[nitro.1000bhp]

Been living with my 850gs for a couple of months now, i am actually in the middle of a longish ride and have covered about 4k kms now. My thoughts, this thing does it all!!. Bmw has been in the adventure game for donkeys years and it shows. All the little details and you come to realise why they've done what they've done. Like the gear and brake levers are made of steel instead of loominum (looking at u tiger 900) . Why? Coz if it gets bent or breaks, you could unbend it with a pipe or weld it back on if it's broken. The switch gear is quite intimidating to begin with but soon you realise all that one needs is at one's fingertips like, tcs off, ride modes, suspension settings etc. No need to get into some menu and scroll, it becomes intuitive as you ride along.

Oh and i don't know what the Africa twin crowd have been harping on about how it's better than the 23' gs850 off-road..I have been through some really gnarly single-track stuff on my bike where some of my buddies were even struggling on their 250-350 dirt bikes where this thing simply breezed through. River crossings, in between trees and vertical uphill climbs , it takes them like a walk in the park. The fuelling is glitch free, the motor is very tractable from low rpms at a higher gear than required.

Not so likeable things are the gearbox..it takes time to get used to, but just like my Duke 390 it doesn't like to putter and shift through gears like a commuter. You can't shift gears as you wish but have to get it to a certain rpm before you upshift, same with downshifts, you have to wait till the rpms drop sufficiently to be able to do it. Other not so great things, it's super top heavy while you're stood still but it's very manageable even at 5kph, it masks it's weight really well at low speeds. Front forks are non adjustable and can be harsh on ruts and broken roads, it's still 'OK' if you come from a bike like the Duke but then it can be better when one pays this much to begin with. That's all that's bad as I've figured out till now and I'll sure post more as I go along.

And about the 1250 being way better , i will find out soon, but i won't do a silly 2km test ride around the dealership and come to a conclusion. I will do a comprehensive test ride of atleast a 100kms and figure it out myself. But then, the 1250 is also 'just' 10 big ones more than my bike so..even if it is better I may not be able to afford one any time soon.

PS: anyone who is overweight and find the front forks inadequate can try the touratech closed cartridge kit. It won't break the bank but I hear it does wonders.

Cheers.

[kosjam]

Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp

Been living with my 850gs for a couple of months now, i am actually in the middle of a longish ride and have covered about 4k kms now. My thoughts, this thing does it all!!. Bmw has been in the adventure game for donkeys years and it shows.
Cheers.

hi Nitro

tried to send you a private message, but your mailbox is full, would like to connect with you and ask some questions about the GS850.

Mainly, what made you choose the GS over the GSA which has more features and a bigger fuel tank as well? Did the seat height play a part in the same?

Secondly, What is the real world fuel economy you are getting on the GS?

[GutsyGibbon]

Originally Posted by kosjam

Mainly, what made you choose the GS over the GSA which has more features and a bigger fuel tank as well? Did the seat height play a part in the same?

For the GS1250 I faced the same questions. My commute to work is 3miles , and my weekend rides are 200miles. On long rides I certainly stop every hour, I almost never ever ride till its dry. Even if I imagine riding to some desolate area, I can always carry an auxiliary tank with me. The bigger tank and extra gas moves the center of gravity upwards. If 99% of use cases do not need the bigger tank, why bother.

The seat is an inch wider and couple inches higher on the ADV. I am 6'1" both my heels easily touch the ground while seated, I like that on the GS. For off roads (yet to do this), I think I will like the seats that are slimmer. I only have a thousand road miles on my GS, but I certainly love the slimmer seats compared to the ADV for regular roads.

Although the point about GS being lighter does not really hold true. Most people end up putting the same kind of engine protection, and luggage racks on the GS. You may end up with the same final cost. But, you cant make the ADV seats slimmer, or the bike lighter if you feel like it.

This was my logic - I can see how others may think differently.

