[Mohnish]

Need the technical specs of the two types of engines used in the Scorpio and particularly in the SLX Jan 2005 2.6T and the newer ones ie. after March where the CRDe was installed.

Also your comparisons and opinions on the two engines would be most useful.

Thanks in advance.

Regards.

[bhp1]

The CRDE scorpio engine is better than 2.6 turbo. Crde meets the new emission norms which 2.6t could not.
Crde is more powerful,
refinement is more in crde,
crde has better pickup & is slightly more fuel efficient.
2.6 is agrarian in comparison.
Crde is more drivable , power delivery is more linear.

But the newly launched 2.2 eagle engine is 1up on both.

[Mohnish]

Thanks bhp1...I have test driven the 3 engines, and honestly other than the crde being smoother than the 2.6t I didnt find much difference (you do feel the turbo 'kick in' on the 2.6t). The 2.2 is another ball game however..very refined compared to the previous two. But then this could be cause the 2.2 engine was brand new and the crde / 2.6t were atleast 3 years (2005) old both. Also, can't be sure of the maintainence levels of the older engines, so difficult to decide. Hence the query.

Would you be inclined to agree with the theory that the 2.6 t being a more crude (basic) than the crde and the 2.2, it is less prone to failure (electronics) in rough conditions?

Do you know of any link I could get the detailed engine specs (max torque etc.) of the 2.6t ?

I have just aquired a Scorpio SLX 2005 with the 2.6t engine in pretty good shape and am in the process of restoring it to 'great' shape. Will post pictures after done.

Thanks in advance.

[bhp1]

You are welcome mohnish, crde was derived from the 2.6t only i believe. So, the similarities. Maintainence levels of 2.6t were not huge, infact it might turn out to be lesser than modern engines because of its basic nature & most of garage mechanics knowing how to deal with it.
2.6t was a rugged engine, derived from agararian roots, maybe mahindra tractors. So your view seems right. Apart from the fact that it relies on lesser electronics.
One thing i had heard quite often about 2.6t was over heating. Mahindra had later on rectified it on newer models.
I shall try to find specs. & let you know soon.
Looking forward to pics.

Specifications Diesel Engine Type 4 stroke, Turbo-charged, Intercooled DI Engine Bore / Stroke, mm 94x94 No. of Cylinders 4 Displacement, CC 2609 Compression Ratio 18:5:1 Max. Net Engine Output, RPM 109 HP @ 3800 RPM Max. Net Torque, RPM 26Kgm @ 1800 Air Cleaner Dry Type Oil Filter Full Flow, Paper Type Fuel Filter Dual Type Clutch Hydraulically operated, Single plate, dry type, 240 dia Gear Box 5 Speed Type Synchromesh in all forward Gears No. of Gears 5 forward, 1 Reverse Gear Ratios I 3.78:1 II 2.09:1 III 1.43:1 IV 1.00:1 V 0.79:1 Reverse 3.52:1 Axle Front 2WD:Non Drive, Stub axle
4WD:Full floating, Drive axle, 4.55:1 Rear Semi Floating Hypoid Type, 4.55:1 Tyres & Wheels Rim 6J x 15 Tyres P235 / 75 R15 Steering Power assisted, Rack & Pinion Frame Tubular ('C' in 'C') ladder type Suspension Front Indeoendent Front with coil spring for 2WD,
Torsion bar for 4WD Rear Leaf Spring Anti Roll Bar Provided in Front Shock Absorbers Hydraulic, Double Acting & Telescopic Brakes Service Brakes Tandem Master Cylinder, Vaccum, Assisted Servo with LSPV & BV Front Ventilated Disc and caliper type Rear mm x mm Drum Type Parking Brake Internal expanding with auto adjuster on rear wheels, hand lever and cable type Fuel Tank Capacity, Ltrs. 55 Ltrs. Electrical System System Voltage, V 12V Battery, V, Amp-Hr 12V, 65AH Alternator (Max, output), Amp 90A Wiper Motor 2 speed with intermittent, link type Dimensions Wheel Base, mm 2680 Wheel Tread, mm (Front / Rear) 1450 Overall length, mm 4325 (bumper to bumper) Overall width, mm 1700 (body to body Middle door) Overall height, mm 1916 Front Tract, mm 1450 Rear Track, mm 1450 Min. Ground Clearance, mm 180 (Below axle differential) TCD, Mt. 11.2 for 2WD
11.4 for 4WD Weights Max. GVM, Kg 2WD : 2510 Kg.
4WD : 2610 Kg.

[RedMM340]

The crde is a computer controlled engine and is very difficult to tune. Plus if you have computer problem, it will be expensive to repair. Keep in mind the only point of crde is emission control.

I have a 2.6 turbo (non-crde) and like it much better. Totally tuneable for extra power. No computer keeps it simple. Put in a bigger intercooler, raise the boost pressure, increase fuel flow, and you will make crde Scorpios eat your dust.

[Mohnish]

Thanks Bhp1 for a complete detailed spec readout...Really helpful.

Thanks RedMM for your thoughts...You have put me at ease. I settled for the non crde as the crde that were offerred for sale (used) were not 'well' maintained. Most of them had unusual vibration/rough (not related to foundation wear) at idle. On the other hand, the non crde that I purchased was a good clean machine.

