[Samba]

Yesterday, I took my Jimny to Jyote Nexa for the 2nd service. These guys did a good job in servicing the vehicle, and I asked them to replace the engine oil too.

Now coming to the main point. When the car was raised on the lift, I went underneath to make an underbelly inspection.
I noticed that there are scratch marks on the propeller shaft, which under extreme articulation or load, rubbed the underbelly of the car.

I just used the car for a road trip to Arunachal, the car has not gone for any proper off-roading. I have heard this same issue with other Jimnys as well. What I feel is, this is in fact, a design flaw when the car was transformed from 3 door to 5 door.

I have officially asked the service center to take it as a complaint, and they have noted it down. I will wait to see how MSIL resolves this issue.

The pics for reference -

[arjab]

Originally Posted by Samba

Now coming to the main point. When the car was raised on the lift, I went underneath to make an underbelly inspection.
I noticed that there are scratch marks on the propeller shaft, which under extreme articulation or load, rubbed the underbelly of the car.

This is a very serious design issue which Suzuki should acknowledge at the earliest and immediately start taking corrective steps.

I am shocked by the fact that: how could this clash go undetected by Maruti and Suzuki's Vehicle Integration team at the DMU stage? How could CAE overlook this? Or was sufficient CAE not done?
I have a feeling that some smart aleck took the 3-door's propshaft kinematic study and extrapolated it to the 5-door's. In real life, the longer prop + the spongy rear suspension setp, teamed up to knock the propshaft against the cross member.

What is the remedy then? A complete redesign of the cross-member. If the cross member is a bolted one, (i have not checked on that), then the redesign can be done a bit quicker and retrofit kits can be sent out to dealers. But if the cross-member is welded to the side-long members then the issue is more complex as redesign and changes has to be done at assembly/manufacturing line level.

Another alternative can be to put a chamfer / notch - basically "scoop or shave" off a part of the metal on the underside of the cross-member. Add a pair of stiffer rear dampers and it should work.

Whatever it is this is a big dent to the reputation of "japanese design and manufacturing process excellence", blah-blah. All the more so because the Jimny is not a new model. It has been soldiering on for decades in Suzuki's lineup, and by this time Suzuki and Maruti engineers should know the car in and out, blindfolded.
Guess they don't.

[gsferrari]

Originally Posted by Samba

.
I noticed that there are scratch marks on the propeller shaft, which under extreme articulation or load, rubbed the underbelly of the car.

Fyi Maruti is aware of this. I raised the issue several months back. There was a call with the entire product team (engineering, chassis, drivetrain, suspension etc.). Couple of weeks back a team of 7 engineers from different departments flew to Chennai to inspect two vehicles exhibiting this issue, mine included. A third vehicle was also there but we ran out of time.

I'm assuming Maruti is taking this very seriously. I have forwarded your post to the PR and engineering teams today.

If I get any sort of update, which is unlikely given the serious nature of this issue, I will update here. A more realistic expectation can be to hear from Maruti in a few months with some sort of recall to install be parts that fix this issue. We should also not be surprised to hear complete silence. Anything is possible.

Rest assured enough noise has been made and yours is the first public post regarding this and I am sure any urgency that may have been lacking until now would have kicked into high gear. This is a PR disaster they need to resolve asap.

[arjab]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

I'm assuming Maruti is taking this very seriously.

More than Maruti; Suzuki should be acting double quick on this design issue. The Jimny is an export vehicle.
Similar complaints by Jimny users from other countries can rake up painful memories for Suzuki, making them reminesce about Jimny's Grandfather's toppling incident in the ninety's. Not a plesant thought.
And if any propshaft or cross member or any other component fails, due to this design fault, in countries other than India, then those people will not be as condescending or forgiving like us Indians.
They will can go legal and it'll be a mess for Suzuki. As it is consumer protection laws in other countries are far stronger than ours.

Originally Posted by gsferrari

If I get any sort of update, which is unlikely given the serious nature of this issue, I will update here.

Thanks Guru. Deeply appreciate

Originally Posted by gsferrari

A more realistic expectation can be to hear from Maruti in a few months with some sort of recall to install be parts that fix this issue.