[7.83hz]

There's a rental company in Chandigarh called 'pick my moto' that offers a bunch of high end adv bikes. Last year I was fortunate to take an F850GSA from them up to Spiti and back. Had the bike with me for 12 days and really got to understand the bike through and through.

The Beemer is an incredibly comfortable adv capable touring machine. The massive tank affords a range of almost 550-600 kms, it beggars belief. But it also makes it unwieldly when standstill because it pushes so much of the weight up high. Once the bike gets moving, the mass almost magically disappears.

The dynamic esa is a game changer. Between terrains, riding styles and loads, it's a quick operation on the controls to get the bike set up. The front forks are abysmal in comparison. Maybe they could've balanced the scales by offering manual adjustability on both ends and saved some dough on the trick esa. If nothing else a factory option to up-spec the fork with adjustability would've been greatly appreciated for the advanced riders.

The riding ergonomics while sitting/standing are flawless, they have indeed been doing this for donkey's years. Over baby heads and small imperfections, the bike legit flies through, only once the front end is challenged a little more does it all start to come apart. At many instances I found myself going over rough terrain in absolute magic carpet comfort in speeds of 100kmph. But come in too hot into a corner and load up the front brakes and the forks just aren't up to the job. It's difficult to get into a flow with the flow because of this, all the fun has to end halfway through the straight and you need to calmly scrub off all the speed well before entering a corner only to begin pushing all over again. Less than ideal. This become even more apparent when the rear is loaded up with a pillion/luggage and front goes from floaty/vague to absolutely overworked upon load transfer. The chassis is good, suspension not so good. A touratech/tractive fork upgrade kit would cost in the ballpark of 1-1.5L and that should sort this issue out entirely. Worth the additional cost imho if you plan to ride it hard.

Now comes the deal breaker - the motor and the transmission are just plain un-inspiring. It sounds so bad at idle that you just want to ride away from anyone that can possibly hear it. Things settle down and get better in the low-mid range and it's barely audible at that point and when you really wind it on, it starts to sound nicer. Everything about the engine character just screams budget. The transmission is worse than the motor. Plenty of false neutrals, needs a very specific rev range to really slot in smoothly, and a damp, soggy, spongy feel throughout. No bueno.

Once you come around the really understand the engine you realize the design of the entire bike. It's a giant lardy sofa on wheels that doesn't like being pushed. Ride it nice and easy and the bike will respond in kind, it's not built to be an athlete, it's a mile munching mule.

Having said all this the quality of fit and finish and the ergonomics are leagues ahead of the Tiger 900. The Tiger might still be a better overall bike from factory because of it's spec sheet but the base F850GS Beemer with a little work thrown in could be a worthy contender for the middleweight space.

2 pennies. Make of it what you will.

[imranstael]

Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp

All the little details and you come to realise why they've done what they've done. Like the gear and brake levers are made of steel instead of loominum (looking at u tiger 900) . Why? Coz if it gets bent or breaks, you could unbend it with a pipe or weld it back on if it's broken.

Just wanted to point out that the gear lever and brake lever of the Tiger 900 have pivoting spring loaded hinges, so will fold on impact with rocks or on drops. They needn't bend back since the folding mechanism pretty much removes concerns about broken/bent levers.

Triumph puts steel levers in the Bonneville line but consciously chose aluminium folding levers for the Tigers (more expensive and well engineered IMO).

[nitro.1000bhp]

Originally Posted by kosjam

hi Nitro

tried to send you a private message, but your mailbox is full, would like to connect with you and ask some questions about the GS850.

Mainly, what made you choose the GS over the GSA which has more features and a bigger fuel tank as well? Did the seat height play a part in the same?

Secondly, What is the real world fuel economy you are getting on the GS?

Hi Kosjam, sorry bout the mail box, will clear it out when I find time.

