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-   -   Using a copper 'dabba' to prevent theft of keyless entry cars (https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/technical-stuff/229078-using-copper-dabba-prevent-theft-keyless-entry-cars.html)

My new Creta is only 3 weeks old, but it's been keeping me up at night for months already. I've been a bit paranoid about securing it against theft and especially so as I have open parking. The fact that Delhi seems to be the top car theft destination and Creta seems to the most popular catch, atleast going by Youtube videos, didn't help. :Frustrati

So far I've invested in a car cover (TPH Pilot 373) and a combination type steering wheel lock even while restlessly monitoring the inbuilt telematics (Hyundai Bluelink). More details on these soon in my upcoming ownership report. But I just had to share my latest delightful discovery immediately with you guys.

The one thievery tactic that had me most concerned was mimicking of the radio frequency signal emitted by the car's key fob. I understand that the fob emits this low-range signal 24X7 and that is how your car knows when you are nearby for opening the boot and ORVMs, apart from unlocking the car and starting the engine. The way this works against you is if someone manages to latch onto that signal from inside your home and then boosts it to their partner standing next to the car. A search on Youtube shows hundreds of cars being stolen this way in the US, especially Teslas. All you need is a 2-person team and a couple of tablets/phones with the right hardware and software.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR8RrmEizVg&t=5s

The solution seems to be storing away your key fob in a Faraday Cage, which essentially blocks the radio signals for your fob. This category of cages in the form of boxes and pouches seemed very popular on Amazon.com, but the custom duty + shipping cost to India didn't seem very attractive. I found almost all these products listed on Aliexpress as well and did place an order for ~3 USD Faraday pouch yesterday, which seems fairly pocketable.



https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000...730c3acdqqfL0j

In the meantime, I looked up DIY versions and a few did appeal to me such as coating any handicraft wooden box with some copper adhesive tape. See the video link below to know more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NguyYHPjwnI

I also achieved moderate success by wrapping the fob tightly in multiple layers of aluminium foil (copper foil would have been more effective but I couldn't find any around my house), which did work but wasn't a great plan because the foil might scratch the fob and there's only so many times you can keep wrapping and rewrapping your key before starting the car. I also tried putting the key fob inside a stainless steel box and then put that box inside an aluminium ziplock bag which went inside another aluminium ziplock bag. This method worked on and off, depending upon how many bags I was willing to spare.

This is when a lightbulb went up in my head and I thought, "Why not store the fob in pure copper vessel?". Some research on Amazon.in threw up this product as a well sized container. It was also returnable; perfect for my experiment.



https://www.amazon.in/gp/product/B01...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

The copper 'dabba' arrived a few minutes ago and I promptly lined its base with a circular cut-out of foam salvaged from a Paul John Whisky canister. I put my Hyundai Creta key fob inside. It fit just right. Walked up to the car. Lo and behold! The ORVMs did not unfold. Pressed the unlock button and nothing happened. Sweet success! clap:



Really can't think of a better solution to protect your car from high-tech thieves at this price point. It is perfect for storing the key when at home. The 'dabba' is inconspicuous and Lord Ganesh embossed on the cap kinda checks off as well. Now, I need to find something that can fit in my pocket for storing the fib when in office or out and about. The Aliexpress pouch should work but I'm wondering if there's a simpler domestic hack for this too :D

This reminds me of the Tamil movie "Kannum Kannum Kollaiyadithaal".

After seeing this, I feel that locking the doors manually using key is way more safer than the remote locking system.:D

Electromagnetism 101 everyone!!
Electrical permittivity inside a closed metallic sphere is zero.

An ingenious solution to a modern problem. Though, carrying the dabba around in your pocket will be inconvenient. And the dabba will rattle where you place it in the car.

Yep but that still won't prevent thieves from tapping into the RF signal from your keyfob, unless you totally disable it by removing the batteries.

Yep. The idea is to keep the dabba in my house, without worrying that someone can stand below on the road or at the gate and latch onto the RF signal from the keyfob.

