[lurker]

My gut feeling is that in order to remove the typical 'clackety-clack' of diesel engines on the higher models like A4, Superb, Passat etc and in order to make it sound much more smoother and less rough than it's lesser siblings. VW tinkered with the balance shaft of the fuel pump but in the process compromised it's reliability.

Just google with the keywords, 'Volkswagen, Audi 2.0 TDI fuel pump balance shaft' and you will find a cottage industry in europe milling away with a multitude of solutions to this commonly acknowledged problem in this particular generation of VAG engine.

[rav11stars]

I simply fail to understand some things which seem logical though.

• When customers go for a top-end/luxury brand they're not just paying for the styling or the numerous airbags or ac vents.
  We're paying for reliability. Reliability of the vehicle, the spares and most importantly their service.
  Also whether it's Maruti, Audi or a Rolls-Royce no manufacturer or a customer expect the vehicle or engine to go kaput. The percentage of cases where such things happen is very rare. Most of the vehicles just work fine with the normal servicing schedules.
  So I'd rather expect the dealership/service to be forthcoming and outright helpful in such cases rather than trouble the customer.
  I didn't expect that Audi would push a customer so much that he had to resort to legal procedure.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by nitinbose

Hi Sahil,

Congrats on your victory!

Its a lazy statement given by the dealers that the damage is due to the fuel used. Do they expect us to stop by the fuel station and test the fuel before filling up our vehicles? If the dealer mentions adultered fuel, in what way was it adultered?

I guess the German cars are not considering India as a serious market for them and that the sales target figures must be some three digit figures which they're easily doing and remaining relaxed, least bothered to what happens after the sales.

Well said Nitin. It all boils down to economics. Lets face it India does not feature in the mindshare of VAG. Period. VAG sold 9.8 million cars in calendar 2013. Of that roughly 45,000 were in India give or take a few hundred i.e. less than half a percent. They experience some of the VAG owners are experiencing is this 0.45% factor. In short they don't care. India is now the 8th largest car market in the world going by number of units sold (but not by $ value) with 1.9 million sales in 2013 and climbing. The others are France (2.2), Russia (2.6), Japan (2.7), Germany (3.2), Brazil (3.4), USA (12.8) and China (18.4). Abhi picture bakki hai. I recall in the 1980s foreign airlines giving two hoots to passengers boarding in India. The attitudes today of Lufthansa or Air France or British Airways is substantially different from the scornful & gruff tones tones of 25 years ago. VAG too shall change which will be a nice thing for us car lovers and owners because fundamentally they design and build great cars.

[Khushrav]

Show me one car maufacturer or car model that does not have any issues at all. My uncle who lives in US had purchased a BMW few years ago. He had the option to walk along in the factory while his car was getting assembled and he hated the experience as it was a shoddy job.

Let's accept that a car is an engine + rubber + steel + hundreds of components all working together and prone to some failure. While I agree that more expensive cars should be low on defects...the cost is not inversely proportional to the defects.

The larger issue is around the Indian service standards and our poor levels of tolerance. If these improve, more than 50% of our issues could get sorted.

[rattanw]

IMHO, each and every car manufacturer in India is guilty of passing on second grade products in Indian market. The impact and % of defects may vary from manufacturer to manufacturer, but their attitudes remain the same. What is truly sad is that even brands previously considered reputable and defect-free like Merc and BMW are going down that same path - the path where Indian buyer is treated differently, consistently. Numbers may tell a story, like 0.5% share of India in VAG's global sales, yet 0.5% is not small but a significant number when one considers the amount of years it took to reach that level and the potential for future growth, what with the growing incomes and all!

Investing 50 - 60 lacs in an automobile is a big deal. The experience is akin to going to a 5 star hotel vs. eating at a roadside eatery. You do not go to the 5 star hotel for food and quality of food alone, you go there for a certain level of service that is an integral part of overall package that you are receiving at that price point (I do not mean any disrespect to any other consumers, much like me myself nor do I wish to state that buying a 5 lac car should mean that it be any more defective than a car worth 50 lacs). If after paying that super high price, you receive a bad package, then definitely someone has to own up and compensate you.