I chose the gs over the gsa because it felt more compact for my size. I am 5'7 and though I was on tip toe, the height of the gs was manageable for me but the gsa felt awkward with its slightly taller seat height. Also, I didn't like the width of the tank on the gsa, my legs were too stretched out, it didn't feel natural for me when holding the tank either seated or standing up. And I was not comfortable with the sheer width of the gsa, though it may feel the same to ride dynamically I wasn't confident I could squeeze through gaps in our manic traffic conditions.

Fuel economy is around 12-15 if you are not on relatively free highways where you can't engage cruise. If cruising at say 5k rpm it does around 140kph and can get close to 18-20kpl. On average I see it hover around 5.5 to 6L per 100km. On trails or slow speed stuff it drops drastically to may be even single digits. Overall, my range varies between 250- 280 km on a tank full.

Cheers.

[kosjam]

Originally Posted by 7.83hz

There's a rental company in Chandigarh called 'pick my moto' that offers a bunch of high end adv bikes. Last year I was fortunate to take an F850GSA from them up to Spiti and back. Had the bike with me for 12 days and really got to understand the bike through and through.
Plenty of false neutrals, needs a very specific rev range to really slot in smoothly, and a damp, soggy, spongy feel throughout. No bueno.
Once you come around the really understand the engine you realize the design of the entire bike. It's a giant lardy sofa on wheels that doesn't like being pushed. Ride it nice and easy and the bike will respond in kind, it's not built to be an athlete, it's a mile munching mule.
Having said all this the quality of fit and finish and the ergonomics are leagues ahead of the Tiger 900. The Tiger might still be a better overall bike from factory because of it's spec sheet but the base F850GS Beemer with a little work thrown in could be a worthy contender for the middleweight space.
2 pennies. Make of it what you will.

Thanks for you detailed review. I did shortlist the tiger 900GT, but i felt there was an ergonomic issue for me, (I am 5'7") and had to drop the bike from my shortlist.
Is it possible that the engine and transmission issues were due to the fact that it was a rental (and I have seen how rentals are used and abused in Spiti) and accelerated wear was part of the issues?
In any case, my main concern was the seat height, but your review did help me be sure about my decision about the beemer. Such decisions have a rational component and an emotive component. Both need to be satisfied to go ahead. Tiger just didn't give me the satisfaction from the emotional side of things.
Me being a sedate rider it doesn't matter to me that the engine doesn't like being pushed. And as I will respond to Nitro lower down, the height is an issue, and the larger fuel tank can cause balance issues.

Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp

Hi Kosjam, sorry bout the mail box, will clear it out when I find time.

I chose the gs over the gsa because it felt more compact for my size. I am 5'7 and though I was on tip toe, the height of the gs was manageable for me but the gsa felt awkward with its slightly taller seat height. Also, I didn't like the width of the tank on the gsa, my legs were too stretched out, it didn't feel natural for me when holding the tank either seated or standing up. And I was not comfortable with the sheer width of the gsa, though it may feel the same to ride dynamically I wasn't confident I could squeeze through gaps in our manic traffic conditions.

Fuel economy is around 12-15 if you are not on relatively free highways where you can't engage cruise. If cruising at say 5k rpm it does around 140kph and can get close to 18-20kpl. On average I see it hover around 5.5 to 6L per 100km. On trails or slow speed stuff it drops drastically to may be even single digits. Overall, my range varies between 250- 280 km on a tank full.

Cheers.

I too am 5'7" and this was the precise reason I am having the issue of deciding between the 2 bikes. The width of the GSA along with the top heavy nature of the larger tank caused me to think twice. You have answered my exact question and now I feel I have taken the correct step of booking the GS instead of the GSA. Thanks for your response, it helped me gain peace of mind.

Just one question though, with a usable volume of 15 litres and subtracting 3 litres reserve, if you are getting 250 km per tank full, wouldn't that mean you are getting an average of above 20 kmpl?

