[sirjokhi]

Why am I not surprised by this? My Octavia VRS' front grill chrome started peeling off in the first six months itself. When I tried to claim warranty, they simply denied the claim by stating I used a chemical which had a reaction resulting to this. I never used any sort of chemical but it is impossible to prove, isn't it? Having the extended warranty for 4 years, I started getting it serviced from a friend's garage because the aftersales is so pathetic. I am anyways not going to get a claim, why should I suffer? Same answer has been given for your vehicle. This shows VAG has a complete sheet of excuses probably handed over to their employees to fool customers in different cases of warranty claims. I had hoped Audi would be different but that doesn't seem to be the case. I'm really sorry for what you're going through.

[no_fear]

@prateekchanana

Out of curiosity - have you ever had any detailing work done on your car, especially the seats. I am just curious as certain chemicals trigger the oxidation process faster.

Looking at your pictures, I noticed that the oxidation process is very uniform and along the strips of leather upholstery that form the inner part of the seats than the outer. It makes sense as the outer and inner layers are stitched together.

bmwlover also said it correctly - different leather pieces were used, which combined with the different chemical treatment the two separate pieces received are causing this issue.

Normal leather wear and tear / discoloring usually happens on the seat part where our backsides rest. Its most pronounced in edges and center of seat which has the most contact with human body. Its rare for the seat back to fade uniformly like the seat bottom. The fade pattern is also very uniform and not concentrated. So clearly this is a manufacturing defect.

Going back to the supplier issue - yes, you and kiku007 are correct that Audi should own up to supplier defects and compensate you fully. But I am highly doubtful if Audi will even bother to listen. Audi will argue that this is normal wear tear or the customer has used car detailing products which damaged the integrity of the component and Audi wont be held liable. It's a matter of he said / she said. Most car makers never play nice, however famous or reputable they are.

[Singh101]

Yikes!

Anyone else get the shivers imagining yourself in the shoes of the OP, having bought a supposedly premium German sedan, having paid much higher taxes on it, insuring it for much more than the average Joe does his or her's, loving and maintaining and running it- all costing more than your average car owner's running costs (read detailing, service costs, premium fuels et al.)?

On one end, there's resignation. "Yeh India hai, yahan aisa hi hota hai.", correct? On the other end, there's digging trenches and waging war. I wonder if I could keep my composure if I'm ever in the position of owning what I thought to be a premium car, a premium ownership experience and am faced with this treatment. I am of the opinion that violence has no place in an educated, civilised society but it'll take a lot more than breathing exercises to keep me from blowing my lid.

Sucky move, Audi India. VAG is easily the worst offender when it comes to customer harrassment. Though let's not forget-

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...-rejected.html (BMW X1 Crystallized Headlamps warranty claim rejected)

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...39-000-km.html (Volvo S90 : Interior, leather and cosmetic issues after just 39,000 km)

*sigh*

So much for premium cars, eh?

[SuperSuri]

I’ve used the services of Jaspreet in the past for my i20 and a Mercedes C43S AMG, must say he is the best in the business. If he refuses, then I would suggest looking for brand new leather for the seats.

Keep us posted.

Let me know if you need any help with a custom seat installer as I know one guy in south delhi who does custom interiors on luxury segment cars. But he might take time to complete the job.

Thanks for the contact details of Mr. Jaspreet, in fact I did a quick search for leather detailers in Delhi today and came across his name and detailing devils. Was planning to contact them soon, in fact Mr. Jaspreet is very close to where I live and will definitely give it a shot with him first soon.

[prateekchanana]

Originally Posted by no_fear

@prateekchanana

Out of curiosity - have you ever had any detailing work done on your car, especially the seats. I am just curious as certain chemicals trigger the oxidation process faster.

Normal leather wear and tear / discoloring usually happens on the seat part where our backsides rest. Its most pronounced in edges and center of seat which has the most contact with human body. Its rare for the seat back to fade uniformly like the seat bottom. The fade pattern is also very uniform and not concentrated. So clearly this is a manufacturing defect.

Going back to the supplier issue - yes, you and kiku007 are correct that Audi should own up to supplier defects and compensate you fully. But I am highly doubtful if Audi will even bother to listen. Audi will argue that this is normal wear tear or the customer has used car detailing products which damaged the integrity of the component and Audi wont be held liable. It's a matter of he said / she said. Most car makers never play nice, however famous or reputable they are.

