If requirements of rear space are a deal breaker then why not move your 6+ years old Baleno to that role and start a new hatch/sedan/CSUV/SUV hunt separately ?
- If you're looking for a new city car then why not consider an EV like the eC3, Nexon/Tiago or even the hybrids like the City/HyRyder ?

[rishil.ghurki]

If you're looking for a genuine beater car, look no further from the Grand i10. The Sportz variant is quite decently packed with features for the segment.

i20 is definitely a no as for one, it will feel just like your Baleno and two, maintenance is not cheap and three, not the best FE figures.

I am a little confused with the Venue being in your beater car options. I understand that you've mentioned that this would be your long-term option and I don't suggest much about finance management as I feel it is a personal decision. But, if you like the Venue and need to take a loan for it anyway, why not buy a new one later on, when you're comfortable with the spend (as BHPian shancz mentioned).

Hope this helps!

[MotorDev]

A used 4th gen city will fit your requirement. It has a very good engine with good safety and awsome reliablity. Space is very good and the interior and boot space are good as well. I would recommend you to get the honda city, there are ton's of options available and come on, you know that one cannont go wrong with a Honda city.

[Cresterk]

Buy something good and use your current baleno as a beater. if you are getting the i20, you could get the much better diesel variant for that price. I have been using a 2016 i20 CRDI top model for the past 7 years and I can tell you straight up that this car is absolutely not suited to be a beater. It has a lot of complicated electronics, normal service costs are always around 10k+ at hyundai dealerships and they will always push you to replace things instead of repairing. You will need a good third party workshop if you intend to keep it for long. Even something as simple as a wheel alignment from outside will require you to go to hyundai and get the electronic power steering angle sensors reset via their tool. Thankfully, it's still a hoot to drive and it hasn't left me stranded on the road yet so I plan on keeping it.

Just get a used previous gen swift. Maruti is the king of beater cars in India. Cheap to buy, cheap to own, cheap to repair. If you want a cheap hyundai, stick to the i10.

[buzzy_boy]

Stick to your original budget, but buy a used Wagon R.

Reasons:

1. Used car, and no loan = Buying your first new car makes no sense in the current market due to frequently changing legislation, and interest rates.
2. Maruti = Hyundais tend to develop niggles > 5 years. Marutis tend to last longer.
3. Wagon R = it will will have a better resale value 5 years down the line.
4. Not something bigger = you may need to re-evaluate your needs 5 years down.

[TSI_Exhaust]

Hey SixPistons!

The Grand i10 you mentioned is actually already a pretty good option.

A gentleman above pointed out getting a used Honda City (4th Gen). That is an excellent recommendation! Especially compared to the creature comforts of the Venue that you are also targeting. Having owned one (Venue), I can assure you that the excitement will quickly and surely fizz away. The engine won't feel exciting after a while, the lower end lag is quite prominent. The Honda City will also be worth the EMI that you will pay, whatever that amount may be. Being a Honda, it will not be hard on the pocket and will be cheap to maintain. The City is a sorted product. All in all you be getting a better car engine wise & dimensions wise. Overall a better package than the Venue.

It isn't a beater car exactly but if you are okay with shelling out the mount of money that you would for a Venue, the City would actually be a better deal for the long run.

[Sagarjagga]

You can get new Ignis Sigma for around 5.5 - 6 lakhs. It would be much better than headache of a pre owned car. And it's the perfect city beater.

[SixPistons]

Ahh so many responses and I could not keep pace. Work and some engagements at home kept me away from finding adequate time to respond. Thankful to all your responses and I will share my thoughts to each post one by one.
In the interest of brevity, I will try to avoid re-iterating a point if already covered earlier.

I eventually ended up booking a Turbo DCT from Hyundai(read on to find more )

--

Originally Posted by JohnDoe

Stick to your budget and get an i10 grand.

Or else get a new or preowned Alto K10 or Alto 800.

Increasing your budget to buy a premium mass market car on loan when you can purchase an entry level car in cash seems like a financial blunder.

The creature comforts you seek now in Venue are soon going to be obsolete also the 20k EMI @13% will hinder your financial growth for the next 2 years.

Agree that buying a pre-used car on a loan is a bad idea unless I am getting a good deal: Between 8k-10k kms per year, well maintained, company service record, good depreciation etc.

I looked hard for a decent Grand i10 of 2019 or newer make. i20 was a close second consideration. Reading most of the responses, I decided against a Venue for many good reasons. While our Baleno drives well even after 50k, a second Maruti is out of the question as overall ownership experience leaves a lot to be desired. Therefore, anything from Maruti's stable was out of the question.

