PCD Conversion: How Safe and Availability

moralfibre · 27th January 2008, 21:56

Guys, I came across this converter plate for fitting 100 PCD alloys on 98 PCD hubs.

My questions:

1) How safe is it to do such a conversion.
2) Does reliability go for a toss?
3) Does such a conversion alter the steering / suspension geometry by even 0.01 %?
4) Are such plates available in India or can we easily engineer and fabricate them?

From the same site I came across something called Camber plates. Can someone shed some light on the purpose of these?

Source:: Italian Car Club

v1p3r · 27th January 2008, 21:58

Most European wheels run 98/100, like OZ etc. But they're safe enough, like wheel spacers. As long as they are balanced, and of good quality.

Camber plates allow you to adjust your camber angles. I think you will have to remove the top mount of your struts and put these in instead.

moralfibre · 27th January 2008, 22:27

More gyaan for those interested - turbo124.com • View topic - Hub modifications

nitrous · 27th January 2008, 22:29

Camber plates are used in road car to race car conversion to get negate camber to race standards.

vikram_d · 27th January 2008, 22:31

Conversion plates are safe. No problems with them at all. One of my friends had used them to convert from 113 pcd to 100 pcd. We made them locally and till date no problems at all. It's been close to year since installation.

No idea about camber plates.

kpzen · 27th January 2008, 22:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikram_d

One of my friends had used them to convert from 113 pcd to 100 pcd.

Which car ? Just for my knowledge.

vikram_d · 27th January 2008, 22:51

Sorry it was 114. Alloys that he had used on his innova were moved to his swift.

kpzen · 27th January 2008, 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikram_d

Sorry it was 114. Alloys that he had used on his innova were moved to his swift.

Phew!!
5 bolts to 4 bolts conversion. ??
If the alloys used in Innova were transfered to Swift then it should 100 to 114.3 PCD and not the other way as u have mentioned.

v1p3r · 27th January 2008, 23:13

How did he manage 5 lugs to 4, or vice-versa? Can you put up pics?

iraghava · 28th January 2008, 09:35

Hub conversion should be alright like Akshay said provided it's correctly engineered & of good quality. Unfortunately, I've not come across any such product available locally till now. So, if you want it, you'd have to source it from abroad.

As for the Camber plates again they're specialised equipment but remember you're messing with the suspension geometry here so make sure you know what you're doing before you go into it.

ram_hyundai · 28th January 2008, 11:15

i dont think its safe especially with our gutter, un scientific geometry humps and dips strayed roads.please refrain from any thing that can in the long run damage any of the costly components as far as possible.
ram

vikram_d · 28th January 2008, 12:46

Dont have any pics of it. Will try to get a pic when my friend goes for wheel balancing.

But what we essentially did was made a plate similar to the one in the photo above with 5 to 4 conversion. The plate had 5 bolts which were used to hold the alloys in place and four holes which were used to bolt on the plate to the vehicle.

There is another method of doing the conversion but have never tried it. We can plug the existing holes of the alloys using SS inserts which are fitted into the holes using a process called shrink fitting. After this we can drill new holes in the alloys to match the required PCD.

TURBOSAM · 29th February 2008, 08:41

before commenting about the quality parameter of the product, i would like to tell u people-- the wheel should be fitted on the hub.
in this case all th vertical shocks felt by the wheel are transfered to the hub , and bolts do tyhe reataining job only.
in 99.99% aftermarket wheels the bolts bear the shocks as the wheel is not supported on the hub... at least it can damage the bolts and hub threading .+make it diffcult to replace a punctured tyre!.
at the most ... ull end up in an accident .
quality of the aftermarket conversion kid depends upon the indivisual piece.. as the tempering ,hardening process may be of questionable quality..
the choice is all clear.... u want looks first at the cost of safety... or safety first...
all the best.. as every shock the wheel will experience will be bourn by the adaptor plate completely ... then transfered to the hub.. ..
think twice..

Sankar · 29th February 2008, 09:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by TURBOSAM

before commenting about the quality parameter of the product, i would like to tell u people-- the wheel should be fitted on the hub.
in this case all th vertical shocks felt by the wheel are transfered to the hub , and bolts do tyhe reataining job only.
in 99.99% aftermarket wheels the bolts bear the shocks as the wheel is not supported on the hub... at least it can damage the bolts and hub threading .+make it diffcult to replace a punctured tyre!.
at the most ... ull end up in an accident .
quality of the aftermarket conversion kid depends upon the indivisual piece.. as the tempering ,hardening process may be of questionable quality..
the choice is all clear.... u want looks first at the cost of safety... or safety first...
all the best.. as every shock the wheel will experience will be bourn by the adaptor plate completely ... then transfered to the hub.. ..
think twice..

Turbosam, but aren't there two types of wheel to hub fittings... Hub-centric and Lug-centric.

In case of Hub-centric the wheel's centerbore should match the hub and the load is transferred to the hub via the centerbore mounting. In hub-centric types the main duty of the lugs is to hold the wheel to the hub. USually found in bigger vehicles such as Sumo/Scorpio/Safari etc.. I think even Amby is hub centric.

In lug-centric wheels the wheels are centered using the special tapered nuts and load bearing is done via the studs. In lug-centric the lugs hold the wheel to the hub and the load is also transferred through them.Lug-centric is usually found on small and medium size cars. Most Marutis including Swift are lug centric. Don't know about SX4.