Still haven't found anything for keeping in the pocket after parking in office/mall/market. A copper lined purse might be ideal. The search is on.

I am not mentioning about cars which come with remote locking system. I know that a car which comes with remote locking system can be locked/unlocked using remote as well as key. I am mentioning about cars which do not come with remote locking system. (e.g.) Older cars like M800 and base variants of some cars like Wagonr, Tiago, etc.

Hopefully you've watched Kee & Irumbu Kuthirai & found alternatives hehe

Technology only aids us; if burglars are smart enough, we ought to have some common sense, if not smarter. Manual locks have got even greater perils than FOBs.

I feel this is hilarious as well as unfortunate.

Keyless entry was supposed to be a technological advancement to give more convenience.

However, if one has to resort to above kind of methods which are highly inconvenient to achieve the original/baseline function of a key (security of car from theft), then this technological advancement has failed :(.

I thought I would suggest a gear lock then read your previous posts to note you have an AT.

A quick search resulted in these options. I feel they would serve the purpose.

Steel Pedal Lock



Steering Wheel Lock

Using this one currently and quite happy with the combination lock mechanism.

Another cheaper & easier solution is to take out the battery from the key fob.

Use mechanical key for opening the doors. And put key fob “on the button” for push button start.

The convenience part of keyless entry is obviously sent out of the park.

Ingenious solution to the problem.
While the "dabba" is fine while at home. For outside, I think it can be custom made by our nearby welder/metal shop. Just buy a small copper sheet and get it shaped from metal worker with the same outer shape as your key with a copper cap lined with foam on the inside.(just like a refill(your key) inside a pen's body(hand made copper key cover:))!)

That's a good idea. I was initially thinking of approaching local jewellers to see if they can make a copper lined pouch/purse but the 'lohaar' should also be able to execute something along the lines of what you suggested.

Even an Aluminium foil wrap would serve the same function! Just like purses have "NFC block" anything that provides an electromagnetic shielding will work, except perhaps not providing a lucrative business case targeting the unassuming. The fact remains, while we can't be too cautious, we are often overly paranoid. The moment you put the key in your pocket the RF attenuation at 315/433MHz due to flesh proximity and clothing layer and the humidity of the region, is often enough to degrade the MDS(minimum discernable signal) at the receiver, to enable a successful decode. To enable a lifetime of the CR2032 battery, the EIRP and the nett transmitter power is about 5-7mw in a signal "burst" that has a 2% duty cycle. Get a pouch for that matter, but, a specific car theft is still a matter of probability and immensely bad luck, than "hi tech thieves" we tend to glorify. If they were really that smart, some of whom are pathological thieves by choice, agreed, they would have figured out a better life anyway. Brickbats welcome! But the fact is as above,( the technical part)

Wouldn’t you call youself paranoid. I would definitely. It’s one thing being safe but this is at some other level. What purpose insurance is for?
Incidents will happen in life. If not car theft then some thing else will happen. You can’t safegaurd against the perils of life. Its better to relax and enjoy life.

I have a collection of all my old mobile phones i have used till today. Never lost even a single one of them but in Jan 2019 lost my brand new iphone 11 to a thak-thak gang even after years of reading newspaper and reminding myself to be careful at traffic signals from these gangs.

No disrespect meant to you OP, but is car theft really as bad as you make it out to be in Delhi? Like has there been even a handful of cases of car thieves using tech to boost signals etc that it warrants so much headaches and sleepless nights over?

I was curious and checked NCRB stats + media reports and Delhi has about 40,000 vehicle thefts / year.

There are 11 million vehicles in Delhi.

Chances of your vehicle being lifted is 0.03%. For some perspective, one has a greater chance of dying by having a coconut falling on their head than a car being stolen, doesn't mean everyone living in the south walks around with a helmet on their heads now do they?

Again, I mean no disrespect and felt that this was a little ott, but then again your car, your choices, it is a free world after all.