I think they will redesign the cross member, validate it and incorporate the changes in Jimny 5-door Version 2.0
As for the rest of us: expect a classic Maruti response of "Case by Case analysis and inspection by authorised service centre"

Originally Posted by gsferrari

This is a PR disaster they need to resolve asap.

More than PR, this is a slap in the face of the much touted "Japanese Engineering Excellence"
We continuously crib and rant, including Team BHP members, that one should never buy Tata and Mahindra Version 1.0 products as they'll be riddled with bugs and it is best to wait for Version 2.0 of their products.

What is this then?

I strongly request Team-BHP Moderators to please put this Jimny Propellor shaft strike issue on a separate thread so that others affected can put forward their cases as well.

Let's hope for some solution. Fingers crossed.

[gsferrari]

I'm not trying to shield MSIL but they've been very proactive. It is easy to throw tantrums, a bit harder to work towards a solution. I'm normally a "throw my fists around" kind of guy but in this case, I want to work with MSIL, give them all the feedback and evidence they need to fix this for all of us who paid full/discounted price.

If anyone else has this issue, please post here or in any new thread created for this purpose and I will share it with the Maruti engineering and PR teams.

[arjab]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

I'm not trying to shield MSIL but they've been very proactive. It is easy to throw tantrums, a bit harder to work towards a solution. I'm normally a "throw my fists around" kind of guy but in this case, I want to work with MSIL, give them all the feedback and evidence they need to fix this for all of us who paid full/discounted price.

If anyone else has this issue, please post here or in any new thread created for this purpose and I will share it with the Maruti engineering and PR teams.

Absolutely 100% agree.
Suggestion to MSIL, if they can depute their service personnel stationed in the respective regions to inspect and collect evidence of the propstrike issue, alongwith the respective vehicles' VIN nos, we'll be glad to facilitate their visit and extend our co-operation.

[BlrAutoZen]

I have a Jimny booking and now with this issue, I am thinking of cancelling the booking. Based on the discussion on the issue in this forum, it looks like this is a design issue and cannot be fixed with a recall. I am not an auto expert so looking for advice from esteemed members if this issue is serious enough to wait for Jimny 2.0

[shree_shell]

Originally Posted by BlrAutoZen

I have a Jimny booking and now with this issue, I am thinking of cancelling the booking. Based on the discussion on the issue in this forum, it looks like this is a design issue and cannot be fixed with a recall. I am not an auto expert so looking for advice from esteemed members if this issue is serious enough to wait for Jimny 2.0

I am in similar situation and would like to hear from existing/ previous Maruti owners. My Dad and I have narrowed our search down to Jimny, as a reliable beater, and a robust off roader to drive to our remote farms. The car will be mainly used by my parents since I don’t live in India.

My current strategy is to get clarification from the dealer about this issue, before putting the money down, and perhaps even using this issue as a bargaining point to get even better discounts. I am trusting Maruti’s “customer satisfaction” and reliability record here to rectify this issue during our ownership. This could be our first Maruti after 25 years.

[bj96]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

...
If anyone else has this issue, please post here...

This "bangle" on the propeller shaft seems to be clearly visible even in the sideways fallen Jimny from Rock-N-Road event posted earlier in the thread at the below post. I'm reposting the pic with mark highlighted below.

Originally Posted by pepega

Provisional results declared for the finale of Rock N Road ...
Attachment 2585913
...

Until the issue is understood and sorted, I think, it is safer to avoid extreme offroading with Jimny? Please keep us posted. Thanks for taking this up with the right authorities .

-BJ

[Aditya]

Maruti Jimny: Propeller shaft rubs against car underbelly under extreme articulation or load - Posts moved to a new thread.

[Jeroen]

Before we have yet another thread where most of are esteemed members are going to be up in arms about a manufacturer and alleged quality and or design issues, I suggest to understand what is happening first.

We need to understand under how much load this is happening. The OP mentions

Extreme articulation or load

. Not sure what he means. Cars don’t get designed for extreme articulation and or loads. But cars get designed for certain maximums. They will be mentioned in the owner manual. If you go beyond those all bets are off.

Should be very easy to verify under what conditions this happens. If it well above what has been specified you can’t really blame the manufacturer. If it’s under, you have real data to support your argument towards the manufacturer.

So far, all we have an image and opinions. This is an easy one to get very concrete.