Originally Posted by 07CR

Stick to the budget and get a grand i10. Since it's a beater car, it need not be too expensive, when especially you will be taking a loan.
Elite i20 is too underpowered, and grand i10 with same petrol engine, but lesser weight should be manageable. Avoid the venue, IMO there are way better options in CSUV segment.

Agreed. However, I could not find a good deal on a used Grand i10. I checked out few Elite i20 as I was not finding too many good options in Grand i10.
It was always the depreciation vs age/odometer reading that was way off.

Originally Posted by shancz

Some points from my end :
- Elite i20 isn't a beater considering its positioning and the general maintenance costs of an old Hyundai.

Yes, it was considered as more of a compromise. It was more agreeable to everyone at home (+1).

Originally Posted by shancz

- Getting a 30k driven Venue at close to 10 lakhs doesn't make sense, rather get a new one later on if you liked it so much.
Also the long term maintenance of TGDi engines could add some extra costs to maintenance but I don't have enough info on it.

Yes, took me a while to realise that isn't a valuable bargain, until the excitement of that engine tapered off. As I checked the new car price from that time, I realised I was not even getting a nominally depreciated car.
I feel that TGDi engines should be fine over long term, especially given that Mahindra already offers one and Tata is also moving towards TGDi as a replacement for RevoTron. That said, while I am willing to take a risk there, extended warranty is a must for a TGDi vehicle.

Originally Posted by shancz

- If requirements of rear space are a deal breaker then why not move your 6+ years old Baleno to that role and start a new hatch/sedan/CSUV/SUV hunt separately ?

As it happens, this has been the way of things. After multiple test drives of i20 NA Manual, i20 NA Automatic, i20 Turbo 1.0 DCT and Nexon Petrol, I have booked the i20 NLine N8 DCT (I have read about risks associated with the DCT). The Baleno will graduate to a Luxury Beater now with i20 as the more pampered ride for secondary usage.

Nexon came to be a close second. It offered probably the best ride handling and confidence to me while driving as well as in the cabin in general. A very satisfying cabin indeed The lack of refinement in the engine, the vibrations and hard gear shifts, however, were enough to tire me out. And then there is the infamous after sales service from TATA Dealerships. Otherwise, it would have been the Nexon.

Other notable considerations were XUV300(A bit too pricy), Punch(or the lack thereof), Altroz(I and father felt disconnected with the Cabin), Sonet(Another Venue, so no), Kushaq(Bit too pricy; Can only afford base variant and I will probably end up spending way too much to bring it up to speed)

Originally Posted by shancz

- If you're looking for a new city car then why not consider an EV like the eC3, Nexon/Tiago or even the hybrids like the City/HyRyder?

Somehow not convinced on EVs so far. I suspect the technology has a lot to evolve still. I will buy an EV when I can:
1. Charge it from 0% to 100% in about 30 minutes.
2. Travel from Delhi to Amritsar on a full charge and still have little bit left. So somewhere around a range of 600+ kms on a single charge.
I believe we will get there in a 2-5 years and another few years for wide adoption.

I do not find HyRyder/Grand Vitara/Brezza etc to be very appealing. Also, HyRyder and Grand Vitara only differ in clothing. Also, new city feels like its too long and I believe the Hybrid variant will be too big of a stretch on my budget.

[shancz]

Originally Posted by SixPistons

- I feel that TGDi engines should be fine over long term
- I have booked the i20 NLine N8 DCT (I have read about risks associated with the DCT).
- Nexon came to be a close second.
- Somehow not convinced on EVs so far. I suspect the technology has a lot to evolve still.

- Yes my point was just on a direct comparison with NA petrols. But its the flavour of the town now.
- Congratulations, you chose well, have fun
- Nexon needs that DCA at the earliest.
- That's true hence it's still a strict no for a single car garage.

Have fun with your N-Line

[SixPistons]

Originally Posted by rishil.ghurki

If you're looking for a genuine beater car, look no further from the Grand i10. The Sportz variant is quite decently packed with features for the segment.

Yes, I was searching for a well maintained Sportz Variant from about 3-5 years back.

Originally Posted by rishil.ghurki

i20 is definitely a no as for one, it will feel just like your Baleno and two, maintenance is not cheap and three, not the best FE figures.

Yes, FE is not the best on i20s.

