[phamilyman]

Summary:
Battery warranties are contentious. OEMs now offer new car comprehensive warranty upto 4 years (Skoda) but the batteries are often warranted for 1 year due to potential for operator error. A battery is 10kg of non-biodegradable plastic plus toxic chemicals - forcing manufacturers to ensure a 3 year replacement warranty as standard will have massive environmental benefits for the nation.

Context:
My limited observation / experience / thesis is - Battery manufacturers offer excellent replacement warranty upto 3 years but car OEMs only warranty battery replacement upto one year.

I suspect car OEMs either buy cheap crappy batteries or simply do not want this headache which battery manufacturers do not shy away from.

Society as a whole will be better off if car OEMs offer the same battery warranty as battery OEMs.


There are tens of thousands of new cars (just 1% of annual new car sales is ~30k) whose batteries are being replaced earlier because of this dichotomy which is results in needless environmental.



(Toyota terms as an illustration - all would be similar)


Why do governments mandate emissions?
Because MY car's emission has negative externalities on the environment. The same can be said about our battery replacement. God only knows how safely battery fluid is handled when our old batteries are sold.

So, why should the same logic not be extended to car batteries?

I suspect many of us have had to change batteries BEFORE 30 months - the real warranty period of a battery!

That said, I am cognizant that the battery is VERY prone to operator error and can be drained / ruined by careless users. I do think such a policy is a minor increase in sticker price but far better for the environment as a country.

As a reference - I am only sharing my warranty battle woes with Toyota as an example of the common man's plight
My context for starting this thread:

I own two cars - both of which needed battery changes before two years:
a. Ford Aspire Apr 2017 - a cell gave problems Nov 2018. The battery was changed in Jan 2019 free of cost by Ford India in the 20k service (Thanks a ton!)


b. Toyota Yaris Aug 2019 - a cell is dead end Oct 2020. The dealer has flatly refused on email and Toyota has NOT responded despite follow up calls ("Sir your call reached enquiry, complaints team will call you back". Only a couple of calls came to understand the problem. Silence otherwise.



Thankfully courtesy WFH - I have a spare car, the spare time and energy to fight Toyota. Not everyone CAN do that.


Coming to bikes:
a. Honda CBR 2015 - Despite once in 4 week use, my Honda CBR's battery survived almost 4.5 years and I am grateful to them for that level of quality
b. Bajaj Pulsar 2005 - The OEM battery lasted 3+ years and gave up due to limited use.

Coming to aftermarket batteries, my experience has been excellent:
a. My 2008 Swift Diesel's first replacement battery gave up at 2 years but courtesy the 2.5 year replacement clause - it was freely replaced AND the replacement ran for almost six years till it was sold!
b. Pulsar 2005 - I switched from non-sealed to cheap aftermarket UPS batteries and none lasted less than 3+ years despite riding <100km a month!

My belief is that this proposal would cause a minor increase in cost of the battery and hence the vehicle, which would be kept in check by competitive dynamics, while ensuring that the environmental benefits are accrued as a nation.

What do you think?a. Please vote - have you had a car battery replaced before 2.5 years?
b. Please share your opinion - do you think the new car battery warranty should be much longer?
c. That said, please share your counter opinions - surely there are complexities in such mandates even if the system wide benefits make sense

[aargee]

OE Panasonic batteries lasted from Mar 2017 to Jun 2020, close to 40 months with 60K on ODO on SCross. After market batteries I think is pretty good in that terms, they all have lasted atleast 6+ months on motorcycles (can't be precise). Amaron on WagonR unbelievably lasted from Jan 2007 to precise Jan 2013 on a 60 month warranty battery. OE Exide battery on CBR lasted from 2011 Jun to 2014 Jul; although I was dissatisfied at that point in time, however now, I think it's OK. That bike has consumed 3 batteries (including OE) in 9 years of time period which I think is pretty good. I've no precise measurement for Activa, but last week was the 4th battery change in 15+ years. But you can ignore this stat because we sometimes run the scooter without battery for few months before buying a new one.

