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Originally Posted by kiku007 That's a huge list and it is interesting to see that people are ready to spend almost 2 million on a Tata or Mahindra SUV where quality and service seems to be a hit or miss rather than a standard. I think it comes down to the lack of enough competition. I work in quality too and the way people closed their eyes for quality issues in the Thar is fit to be taught in business schools. Sadly when there's no competition then a unique product can get away with it. It is what it is. |
Very True!
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Japan:- Japanese cars are reliable. Sure but let's not paint a picture that every carmaker and automobile that comes out of Japan is the pinnacle of reliability at all times. They have issues too.
- The Innova Crysta has its own "Niggles and issues" (Niggles & issues with the Toyota Innova Crysta) thread.
- Do search for Toyota/Subaru's engine issues with the new GR86/BRZ or the wheels coming off the Subaru Solterra or the DPF issues.
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I'm sure they do have issues. But then it's not a given everytime like Indian companies. Those I would call exceptions, specific to certain models or sometimes areas, not across the range. Whenever a new vehicle is launched I happen to go and test drive it. And I always go as a clean slate without any preconceived notions. But Everytime I go and TD any vehicle by an Indian Manufacturer, I'm utterly disappointed. I don't understand how can someone pay such prices for these vehicles. Even if they're cheaper than competition, they're still not worth somebody's hard earned money IMHO
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Germany:- What part of the DIESEL-GATE would relate to over-engineering and quality? If anything it was the opposite of that. They couldn't engineer a diesel car to handle the emission norms and wrote software to cheat the test equipment.
- The Golf MK8's infotainment system would enter the automotive museum under the section for worst designed and implemented UI. User-experience is a key pillar of success for infotainment systems.
- I won't disagree that a BMW, Porsche are brilliantly engineered vehicles but I would not say the same about everything that comes out of the VW-Skoda India.
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Diesel-gate was an overambitious attempt by their Ex CEO to continue to reap the benefits of an existing tech without spending huge money on a new tech, not that they can't. They did after that and still have that. That's on them, yet it doesn't affect the consumer in any way other than the fact that your vehicle may not meet the emission norms. That's a legal flaw, not a technical/mechanical flaw with the vehicle per se. I won't go to the infotainment systems because VW is not the only one guilty of that. In fact, a lot of other brands have been bashed for that as well and trust me Indian and Korean manufacturers are no pioneers either. So, that will keep varying from model to model and gen to gen. I mean the brands want to show that they've implemented a digital display and MID, but to be honest, I don't like it from any brand. Some may think they have improved over time, but I still find all of them laggy. In fact now even the buttons are gone, so that's the final nail in the coffin for safe driving.
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UK:
I'm not sure which company we are talking about here. Lotus or McLaren?
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No. I was referring to Jaguar and Land Rover mate. Lotus and McLaren are in a different league. I won't be comparing sports/super cars to sedans and SUVs.
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Korea:- I think the Hyundai-KIA group don't benchmark (copy in your words) them against just the Japanese.
- They are so bullish that they pretty much benchmark the best in every segment and go about building their cars to match the best. Examples: Their N range, IONIQ EV range and the Pallisade SUV.
- However, Hyundai-KIA India seems to be like a different budget/sub-brand of the global one. It is not the same.
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Yes that's true. If you have a strong marketing, you can sell almost anything. Hyundai Verna and Creta are prime examples of that in India. We all know how poorly Verna handles, the suspension setup is very sloppy and the body roll is so evident that even a kid can tell something's wrong. Still people bought it after taking a test drive and are still happy because many of them don't even know the whole purpose of a TD. For most, it's all about just those cheap fancy features that don't cost a thing to the manufacturer but help to sell these vehicles. I'm not into fancy features at all. I like my cars analog, with tactile feedback and communicative chassis. Handling will always take precedence over sheer power. I think our market will take time to mature to understand these concepts. Right now, they're more interested in sunroofs, 'n' number of extra speakers, apple car play, led lights etc.
As for being the benchmark, let me assure you they're NOT. That's what the websites/YouTube makes you believe. I've worked on a lot of Hyundai vehicles over the years and the quality of their filters, components, hoses, etc. are not even close to their Japanese counterparts that they copy. The designs are uncannily similar but still they leave a lot to be desired.
Just like Intel, Hyundai has kept a budget aside. A guy leading their marketing team (a close friend) once told me they have "x" billion dollars kept aside just to ensure that all magazines, YouTube vloggers, and websites write glorious reviews for them. Intel does the same with computer manufacturers - Intel used to pay 2 billion dollars every years to the computer brands just to use their processors (This is a figure from 2016, now it may be even more). This is way bigger than us. That's why I would never trust the internet but get my hands dirty (Pun intended
) if I want to know the complete truth.
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USA:- The Ford Endy was a good SUV and I don't recall any major/on-going quality or reliability issues with it. Sadly that option isn't available in India anymore.
- Coming to this specific thread, I think people can only pick from the available options and it will be useful if we stick to listing out the pros and cons of the vehicles in question rather than use blanket statements at a country level.
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Sure I do respect your opinion, but a little extra info doesn't hurt. Especially given that this same thread may be read by a lot of visitors as well. A bird's eye view on various brands makes people aware and they can make an informed decision irrespective of the models they're looking at. And yes, I had to mention all that in order to give the OP a rough idea on what to expect based on the country of origin. After all, were all here to help each other out