[audioholic]

Originally Posted by channelv

Will switching off "Äuto Off" in city help? as the vehicle starts and stops several times in city or crowded roads.

That way engine will be continuously "ön" for longer periods of time.

Can that be a possible cure for DPF issues?

I dont think thats going to help. This is a feature offered by a manufacturer who would have internally made such an analysis before deeming it fit for the feature list. If the start stop was detrimental to the functioning of DPF then it would not be offered at all.

If DPF regeneration is taking place, start stop system would be disabled internally until the process is complete, and also would not be enabled until other operating parameters are normal. In addition to this, keeping the engine on for longer periods of time would not improve the condition but worsen it. Hence, start stop system would actually work in reducing the rate of soot build up in the DPF. Hence, manually disabling the start stop system and then idling the car in traffic would only do worse than better.

[hserus]

Originally Posted by audioholic

I dont think thats going to help. This is a feature offered by a manufacturer who would have internally made such an analysis before deeming it fit for the feature list. If the start stop was detrimental to the functioning of DPF then it would not be offered at all.

A lot of ifs .. the fact remains that dpf fill up keeps happening despite this in thick traffic as well as in the hills. Is the root cause bad fuel? Wrong grade of engine oil filled by dealerships who don’t want to maintain one oil for bs6 one for bs4?

[Bibendum90949]

Originally Posted by hserus

Wrong grade of engine oil filled by dealerships who don’t want to maintain one oil for bs6 one for bs4?

We certainly know of a case with bhpian srikanthmadhava's BS6 Creta filled with engine oil specified for BS4 Creta and so are the other Cretas that had come for oil change till the goof up was unearthed. Hope Toyota has not made any such slip-ups at dealer level, which is very unlikely.

Originally Posted by srikanthmadhava

I took help from the same service advisor and he took me to the barrel of oil that was being used. To my disappointment, it was 5W-30 A5/B5 spec.
I quickly showed him the Hyundai website and my car manual and we met the service manager to discuss on the same. Service manager verified the manual and made some calls to confirm the required oil and he asked me to wait in the lobby for sometime.

He came back saying that they have the updated oil in stock and he himself offered to replace the A5 one with the correct spec. He took me to the barrels to verify the spec and they had an unopened barrel of the perfect spec OW-20 C5 fully synthetic oil. He also reminded his team about double checking and using the new oil in BS6 diesels cars.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by hserus

A lot of ifs .. the fact remains that dpf fill up keeps happening despite this in thick traffic as well as in the hills. Is the root cause bad fuel? Wrong grade of engine oil filled by dealerships who don’t want to maintain one oil for bs6 one for bs4?

As systems get more complex, there will be lot more ifs and buts that are present than one can expect. Unless you continuously monitor DPF health while driving, its impossible to judge what difference start stop, remap, AC off or any other load difference on engine would make. Theoretically, for X amount of fuel burnt in the engine, there is Y amount of soot generated. The relation between X and Y would change based on various conditions. But the basic principle stays. Hence, if you are reducing fuel consumption by start stop, soot production must also be lesser for a given duration of time. That need not directly imply that by using start stop we would not face any issues of DPF, nor vice versa. That is a wrong conclusion to make.

About wrong oil I dont think thats the case especially with a manufacturer like Toyota. Their service processes are highly organized and as I saw in the first service of my Innova, they had the correct oil for DPF vehicles and filled the same. After all, emission warranty still exists and they would be held responsible if the wrong oil was filled and face the wrath of TKM. I suspect this is a fuel related issue or random issue outside of the exhaust after treatment. Considering how well the two models ie Innova and Fortuner have been selling, the issue is not so common.

[channelv]

Originally Posted by audioholic

I dont think thats going to help. This is a feature offered by a manufacturer who would have internally made such an analysis before deeming it fit for the feature list. If the start stop was detrimental to the functioning of DPF then it would not be offered at all.