Originally Posted by rishil.ghurki

I am a little confused with the Venue being in your beater car options. I understand that you've mentioned that this would be your long-term option and I don't suggest much about finance management as I feel it is a personal decision. But, if you like the Venue and need to take a loan for it anyway, why not buy a new one later on, when you're comfortable with the spend (as BHPian shancz mentioned).
Hope this helps!

I know what you're thinking. This was a wild card entry. And it would also mean Baleno became the new beater. But I was lucky enough to ask here before applying for a loan to understand it was not a good value prop. The new one, I feel is too highly priced. Did consider the new turbo. But then again that was only available in Automatic now and that meant a heavier price tag but less features.

I would end up spending a lot of money to customise things around. So I ended up booking i20 N-Line DCT as the test drive (about 15-ish kms between me and my brother) was amazing.

After reading many accounts of Dry Dual Clutch Transmission related problems and the common issues that can crop up as we drive more and more, I have made peace with it. We have decided we just need to adapt to the right way to talk with a DCT.

As BHPian GTO said in a post I can't find now, 'I would rather have a car that I am happy driving, with with a risk of a problem every 5 years, than sit behind a wheel that bores me for 10 years.'

Originally Posted by MotorDev

A used 4th gen city will fit your requirement. It has a very good engine with good safety and awsome reliablity. Space is very good and the interior and boot space are good as well. I would recommend you to get the honda city, there are ton's of options available and come on, you know that one cannont go wrong with a Honda city.

I mean it is a City so it comes with the obvious benefits. I really liked the third Gen City so I was looking for a little while but again did not find very convincing options. The options I saw felt like they were abused by their previous owners so that did not work out. I did try a 4th gen Honda City. Although I have always liked, I felt that it was quite a looong car to drive and a bit hard to manoeuver in spaces I usually am. I think I have become more used to sub-4m cars.

Originally Posted by Cresterk

Buy something good and use your current baleno as a beater. if you are getting the i20, you could get the much better diesel variant for that price. I have been using a 2016 i20 CRDI top model for the past 7 years and I can tell you straight up that this car is absolutely not suited to be a beater. It has a lot of complicated electronics, normal service costs are always around 10k+ at hyundai dealerships and they will always push you to replace things instead of repairing. You will need a good third party workshop if you intend to keep it for long. Even something as simple as a wheel alignment from outside will require you to go to hyundai and get the electronic power steering angle sensors reset via their tool. Thankfully, it's still a hoot to drive and it hasn't left me stranded on the road yet so I plan on keeping it.

Just get a used previous gen swift. Maruti is the king of beater cars in India. Cheap to buy, cheap to own, cheap to repair. If you want a cheap Hyundai, stick to the i10.

So I have mentioned the tussle between i10 and i20. However, my cousin drives an i20 petrol, 2016 manual and found it to be a fuss-free car. What's worth noting is he does not drive it daily but after 7 years(he got it pre-used at 15k on the odo in 2020) he hasn't had any niggles with the car except the tires which I believe he got changed last year some time. What's also worth noting is we had the first-gen Santro for about 10 years and it barely gave us any hiccups except the the infamous A/C problems with first-gen Santro. We had it for almost 1.5L+ kms on the ODO. That said, many dealerships are notorious for pushing needless Value Added Services. (Also common in case of our Baleno) However, since I have decided to go with i20 N-Line N8 DCT, I have decided to make peace with whatever happens now.

On the Swift: We had the first generation Swift (2009-2016) in its diesel guise. I learnt driving on that car(read: haath ki safaai). Absolute beast. No non-sense car. Super stable at even 140 kmph. In fact, ride dynamics were quite sorted. We had to let go of it in 2016 due to the restriction of Diesel Cars' age to 10 years in Delhi around 2016/2017 so I couldn't have it for myself later on. I wouldn't have let that go if I had the chance.

Cut to today: When occasionally I am behind the wheel of my aunts' DZire 2020 and Swift 2015 (both petrol), I fail to find the connect with either of them. Good cars nevertheless. While most people find the Beige in DZire very nice, I found it to be very bland. On the other hand, everything about the black interiors from 2015 Swift reminded me of my first love , although I liked the original swift's interiors better. So, Swift was specifically out of question (sorry no offense Marutis are good beaters and the Baleno is also close to becoming one.)

[SixPistons]

Originally Posted by buzzy_boy

Stick to your original budget, but buy a used Wagon R.

