[Cresterk]

Originally Posted by SolidusSnake

Update: I insisted that subframe shift be reversed. I suggested another virtus be brought to help bring subframe to original condition.
This was done and my car’s subframe was restored, voila, alignment values including caster all came into limit. Steering feedback, weight again became normal. However left pulling issue persists as before, to keep car going straight, steering has to be tilted to right. VcDS cable connected, no error code in power steering system. Alignment checked multiple times, matches with the other Virtus, values of both the cars attached below.
What to do now?, service guys clueless, help me out

Have they tried resetting/recalibrating the steering angle sensor? My hyundai had the same issue because some geniuses forgot to reset the angle sensor after alignment, making the EPS think the steering isn't centered and thus constantly steering towards the left. No one had any idea what it was till a senior technician stepped in.

[Newtown]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

There are other possibilities too, such as play in one of the steering components, wheel bearings and such. But that is even more unlikely on a new car.

The Taigun had a recall for wheel bearings which was done at the 6-month inspection. Very well could be the bearings as well as you mention.

[teja030]

Originally Posted by zeng

Interesting that the computer does not detect and require the need to recalibrate the steering angle sensor aka zero calibration after restoring subframe position by the VW dealership.

The Computer in case of VW Virtus does not detect and give an error code to Re-calibrate the Steering Angle Sensor.
Re-calibration has to be done proactively after a Wheel Alignment to correct all the tilts, pulls etc on the SW if detected.
Issues after Wheel Alignment related to the SW have been observed on many Vehicle brands which were subsequently corrected with the help of SAS calibration .

[teknophobia]

IIRC, there used to be a time when a lot of European cars are manufactured with a slight left pull to correct for the slope of the roads. When the same cars were sold in RHD markets, the left pull got exacerbated due to the opposite sloping of the road.

There was a documented solution involving a sub frame shift. Seems to be a similar issue here.

[SolidusSnake]

Update: a technician from plant in Pune came, he recalibrated the steering angle sensor, quite a elaborate process, he drove the car with a laptop attached for quite a bit. Voila, car now drives properly. As per him if sensor is not properly calibrated, steering looses all the feedback.
Further as per him subframe is never to be touched unless there is damage and those bolts are single use. He got my subframe bolts replaced with new ones

[Sankar]

Originally Posted by SolidusSnake

Update: a technician from plant in Pune came, he recalibrated the steering angle sensor, quite a elaborate process, he drove the car with a laptop attached for quite a bit. Voila, car now drives properly. As per him if sensor is not properly calibrated, steering looses all the feedback.

As I had suggested on the very first page of this thread. If sensor is not properly calibrated EPS will go nuts.

Originally Posted by Sankar

Would suggest that OP get the steering angle sensor value checked with steering held straight.

Originally Posted by SolidusSnake

Further as per him subframe is never to be touched unless there is damage and those bolts are single use. He got my subframe bolts replaced with new ones

Correct. Re-using TTY old bolts is jugaad it works. Not the best solution.

Originally Posted by Sankar

New bolts should be used.

Service manual calls for new bolts because they would be torque to yield bolts which is designed to stretch during the torquing process. Re-using them will not yield the same clamping force as a new bolt would and the stress cycling during re-use could cause it to fail.

[SolidusSnake]

Originally Posted by Sankar

As I had suggested on the very first page of this thread. If sensor is not properly calibrated EPS will go nuts.





Correct. Re-using TTY old bolts is jugaad it works. Not the best solution.

Indeed my EPS had gone nuts, day and night difference after re calibration

[SolidusSnake]

Originally Posted by Sankar

As I had suggested on the very first page of this thread. If sensor is not properly calibrated EPS will go nuts.
.

Any idea why he had do drive so much with laptop attached to calibrate it?, I thought it would be a simple plug and play process

[Jeroen]

Very glad this appears to be solved now. As i mentioned from very early on messing with the subframe is a bad idea.

On the matter of the re-use of bolts. In my opinion if the official workshop manual and or instruction call for replacing certain bolts and or nuts it needs to be done.

Not all bolts and nuts need replacing every time. It really depends on the design and criticality of certain parts. E.g.on my Mercedes the bolts and nuts that keep the steering box to the chassis can only be used once. Same on my Spider.

I don’t think I have come across any bolts on my Jaguar that can only be used once. BUT, any selflocking nut should really only be used once. And every car has quite a number of those. You can re-use the respective bolt,but the self locking nut can only be used once.

These one time use bolts, when torqued to the correct value ensure the part is kept in place. However, they loose some of their elasticity, so that is the reason you can’t use them twice.

I am glad they did replace those bolts as well. Unfortunately, and one or two replies in this thread are testimony to that, there are plenty of mechanics and wannabe mechanics who don’t understand why you can use a bolt/nut once. Run a mile from them!

