[Diesel9999]

Hi Folks

My GLE 250D is now about three years old and it has done 35K kms approximately. The bulk of my daily driving is taken care of by an Innova Crysta ZX AT, so the GLE has been used quite sparingly.

I am now looking to replace the GLE with something nice. Whether I'll sell it or keep it in the company for someone else's use is something I haven't decided yet. But I'm looking to move on. And I am unable to make up my mind.

Requirements :

A) Ride Quality - Very important to me and I am looking for a vehicle that improves upon the GLE's quite decent levels of comfort

B) Space - Though this vehicle will primarily be used as chauffeur driven daily driver, it will occasionally need to double up as a family hauler for 5.

C) Price - Looking for something around the 1 Crore mark or less, give or take 10%.


Vehicles Considered :


1. New GLS 400 - Being a longstanding Mercedes customer, this was my first vehicle of interest.

+Loved the quality of the interiors and the overall fit and finish. Great Front seats
+Loved the engine and refinement levels. Coming from the GLE 250D, I found the GLS 400's engine to be quite brilliant.
+ Fantastic Audio system. Long list of features to keep the nerd in me happy.
- The rear seat somehow wasn't to my liking. Though it has a decent amount of recline, the knees are pointing up. The 'under thigh' support angle was very strange. The Mercedes executive assured me that it is just a matter of getting used to this angle and that I'd be right at home in a few days. Somehow, wasn't convinced.
- I love the old GLS's butch looks and raw charm. The new GLS has lost some of that macho appeal!
- On Road pricing would be about 1.25. This is stretching it a bit over what I had in mind.


2. BMW X7 - I thought I'd be doing the folks over at BMW a disservice if I didn't check out their beloved competitor to the GLS. How wrong I was!! Apparently, the folks at KUN BMW Hyderabad are not too concerned about sales. When I went to enquire about the X7, I was very haughtily informed by their sales executive that "very very important people themselves are waiting for a period of six - seven months at least. So, don't expect anything before the end of the year".

After being made to understand in no uncertain terms that I wasn't going to stand a chance in front of those "very important people", I asked if I could at-least check out a demo car. Once again, I was given a dressing down for being so blasphemous as to ask for a test drive. "Didn't I just tell you that there's a waiting period until the year end? How can I offer a test drive?".

So, I can't judge the X7 on its merits. But after the experience at the showroom, I am not keen at all.


3. Toyota Vellfire - A couple of my friends swear by this house on wheels. And given my largely hassle free experience over the years with Toyota's I decided to check this out

+ Mind Blowing middle row comfort. I haven't experienced anything close to what this seat has offered in any car, ever!
+ Tons of space and usability. Even the third row is very comfortable and spacious
+ Super silent engine and excellent NVH levels of the cabin. The isolation from the road is very very good.
+- Ride quality was a mixed bag. I thought there was a firm edge to the suspension tuning, especially over minor road imperfections. But it handled big potholes and undulations very well.
- Looks are a hit or miss. The road presence is terrific for sure but my own family members had sharply contrasting opinions on whether the car was a looker.
- At approx 1 Crore on Road, am I 'downgrading' from a Merc to a Toyota?


4. One or two year old Range Rover Sport - Always had an eye on the Range Rover Sport. But a nicely specced out version puts the price north of 1.5 Crores on road. So I am on the lookout for a lightly used pre-worshipped Sport with a decent configuration.

+ Brand/Snob Value. Well it is a Range Rover for god's sake, so expect some star dust to rub off on users
+ Great Ride quality, especially on sensible tyre/rim sized vehicles.
- Average rear seat legroom
- Rage inducing reliability and repair bills.


So there you have it folks. Help me decide. And if you can think of some other interesting alternatives, do let me know. I'm not in a hurry and I can wait for a couple of months if interesting vehicles are on the horizon.

[GTO]

Originally Posted by Diesel9999

My GLE 250D is now about three years old and it has done 35K kms approximately.

