[GTO]

Jay asks this question via the Team-BHP share page!

Am noticing more & more Maruti cars such as Baleno, Vitara Brezza etc. that we service have strange materials used.

There is this carpet-like material in the rear wheel well cladding, but proper plastic trim cladding at the front. Is there any rationale or reason for this? Or just cost cutting?

We are having a tough time removing all kinds of mud & muck which doesn't go away easily, and we end up wasting water and time. Customers are also puzzled at this difference in material and asking us to source a rear wheel well cladding in plastic.

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by GTO

Jay asks this question via the Team-BHP share page!

The Carpet like cladding is excellent(while being cheaper and lighter) for NVH compared to plastic which needs additional damping to achieve same level of NVH performance. Also, the carpet like material has a plastic/laminated sort of backing which touches the metal wheel well. So rusting isn't a concern.

Having said that, its impossible to get it completely clean visually. If you are concerned and want to have it super clean(until you hit the road next time), you can follow this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsZDNv8eGSA

Regards,
Shashi

[bvasista]

Thanks to Jay, GTO, Leoshashi.

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

The Carpet like cladding is excellent(while being cheaper and lighter) for NVH compared to plastic which needs additional damping to achieve same level of NVH performance. Also, the carpet like material has a plastic/laminated sort of backing which touches the metal wheel well. So rusting isn't a concern.

I understand that carpet like cladding is better compared to plastic. Any idea what could be the rationale behind Maruti opting for plastic in the front and carpet in the rear? They could have opted for carpet cladding to the front wheels also which is cheaper.

Sorry if this is a dumb question

[saket77]

NVH & cost factors aside, what will happen during rainy season, car wash or when the car rides over mud? If this carpet gets smeared in mud, it will be a task in itself to clean it.

If the plastic cladding was doing the job then why to re-invent the wheel? Or is it that there is still a plastic cladding beneath the carpet so as to aid to insulation?

[Shreyans_Jain]

Ideally, there should be this fabric or carpet type cladding covered by plastic cladding. This is how it is supposed to be done, this is how it is on my Hexa, this is how it is in premium cars. Skimping on any one kind of cladding or both is basically done for costs reason.

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain

Ideally, there should be this fabric or carpet type cladding covered by plastic cladding. This is how it is supposed to be done, this is how it is on my Hexa, this is how it is in premium cars. Skimping on any one kind of cladding or both is basically done for costs reason.

Exactly. That's the best way to do it. Earlier I was apprehensive about the durability of this carpet and what if it remains wet for a long time, thus promoting rust.

However in Brezza, this felt like material is pasted over a flexible plastic laminate. Thus even if its wet on the wheel side, the side touching the body is relatively dry. I wonder what's the need of such cost cutting(if its that way) because cheaper cars like Swift get a normal plastic liner even at the back. Still better than getting nothing(looking at you, Toyota).

Attaching pics of Brezza's rear liner:





Regards,
Shashi

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by bvasista

I understand that carpet like cladding is better compared to plastic. Any idea what could be the rationale behind Maruti opting for plastic in the front and carpet in the rear? They could have opted for carpet cladding to the front wheels also which is cheaper.

One reason I can think of is in case of the front, there is a second layer of insulation in terms of the firewall which is again heavily cladded with foam or insulating material. The wheel well itself is not a metal panel and structurally consists of the fender outside and the engine apron inside. In this case, the plastic panel is more for the sake of sealing the engine compartment from debris. But in case of the rear, the panel for the wheel well is directly a part of the passenger compartment and road noise can enter the compartment easily. Hence, a carpet based material is used which is more effective in damping out road noise as well as hits from pebbles etc. The plastic panel on the other hand will create a racket when struck by debris from the road and can only be used as a method of preventing debris and not as a method to damp sounds. Hence, more than the cost, I believe this is something to do with the intended purpose. Cost cutting is when you dont get anything at the back, like my Celerio I can hear every pebble that is thrown up by the tyres.


Well to keep it clean one can try out two things - Cheaper way is to spray some rubberised coating or lacquer onto this surface. Though the carpet finish will go away, it will still work as intended. The other way is to go with a hydrophobic coating or a generous quantity of some plastic dressing once in a while so that dirt does not stick to the material.

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by audioholic

Hence, a carpet based material is used which is more effective in damping out road noise as well as hits from pebbles etc. The plastic panel on the other hand will create a racket when struck by debris from the road and can only be used as a method of preventing debris and not as a method to damp sounds.