Regards.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Please PM me if you need any help.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[gd1418]

Hi Gaurav,

Read your post about increasing the performance of the above:

Originally Posted by RedMM340

I have a 2.6 turbo (non-crde) and like it much better. Totally tuneable for extra power. No computer keeps it simple. Put in a bigger intercooler, raise the boost pressure, increase fuel flow, and you will make crde Scorpios eat your dust.

What I want to ask is how do you raise the boost pressure? By installing a bigger turbo? Secondly, how would you increase the fuel flow?

[RedMM340]

Originally Posted by gd1418

Hi Gaurav,

Read your post about increasing the performance of the above:



What I want to ask is how do you raise the boost pressure? By installing a bigger turbo? Secondly, how would you increase the fuel flow?

Hi Mohnish,

The best way to increase boost pressure is by installing a variable boost regulator. This a pressure regulator that fools the wastgate into opening at higher pressures. I am using a Turbonetics brand in my CJ340, that costs about $100. There are several cheaper brands on U.S. ebay but be careful with these since a small turn of the knob will make huge changes in boost.

Along with the regulator, a boost pressure gauge will be needed. Not sure if these are available here in India, but you can check around.

Higher flow injectors with special polishing will make a huge difference. But this is a high specialized item that is available in the U.S. and is expensive. Figure about 25k to 30k rupees for a set of 4.

Fuel flow can be change by a mico bosch pump shop. They have a flow calibration machine, and you can have them increase flow by about 5%. Keep in mind that this will reduce your fuel economy and will give you more black smoke.

If you do this, you should be prepared to do it more than once to fine tune the fuel flow. This will require removing the fuel pump.



Regards,

[Mohnish]

Originally Posted by RedMM340

Hi Mohnish,

The best way to increase boost pressure...

Hi RedMM340,

I read on one of the threads your journey to get your 340 from the dealership to where its at today....amazing.

Though I would like to increase bhp, I am not certain that I want to go through the full 9 yards. I was thinking more in terms of k&n air filter only and maybe something else which would be a minor addition / alteration...But I know, not much gain without pain!!!

[Speed-Gladiator]

Originally Posted by bhp1

You are welcome mohnish, crde was derived from the 2.6t only i believe.
=======================
11.4 for 4WD Weights Max. GVM, Kg 2WD : 2510 Kg.
4WD : 2610 Kg.

Nice information Bhp1.

I am looking forward to buy a used 2004 Scorpio 2.6 Trubo GLX. I would like to know the about the Fuel economy of this vehicle. Whether the power of this one can be matched with the CRDe. If not, how it is reflected in the acceleration. I heard that the lower end torque is better in non CRDe compared to CRDe in Scorpio, Is that true ? Any difference in the suspension in the Non CRDe model compared to the newer one?

Thanks in Advance

[shankar.balan]

low end torque is certainly more pronounced in the old non crde version
that vehicle climbs hills and takes hairpin bends in 2nd whereas in the new crde one I find one has to move to first to get that initial power up
plus the old engine has less electronics and other bits and bobs which basically makes it more capable of a higher level of hard usage.

Crde is nice and refined and powerful etc and excellent on highways.

In terms of FE - in my experience I cannot see much difference - the old one gave about 9-10 in city and 11-12 on highways. the new one is pretty much the same.

the suspension in the old one was leaf springs at the back which are bumpy and bouncy on bad road surfaces. now they have multi link rear suspension which is more cushioned and softer, but still bouncy unless properly strapped in.

the scorpio sits really well on the road when well loaded. I am mostly alone in mine or when going out of town its only my wife and me. Therefore I find it helpful to load up the back with 2 of my steel wheels as extra ballast just to "settle" the vehicle.

hope this helps you

Originally Posted by Speed-Gladiator

Nice information Bhp1.

I am looking forward to buy a used 2004 Scorpio 2.6 Trubo GLX. I would like to know the about the Fuel economy of this vehicle. Whether the power of this one can be matched with the CRDe. If not, how it is reflected in the acceleration. I heard that the lower end torque is better in non CRDe compared to CRDe in Scorpio, Is that true ? Any difference in the suspension in the Non CRDe model compared to the newer one?

Thanks in Advance

[Speed-Gladiator]

Thank you very much Shankar.

In the older version is using less electronics so the maintenance cost also should be lower? What are the things to be consider if am going to buy a 2004, 80k done, Scorpio 2.6 turbo vehicle.

I heard about compression test. Can you please explain and how to do the compression test ?

[josepeter]

Originally Posted by RedMM340

The crde is a computer controlled engine and is very difficult to tune. Plus if you have computer problem, it will be expensive to repair. Keep in mind the only point of crde is emission control.

I have a 2.6 turbo (non-crde) and like it much better. Totally tuneable for extra power. No computer keeps it simple. Put in a bigger intercooler, raise the boost pressure, increase fuel flow, and you will make crde Scorpios eat your dust.

Dear RedMM340,

I have been contemplating an engine swap for my Bolero MDI3200TC, the scorpio 2.6T being the preferred one. Is this a very complicated affair? Will I end up with a reasonably reliable machine after a month or two in the garage with a budget of say 50K INR?

[jkdas]

You can add Pete's box to one.