[Mustang Sammy]

Originally Posted by noopster

finally backed off for 3 reasons: price, dealer responsiveness (pathetic even at pre-sales stage)

The larger point I am making is: you should have taken a longer test drive.

The Tata Motors dealership sales team in Pune is HORRIBLE. They need to be replaced en masse, as they don’t seem to have any interest in showing their products, let alone arrange a test drive.

The point about the longer test drive is spot on. Only caveat is that if you do so in a car that is beyond your budget and you fall in love, you run the very real risk of giving in to temptation.

[loneagl09]

For the life of me, I never understood the problem of knee hitting the console. For reference, I'm 6 feet, 85kg, and my knew never ever hit it. Granted I'm driving an automatic, but there seems to plenty space even with the clutch.

[fhdowntheline]

What is it with front seat sizes in the new and larger cars ? I test drove the Hector CVT recently and felt the front seat was not larger than my Creta's seat. In fact due to the overdone ICE module in the canter, I felt the driver and especially passenger seat to be a bit cramped. Even the Safari did not feel very comfortable during one official road trip. I distinctly remember the seats in my erstwhile Linea/City, they were so much more comfortable.

[impala]

Originally Posted by tp_dominator

The Next Ride, XUV700

I am driving one for around 19 months now and I am very happy with it barring some earlier niggles. Given you had a concern about under-thigh support, do a longish test drive. This is one concern I have with XUV700 too, and I am 5'11". Unless I keep the seat weirdly high, the car lacks under thigh support and I often feel calf pain too. Something I didn't experience in other cars including small hatchbacks. I know someone else who had similar concerns too.

[jetsetgo08]

Originally Posted by loneagl09

For the life of me, I never understood the problem of knee hitting the console.

Due to the clutch pedal rake angle, longer travel in the MT's, for an average indian height, one tends to sit closer to the dashboard esp. when driving in traffic. And the knee touches the dashboard in that position. However, this was a known problem from the Zest and Hexa days.

May not observe the knee hitting issue in Punch and Altroz as the steering and ABC pedals are shifted towards the right w.r.t driver seat, but this results in the legs being twisted at an angle as against the upper body.

[loneagl09]

Originally Posted by jetsetgo08

Due to the clutch pedal rake angle, longer travel in the MT's, for an average indian height, one tends to sit closer to the dashboard esp. when driving in traffic. And the knee touches the dashboard in that position. However, this was a known problem from the Zest and Hexa days.

May not observe the knee hitting issue in Punch and Altroz as the steering and ABC pedals are shifted towards the right w.r.t driver seat, but this results in the legs being twisted at an angle as against the upper body.

This makes sense as I adjust my seat much further back. Glad I stuck to AT then.

[r24x7]

Originally Posted by tp_dominator

Edit:- This is going to be a long post since I had started writing an ownership review, but the journey of the car itself has been short-lived with me, so I would try to capture the essence of my ownership of 9 months and 24,000 kms. This car is now sold and will be replaced with another one shortly. Kudos to mods for encouraging me to share the report nonetheless.

The moment I read the title "Sold my Tata Safari in 9 months" on the Hot Threads section, I instantly knew it deep inside before even opening the post that it was going to end with XUV7OO. Never felt so predictive about something so far in my life!

I'm pretty sure this post of yours is going to end the dilemma between Safari and XUV7OO for loads of people researching online and also result in huge number of booking cancellations for TATA. But, this is the truth and you had to say it out.

Just to give a perspective from someone who took possession of a BS6.2 Safari Diesel Automatic very recently. The problems listed still exist today and I was very much aware of these issues when I was going with the vehicle purchase. Every single issue mentioned here was put forth to the sales advisors and I was given one and the same answer. "All issues are now resolved with BS6.2 Saar!".

1. Left pull - It still very much exists and not solved by TATA even after 2 years of vehicle launch. Some people do claim that it has been resolved by service centers by something called a subframe shift. I have experienced this in last 3000 KMs and went once to SVC. Since it is hardly noticeable in city drives, I will only have to wait until next highway drive to see if this still happens. But is is very much an issue.
   
2. Left knee touching center console - This is a genuine ergonomic flaw but thankfully you can find a suitable position as long as you have the automatic variant. I have 0 issues in this regard.
   