Talking about batteries, Exide IT-500 lasted a whooping 10 years from 2010 Jun to Apr 2020 on a 48 month warranty battery.

Finally to touch base on govt mandate, I think govt has no role in it as there're greater amount than this segment of pollution.

[Eddy]

Maruti changed my battery after 20 months under warranty. No hassles at all. In fact, they sent someone to jump start the car and gave me a replacement car for the 2-3 days it took for them to process the warranty claim.

[Turbohead]

1)Hyundai i20 2009: 3.5 years
2) VW Vento 2014: 2.5 years. The second battery, which was aftermarket, was replaced again after 2.5 years.
3)Suzuki Access 125 2018: Barely 1.5 years.

I can't recollect the data for previous cars.

If I'm not mistaken, battery cost is directly proportional to the life or warranty they usually give. And that is huge cost for a car manufacturer who cheapens out even on tyres to save ₹500

Although you have suggested a noble cause, the government will be least bothered to implement this as it will further increase prices of all vehicles, especially at a time when the people and manufacturers are openly blaming them about the high taxation on cars.

Noble suggestion. Not gonna happen anytime soon.

[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by Turbohead

And that is huge cost for a car manufacturer who cheapens out even on tyres to save ₹500

Although you have suggested a noble cause, the government will be least bothered to implement this as it will further increase prices of all vehicles, especially at a time when the people and manufacturers are openly blaming them about the high taxation on cars.

Noble suggestion. Not gonna happen anytime soon.

Fully agree - but still we must endeavor and TBHP as a forum can force them to do the math. All we need is ONE proactive manufacturer - Tata's unrelenting focus on safer cars has translated into higher sales and brand uplift. Once someone like them takes it up - Maruti will quietly be forced to follow suit - competition is a beautiful thing sir!

Here's what batterybhai.com says for my Yaris:


The delta is 1000Rs a retail customer for a 12L car - I'm willing to bet the incremental cost for Toyota is easily in the range of ₹500-600 if not lesser so unlike tyres where it is harder to quantify a BETTER tyre for the aam aadmi - this leads to brilliant virtue signaling - its the best incremental 500Rs they can spend in their cars!

Its very nice for Toyota to then say - even their battery is warranted upto 3 years. This is stuff like this customers across India care for, understand and relate to.

So to sum up:
- Is the cost dramatically high? Nah - only ~500₹
- Can this be a selling / virtue signaling point for the OEM? YES
- Will customers acknowledge this? Hell yeah!

- Will it lead to better outcomes for the environment? Hell Yeah!


5/9 votes are for car batteries getting replaced before three years which indicates that a 3 year replacement warranty for the battery (driving up quality as a consequence) WILL have considerable positive environmental impact!


No such change is ever easy but is it worth pushing for, as India's pre-eminent community of petrolheads? TOTALLY!


PS: now the reasoning for the mfrs seems very clear to me - they save 500/car, replace the battery for some of the ~10% who seem to have had such issues (going by the votes), and overall net a decent profit!

[Kosfactor]

From a consumer protection perspective this will force manufacturers to add battery saving tech like we see in Hyundai cars or maybe install bigger battery for good measure. Yes cost will go up.

However considering the small number of per capita car ownership in India and that battery is recycled, environment impact is perhaps the least concern here. (No prices for guessing why car owners are at the receiving end of all kinds of taxes as well as blamed for crop burning!!)

Usually good driving practises and periodic maintenance will ensure that battery lasts ~ 5 years without any visible degradation in performance for daily drive vehicles.

More than cars I think it's Scooters that run the battery down quickly.

[airbus]

I would expect any new car battery to last 3+ years minimum. My previous car battery lasted for 6.5 years until I sold the car and current car battery will complete 5 years next month, still going strong. I have replaced my scooter battery after 6.5 years. So, my experience is not bad with manufacturer provided battery.

[landcruiser123]

Why over-regulate? Government can tighten manufacturing standards, but 3 year warranty is too much. Most people I know have got over 3.5 years of battery life. A handful of people I know got theirs replaced for free within a year. And most of the people who got their battery replaced had drivers.