If DPF regeneration is taking place, start stop system would be disabled internally until the process is complete, and also would not be enabled until other operating parameters are normal. In addition to this, keeping the engine on for longer periods of time would not improve the condition but worsen it. Hence, start stop system would actually work in reducing the rate of soot build up in the DPF. Hence, manually disabling the start stop system and then idling the car in traffic would only do worse than better.

I don't have technical knowledge on this and appreciate all the views.

IMHO, putting off start/stop mechanism might have helped because generally Diesels aren't meant for short drives (which cause frequent start/stop).

Also, Automatic Idling Stop/Start Function- is only offered on Automatic 4Wd Fortuner and Legender.

Are these the only Fortuners having this issue?

[starter]

As far as i know, with the recent price hike, there are a couple of changes in the fortuner.
One of them is the removal of start/stop in automatic fortuners.
Whether it's because of DPF issues or some cost saving measure is unclear.

[hserus]

Originally Posted by starter

As far as i know, with the recent price hike, there are a couple of changes in the fortuner.
One of them is the removal of start/stop in automatic fortuners.
Whether it's because of DPF issues or some cost saving measure is unclear.

When a top end Scorpio has start / stop, side bending & follow me home lamps etc and cars twice the price don't you start to wonder whether you're really getting your money's worth.

Toyota manages to sell even barebones taxicab spec innovas at astronomical rates, just because of its reputation for reliability. Wonderful how they manage it.

[starter]

Originally Posted by hserus

When a top end Scorpio has start / stop, side bending & follow me home lamps etc and cars twice the price don't you start to wonder whether you're really getting your money's worth.

Toyota manages to sell even barebones taxicab spec innovas at astronomical rates, just because of its reputation for reliability. Wonderful how they manage it.

To each their own. For me personally, i find these start stop functions annoying - to the point that I hate them.

End of the day, people put their money only where they see value.
Gone are the days where manufacturer can think they can sell anything and people take it.
Food for thought for Mahindra i guess. If they could improve on their reliability, market is willing to pay a premium.
Anyway, we are digressing from this thread.

[Rahul Rao]

DPF issue occurs to vehicles that have less usage between starts and stops, and people who rev up to high rpm's before engine has warmed up completely.

The Fortuner has a long stroke small bore engine which is common in haulers and commercial vehicles, so I will talk about my experience with CV's and their DPF related issues here.

I am an Automotive sub assembly manufacturer, and many CV owners send their vehicles directly to us bi-passing dealers, so I can talk to vehicle owners and drivers to gauge service related issues. My components for buses carry a 18 month 5 lakh km warranty, and those who have actually kept their vehicles on roads for 20 hr 1000 km a day actually spend less on maintenance annually than those whose buses run 7 to 10 Hrs and 400-600 km a day. The runners can manage between 20 to 30 lakh km before the engine is first touched except for oil change.
CV's where the owner has opted for high power engines and used them on flat roads have faced dpf problem's, where as CV's with lower power engines on flat roads and both lower and higher power engines in hilly regions do not fqace these issues.

My advice to friends here is buy a BS6 diesel only if you have a 500km+ run once a month, secondly use the power you have bought. Many here buy SUV's with 160+ bhp at 4500 rpm and use it to cruse at 100kph in 6th at 1200rpm where your engine is actually generating barely 40-45 Hp.
Floor your car when you are in ghats generate power take it to 120 in 3rd gear, and most important take at least one moderate drive (400-500km) a month, your engine will be happy and in turn you will be happy.
If a 220 Hp 16 ton bus that cruises at 80 engine ticking an gentle 1100 rpm in 6th can get its DPF choked up where as its 165hp option which ticks over at 1350 rpm in 6th doing 80, but sees an occasional 2500 rpm when the driver floors it in 4th to overtake a slow truck on a gradient never faces this issue you should understand that the source of dpf problem is under utilization.
Note the same 220 Hp engine in a 46 ton semi trailer does not face clogging issue.