3. Buggy Infotainment system - I can say that the 2023 infotainment system is far far better, yet still little buggy. For most days it works flawlessly, like 90% of time. When things start acting up, there is an option to do a forced hard restart.
   
4. Hard/Stiff seats? I'm going to give it a pass. I have not experienced it.

Well, to the last part. If I was really aware of the issues, then why did I still go with Safari?

1. Exceptional Highway Ride quality. The damned suspension just glides over all kinds of paths that you would tread on. The regular highway routes that I used to take has few sections where 5-6 speed bumps are placed to slow down vehicles; I used to slow down to 5-10 KMPH on my previous ride, I now just glide over at 80 KMPH.
   
2. Nothing to complain on NVH levels. Very refined in highway drives.
   
3. Based on my budget, I was either looking at AX5 or XTA+. It was a no brainer that I had to get the Safari XTA+. Detailed post (2021 Tata Safari Review)I made here already.

Do I regret buying it? Absolutely not!

I understand my usage and the pros of the car outweigh all the cons for me. However, if I were in a situation of having to drive 20K+ Kms in an year. Then I would definitely look at ergonomics first.

Hope this post of yours makes a dent in TATA's sales. Hope TATA gets notice of this post and think of fixing the basic blunders that have been persisting since 2019.

[heman_369]

Originally Posted by tp_dominator

I
I had kept both Scorpio N and the XUV700 for a couple of days with me (at different times) and drove them both in the city and on short highway trips. I can verify that I found XUV700 more comfortable for my use cases and hence went ahead with the same.

Sad to see your safari going, But it is better to part ways than endure the pain. If it helps I have driven my XUV700 AX&L D AWD AT for 30k kms in 15 months with multiple long drives in excess of 1000km a day. You cannot go wrong with the part of driving comfort and no fatigue. XUV 700 is a long distance cruiser where you can easily drive all day long with superior comfort to all passengers.

[Neil Roy]

Originally Posted by tp_dominator

Edit:-
The famous left pull - the steering would just move to the left at higher speeds if I was not holding it tightly enough - fixed with a subframe shift which took a whole day.
While on the point of the accelerator, the A-pedal is placed at an awkward angle which made my ankle numb and pain started transmitting to my calf area and subsequently to the under-thigh. I never had to check the A-pedal angle before buying a car. These are some basics which a manufacturer selling a 25 lakh rupee car should have been able to address and assess. The feet don't fall naturally to the pedals, combined with not being too close to the pedals due to the knee console hitting the upper-thigh or the knee region, this added to overall discomfort.
7. The pièce de résistance - the front seats. I mean apart from the stiffness, how bad can somebody design a seat on such an expensive car. The car lacks under-thigh support and this became evident on the long journeys. Moreover, this might apply to a very few individuals who are of similar shape and size as me. But this was a H-U-G-E deal breaker for me. Also, if one monitors closely, the driver's seat is at an angle to the steering so you are always sitting in a cross position. This, with the nervous steering and the left pull - compounded the problems to a very uncomfortable level.

Originally Posted by jetsetgo08

These 2 points and also off-center steering, pedal combo are recurring for the newer generation of Tata vehicles including the Punch and Altroz. While many may not have noticed during short test drives or luckily their bodies would have probably adopted to the weird seating. But, it's a big pain to drive for longer durations with unconventional ergonomics.

As a fellow Safari owner and one who has the same needs as you, I can empathise with your suffering. To make matters worse, I came from a 2016 Chevy Cruze to the Safari and believe me, American and European cars are designed in such a way that you'll be immediately at home in the cockpit aka the driver's seat. Just like you, I have a pretty high mileage and the only thing that made me choose the safari was safety. Comfort was there, but safety was the priority. So far, I have clocked 65000 kms in 2 years and all the complaints that you say are true.But, barring the left pull for which there seems to be no solution, the rest have a work around.
I have put an 1 inch think thermocol pad in the well area where your heel rests and increased the height of the A-Pedal by fixing a plywood with the after market A pedal drilled and threaded . It seems to increase the driving comfort and the ergonomics. For the other safari users, you can try it and see if it helps.