Hi @no_fear, as I mentioned before in another post, I have not got any done work on the cars interiors yet as the need for it never raised with my usage. What I noticed yesterday while taking the pictures and observing closely that the fade is more apparent on the rear bench which are less used. The front seats are getting restored to original color in some parts or may be they had lesser fade since begging comparatively.

You are right regarding what audi is saying and I did not want to get involved in who said what. If it was a smaller issue I would have let it go and get it replaced myself. Like after the second service my car came back with a missing cap of wiper fluid liquid. Now in those two years the only time I had seen inside the hood was during taking the delivery and then before and after the first service of the car. The posting of wiper fluid in audi is very different from my other cars as it is located in the right corner of the upper hood right above the end of front wheel (image attached for reference). I never noticed it being there or missing all three times.


image source - audiworld.com

So when the car came back post service, the invoice mentioned as washer fluid cap missing in comments. I asked why was this not notified when the car went in, and also that I have never replaced it myself or even open the hood till date, how can it suddenly go missing? I further asked the SA to check that may be they forgot to put it back post refilling the washer fluid. The Audi Gurugram SA told me sir its not something that can happen at our service centre. As the first service was done at Audi Delhi West, and it was under renovation during my second service, the SA told me may be it went missing during first service and they failed to mention it. Easier to shift the blame right. I then asked the driver to share the images he took of the engine bay while taking the car in the morning, but the angle did not show the area where the reservoir cap is due to its position.

I decided to let it go and asked the SA that just get me a new one and he said we don't have it in stock and have to order it. He told me it will cost a 1000 bucks or so and will be there in a week, I told him to go ahead. Never heard back from him, found the part number after a month and ordered it of aliexpress (good old aliexpress days). Finding it on any indian website was little tough because its of rectangle shape and not round like most other cars which were easily available everywhere.

Originally Posted by Singh101

On one end, there's resignation. "Yeh India hai, yahan aisa hi hota hai.", correct? On the other end, there's digging trenches and waging war. I wonder if I could keep my composure if I'm ever in the position of owning what I thought to be a premium car, a premium ownership experience and am faced with this treatment. I am of the opinion that violence has no place in an educated, civilised society but it'll take a lot more than breathing exercises to keep me from blowing my lid.

The whole process is so infuriating, but at the same time I've been taught and have learned with time no matter what life throws at you, loosing your calm only makes things worse. But lets not get into this discussion here and take this thread off topic. Its not just Audi, or automotive brands, in many other major brands the customer service experience offered in India compared to other countries has day and night difference. The stricter consumer laws outside are a major help for consumers as well.

Originally Posted by SuperSuri

I’ve used the services of Jaspreet in the past for my i20 and a Mercedes C43S AMG, must say he is the best in the business. If he refuses, then I would suggest looking for brand new leather for the seats.

Keep us posted.

Let me know if you need any help with a custom seat installer as I know one guy in south delhi who does custom interiors on luxury segment cars. But he might take time to complete the job.

Thanks SuperSuri, I couldn't make it to Jaspreet's this week. Will hopefully visit him next week to see what can be done. Will contact you if it doesn't work.

Haven't heard any further update from Audi after my last mail, don't think will hear anything further now either.

[M.Sadhwani]

The SA told me the final approval is done from Audi Germany for such warranty claims as the original warranty is over and the car is now in extended warranty, though it shouldn't matter I think if its the standard warranty or extended. You thinking getting in touch with Autocar India is useful in this case? And if yes on which id shall I drop them a mail ?[/quote]

Facing a similar issue. The arm rest has come loose, the SA has shared a page from the ‘extended warranty exclusions’ which clearly states it does not cover upholstery.
He also mentioned if this was under the standard warranty period they could have replaced the whole assembly. I asked him to show us any signs of mishandling or over use and how it was the owners fault but they just stuck to their extended warranty exclusions. They are expecting me to pay something close to 30k for the whole assembly.
This is a known issue in most of the Q3’s

Also, even if they don’t cover upholstery shouldn’t the control arm fall under moveable parts And should be covered?

However the issue you are facing is completely different but since we’re talking about Audi’s extended warranty support for upholstery I thought sharing this would be appropriate.