Don't sell it so early. You might as well be burning money! The depreciation hit is insane, especially on expensive cars. Do read this thread of mine. Worst case scenario, give it to someone within the company, as you said. And if you like changing cars every 3 years, better to buy certified used luxury cars in warranty (zero risk) that have already taken the initial depreciation hit (1 - 3 year old examples), then change them as frequently as you like.

Space - Though this vehicle will primarily be used as chauffeur driven daily driver, it will occasionally need to double up as a family hauler for 5.

Try the front seat of the GLS. IMHO, even for chauffeur-driven purposes, the front passenger seat is twice as comfortable as the rear seat in any car - related thread (Why the fascination with the back seat?!!).

BMW X7

Should be your top choice IMHO, main downer is that ugly face. But otherwise, it is a splendid car. I understand you had a bad showroom experience, but try another salesperson or another dealer (even if from another city). You have to live with the car, not the salesman, and one should never drop an excellent car because of the sales guys attitude. Why give someone else the power to decide what car you will drive? Especially an idiot you will meet just 3 or 4 times. Sharing a relevant post of mine:

Originally Posted by GTO

On Team-BHP & elsewhere, I'm seeing too many mentions of ditching a car model from the consideration list because:

• The salesman was disinterested / rude / unavailable
• A test-drive wasn't offered promptly
• No one returned calls or responded to a web query
• Other similarly negative sales experiences

My advice = If you really like the car, please do NOT drop it just because of the sales experience. Reason? You have to live with the car, not the salesperson. Don't let the 15 - 30 minutes of a bad experience with that salesperson affect the MANY YEARS that you'll spend with a car. It is the actual product & driving experience that will keep you smiling in the years to come, not the dealer. I mean, seriously, think about it = an exceptional sales experience + average car OR an average sales experience + exceptional car. Which one would you really pick? We all know the answer to that.

Again, you have to live WITH THE CAR, not the salesman. And you never know, the after-sales & reliability could be good. My point is, don't let one ill-trained person on the showroom floor decide YOUR choice of car. If you love a car, be adamant about it.

As an example, VW's pre-sales experience pretty much sucks. But if I really liked the Passat, I would go ahead and buy it. Similarly with Tata. Many of their showrooms are relics from the stone-age, and the sales experience can leave a lot to be desired, yet if I really loved the Tiago JTP, I'd buy it. Irrespective of the car, you can have a good or bad experience at ANY brand. Do NOT let that influence how you're going to drive for the next 5 - 10 years. Pick another salesman, talk to the management, go to another dealer, escalate the issue to the manufacturer, be more aggressive with your followups...just get in the driver's seat of the damn car you love!

I mostly buy pre-owned, so don't care much about the sales experience anyway. But even when I'm shopping new, the product always matters 10X more than the person selling it. Even if he's a sleazeball. What I'm saying in a nutshell is, the build + quality + engine + suspension + comfort + driving pleasure are far, far more important than the salesman's attitude (or someone who's just having a bad day).

P.S. Believe it or not, Ferrari was known to have the worst dealers in India. If you had the moolah, would that stop you from owning one ?

P.P.S. All manufacturers have a few / some / most dealerships run by scumbags. Or thugs. Or both. No one has a dealer list full of well-meaning saints. What are you going to do now?

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by Diesel9999

My GLE 250D is now about three years old. I am now looking to replace the GLE with something nice.

Originally Posted by GTO

Don't sell it so early. You might as well be burning money

He will be having the older generation GLE, if he has picked at the right discounts, the losses will be little and it does feel old, so I will say, it's a good time to sell that car

Vehicles Considered

I will agree with all of your observations including the rear seat on GLS as well the suspension on the Vellfire. If this car is going to be purely for the rear seat, Vellfire will be my pick, next time load the rear bay with something or go for a ride with a full load of 5 as you intend to use. You will love the suspension when it's loaded as against when travelling just with the chauffeur. If your drive is going to be split between self and the driver, GLS will make more sense. As GTO has suggested, for longer distances try the front seat. And the car is wide, there will be enough distance from the driver.

X7 has been always in demand but you can get from stocks at some of the dealerships with small discounts too. Now, given the current situation, I am expecting things to slow down a bit. For some reasons, I have never liked the shape of X7 and didn't bother to test drive one. I am not sure, X7 will appeal in terms of looks to you either.