The other addition I would recommend is the EBC brake fluid. It has made braking more progressive and I'm more comfortable on high speeds now. I cant wait for TATA to upgrade and then charge me a high premium for it but rather bring out the pseudo designer in me.
Do keep us posted with your XUV700 feedback. It seems to be a more complete package.

[Apex1815]

Originally Posted by DCEite

I think this is an ergonomic issue with the Harrier/Safari (and even smaller TATAs like Punch and Nexon). Someone with long legs will not find comfortable seating position !

I validate your point here for TATA Nexon atleast.
I am having TATA Nexon XZ Petrol (Manual)which I bought in Sep 2021 and have clocked almost 19000 Km. Within first few 100 Kms and initial days of ownership I realised this ergonomic issue.

The dead pedal in Nexon adds more to this trouble. While you press the clutch pedal, your foot will interfere with the dead pedal from left side. It took me initial 2~3000 Kms to get used to it and I started wearing the shoes which are not broad at the toes otherwise it will keep interfering.

Sadly no Nexon user or reviewer has pointed it out.

[FLYBOYSID]

Originally Posted by loneagl09

For the life of me, I never understood the problem of knee hitting the console.

I second the motion. I am about 5’11” and don’t face this issue of knee n dashboard meeting up. Though it has been only 2 months and 5k km on my safari, but I have done a few 12+ hour trips too n found the car to be comfortable.
Comfort is a very subjective assessment though.
XUV 700 is a nice package n I did a couple of long TDs on it. I found the blind spots due to A-Pillars a bit concerning. Also I somehow managed to hit my head during every ingress or egress. I would have still lived with it but for some reason my kids n wife turned it down in unison. As I said Comfort is very subjective and one is better off where one finds his or her comfort zone.

[tp_dominator]

Originally Posted by 07CR

Call it premonition or what, but I had seen your last post on Azure (You had also mentioned about the next ride being the Safari), and somehow I felt that this is not a good move. You will miss Azure, and regret buying the Safari. Personally, I am not a fan of Tata Vehicles above Altroz, but I never wish anyone ill for buying their cars above Altroz. But somehow I had that feeling.

PS- I too own a Ecosport S TDCI (17 inch rim), and maybe that was some weird connection between our two Ford's, which led me to the premonition!

I also follow your posts where you update about your Ecosport. I never thought that any car costing so much will have ergonomic flaws. I can expect them in lower priced ones but not the ones costing as much. However, this may also differ from person to person and others may not find it discomforting enough to warrant a replacement.

On a lighter note, wish you had shared the premonition with me beforehand, would have saved me quite a few bucks.

Originally Posted by sandeepmdas

I own the XU700 since March 2023, having replaced my 10-year-old 500 with it. I'll tell you the three factors that bother me.
.
.
Now that said, the service interval of Tata cars was an irritatingly frequent 5000kms / 6 months previously. I assume it is the same for the Safari. The 700 comes with a 10K/1 year service interval that you can live with (except the first service which is within the first month or 1000 kms). However, the major service of the Harrier AFAIK is 15K / 1 year means you need consumables in every 15K only. This advantage is applicable only if you're clocking more than 10K per year.

Thanks a lot for sharing your ownership insights on the XUV700. However, for the issues you mentioned, Safari has an equally, if not worse, bad A-pillar blind spot and the wing mirrors cover a very less area with the range of adjustment also restricted so these two will somehow manage. My tipping out earlier and deciding to go with Safari was this auto dimming IRVM. With a vehicle so much technology and 5 star safety, this simple safety device is left out.

Moreover, the service intervals for Safari are minor service at every 7500 kms and major service is at every 15000 kms. Also, the costs are way more than what XUV700 costs for the same number of kilometers travelled. I have attached below screenshots for the stats on FE and overall costs. I had visited the workshops for services, DEF top ups and one damage to the AC pipe for a total of 9 times in 9 months and 24k kms.

Originally Posted by fhdowntheline

What is it with front seat sizes in the new and larger cars ? I test drove the Hector CVT recently and felt the front seat was not larger than my Creta's seat. In fact due to the overdone ICE module in the canter, I felt the driver and especially passenger seat to be a bit cramped. Even the Safari did not feel very comfortable during one official road trip. I distinctly remember the seats in my erstwhile Linea/City, they were so much more comfortable.