And as you say the quality of the 'studs' of aftermarket PCD converters and spacers may not match the factory studs. It's important that the studs on these adapters are strong enough as that of the factory item to be able to take the load.

I have seen aftermarket local studs, inserted into the original hubs, break under usage.

Tej Khokhar · 4th May 2011, 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikram_d

Conversion plates are safe. No problems with them at all. One of my friends had used them to convert from 113 pcd to 100 pcd. We made them locally and till date no problems at all. It's been close to year since installation.

No idea about camber plates.

Hi Vikram,

I a, trying to get such a adapter plate made for my conti 120/5 PCD to 114.3/5 PCD. Since you have tried it out and got it done in Bangalore with good results, could you help me with the following details:

1. what material needs to be used?
2. these must be hub-centric, right?
3. where can i get these fabricated and the cost for them as well?
3. were you able to do high speed driving in the friend's car without experiencing any wobble, noises from the wheels ??

Thanks, Tej

Would appreciate a little guidance on the same.

27th January 2008, 21:56	#1
moralfibre Team-BHP Support Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: MH-12 Posts: 8,515 Thanked: 14,165 Times	PCD Conversion: How Safe and Availability Guys, I came across this converter plate for fitting 100 PCD alloys on 98 PCD hubs. My questions: 1) How safe is it to do such a conversion. 2) Does reliability go for a toss? 3) Does such a conversion alter the steering / suspension geometry by even 0.01 %? 4) Are such plates available in India or can we easily engineer and fabricate them? From the same site I came across something called Camber plates. Can someone shed some light on the purpose of these? Source:: Italian Car Club
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 21:58	#2
v1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: BLR / DXB / LON Posts: 5,358 Thanked: 7,323 Times View My Garage	Most European wheels run 98/100, like OZ etc. But they're safe enough, like wheel spacers. As long as they are balanced, and of good quality. Camber plates allow you to adjust your camber angles. I think you will have to remove the top mount of your struts and put these in instead.
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 22:27	#3
moralfibre Team-BHP Support Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: MH-12 Posts: 8,515 Thanked: 14,165 Times	More gyaan for those interested - turbo124.com • View topic - Hub modifications
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 22:29	#4
nitrous Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: UAE/Lon/Madras Posts: 6,965 Thanked: 332 Times View My Garage	Camber plates are used in road car to race car conversion to get negate camber to race standards.
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 22:31	#5
vikram_d Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,427 Thanked: 1,188 Times	Conversion plates are safe. No problems with them at all. One of my friends had used them to convert from 113 pcd to 100 pcd. We made them locally and till date no problems at all. It's been close to year since installation. No idea about camber plates.
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 22:51	#7
vikram_d Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,427 Thanked: 1,188 Times	Sorry it was 114. Alloys that he had used on his innova were moved to his swift.
	() Thanks

27th January 2008, 23:13	#9
v1p3r Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: BLR / DXB / LON Posts: 5,358 Thanked: 7,323 Times View My Garage	How did he manage 5 lugs to 4, or vice-versa? Can you put up pics?
	() Thanks

28th January 2008, 09:35	#10
iraghava Senior - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bhaiyyaland Posts: 8,033 Thanked: 278 Times View My Garage	Hub conversion should be alright like Akshay said provided it's correctly engineered & of good quality. Unfortunately, I've not come across any such product available locally till now. So, if you want it, you'd have to source it from abroad. As for the Camber plates again they're specialised equipment but remember you're messing with the suspension geometry here so make sure you know what you're doing before you go into it.
	() Thanks

28th January 2008, 11:15	#11
ram_hyundai Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Calicut ,trisur Posts: 2,020 Thanked: 53 Times View My Garage	i dont think its safe especially with our gutter, un scientific geometry humps and dips strayed roads.please refrain from any thing that can in the long run damage any of the costly components as far as possible. ram
	() Thanks

28th January 2008, 12:46	#12
vikram_d Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,427 Thanked: 1,188 Times	Dont have any pics of it. Will try to get a pic when my friend goes for wheel balancing. But what we essentially did was made a plate similar to the one in the photo above with 5 to 4 conversion. The plate had 5 bolts which were used to hold the alloys in place and four holes which were used to bolt on the plate to the vehicle. There is another method of doing the conversion but have never tried it. We can plug the existing holes of the alloys using SS inserts which are fitted into the holes using a process called shrink fitting. After this we can drill new holes in the alloys to match the required PCD.
	() Thanks

29th February 2008, 08:41	#13
TURBOSAM BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: pune Posts: 241 Thanked: 2 Times	beware! before commenting about the quality parameter of the product, i would like to tell u people-- the wheel should be fitted on the hub. in this case all th vertical shocks felt by the wheel are transfered to the hub , and bolts do tyhe reataining job only. in 99.99% aftermarket wheels the bolts bear the shocks as the wheel is not supported on the hub... at least it can damage the bolts and hub threading .+make it diffcult to replace a punctured tyre!. at the most ... ull end up in an accident . quality of the aftermarket conversion kid depends upon the indivisual piece.. as the tempering ,hardening process may be of questionable quality.. the choice is all clear.... u want looks first at the cost of safety... or safety first... all the best.. as every shock the wheel will experience will be bourn by the adaptor plate completely ... then transfered to the hub.. .. think twice..
	(1) Thanks