I have never recommended or bought JLR so cannot comment but have taken multiple test drives on RR Sports and Vogue and can tell you safely, Sports is not something that will be better over a GLS or an X7 in terms of rear-seat comfort. You have to consider Vogue which usually is over 2CR.

[//M]

I am absolutely not a judge regarding vehicles in this segment and have had very little exposure of driving some of these cars like the GLE and X7 only for a few kms.

However, since you are pretty content with Mercedes Benz sales and support and liked the space and comfort levels of the Vellfire, therefore, out of curiosity, if I may ask, is V220d an option?

Originally Posted by Diesel9999

3. Toyota Vellfire
.
.
- Looks are a hit or miss. The road presence is terrific for sure but my own family members had sharply contrasting opinions on whether the car was a looker.
- At approx 1 Crore on Road, am I 'downgrading' from a Merc to a Toyota?

Your two major concerns with the Vellfire might get sorted as well considering the V Class is certainly a better looking vehicle purely in comparison to the Vellfire and as a brand, it is definitely not a downgrade.

[androdev]

Just as an alternative, why don't you test drive S-class category sedans having air suspension with ride height adjustment? I can assure you that these cars can handle bad roads on par with Innova. I never found myself wishing for more GC or ruggedness while touring all over south India during last 8 years with W221 S class. And on good roads, they will be sublime.

Doesn't make much sense if you are after the "SUV looks and image" though.

[CosmicWizard]

Originally Posted by Diesel9999

After being made to understand in no uncertain terms that I wasn't going to stand a chance in front of those "very important people", I asked if I could at-least check out a demo car. Once again, I was given a dressing down for being so blasphemous as to ask for a test drive. "Didn't I just tell you that there's a waiting period until the year end? How can I offer a test drive?".

So, I can't judge the X7 on its merits. But after the experience at the showroom, I am not keen at all.

I am myself in the queue since Jan for a 2021 X3 but was told that there is no production of X3/X4/X5/X7 till atleast June/July. To make matter worse, without having produced or delivered a single vehicle, they raised the X3 prices twice in last 4 months nonetheless (50k in Jan, 1L in Apr)

[androdev]

Originally Posted by CosmicWizard

I am myself in the queue since Jan for a 2021 X3 but was told that there is no production of X3/X4/X5/X7 till atleast June/July. To make matter worse, without having produced or delivered a single vehicle, they raised the X3 prices twice in last 4 months nonetheless (50k in Jan, 1L in Apr)

I think BMW has become very shy to keep inventory of cars only to be forced to sell at huge discounts. This trend will remain for sometime to come and they will be very smart to avoid clearance sales. These days it's better to buy as and when the need arises instead of timing any type of stock clearance window - especially for people outside Mumbai and Delhi.

[Akshay1234]

The Range Rover Sport shouldn't be considered, its like a segment down on the GLS and X7. You may be able to get a slightly used Vogue in your budget, but again apart from the space and the ruggedness it will not offer you much.

The GLS and X7 being relatively new releases, will both feel like a significant upgrade over the GLE you have. The X7 rear is slightly better IMO with the captain seats, but they are also lacking a tad bit on thigh support.

X7 waiting period is super long, and even the GLS I know people who have been waiting for 2-3 months for their cars. I guess its best to take a test drive of both, and then decide.

The S class has been going at great discounts, upto 30 lacs I believe. This is honestly a great car and offers comfort like none other. I would definitely consider this if I were you.

[Raahil_23]

Hey diesel9999,
I would also suggest you to not sell the car.
We were in a similar situation few months ago while replacing our 2017 X5 with the new X5 and the depreciation hit on such a recent car is insane. The prices offered to us were in the low 30s. Senses soon prevailed and we decided to keep it in the family as you suggested.

Out of the cars you are looking at, I would strongly suggest checking out the X7 again, maybe through a different dealer as it tends to suit all your requirements. Having sat in both the GLS and the X7, the X7’s captain seats are much better than those of the GLS, but they do lack a bit of under thigh support. I would have suggested the X5 too, especially the 40i but the X5 fails in the rear seat comfort department which is one of the key requirements for you.
The large grill may draw opinions, but its your personal preference at the end, whether you like it or not.