Just get under that car with a camera, pile in people and stuff and take images of the clearance.

Jeroen

[Samba]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

Should be very easy to verify under what conditions this happens. If it well above what has been specified you can’t really blame the manufacturer. If it’s under, you have real data to support your argument towards the manufacturer.

Hello Jeroen,

The maximum load, the car carried was 4 people. That too for a very short distance. The load capacity of the car was never exceeded.

Extreme articulation = Crossed few ridges where it required a good amount of articulation, but none of the wheels ever left the ground. It was not even required to engage the 4wd. ESP off in 2wd itself was enough to take the car through.

This car is meant to carry 4 people, and where a wheel is not even leaving the ground, the propeller shaft should not touch the cross member. Offroad vehicles are meant for this. And on quite a few vehicles this issue have been reported.
Even under extreme condition where the wheel leaves the ground, the propeller shaft should not touch the cross member, if the vehicle is carrying permissible load.

Please check this link too -

https://des-sol.co.za/product/cross-member/

Abroad, there is a redesigned cross member available for people who opt for a lift kit in Jimny. But here, my car is totally stock including the tyres.

So in all aspect, this looks like a design flaw when the car was being redesigned from 3 door to 5 door.

What you told is absolutely right, by taking the car where a good amount of articulation is required, and then adding load to the car and then taking the pic or video of the cross member touching the propeller shaft will make more sense.
But isn't that the duty of the R&D department of MSIL to check and report back when quite a few number of customers have reported the same issue?
Are the customers supposed to do this?

If required I can even sort this out by some DIYs, but I won't do that as the car is in warranty.

All I can confidently say is - The terrain on which my car has been driven, and the load my car carried, this should not happen.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by Samba

The maximum load, the car carried was 4 people. That too for a very short distance. The load capacity of the car was never exceeded...

...But isn't that the duty of the R&D department of MSIL to check and report back when quite a few number of customers have reported the same issue?
Are the customers supposed to do this?...

We have a large number of threads on the forum where it is alleged there is a fundamental problem with a car. All these threads have the same in common. There is always somebody with a story/experience. Then a bunch of members chirp in with opinions. What all of these threads lack completely is simple and unbiased data.

You say the car was driven with only four persons. But apparently you did not hear it? So something else might have happened. That is why it is much more convincing and much more constructive to gather some real data.

In this case it is extremely simple and it won’t affect your warranty at all. Simply get your phone/camera out and start taking images underneath the car as you pile more and more people in.

That is easily done, easily documented and it would also be far more impactful making your point towards the manufacturer.

The problem with all these threads is, everybody gets on their high horse, folks become indignant and starts assigning blame to the manufacturer. But when push comes to shove we only have stories and opinions to go by.

So gather data, because it makes your story a hundred times better. I have no opinion on what happened here. But I can think of all kinds of reasons as to why this happened.

Jeroen

[shree_shell]

I can confirm that Maruti is indeed aware of this. We discussed this issue yesterday evening when we were about to put down the booking amount at a dealership in Pune. We were told that Maruti is working on a solution for this and will likely implement it during the first service. I would take this reaffirmation with a grain of salt, but at the same time, I believe Maruti will resolve it; as other Bhpians have said, a lot is at stake for Maruti here especially because this is an export product. If they don't fix it, I will turn to the aftermarket solution (@Samba has suggested a potential solution above).

Anyway, I went ahead with the purchase while being aware of this issue. It's the Thunder edition in Alpha AT trim in Kinetic Yellow, with all the farkles. I am not sure if others sitting on the fence while knowing this issue should do the same, perhaps I am used to owning cars with known serious flaws which makes excusing Maruti easier - be it my '07 M-coupe's S54 engine, or our '20 Octavia's DSG - both have not thrown any tantrums yet. However, they all, including Jimny, have an irreplaceable character and are nearly the best at what they do. Other candidates in contention were the Hyryder and Grand Vitara, and the Jimny seemed like a better go-anywhere beater.

[Ton Ami]

Well, this looks serious. The cross member seems to be a welded part hence modifications to it may not be that easy (at least as a retrofit).

I think raised rear suspension can solve this problem. Ofcourse that will impact driving dynamics but there aren't many options for existing owners to solve this problem quickly.