Jeroen

[SolidusSnake]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

Very glad this appears to be solved now. As i mentioned from very early on messing with the subframe is a bad idea.
ace.
Jeroen

The plant technician view was that shifting subframe, which as per him should never have been done messed up the sensor calibration and that’s why sensor had to be recalibrated. But there is this lingering doubt in my mind, that my subframe was loosened 3 times and shifted, therefore it probably has changed from the factory default position. Am I overthinking it, if not can I do anything about it?

[SolidusSnake]

See the pics of left and right wheels, to my eye it seems that suspension component visible in the pic is at a different angle on left and right wheel, is it normal? can it be due to the subframe shift performed on my car?

[teja030]

Originally Posted by SolidusSnake

The plant technician view was that shifting subframe, which as per him should never have been done messed up the sensor calibration and that’s why sensor had to be recalibrated. But there is this lingering doubt in my mind, that my subframe was loosened 3 times and shifted, therefore it probably has changed from the factory default position. Am I overthinking it, if not can I do anything about it?

I am glad the issue has been resolved and it was just what I had thought of and mentioned quite a few times earlier in my posts. Unfortunately, SAS calibration & Wheel Alignment are the most neglected things on 80% of cars coming out of Chakan, Pune Plant. I have corroborated this fact with several recent VW owners . The team appointed for this job off-late in the VW plant must have been the most inexperienced and lacklustre team to say the least. VW India has to correct this immediately if somebody is listening. It’s the steering compartment buddy ! No messing with it ! It Can be deadly .

Unfortunately, most VW service centers are also unaware & inexperienced regarding SAS calibration. They do the Wheel Alignment 10 times but will never think out of the box. The catch is in SAS calibration. When your SW is accurately calibrated with a good WA / WB, I have observed that the ride quality, handling would be accurate and top notch with no pulling whatsoever. Unaware, many owners bang their heads unable to resolve the pulling and SW issues. . And as service center technicians are also unaware, this gets even more complicated and remains unresolved for months & years together for a vehicle owner.

But, let me tell you, the pre-2013 VWs were handled with precision and care at VW Factories . These kind of issues never popped up whatsoever on vehicles. I can tell you this with experience.

And coming to your actual issue, SAS calibration is nowhere linked to the Subframe shift. Ofcourse, Subframe shift would affect the overall handling of the vehicle but does not disturb the SAS once set . To be honest, your SW calibration was not done properly at Factory itself. What the VW plant technician just told you was a just a pure ‘whitewash’ for their errors and in his attempt to protect his colleagues for their lack of knowledge and assessment. I am not surprised, the guys at VW Service Center never raised the issue of SAS calibration with you, simply put they are just not aware. If they were trained on this, you could have simply avoided the entire hassle.

VW India has to step in and address this issue asap to avoid further hassle to customers by saving their time and peace of mind. Hyundai technicians are well trained on this. They check SAS calibration proactively if any handling, pulling issue pops up on their vehicles.

[SolidusSnake]

My steering seems much heavier when moving on left side when car is in speed than on right side, what can be the cause

[Kosfactor]

Originally Posted by SolidusSnake

My steering seems much heavier when moving on left side when car is in speed than on right side, what can be the cause

Looking at the pictures you had posted earlier - please take the vehicle to an independent alignment specialist, let them diagnose the problem and see if its something they can fix or it needs ASC support. Most likely the ASC has messed up something earlier.

[zeng]

Originally Posted by SolidusSnake

Update: I insisted that subframe shift be reversed. I suggested another virtus be brought to help bring subframe to original condition.
This was done and my car’s subframe was restored, voila, alignment values including caster all came into limit. Steering feedback, weight again became normal. However left pulling issue persists as before, to keep car going straight, steering has to be tilted to right. VcDS cable connected, no error code in power steering system. Alignment checked multiple times, matches with the other Virtus, values of both the cars attached below.
What to do now?, service guys clueless, help me out

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attac...a3f794b7e.jpeg

As I said before, there is nothing wrong with this Virtus chassis and the suspension components are generally functioning as it should.

IMO, the guys from dealer/VW attending to this alignment is doing a great job in listening to your 'complaint' and attempt to deal with it positively and I consider the outcome of this alignment as among the better done I've seen online or here in bhp, albeit with some minor imperfection which is beyond the resposibility/shoulder of the service guy on the ground that you dealt with.

Granted, you're sensitive enough to sense the minor imperfection and acknowledged by the guys involved.

The recalibration of steering angle sensor carried out does not resolve the vehicle pull left problem and steering wheel off-centre problem. It is basically a wheel alignment problem.

I would say your best bet is to return to this particular alignment facility (hopefully with the same alignment rack AND the same alignment tech with repeatable alignment readings) and adjust the Front Left Camber more negative from current -0°45' to say -1°00' to -1°15' range AND balanced front toes of say, +°05' each side to be followed with a joint test drive.

Patience (by the alignment guys) is called for in order to meet your expectation (which I believe is justified and valid).