Any manufacturer selling their product in a given market is solely responsible for ensuring that their product is geared to local standards and meets all local conditions. Anything less in my opinion is criminal negligence. I mean, how is a consumer supposed to know that BS IV fuel has x level of sulphur in it. I do not know it, neither I should. All I know is that I am buying a product. And paying an x amount of my hard earned money. And that product should be well worth every penny of that money. Anything less in my opinion is a defect in service and pretty serious defect at that.

That said,I guess its our infallible spirit and forgiving nature that most manufacturers truly rely on. That in addition to the truly lax laws and even more lax enforcement of such laws makes it an one sided battle. Even in the rare cases where a brave buyer chooses to fight till the end and takes the legal route, the amount of penalty / monetary fine imposed on manufacturer are paltry. I mean, let one court impose a fine of 5 million USD in one such case and you will see the ripple effect take shape. If nothing else, it will at least act as a deterrent and a precedent at the same time. There are enough provisions in the law to impose punitive fines, why can't our courts put those in action. Have two or three more instances like that (where courts impose multi million dollar fines in punitive damages) and each manufacturer will be forced to take corrective actions. Have 10 cases like that, and bang! you will see manufacturers going on the defensive and doing what they should have done in the first place to begin with.

[sahilverma]

Hi guys,

Just to update you, I have now received a service quote from Audi which is significantly different from the original quote they sent me – see email below to Audi.

I am attaching a copy of the court order (hpsc164), letter from Audi (SV Letter) which states that Audi India does not have a workshop facility of their own!, latest service quote (Service Quote 6876 - 05112014) and the original service quote (21).


From: Sahil Verma
Sent: 06 November 2014 11:25
To: 'Rao, Tarkeshwar (NSC India)'
Cc: sachin.kambli@audimumbaisouth.net; Ashok.Shetty@audimumbaisouth.net
Subject: RE: Kind Attention: Mr. Verma
Importance: High

Hi Tarkeshwar,

I have now received the service quote of the dealer “through Audi” and would like to point out the following discrepancies –

1. Quote is dated 12 Aug 2014

2. Under labour, items number 9-16 have been newly added as compared to your original quote of 16 June 2014

3. Under parts, items number 2 and 7 and 11-31 have been newly added as compared to your original quote of 16 June 2014

4. There is a discrepancy in cost in the below parts

No 1 – Injection Unit: Current quote – 112,000.00, June quote – 119,669.36
No 3 – Fuel Distr: Current quote – 31,478.23, June quote – 53,392.01
No 4 – Fuel Unit: Current quote – 16,801.78, June quote – 31,355.56
No 8 – Washer: Current quote – 520.89, June quote – 882.67
No 9 – Pump: Current quote – 76,270.23, June quote – 130,612.46
No 10 – Fuel Filter: Current quote – 1,473.78, June quote – 1,969.78

5. You quote states payment terms as ‘By Cash, Cheque/DD – Subject to realization’ which is in conflict with the order passed by the National Commission to deposit the cost of repair with the commission.

6. The order of the Hon’ble National Commission dated 30.10.2014 has directed Volkswagen Group Sales India Pvt. Ltd. and Audi India Private Limited to repair the car. However, I note that you are now refusing to do so on the pretext that you do not have a repair facility in India. As this is contrary to the order of the Hon’ble Commission, I reserve my right to take appropriate steps before the Hon’ble Commission in this regard. You may note that a submission was made by your counsel before the Hon’ble Commission on 30.10.2014 that the Hon’ble Commission may direct Respondent No.5 to repair the car instead of directing Respondent Nos. 1 and 2 to do so. However, this submission stood rejected by the Hon’ble Commission. It now appears that you are seeking to overreach the said order of the Hon’ble Commission.

By forwarding the service quote, I proceed on the basis that Audi India is confirming the contents and necessity of the same for alleged repair on account of alleged fuel adulteration by water as I have been given to understand and which I have disputed. Given the order by the Hon’ble National Commission, I approve this repair by the Respondent Nos. 1 and 2 in terms of the order of the Hon’ble Commission and shall deposit the cost indicated with the Hon’ble National Commission, however, this shall be without prejudice to my rights and contentions and I shall make a prayer to the Hon’ble Commission to recover these.