[Diesel9999]

Originally Posted by GTO

Don't sell it so early. You might as well be burning money! The depreciation hit is insane, especially on expensive cars. Do read this thread of mine.



Should be your top choice IMHO, main downer is that ugly face. But otherwise, it is a splendid car. I understand you had a bad showroom experience, but try another salesperson or another dealer (even if from another city). You have to live with the car, not the salesman, and one should never drop an excellent car because of the sales guys attitude. Why give someone else the power to decide what car you will drive? Especially an idiot you will meet just 3 or 4 times. Sharing a relevant post of mine:

As Turbanator said, I got a fairly killer deal when I bought it. So the depreciation hit is not as bad. However, I do agree with your observations GTO and I might end up keeping the car within the company. As for the X7, sadly there's only one dealer out here in Hyderabad. I need to see if there's any X7 in known circles and take a test drive. And what is your opinion on the Vellfire?

Originally Posted by Turbanator

He will be having the older generation GLE, if he has picked at the right discounts, the losses will be little and it does feel old, so I will say, it's a good time to sell that car



I will agree with all of your observations including the rear seat on GLS as well the suspension on the Vellfire. If this car is going to be purely for the rear seat, Vellfire will be my pick, next time load the rear bay with something or go for a ride with a full load of 5 as you intend to use. You will love the suspension when it's loaded as against when travelling just with the chauffeur. If your drive is going to be split between self and the driver, GLS will make more sense. As GTO has suggested, for longer distances try the front seat. And the car is wide, there will be enough distance from the driver.

I actually thought of loading up the rear cargo bay of the Vellfire with a few 25 kilo benchpress plates . Will do that and check it out. If not for that Toyota badge and 1Cr price, I would have gone for it with my eyes closed.

Originally Posted by //M

I am absolutely not a judge regarding vehicles in this segment and have had very little exposure of driving some of these cars like the GLE and X7 only for a few kms.

However, since you are pretty content with Mercedes Benz sales and support and liked the space and comfort levels of the Vellfire, therefore, out of curiosity, if I may ask, is V220d an option?

Your two major concerns with the Vellfire might get sorted as well considering the V Class is certainly a better looking vehicle purely in comparison to the Vellfire and as a brand, it is definitely not a downgrade.

Good point. But one of my friends has a V220d and is not very happy with the refinement levels and seating. Quite a few V220's have come into the used market in Hyderabad recently with very low mileage on them. I guess only a marco polo edition of the V would be plush enough but that retails for over 1.4Cr!!

Originally Posted by androdev

Just as an alternative, why don't you test drive S-class category sedans having air suspension with ride height adjustment? I can assure you that these cars can handle bad roads on par with Innova. I never found myself wishing for more GC or ruggedness while touring all over south India during last 8 years with W221 S class. And on good roads, they will be sublime.

Doesn't make much sense if you are after the "SUV looks and image" though.

The S class has always been something I aspired to buy. But I'm saving it for a special occasion, either personal or professional. I would want the S to be with me for life and I don't think I am ready for it yet. Plus I also can't afford the Maybach version of it yet

Originally Posted by CosmicWizard

I am myself in the queue since Jan for a 2021 X3 but was told that there is no production of X3/X4/X5/X7 till atleast June/July. To make matter worse, without having produced or delivered a single vehicle, they raised the X3 prices twice in last 4 months nonetheless (50k in Jan, 1L in Apr)

I don't know what BMW India's strategy is or maybe it is a genuine supply chain issue that seems to be plaguing all manufacturers. Even the Mercedes GLS 400d has a waiting period of a couple of months. But the showroom at least had a demo vehicle available and the team had the decency to listen to my requirements.

Originally Posted by Akshay1234

The Range Rover Sport shouldn't be considered, its like a segment down on the GLS and X7. You may be able to get a slightly used Vogue in your budget, but again apart from the space and the ruggedness it will not offer you much.