Also, too many variables to consider. For example:
1. City/Highway driving - many people turn on/off their engines regularly in the City which places a load on the battery/starter
2. Fluctuating ambient temperature
3. Usage of AC/ICE systems without starting the engine

If environmental pollution is the real motive behind the proposal, I'd day the Government should improve public transit to reduce dependency on the automobile.

[R2D2]

My car batteries have lasted anywhere from 2.5-4.5 years depending on the car and its usage including the ICE and other accessories fitted. my new car batteries are replaced in the 2-3 year time frame only because I don't want to get stranded having experienced a battery failure at a traffic signal during peak hour traffic decades ago. I will happily replace a battery at the first sign of weakness. Costs me a little over 1.1x a tankful of petrol. And this expense every few years is basically the cost of owning and running a car.

OEM batteries are certainly not as well made as the aftermarket parts and I can confirm to that from experience. As for warranty terms on OEM batteries the warranties are offered by the battery manufacturer not by car manufacturer. I'd have been happy if the battery warranty lasted as long as the car's main warranty but the thing to remember is a battery like brake pads, clutch disc, wiper blades etc are considered consumables and no manufacturer OEM or car will stick their necks out on this one due to the innumerable styles of driving, maintenance and environmental conditions by the public at large.

The good thing about battery replacements nearly all the material is recycled including all of the lead (which is a deadly poison) and the plastic case/container too. So the environmental impact is minimal.

[sanchari]

My 2016 Honda Jazz battery failed suddenly without any warning at around 3.5 years. I was going over a road hump in 3rd gear and the car stalled, and then lost all power and couldn't even start the car. Luckily, I was on a slight incline and I could put my car in neutral and move the car to the side of the car. I thought it was some problem with car battery charging and took it to Honda ASC who checked it and said battery was dead as a dodo and had to be replaced.

[anb]

The stock batteries of my two Polos hardly lasted 2 years while the 6th year old 320d is still running on stock battery.

[Lalvaz]

I have had a very good experience with OEM batteries for Hyundai Santro (5+years), Maruti Swift Diesel (4 years). The Swift has been through 2 replacements and inspite of getting a premium battery, the lifespan was about the same as the OEM.

Hence I don't think its fair to stereotype OEM's as using cheaper quality batteries. If you see the luxury cars, their OEM batteries are known to last 7 years too. Replacement cost could be as high as 50k in my experience.

Also, I'm not in favour of increased regulation and making a 3 year warranty on batteries mandatory. I think the focus should instead be on the free market competitive spirit spurring automotive manufacturers to do better and better.

[GTO]

I think most of my OEM batteries have lasted ~4 years. But yes, will agree that many OEM parts - especially batteries & tyres - are usually junk. Because they are essentially like commodities & can be easily replaced by owners, manufacturers go for the cheapest possible option (Maruti buys tyres for 400 bucks / piece - imagine!).

[anshu1101]

VW Vento Diesel 2013 - The first battery (Exide) lasted for about 2 years 8 months.
The second battery (Amaron) has been running flawlessly for the last 4+ years.

[BLACNWYTE]

The OEM battery (Exide Make) in my Activa 125 lasted a shade over 3.5 years. It might have lasted longer had I used the kicker for cold starts more instead of choke + self.

The OEM battery (Exide make) in our Creta just crossed the three year mark last Saturday and it's still going strong. Hopefully it'll last another three years or more (fingers crossed). I have not faced any delay in cranking and from pressing the start button to the engine starting takes less than half a second. So I've voted for 3+ years.

Originally Posted by anb

The stock batteries of my two Polos hardly lasted 2 years .

I have a colleague who's OEM battery in his petrol Polo which is well into it's seventh year. Since the past three months it has begun to show its age with a 1-2 sec delay to crank and 3-4 second starting time. I have asked him to replace it before it leaves him stranded on the road but he is of the opinion that he is going to use till it dies completely.