Reasons:

1. Used car, and no loan = Buying your first new car makes no sense in the current market due to frequently changing legislation, and interest rates.
2. Maruti = Hyundais tend to develop niggles > 5 years. Marutis tend to last longer.
3. Wagon R = it will will have a better resale value 5 years down the line.
4. Not something bigger = you may need to re-evaluate your needs 5 years down.

Agree on all 4 points. However, in case of point 2, I think anything except a Honda/Toyota tends to develop niggles >5 years. It kind of depends on luck, driving style and road quality on how long after 5 years they develop them.

From a purely financial perspective, it makes perfect sense. In fact it has a better Value proposition than the Alto in my opinion. The WagonR also comes with a practical boot and good driving visibiity. But then again, I was specifically looking outside of Maruti.

Actually, since you mentioned WagonR which is a tall boy kind of car, if I had to buy a Maruti, it would've been a Brezza without a doubt. Old, used vs New would've been the question. The old Brezza is quite a sensible car overall and also the one with somewhat sensible ride dynamics. On the other hand, the new one has (ahem, ahem!) Paddle Shifters. B

Originally Posted by TSI_Exhaust

Hey SixPistons!

The Grand i10 you mentioned is actually already a pretty good option.

A gentleman above pointed out getting a used Honda City (4th Gen). That is an excellent recommendation! Especially compared to the creature comforts of the Venue that you are also targeting. Having owned one (Venue), I can assure you that the excitement will quickly and surely fizz away. The engine won't feel exciting after a while, the lower end lag is quite prominent. The Honda City will also be worth the EMI that you will pay, whatever that amount may be. Being a Honda, it will not be hard on the pocket and will be cheap to maintain. The City is a sorted product. All in all you be getting a better car engine wise & dimensions wise. Overall a better package than the Venue.

It isn't a beater car exactly but if you are okay with shelling out the mount of money that you would for a Venue, the City would actually be a better deal for the long run.

Yes, Grand i10 would've been quite a sensible option. I have addressed the reasons I did not go for the City and your point about creature comforts in the Venue reaffirmed my choice of not going for a Venue. Some design issues do present themselves in a venue in the form of a misfitting MID/Instrument Cluster, Climate Control cluster and a little out of picture design. Somethings remain to be desired.

However, I am opting for the 1.0 Turbo engine with i20 NLine N8 DCT. I did not find the lag to be prominent according to my driving style. Besides, I believe anything below 2k rpms means 2nd/3rd gears for most medium traffic conditions. In that sense, I did not feel it to be a problem. In a way, the turbocharger would deliver that extra kick a bit later when there was room on the road to utilise it. Summing it up, I felt the lag was fine and something I didn't mind, as long as the engine had more power to deliver, although at slightly higher RPMs. Besides, the Turbo + DCT combination in i20 is in very good sync. First 2 minutes in the drivers' seat and I knew I was buying it.

On the finances, I have decided to take a plunge for a longer time period. My initial plan for to get something for anything between 3-6 years but now I am making a decision for a longer time period. Since between booking and delivery, its going to be 2-3 months' time, it makes things smooth as I will make a larger down-payment (50%-60%; I am trying to keep an EMI within 15-16k for 3 years) and get a smaller loan, something to the tune of my initial budget. Financially, it will pinch a bit for now, but given a longer time frame I want to get something I will like using over the next decade.

Originally Posted by Sagarjagga

You can get new Ignis Sigma for around 5.5 - 6 lakhs. It would be much better than headache of a pre owned car. And it's the perfect city beater.

Its a nice looker. The faux-SUV like style and yet a 80-something HP engine is a bit of a downer though. At that price point, I would also need to spend quite a lot on the after-market. Besides, although it sells through NEXA, it is still a Maruti, which means the usual Maruti niggles down the line.

Therefore, my decision of getting the N Line N8 DCT.

[SixPistons]

I will post any updates on the booking and delivery process soon.

The used automobile scene here in Delhi is quite something. Inflated and Overrated, due for a cooldown. Possibly soon, as the Semiconductor availability and supply chains improve.

So far I do not remember coming across a data-backed discussion on the used-car scene in India here on the forum so far. If there is one, please point me in the right direction.

In the absence of such a discussion, I would love to make a thread covering data-backed insights about the used car market. Me being a Data Scientist, I want to put my skills to good use. Ideally, this thread would also serve as a 30,000 ft view of the market in India in 2023.So if there are some questions for which anyone would like data-backed answers or explanations, or a hypothesis you would like to test, please feel free to share. I will try to present whatever data I can find and insights I can derive over the next few weeks. It is the age of data, we should use it to our benefit