A copy of the order dated 30.10.2014 is also attached for your reference and compliance.

Also note that I have had to urgently relocate out of India to the UK due to my daughter being critically ill and therefore all correspondence should be sent to me via email or I may be contacted on +4477xxxxxxxx keeping in mind the time difference between India and the United Kingdom.

Kind regards,
Sahil


From: Rao, Tarkeshwar (NSC India) [mailto:tarkeshwar.rao@audi.in]
Sent: 05 November 2014 12:52
To: Sahil Verma
Cc: sachin.kambli@audimumbaisouth.net; Ashok.Shetty@audimumbaisouth.net
Subject: Kind Attention: Mr. Verma

Dear Mr. Verma,

Greetings from Audi India.

Please find attached our letter and repair estimate for your ready reference.

Best regards,

Tarkeshwar Rao
Head of Customer Satisfaction & Delight

Audi India
Division of
Volkswagen Group Sales India Pvt.Ltd.
Silver Utopia. 4th Floor
Cardinal Gracious Road
Chakala, Andheri (East)
Mumbai 400 099
CIN:U50401MH2007FTC168439

Phone: +91 22 3313 7275
Fax : +91 22 3313 7201
mailto:tarkeshwar.rao@audi.in
http://www.audi.in

[sahilverma]

Originally Posted by harry10

Hi Sahil,
Glad to see a resolution after a good struggle. However, I am a little unclear on courts verdict. Why have they asked you to deposit the money with them? Does that mean you will be bearing the cost of repairs and not VW group?

Hi Harry,

The national commission has taken a view that the first matter that Audi needs to rectify is repair my car and return it to me as they've held it in their custody for 4 months despite me giving them the OK to repair it and agreeing to bear the costs of repair. The monies are to be deposited with the court since the matter is sub-judice and hence any monies spent will be held by the court till a verdict is achieved.

I received a service quote from Audi yesterday which I have posted here and it shows there is no standard costing for parts and that they are completely clueless to the extent that they don't mind sending me another quote for the same parts but with significantly different prices all in a span of 4 months.

Hope this helps.

Originally Posted by lurker

this has nothing to do with fuel quality. This is a legacy issue specifically with Audi 2.0 TDI (or whtever they call it these days) fuel pumps which malfunction on certain vehicles due to reasons only the company is privy to.

Team BHP has many threads which have similar complaints of fuel pump in 2.0 TDI VAG engine malfunctioning and dealer blaming it on water, poor fuel, or in some cases pixie dust.

The tragic and especially curious aspect of this is that in each and every such case, both company VAG and the dealer team up to cover-up the issue and pass the entire blame onto the customer in guise of water in fuel, poor fuel quality etc.



Kerosene these days is more expensive than diesel.

For the price diesel is sold, I doubt there are cheap additives anymore apart from let's say furnace oil.

Water may ingress into underground fuel tank, but why are only VAG engines affected by it. Why is Maruti, Hyundai, Toyota, Mercedes, BMW, Renault, Nissan, Isuzu, TATA, Mahindra, Fiat engines never susceptible to this 'water' issue in India.

There is a forum member from Kochi who had a Yeti 2.0 TDI which had same fuel pump issue and dealer blamed it on water or poor fuel quality. There was another Skoda thread this year which I forget that had same fuel pump issue and model was 2.0 TDI.

The interesting thing is that Audi is saying that based on their checks, water hasn't ingressed into the underground fuel tank! I suspect this is because if they admit this to be the case then it is expressly covered by the AudiSure Plan that I have on the car and they would be liable to repair it. On the other hand, they cannot explain why would diesel be adulterated with water (of all things!) and how would foreign particles enter the fuel tank when they've checked fuel lines, fuel cap etc and everything is intact?

[rattanw]

I guess Audi Customer Service team is just trying to buy time, as they decide how to deal with the situation. Plain common sense as well as business sense would dictate Audi to limit the PR damage already caused by this incident and the subsequent court order by reaching a settlement quickly (or at least not stonewall efforts to reach a settlement) - either repair the car fully as the court order mandates them to, or compensate the owner adequately. Well, ideally both should be done in equal and fair manner, i.e. full repairs to the car and significant compensation to the owner. That in the truest sense would be "justice" after a long and unnecessary ordeal.