[prateekchanana]

Originally Posted by M.Sadhwani

Facing a similar issue. The arm rest has come loose, the SA has shared a page from the ‘extended warranty exclusions’ which clearly states it does not cover upholstery.
He also mentioned if this was under the standard warranty period they could have replaced the whole assembly. I asked him to show us any signs of mishandling or over use and how it was the owners fault but they just stuck to their extended warranty exclusions. They are expecting me to pay something close to 30k for the whole assembly.
This is a known issue in most of the Q3’s

Also, even if they don’t cover upholstery shouldn’t the control arm fall under moveable parts And should be covered?

However the issue you are facing is completely different but since we’re talking about Audi’s extended warranty support for upholstery I thought sharing this would be appropriate.

Thanks for sharing this, but see as per the last phone call form Audi India they clearly told me if it was covered in standard warranty, it would have been covered in extended warranty as well. Now what you shared again conflicts what they told me. Even if its covered in standard warranty, its impossible to prove whether something broke because of carelessness of customer or because the part was faulty.

Just like I am being told that its a chemical reaction and I applied something, I can argue that may be something was applied during the service of my car and a chemical they applied resulted in the discolouration. But there is no end to this, If a customer can trust the the company's authorised service centre are competent enough in handling all aspects of the car and won't do anything that may harm it. The company also trust the customer and believe the same that the customer will never do anything to damage the car.

[vinj14]

Sad to see and hear about this. Could it be that the parts turning yellow are real leather while the other (non-affected) parts are leatherette?
I sincerely hope they solve this issue. I am currently driving a MY2018 A4 with brown leather interiors. Will definitely keep a watch out for any colour change in mine.

[M.Sadhwani]

Originally Posted by prateekchanana

Thanks for sharing this, but see as per the last phone call form Audi India they clearly told me if it was covered in standard warranty, it would have been covered in extended warranty as well. Now what you shared again conflicts what they told me. Even if its covered in standard warranty, its impossible to prove whether something broke because of carelessness of customer or because the part was faulty.

Just like I am being told that its a chemical reaction and I applied something, I can argue that may be something was applied during the service of my car and a chemical they applied resulted in the discolouration. But there is no end to this, If a customer can trust the the company's authorised service centre are competent enough in handling all aspects of the car and won't do anything that may harm it. The company also trust the customer and believe the same that the customer will never do anything to damage the car.

They always look for petty excuses to refuse our claims. Always give them a mindful if they try to cut corners.

My car is still in the workshop, they are replacing the steering rack under extended warranty because of some minute vibrations being felt on the steering wheel, they tried to deny stating the new tyres don’t have the ‘AO’ mark (Audi original) hence we cannot assure you that Audi India will honour the claim.

“The ‘AO’ mark is just a gimmick” quoting Mr.Mark Premji (Premji tyres, thane)

Asked them to write a mail explaining how our regular Michelin’s were any different than their stamped tyres with scientific explanations in technical terms. The case was referred to the senior manager and he agreed to replace it immediately (he’s super cooperative). I’m expecting the vehicle back soon.

Don’t plan to let go the arm rest issue though. Will check some legal aspect into this. It’s just disappointing considering how polite and convincing their sales people are when they pitch us those expensive extended warranty products.

In your case ask them for a proper written justification on how they feel it’s a chemical reaction and which chemicals have been used or simply admit it’s some sort of a defect in the raw materials and get this over with. It might be a third persons fault but the customer and Audi goodwill are the ones suffering.

Try to loop in your sales advisor (the initial dealership sales team) on this. The workshop managers always stay on their toes if the sales team advocates for your case and so will Audi India since they are the ones bringing in numbers. I’ve found this to be useful.

Will try to get some insight on this “chemical reaction” and what has been done in similar cases.
It pains me to see your vehicle in this state.


but just a suggestion from a new bhp’ian to a relatively senior bhp’ian, try to get every justification, explanation or settlement offers on mail or in writing from the concerned person (might be from the workshop end or Audi India executive). This helps if we plan to take this up legally (worst case scenario). Developing a healthy relation with our dealership/workshop is the best thing one can do (since they handle our beloved machines) and the legal course should be our last resort.
But desperate times, desperate measures

Hope this helps.