The GLS and X7 being relatively new releases, will both feel like a significant upgrade over the GLE you have. The X7 rear is slightly better IMO with the captain seats, but they are also lacking a tad bit on thigh support.

X7 waiting period is super long, and even the GLS I know people who have been waiting for 2-3 months for their cars. I guess its best to take a test drive of both, and then decide.

The S class has been going at great discounts, upto 30 lacs I believe. This is honestly a great car and offers comfort like none other. I would definitely consider this if I were you.

Lot of recommendations from BHPians for the X7. I seriously need to check for a vehicle among friends or acquaintances now. KUN BMW should at least maintain a demo vehicle so that prospective customers can check it out in person. As for the S, there are killer deals and it is going for about 30 - 33 L discount on remaining models. But l'm not ready for it yet

Originally Posted by Raahil_23

Hey diesel9999,
I would also suggest you to not sell the car.
We were in a similar situation few months ago while replacing our 2017 X5 with the new X5 and the depreciation hit on such a recent car is insane. The prices offered to us were in the low 30s. Senses soon prevailed and we decided to keep it in the family as you suggested.

Out of the cars you are looking at, I would strongly suggest checking out the X7 again, maybe through a different dealer as it tends to suit all your requirements. Having sat in both the GLS and the X7, the X7’s captain seats are much better than those of the GLS, but they do lack a bit of under thigh support. I would have suggested the X5 too, especially the 40i but the X5 fails in the rear seat comfort department which is one of the key requirements for you.
The large grill may draw opinions, but its your personal preference at the end, whether you like it or not.

Not a fan of the current X5. I was slightly tempted by the facelifted 6GT but I decided against it. Only the X7 makes sense for my current requirements. I will see if I can get my hands on a vehicle as the showroom doesn't have one.

[sandeepmohan]

Originally Posted by Diesel9999

The bulk of my daily driving is taken care of by an Innova Crysta ZX AT, so the GLE has been used quite sparingly.

You really should be looking to go all electric. Do add the Mercedes EQC to the list. Not only will this fit the bill for a vehicle that is going to be "sparingly" used, you're going to experience something you've never experienced before.

[ballfry]

Originally Posted by Diesel9999

Not a fan of the current X5. I was slightly tempted by the facelifted 6GT but I decided against it. Only the X7 makes sense for my current requirements. I will see if I can get my hands on a vehicle as the showroom doesn't have one.

Why not consider the Q8 Celebration? It's deceptively large, the celebration trim does skimp on certain features when compared to the full-fat Q8, but something for you to consider.

[Diesel9999]

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan

You really should be looking to go all electric. Do add the Mercedes EQC to the list. Not only will this fit the bill for a vehicle that is going to be "sparingly" used, you're going to experience something you've never experienced before.

Now that is an interesting suggestion. I haven't really given a thought in this direction but will check it out. I read in these forums that the ride can be stiff but it is definitely worth checking out.

Originally Posted by ballfry

Why not consider the Q8 Celebration? It's deceptively large, the celebration trim does skimp on certain features when compared to the full-fat Q8, but something for you to consider.

Not a fan of the current Audi design language

[bhavukjain]

Hey. I feel you should consider the XC 90. One of my close friends recently replaced his ML 250 with XC 90 and is very satisfied with his purchase.

[Delano]

The shortlisted options are all great, but my pick would be the X7!

If you're moving on from the GLE 250d, there are a few options between the GLE 250d and the ones you've picked as well. They may better fit your budget. Try out the new BMW X5, the Volvo XC 90 and Audi Q7 which are all great options too. I drove the ML 250d for 6 years and moved to the BMW X5 (Msports trim). I loved the Mercedes for overall comfort and drive but the BMW X5 is a much more engaging drive when I am at the wheel. The M sports trim also comes with M suspension, sports seats, heads up display and mixed size tyres which make for an exciting drive. Although an SUV, it feels more like a car when you are at the wheel. The X5 is a sharper looking car (IMO) and overall handling and refinement of the new gen X5 is top notch. All these other options will also make your family feel as comfortable on drives and make you feel like you have upgraded! all the best!