On a side note, their customer service team is another joke by the way. And just look at the signature of this guy from Audi - "Customer Satisfaction and Delight"!! Oh my Lord. I mean talk about irony. Some people do have a humorous side.

OTH, Sahil - you did mention about your daughter not being well. I hope its nothing too serious and she gets well soon. Best wishes for her recovery.

[turbodude]

I am really really scared reading this. I used to think that Audi customers are enjoying high quality of service.

A while ago I had read the news of few customers returning Audi on Team-BHP forum. Here is the link
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...d-service.html

Still after 1 whole year if the Audi dealerships and Volkswagen has not improved their services means its time to say good bye to all Volkswagen products. Unless we stop buying their products they will not understand the seriousness of this issue. Every now and then we hear Skoda and Audi issues.

In 2012, a vento burnt in pune. Here is the link http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...-injuries.html

Media shouts when a nano burns; but kept silence on this issue. Hardly any newspapers covered this incident.

I must say that even TATA MOTORS dealers provide very good service compared to Volkswagen dealers. We must avoid Volkswagen at any cost. They have crossed the limits.

[sahilverma]

This really takes the cake!

Audi India should rechristen their 'Customer Satisfaction & Delight' team as 'Customer Harassment Cell' and give everyone a raise/promotion given what a fantastic job they've been doing so far!

__________________________________________________ __________


From: Sahil Verma
Sent: 08 November 2014 10:22
To: 'Rao, Tarkeshwar (NSC India)'
Cc: Sachin Kambli (sachin.kambli@audimumbaisouth.net); Ashok.shetty@audimumbaisouth.net
Subject: RE: Kind Attention: Mr. Verma
Importance: High

Tarkeshwar,

My car has been in your custody for the past 4.5 months and due to your sheer negligence in taking appropriate care of my car, you are now asking me to dish out approx. INR 70K to replace the battery, wipers and a number of other parts which were all in perfect working condition when you took the car from me. This has to take the cake!

Also, can you specify the exact reason for the price revision you refer to below as I fail to understand how you’ve dropped prices in a span of 4 months or was the dealership quoting me higher rates in the first place?

I am in the process of depositing the amount stated in your quote with the Hon’able Commission and will seek redressal through the courts of this grossly mismanaged situation by Audi India and your Mumbai South dealership. Once you have confirmation of the amount deposited, you may go ahead and repair my car.

Finally, thank you for your concern re my daughter however given how you’ve harassed me and my family and what you have put us through in the past 4.5 months, you can do away with this mere formality. We really do not need your false concern.

Sahil


From: Rao, Tarkeshwar (NSC India) [mailto:tarkeshwar.rao@audi.in]
Sent: 07 November 2014 14:08
To: Sahil Verma
Subject: Kind Attention: Mr. Verma
Importance: High

Hello Mr. Verma,

Greetings from Audi India.

This has reference to our communication dated 5th November 2014 and subsequent queries raised in your e-mail dated 6th November 2014, we hereby without prejudice inform you as follows,

1. As far as the date of quotation is concerned, we would like to state that it is a typographical error and we sincerely regret for the the same. Please read the same as 5th November 2014. Please note that the total expenses for carrying out the repair work will be INR 366,092.88 inclusive of labour, part and applicable taxes.

2. For your point 2 & 3, we would like to state that since the Hon’ble commission directed us to provide fresh estimate, we carried out the inspection once again and considering the vehicle has been standing idle for a prolonged period, there are additional jobs added in the repairs estimate sent on 5th November 2014.

3. In regards to your 4th query, we would like to mention that there was a price revision, hence the difference in the pricing.

4. As far as your point number 5 is concerned, “payment terms as ‘By Cash, Cheque/DD – Subject to realization” is a standard line in all the repairs estimate, however, we in our covering letter had specified that the same need to be deposited before the national commission. Hence, request you to consider our statement in the covering letter as final in this regard.