[nitro.1000bhp]

Originally Posted by kosjam

I too am 5'7" and this was the precise reason I am having the issue of deciding between the 2 bikes. The width of the GSA along with the top heavy nature of the larger tank caused me to think twice. You have answered my exact question and now I feel I have taken the correct step of booking the GS instead of the GSA. Thanks for your response, it helped me gain peace of mind.

Just one question though, with a usable volume of 15 litres and subtracting 3 litres reserve, if you are getting 250 km per tank full, wouldn't that mean you are getting an average of above 20 kmpl?

I am quoting range including reserve.. reserve warning usually comes on before 75km.

You have made the right choice IMO. Freebies are nice but if we are not comfortable with the bike then we will regret it every ride. All the guards and protection came to around 1.3L for me which included an alluminium bash plate from givi and bark Busters with metal bars , you still don't get these as standard on the gsa (only get plastic hand guards and plastic bash plate) . Only major omission is the tpms which I can do without. So, in effect all the protection cost me about 30k more than what they offer on the gsa as standard which I don't mind at all.

Attaching some pics of my bike. All the best.

[7.83hz]

Is it possible that the engine and transmission issues were due to the fact that it was a rental (and I have seen how rentals are used and abused in Spiti) and accelerated wear was part of the issues?

It was basically a brand new bike, I took it right after it's first service was just completed. Being high-end rentals, usually the riders are more seasoned and don't just trash the bikes unlike the affordable REs etc. On the flipside, it could be that the engine was just too new to feel completely at ease and it probably gets better over time.

The Tiger's engine is much nicer until 120kph after which a nasty vibration creeps in. For mostly on-road riding, the triple has inherent advantages.

If you're not in a hurry, you could also wait for the Transalp 750. I bet the engine would be silky smooth, fit finish and reliability would be top notch and ownership costs next to nothing. Rumor has it Honda is planning some announcements on the 24th of this month.

[kosjam]

Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp

I am quoting range including reserve.. reserve warning usually comes on before 75km.

You have made the right choice IMO. Freebies are nice but if we are not comfortable with the bike then we will regret it every ride. All the guards and protection came to around 1.3L for me which included an alluminium bash plate from givi and bark Busters with metal bars , you still don't get these as standard on the gsa (only get plastic hand guards and plastic bash plate) . Only major omission is the tpms which I can do without. So, in effect all the protection cost me about 30k more than what they offer on the gsa as standard which I don't mind at all.

Attaching some pics of my bike. All the best.

Thanks. The pics look awesome. I am thinking of getting custom built crash bars, in anodized/ brushed aluminium finish, so they match the bike's colour scheme.

What is the quality of lighting, do you feel the need for additional lighting at night?

Planning to ride down to Bangalore as my first long distance trip after taking delivery. Will extend to Chennai if all things get planned properly...

[7.83hz]

Originally Posted by kosjam

What is the quality of lighting, do you feel the need for additional lighting at night?

On the GSA with the included aux lamps it was still dismal. My 2009 FZ 150 had better lights than the Beemer. You'll most definitely need auxiliary lighting.

I'd caution against custom made crash bars unless you know someone highly skilled and experienced. A cracked chassis in most cases means a totaled bike.

[nitro.1000bhp]

Originally Posted by 7.83hz

. On the flipside, it could be that the engine was just too new to feel completely at ease and it.....If you're not in a hurry, you could also wait for the Transalp 750. I bet the engine would be silky smooth, fit finish and reliability would be top notch and ownership costs next to nothing. Rumor has it Honda is planning some announcements on the 24th of this month.

You're right about the gearbox and bike being too new. Mine was very clunky and missed a lot of shifts in the first 1000kms but started to get better slowly. Now at 5k kms and it's a lot more precise. I didn't miss a single shift in yesterday's ride. The quick shifter is still not the finest so i only use it on highways and only for upshifts between 4-6th gears. Use only clutch for downshifts.