Rahul

[hserus]

Originally Posted by Rahul Rao

DPF issue occurs to vehicles that have less usage between starts and stops, and people who rev up to high rpm's before engine has warmed up completely.

So wait a bit for the engine to warm up / turbo to spool down when switching on and off the engine, don't lug the engine, and give it an occasional italian tuneup and that's more than enough, in a nutshell?

[cool_dube]

Some relevant content from Toyota India website - here

Specifically with regards to high-altitude driving, it has been clearly mentioned that DPF regeneration (auto as well as manual) will NOT occur above altitude corresponding to atmospheric pressure of 60kPa, which is ~4,000 m AMSL.

Both automatic & manual regeneration will not occur due to environmental conditions in high altitudes where atmospheric pressure is less than 60 Kpa.

Net-net, if one is driving at such high altitudes for extended duration, there is a high probability of DPF clogging out, and consequently, the vehicle breaking down! There is no mention of the time/distance window one has, to get down to lower altitudes. This is an absolute bummer. How is it with other BS6 diesel vehicles which come equipped with DPF? As far as I remember, there was no such constraint mentioned in the owner's manual of my BS6 Endeavour 2.0.

[TT-S]

Originally Posted by cool_dube

Some relevant content from Toyota India website - here

Specifically with regards to high-altitude driving, it has been clearly mentioned that DPF regeneration (auto as well as manual) will NOT occur above altitude corresponding to atmospheric pressure of 60kPa, which is ~4,000 m AMSL.

Most of the hill stations in India are below 4000 meters, right? It seems like only Leh, Ladakh and places closer to Himalayas are above 4k meters above sea level.

[cool_dube]

Originally Posted by TT-S

Most of the hill stations in India are below 4000 meters, right? It seems like only Leh, Ladakh and places closer to Himalayas are above 4k meters above sea level.

Yes, except the Himalayas, one will not find such altitudes anywhere in India. Even in the Himalayas, most of the "base" locations - Leh, Kaza, Tawang, etc. where one is likely to spend most of the time - are around or below this altitude. So, the risky part would be traversing the high altitude passes enroute these destinations, as almost all passes on the way to Ladakh or Spiti are above 4000 m. The key would be to spend as less a time as possible at higher altitudes and get down to lower areas ASAP. Good for the car as well as your lungs

On a lighter note, Toyota should have provided a barometer or an altimeter in the BS6 Fortuner

[AnandB]

Originally Posted by cool_dube

Some relevant content from Toyota India website - here

Specifically with regards to high-altitude driving, it has been clearly mentioned that DPF regeneration (auto as well as manual) will NOT occur above altitude corresponding to atmospheric pressure of 60kPa, which is ~4,000 m AMSL.



Net-net, if one is driving at such high altitudes for extended duration, there is a high probability of DPF clogging out, and consequently, the vehicle breaking down! There is no mention of the time/distance window one has, to get down to lower altitudes. This is an absolute bummer. How is it with other BS6 diesel vehicles which come equipped with DPF? As far as I remember, there was no such constraint mentioned in the owner's manual of my BS6 Endeavour 2.0.

Another member here had DPF issues in his BS6 Tucson when he went to Ladakh:

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/trave...ml#post5143907 (Assam To Ladakh in a Hyundai Tucson)

Am happy i got my Kodiaq before BS6 became mandatory and had no issues myself last month.

[Slushmaster]

Question related to the Adblue, is it ok to put the Adblue/ Urea fluid available on HPCL/IOCL petrol pumps. My Feb 2021 Fortuner has started giving warning and there is still 1600 KMs of range left as per display. Talked to the Service adviser and he said get it filled from any petrol pump. It is also coming out to be cheaper at rupees 560 for a 20 litres bucket, the only problem is that all fuel stations have only 20l bucket in stock. Please advise.

Thanks,
Slushmaster