5. As mentioned in our covering letter, we reiterate that Audi India does not have its own workshop facility, in line with standard industry practice, your vehicle will be repaired at the workshop facility of our dealer, Audi Mumbai South. Please be assured members of Audi Technical Team will remain present while the repair work is carried out.

Request you to comply with the Hon’ble national commission order and deposit the sum of INR 366,092.88 before the Hon’ble commission. Subsequent to which, repair works will be carried out.

Hope this clarifies the situation.

We wish faster recovery and good health to your daughter.

Best regards.

Tarkeshwar Rao
Head of Customer Satisfaction & Delight

Audi India
Division of
Volkswagen Group Sales India Pvt.Ltd.
Silver Utopia. 4th Floor
Cardinal Gracious Road
Chakala, Andheri (East)
Mumbai 400 099
CIN:U50401MH2007FTC168439

Phone: +91 22 3313 7275
Fax : +91 22 3313 7201
mailto:tarkeshwar.rao@audi.in
http://www.audi.in


From: Sahil Verma [mailto:Sahil.Verma@regus.com]
Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2014 4:55 PM
To: Rao, Tarkeshwar (NSC India)
Cc: sachin.kambli@audimumbaisouth.net; Ashok.Shetty@audimumbaisouth.net
Subject: RE: Kind Attention: Mr. Verma
Importance: High

Hi Tarkeshwar,

I have now received the service quote of the dealer “through Audi” and would like to point out the following discrepancies –

1. Quote is dated 12 Aug 2014

2. Under labour, items number 9-16 have been newly added as compared to your original quote of 16 June 2014

3. Under parts, items number 2 and 7 and 11-31 have been newly added as compared to your original quote of 16 June 2014

4. There is a discrepancy in cost in the below parts

No 1 – Injection Unit: Current quote – 112,000.00, June quote – 119,669.36
No 3 – Fuel Distr: Current quote – 31,478.23, June quote – 53,392.01
No 4 – Fuel Unit: Current quote – 16,801.78, June quote – 31,355.56
No 8 – Washer: Current quote – 520.89, June quote – 882.67
No 9 – Pump: Current quote – 76,270.23, June quote – 130,612.46
No 10 – Fuel Filter: Current quote – 1,473.78, June quote – 1,969.78

5. You quote states payment terms as ‘By Cash, Cheque/DD – Subject to realization’ which is in conflict with the order passed by the National Commission to deposit the cost of repair with the commission.

6. The order of the Hon’ble National Commission dated 30.10.2014 has directed Volkswagen Group Sales India Pvt. Ltd. and Audi India Private Limited to repair the car. However, I note that you are now refusing to do so on the pretext that you do not have a repair facility in India. As this is contrary to the order of the Hon’ble Commission, I reserve my right to take appropriate steps before the Hon’ble Commission in this regard. You may note that a submission was made by your counsel before the Hon’ble Commission on 30.10.2014 that the Hon’ble Commission may direct Respondent No.5 to repair the car instead of directing Respondent Nos. 1 and 2 to do so. However, this submission stood rejected by the Hon’ble Commission. It now appears that you are seeking to overreach the said order of the Hon’ble Commission.

By forwarding the service quote, I proceed on the basis that Audi India is confirming the contents and necessity of the same for alleged repair on account of alleged fuel adulteration by water as I have been given to understand and which I have disputed. Given the order by the Hon’ble National Commission, I approve this repair by the Respondent Nos. 1 and 2 in terms of the order of the Hon’ble Commission and shall deposit the cost indicated with the Hon’ble National Commission, however, this shall be without prejudice to my rights and contentions and I shall make a prayer to the Hon’ble Commission to recover these.

A copy of the order dated 30.10.2014 is also attached for your reference and compliance.

Also note that I have had to urgently relocate out of India to the UK due to my daughter being critically ill and therefore all correspondence should be sent to me via email or I may be contacted on +447787862759 keeping in mind the time difference between India and the United Kingdom.