I am not sure but isn't the transalp a level lower than the 850gs and tiger 900 in terms of features and electronics? I believe it will compete with the tenure 700 abroad, not sure what level of features we'll get here and how they'll price it in India.

Originally Posted by kosjam

Thanks. The pics look awesome. I am thinking of getting custom built crash bars, in anodized/ brushed aluminium finish, so they match the bike's colour scheme.

What is the quality of lighting, do you feel the need for additional lighting at night?

Planning to ride down to Bangalore as my first long distance trip after taking delivery. Will extend to Chennai if all things get planned properly...

As 7.83 mentioned i would refrain from getting custom bars n stuff. Get BMW approved accessories only. I have hepco and becker bar work on mine and they have withstood my crashes quite well (all slow speed only). I have dropped the bike over 8+ times and they're quite sturdy. These are well tested and I wouldn't risk my precious with some untested custom stuff , specially for crash protection. Also, check about the warranty on fitting custom products, talk to your sales advisor.

About the lighting, it's quite poor. It's ok on well lit roads but very inadequate anywhere else. Also a major issue in ghat sections is the suspension dive under braking, the headlight beam completely dips and one can't tell which way the road is turning. So, i think we'll need 2 sets of lights, one for additional brightness and one for cornering.

All the best.

[7.83hz]

Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp

I am not sure but isn't the transalp a level lower than the 850gs and tiger 900 in terms of features and electronics? I believe it will compete with the tenure 700 abroad, not sure what level of features we'll get here and how they'll price it in India.
All the best.

If we're to consider these bikes as middleweight advs then you can throw in everything from Tenere, Tuareg, Transalp, KTM 890 on one end to the F850GS not GSA, Tiger 900, Desert X and base Africa Twin not the Adventure sports on the other end. Many regard this to be the middleweight segment.

Further within this you'll have discrimination of wheel sizes, displacement, power, torque, rider aids and electronics & of course pricing which span from bare basic on the Tenere to 6000+ possible combinations on the Desert X.

The one great thing the Transalp has going for it is it's low kerb weight 208 kgs in combination with 90+ hp on the crank. The other light middleweights top out around 80 hp and the heavier middleweights are all in excess of 225 kgs, the Beemer being the heaviest at 230 and it sure feels it. The Transalp also comes with ride by wire and electronic rider aids and modes. No one knows how it would eventually be to ride, but it could be a worthy addition to the segment for sure.

[nitro.1000bhp]

Originally Posted by 7.83hz

The one great thing the Transalp has going for it is it's low kerb weight 208 kgs in combination with 90+ hp on the crank. The other light middleweights top out around 80 hp and the heavier middleweights are all in excess of 225 kgs, the Beemer being the heaviest at 230 and it sure feels it. The Transalp also comes with ride by wire and electronic rider aids and modes. No one knows how it would eventually be to ride, but it could be a worthy addition to the segment for sure.

What I noticed on the new transalp from they spy shots is the foot peg placement. It looked too rear set, more like a road bike. That alone would be a deal breaker for me personally. Everything else is desirable.

The 850gs being considered as a middle weight seems comical to me . I believe there should be a category in between the middle weights and the super heavy weights. like they have in ufc, these should rather be called light-heavy weights instead.

[nitro.1000bhp]

Originally Posted by kosjam

Thanks. The pics look awesome. I am thinking of getting custom built crash bars, in anodized/ brushed aluminium finish, so they match the bike's colour scheme.

What is the quality of lighting, do you feel the need for additional lighting at night?

Planning to ride down to Bangalore as my first long distance trip after taking delivery. Will extend to Chennai if all things get planned properly...

Hi Kosjam, I heard the sales guy say there's a new version of the 850gs with more standard features like tpms, bigger windscreen and foot pegs. There's a new colour too and a price increase of 60k. If you haven't taken delivery of yours yet , i suggest you enquire about upgrading to the newer spec. From what I heard these are already being delivered to customers.