Bang on! Hence the carpet is more of a necessity and is not really a case of reinventing the wheel.

Hence, more than the cost, I believe this is something to do with the intended purpose. Cost cutting is when you dont get anything at the back, like my Celerio I can hear every pebble that is thrown up by the tyres.

Guess even your next car won't have any rear wheel liner.

Regards,
Shashi

[laluks]

Originally Posted by audioholic

One reason I can think of is in case of the front, there is a second layer of insulation in terms of the firewall which is again heavily cladded with foam or insulating material. The wheel well itself is not a metal panel and structurally consists of the fender outside and the engine apron inside. In this case, the plastic panel is more for the sake of sealing the engine compartment from debris. But in case of the rear, the panel for the wheel well is directly a part of the passenger compartment and road noise can enter the compartment easily. Hence, a carpet based material is used which is more effective in damping out road noise as well as hits from pebbles etc. The plastic panel on the other hand will create a racket when struck by debris from the road and can only be used as a method of preventing debris and not as a method to damp sounds. Hence, more than the cost, I believe this is something to do with the intended purpose. Cost cutting is when you dont get anything at the back, like my Celerio I can hear every pebble that is thrown up by the tyres.

Learnt a few stuff today. While I like the concept of making the car silent, what I would have wished would be Maruti pays a bit more attention to making safer cars, and even sent them for a crash test than evading the test totally!!

[Thermodynamics]

Originally Posted by saket77

NVH & cost factors aside, what will happen during rainy season, car wash or when the car rides over mud? If this carpet gets smeared in mud, it will be a task in itself to clean it.

It does gets mucky during rains. Not easy to clean like a simple wipe, and not that difficult either as one would presume. I usually allow it to dry, and then most of the dirt will fall off with a simple tap. If it is too filthy, a water hose is sufficient.

The only problem I find is that this thing has poor structural conformity. It tends to deform, refer pictures from Leoshashi. That leaves gaps and dirt can get inside easily.

[ajmat]

It avoids rain and mud spatter. Run a power hose at the front wheel well and water will splash out. Run the same hose at the rear wheel well and it dissipates improving visibility.

Why not pad the front wheel wells with the same.

1: The adhesive might not take the engine heat and you have another burning thread
2: Force of the debris thrown up by the driven wheels might wear this out faster

[pganapathy]

Originally Posted by bvasista

I understand that carpet like cladding is better compared to plastic. Any idea what could be the rationale behind Maruti opting for plastic in the front and carpet in the rear?:

I am guessing this has more to do with engine temperature than anything else. It is possible that the carpet may catch fire, and in order to prevent that happening they will need to invest in fire resistant materials. Instead of that, plastic is more practical.

[naveen.raju]

My Ford Ecopsort had carpet cladding. In just 2 years, what I noticed was that the carpet tends to dislodge from it's position as it tends to get heavy (water gets absorbed). This can be dangerous since it just dangles and can get caught between the wheels. Also, to replace this is pretty expensive (around 1500 per wheel well).

[sudeepg]

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

If you are concerned and want to have it super clean(until you hit the road next time), you can follow this video:

11 minutes and lots of cleaning aids required to clean one wheel well.
The local place where I get my car washed uses some sort of spray. They call it cutting oil , but it does clean the plastic cladding very well. They foam it up with a spray gun and then use this and it makes for a really clean wheel well.

Originally Posted by naveen.raju

My Ford Ecopsort had carpet cladding. In just 2 years, what I noticed was that the carpet tends to dislodge from it's position as it tends to get heavy (water gets absorbed).

I believe that might be because it is not secured properly. The lock clips should hold them in place. Perhaps a bad design or not enough clips holding the liner?

[chiranjitp]

Originally Posted by naveen.raju

My Ford Ecopsort had carpet cladding. In just 2 years, what I noticed was that the carpet tends to dislodge from it's position as it tends to get heavy (water gets absorbed). This can be dangerous since it just dangles and can get caught between the wheels. Also, to replace this is pretty expensive (around 1500 per wheel well).

Yup, Ford Ecosport does have the carpet cladding for the rear wheel arch like the Brezza, Baleno. The NVH levels in Ecosport is very good, I would like to believe the carpet cladding is a factor for that.

As for the carpet losing its shape & dangling, luckily for us the carpet is still in perfect shape. Our Ecosport is a 2016 model with 67k km on the odometer. At what odometer reading did you first notice the dangling issue?

Here is a photo of the carpet after 50k km (sadly don't have a current photo of the carpet):