Kind regards,
Sahil


From: Rao, Tarkeshwar (NSC India) [mailto:tarkeshwar.rao@audi.in]
Sent: 05 November 2014 12:52
To: Sahil Verma
Cc: sachin.kambli@audimumbaisouth.net; Ashok.Shetty@audimumbaisouth.net
Subject: Kind Attention: Mr. Verma

Dear Mr. Verma,

Greetings from Audi India.

Please find attached our letter and repair estimate for your ready reference.

Best regards,

Tarkeshwar Rao
Head of Customer Satisfaction & Delight

Audi India
Division of
Volkswagen Group Sales India Pvt.Ltd.
Silver Utopia. 4th Floor
Cardinal Gracious Road
Chakala, Andheri (East)
Mumbai 400 099
CIN:U50401MH2007FTC168439

Phone: +91 22 3313 7275
Fax : +91 22 3313 7201
mailto:tarkeshwar.rao@audi.in
http://www.audi.in

[laferrari]

Audi I believe is taking the p**s. Literally!!

There are so many discrepancies in their mails, it makes me wonder how they have been in business for so long. The whole episode reeks of their incompetence.

I hope the Hon'ble Comission concludes that this entire saga is a sham and penalises audi in such a way that they shall think a hundred times before giving out a wrong diagnosis or a dodgy quotation.

OT:- Dear Sahil I truly wish your daughter a very speedy recovery to full health. Please don't be disheartened in your struggle against audi at any point in time. They deserve their comeuppance.

[sahilverma]

Dear RW and laferrari,

Thank you for your wishes for my daughters recovery. She was recently diagnosed with leukaemia and is currently undergoing chemotherapy. The past few weeks have been very tough for us as a family and we've been overwhelmed with the support and wishes that have come our way in this time.

Despite all the disruption to our life with my daughters illness and moving countries, I am determined to take this case with Audi to its natural conclusion. The dishonesty and arrogance shown by them has tested my patience and loyalty to the hilt and I am hoping that this case acts as a reminder that a brand is only as big as its customers and that there are consequences to being dishonest and unethical with the very customers that make the brand in the first place.

They've cocked up and continue to do so on so many levels that it is hard to believe that no one in their organisation can see it and wants to step forward to control the damage - wonder which joker is calling the shots here!

Lots more to happen in this saga and will keep you guys posted as things develop.

[rikhav]

Hi Sahil

I have nothing much to add but I truly admire your courage for not losing your hope even after your daughter having being detected with such an illness (wish her a very speedy recovery and she will be in my prayers)

The attitude by Audi shows that they have won many such battles by their might (hiring an expensive lawyer, twsiting facts and make the customer pay)

And the laws in our country only help them more and give them more and more confidence

For you its a car, someone i know lost his real sister by sheer negligance of hospital (overdose of anesthesia). Initially he did lodge a FIR but the lawyer warned him that the hospital will hire the best of the lawyers to cover up and till there is some conclusion they will not get the body and many post mortems will take place.
They did not want anything like this and just wanted the body back, hence withdrew the complaint. The concerned hospital is Beams hospital in Khar, mumbai

Its better to buy a cheap car and forget it or sell it after doing a quick fix job if such a situation happens. No point spending money to ruin ones life

Infact, even a SONATA would not have given you such headaches

Best of luck for your fight ahead and again wishing a speedy recovery to your daughter

[JoseVijay]

What a shame on Audi to harass a customer! Thought only Skoda was the culprit all these days. Now more and more the so called "Brands" join the party. I had a lot of admiration for AUDI and always dreamt of buying one. But this type of experiences discourage me of even dreaming about the car. I have lost all the admiration for the brand.

Dear Sahil, I wish your daughter speedy recovery and remember her in my prayers. Hope you will be freed from this "TORTURE" by Audi soon. Wish you good luck.

[i74js]

This is criminal. Someone in the Audi management who looks after Indian operations from their HQ in Europe should take note of what is happening with respect to customer satisfaction in India.

This is a small issue for Audi and should have been addressed at the first notice itself rather than letting it prolong.

Audi is not a mass market product and the management should be aware of the fact that the customer will have muscle power to pull strings the right way, in this case a legal battle.

Painful for the customer
Eyeopener for the readers and members of the forum
Shameful for the manufacturer and the dealer