I am of the same opinion. My 2009 Fiat Grande Punto had better seats than any other car I have owned after that. I feel the 2000s decade put more emphasis on comfort and take any car from that era and one will find atleast front row seats to be more comfortable and spacious than today's cars.

Originally Posted by impala

I am driving one for around 19 months now and I am very happy with it barring some earlier niggles. Given you had a concern about under-thigh support, do a longish test drive. This is one concern I have with XUV700 too, and I am 5'11". Unless I keep the seat weirdly high, the car lacks under thigh support and I often feel calf pain too. Something I didn't experience in other cars including small hatchbacks. I know someone else who had similar concerns too.

Thanks a lot for the insights. However, with my height of 5'9" and build, I found the driving position to be way better than Safari's. I even took a 200 kms round trip on the test car and felt it was better. However, true picture will only be realized once I own it and drive for my typical long journey. For the calf pain, I think the throttle is more responsive than the Safari and also with adaptive cruise control, this can be taken care of. However, I can only predict and it remains to be seen whether I face same issues in XUV700 as well.

Originally Posted by Neil Roy

As a fellow Safari owner and one who has the same needs as you, I can empathise with your suffering. To make matters worse, I came from a 2016 Chevy Cruze to the Safari and believe me, American and European cars are designed in such a way that you'll be immediately at home in the cockpit aka the driver's seat. Just like you, I have a pretty high mileage and the only thing that made me choose the safari was safety. Comfort was there, but safety was the priority. So far, I have clocked 65000 kms in 2 years and all the complaints that you say are true.But, barring the left pull for which there seems to be no solution, the rest have a work around.

Oh man! Thanks a lot for your post. You have done what actually needed to be done by Tata motors at their factory. Hats off to your effort and thanks for sharing your solution for the issues faced. However, I doubt most people would ever undertake such efforts. These basic ergonomic flaws need to be highlighted to OEMs so that they can make the necessary changes.

[negi15]

Originally Posted by FLYBOYSID

I Also I somehow managed to hit my head during every ingress or egress.

Ditto here. Happened with me on my first meeting with 700. Couldn't understand why?

Left knee touching dashboard problem is most known reported problem with Safari. Some could find workaround it by adjusting steering and seat position(like me), some are still searching for answers. But, yes it is still subject of discussion.
Fit and finish comes second.

Regarding pre-sales experience, it was opposite for me. Requested for 700 test drive at home multiple times, but it never materialized even on making personal calls.

My requirement was a family car for long comfortable drives which could carry 5+2 for short trips also and therefore test drive at home with all members was a must. 700 never came and safari came twice.

Mine have clocked 17K in a year and family has loved every bit of it. Do note that my solo drives are only my office commutes.

Anyway every person has their own unique requirements and use-cases. If it reaches a point where you can't live with it, it good to move on.
@tp_dominator Wish you happy Kms with next ride!

Keep revvin
Negi

[Axe77]

Originally Posted by tp_dominator

This was again a bit of a nightmarish experience but the BH registered car can only be sold to again a BH eligible person as of now at the Pune RTO. I had used all my contacts but since there is no option yet on the Parivahan portal for reassignment of a BH registered car to state series, this is yet unresolved. This is under development I'm told where Pune RTO had sent a clarification mail to the NIC for the same, but they are yet to get a response.

Thanks for that fantastic crisp review despite having sold the car. Very insightful indeed. Can I please trouble you to update the forum in detail on how this progresses.

Like someone mentioned, this will likely be one of the first onward sales of a BH registered car and it would be very instructive for members to know what to expect and how to navigate this.

Cheers.

[tp_dominator]

Originally Posted by Axe77

Thanks for that fantastic crisp review despite having sold the car. Very insightful indeed. Can I please trouble you to update the forum in detail on how this progresses.

Like someone mentioned, this will likely be one of the first onward sales of a BH registered car and it would be very instructive for members to know what to expect and how to navigate this.

Cheers.

Thanks a lot Axe77. I do plan to pen down a write up once I am done and dusted with the transfer formalities. For now, things are still under process and I will have more clarity by next week.