[prateekchanana]

Originally Posted by vinj14

Sad to see and hear about this. Could it be that the parts turning yellow are real leather while the other (non-affected) parts are leatherette?
I sincerely hope they solve this issue. I am currently driving a MY2018 A4 with brown leather interiors. Will definitely keep a watch out for any colour change in mine.

Even if that's the case, the leather used in that case is faulty and the leatherette is not. No reason to refuse warranty for the same.

I don't think tan or black interiors will face this issue and hope you or anyone else never faces such a problem.

Originally Posted by M.Sadhwani

“The ‘AO’ mark is just a gimmick” quoting Mr.Mark Premji (Premji tyres, thane)

Asked them to write a mail explaining how our regular Michelin’s were any different than their stamped tyres with scientific explanations in technical terms. The case was referred to the senior manager and he agreed to replace it immediately (he’s super cooperative). I’m expecting the vehicle back soon.


In your case ask them for a proper written justification on how they feel it’s a chemical reaction and which chemicals have been used or simply admit it’s some sort of a defect in the raw materials and get this over with. It might be a third persons fault but the customer and Audi goodwill are the ones suffering.

Try to loop in your sales advisor (the initial dealership sales team) on this. The workshop managers always stay on their toes if the sales team advocates for your case and so will Audi India since they are the ones bringing in numbers. I’ve found this to be useful.

Will try to get some insight on this “chemical reaction” and what has been done in similar cases.
It pains me to see your vehicle in this state.


Hope this helps.

Thanks, your case also shows the attitude of service centre in trying to avoid any possible claims even when they are justified. I purchased the car from Audi Gurugram and it was shut down because of the bank scam the dealer was involved in. After the dealership reopened under new management, the original team is completely changed now and the advisor I bought the car form had joined Mercedes last I spoke to him. So there is no way I can contact them.

Will drop them another mail and ask them to give a written justification as they have failed to reply to my last mail for almost 5 days now. Thanks again.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by M.Sadhwani

Asked them to write a mail explaining how our regular Michelin’s were any different than their stamped tyres with scientific explanations in technical terms.

Wow!, that must be a new low across any brand and you have rightly asked for a technical explanation. I hope every new buyer of Audi read this thread and understand what they will be getting into. How different is BMW, I mentioned elsewhere, I got my bellows on the 7 changed despite having a higher size (those were BMW rims but non-RFTs).

[prateekchanana]

Finally met Mr. Jaspreet previous Monday and after looking at the seats he told me upfront that fixing this completely is impossible but he can try to reduce it as much as possible. We decided to drop the car a couple of days later. He told me the cost would be around 4k for just doing the seats and interiors.




The difference is much more noticeable in the rear seat than in the front. The yellowing was also much worse on the rear as compared to the front. Trying to clean it off any more was resulting in the leather coming off so we decided to stop at this. Would eventually have to get the seat covers changed a couple of years later as the leather is definitely damaged. Will look for the same once I am past the extended warranty.

I also got external ceramic coating done from Mr. Jaspreet, sharing the review and pictures of the same in my ownership thread at below link.

Ceramic Coating at Dazzle Detailing (2 years with an Audi A4 - Living my dream)

[greenhorn]

Rather than cleaning it, it might be better to refinish the leather.

I found this place,
http://www.colorglo.in/
You may find someplace similar nearby.

If you are looking at diy, then
https://rubnrestore.com/leather-rest...l-leather-dye/
I'm not able to find such products in India, but just fyi

[prateekchanana]

Originally Posted by greenhorn

Rather than cleaning it, it might be better to refinish the leather.

I found this place,
http://www.colorglo.in/
You may find someplace similar nearby.

If you are looking at diy, then
https://rubnrestore.com/leather-rest...l-leather-dye/
I'm not able to find such products in India, but just fyi

Will try finding someone who can do something like this in Delhi. For now it looks much better than before.

Also I sent an email to Audi on 5th July saying that I am not satisfied with the response but there was no reply to that. Finally mailed them again a week later asking for all the diagnosis report as another member suggested. Also asked them to confirm whether the case has already been marked as close and if it is, at least have the courtesy to reply. Got a reply to this mail after a couple of days which just said they offered their best support on their 50% email and that's what they can do as per their technical guidelines. So that's the end of it from Audi's end. They did not provide me with any diagnosis report and didn't even care to reply to that part of the mail.