[vina]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

@vina; Please read my post again. But - for small movements like road irregularities the rubber will allow near normal deformation. The rubber pre-stressing is included in this. This is why I said near normal and not normal. The rubber will be at least 10x more compliant that the spring, so the contribution to the hardness will be negligible.

Sir,

why do you say that the rubber will be 10x compliant compared to the spring? While that may be be so, there is no evidence that it is. Just because it is rubber (actually a synthetic polymer here) doesn't make it compliant - look at the compression stiffness of treads of your car tires for example.

Also if you spend a few minutes using the results of my calculations, you'll realize that if the rubber is 10x compliant compared to the spring, then it is practically useless - it wouldn't even lift the car by the 12mm to 15mm GTO claims.

[sgiitk]

Rubber does not lift the car. Only it stops it the spring from compressing to the same degree. I do not buy the 4mm minimum thickness story.

[Rehaan]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

Rubber does not lift the car.

It does lift the car slightly (vs stock), since the regular space between two windings of the coil is now held slightly further apart by the rubber.

cya
R

[sgiitk]

@Rehaan; A couple of even 5mm do not matter to me. To put the story differently, the range of compression before the rubber becomes a 'brick' is small. The ultimate 4mm figure may be at 200 tons or something like that. So once the rubber 'locks' happens you have a 25% stiffer spring, which controls the bottoming.

[Rehaan]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

....the range of compression before the rubber becomes a 'brick' is small.... ....once the rubber 'locks' happens you have a 25% stiffer spring, which controls the bottoming.

Maybe i have misunderstood when you said "Rubber does not lift the car", but what i'm saying is that it is infact keeping one winding of the coil slightly more expanded even when there is no extra load in the car, thus lifting the car slightly. (About a 1/4 - 1/2").

If the 1.5" Autorunners were used, this would probably be more pronounced.

Besides that, i 100% agree with what you have written in post #142.

Originally Posted by hiren.mistry

...upwards of 40K for new suspension..

FYI - just got new shock absorbers for my Fiesta. Cost Rs.2100 per piece. (Plus roughly Rs.500 per strut in labour).

cya
R

[sgiitk]

@rehaan; I think we are nitpicking. In gross terms we agree. So let us leave it at that.

[hiren.mistry]

Originally Posted by Rehaan

FYI - just got new shock absorbers for my Fiesta. Cost Rs.2100 per piece. (Plus roughly Rs.500 per strut in labour).

cya
R

Now if only Honda spares were that cheap
A few months back I had called Solitaire Honda for a replacement suspension and was quoted 52K

Now I don't know whether that included springs, I did not have the courage to find out. Of course the replacement market will be cheaper but still...

[Guna]

Originally Posted by hiren.mistry

Now if only Honda spares were that cheap
A few months back I had called Solitaire Honda for a replacement suspension and was quoted 52K

Now I don't know whether that included springs, I did not have the courage to find out. Of course the replacement market will be cheaper but still...

This is probably for the entire suspension overhaul and not just spring/shocks.

[zulfi hansi]

GTO Sir, I need advice for my 2004 corolla. It has done 80K, and I am sure the suspension is softer then the civic, not really sure but. Now if I fix these on the rear suspension how will it react in a corolla, also where do I fix, upper or lower on the springs. I do not have any problem with the GC of corolla.

[ananthkamath]

Originally Posted by zulfi hansi

GTO Sir, I need advice for my 2004 corolla. It has done 80K, and I am sure the suspension is softer then the civic, not really sure but. Now if I fix these on the rear suspension how will it react in a corolla, also where do I fix, upper or lower on the springs. I do not have any problem with the GC of corolla.

I am not GTO Sir, but I'd say if you arent having a bottoming issue then you dont need helper springs of any sort. Try and get Konis or other good aftermarket shocks, or if not, just buy a new set of OEM shocks/struts. That will help much more.

Spoke to a buddy that works in NASCAR, it appears they are using the rubber donut method for making changes to the car's balance (under/over steer at limit) trackside. They do it during a pitstop too, which is not very surprising. They have a whole set of rubbers of varying durometer too, so its possible to make the required change very quickly in the pits.

So there you have it, you guys who do the mod can claim it is used in the very pinnacle of sedan racing in the world!!

I find it hard to believe that such a drastic change has not changed the limit understeer of GTO's car. Then again, 99% of drivers cannot detect changes in understeer levels, so maybe it doesnt matter.

[vina]

Originally Posted by ananthkamath

Spoke to a buddy that works in NASCAR, it appears they are using the rubber donut method for making changes to the car's balance (under/over steer at limit) trackside. They do it during a pitstop too, which is not very surprising. They have a whole set of rubbers of varying durometer too, so its possible to make the required change very quickly in the pits.

So there you have it, you guys who do the mod can claim it is used in the very pinnacle of sedan racing in the world!!

I find it hard to believe that such a drastic change has not changed the limit understeer of GTO's car. Then again, 99% of drivers cannot detect changes in understeer levels, so maybe it doesnt matter.

Amazon.com: Superior 18-1901 Donut Style Coil Spring Spacer: Automotive Right here ! looks like a well known method, and cheaper than what GTO seems to have paid (sorry no offence )

[hiren.mistry]

Originally Posted by Guna

This is probably for the entire suspension overhaul and not just spring/shocks.

That could be true. Will find out more when I get my car serviced at the end of this month.

Originally Posted by vina

Amazon.com: Superior 18-1901 Donut Style Coil Spring Spacer: Automotive Right here ! looks like a well known method, and cheaper than what GTO seems to have paid (sorry no offence )

Thats a steal, not sure if thats the price for 1 donut or a set of 4. Even then its just 1/4th of the price we paid.

Good find there Vina!

[mukeshgoel]

I have also paid for Coil Spring Adjuster (Darryl says Assister not Adjuster) for the rear of 2006 Civic.

They have been couriered. Hoping to get it in 1-2 days.

[GTO]

*Update*

Got the wheel alignment done. Results attached:

Originally Posted by zulfi hansi

It has done 80K, and I am sure the suspension is softer then the civic

Sounds like you need to overhaul your suspension, and not an after-market cheap fix.

Originally Posted by ananthkamath

Then again, 99% of drivers cannot detect changes in understeer levels, so maybe it doesnt matter.

True. And then, even if there is a 4% difference...is there any public road safe enough to gauge that? I can confirm though that the handling feels identical to before, even when pushing it. An advantage is that, she doesn't bottom out mid-corner anymore.

[Rehaan]

Originally Posted by ananthkamath

....I find it hard to believe that such a drastic change has not changed the limit understeer of GTO's car.....

I don't really think its such a "drastic change".

Its fairly low durometer rubber in this case, maybe you're envisioning it to be a lot harder?

Originally Posted by sgiitk

In gross terms we agree. So let us leave it at that.

cya
R