[Jaggu]

The prelude or the customer plight!

I have been a Triumph India customer since 2014 apart from the detune fiasco, things were mostly good at the beginning. Even the detune fiasco I would give Triumph a very good rating on how it was resolved to owners content and then later going ahead and publishing the real power figures of the affected model. Here in Bangalore, the sales folks were pretty good and service was pretty decent. Infact just between 3 close friends we had bought 5 Triumph bikes between 2014 and 2016, that should speak volumes regarding our faith in the brand.

Now comes the sad turn of events, as the sales numbers went up the service started to suffer. Initial days it was mostly attributed to the long downtimes compared to the quality. Triumph India has a weird logistic model, where parts used to get shipped to Delhi HQ and from there shipped to dealership across the country. This resulted in huge delays, the whole procurement cycle used to take anything from 4 to 8 weeks! Whereas other brands used to ship parts directly in under 1 to 2 weeks. Fair enough these are premium bikes and not daily rides for many, so we accepted to live with the issues.

As time progressed volumes increased and so did the complaints, most of the rider groups were filled with complaints and issues. Some dealers like the one in Bangalore tried to address some of it by opening a much larger service facility, which we were assured will take care of most of the issues with turnaround time and the agitated owners were assured of better service in the coming days. As time passed another more serious matter started popping up, the quality of service. Over the years other brands had opened shops and the fight for quality service technicians increased, with more opportunities around they moved to greener pastures. Some went to other brands, some were poached by private multibrand garages that were popping up, and some even started their own outfits. End result was more and more apprentice started taking over the job at dealer workshop.

With no formal training process or hand holding from the brands, the dealership is on its own on how these new technicians are brought to speed on the bikes. End result pathetic service quality and sometime very dangerous mistakes that can put the rider's life at risk. The private multibrand garages started making use of this opportunity, but they never had access to OE parts, diagnostic softwares or special tools. This meant one can do basic and generic maintenance with these outfits, but when it comes to more complex / long duration services or repairs which needs troubleshooting, the Triumph owners were at the mercy of the dealership. Let me not get into accident repairs, they were real horror scenarios that even made us riders careful enough not to drop the bike or get into situations! LOL.

It was all but natural that whatsapp groups started forming specific for services related issues, rides or bikes were no more the hot topic. It was how my bike got messed up, how my life was put in danger, how one was conned at service. Last when I checked one such group had 147 Triumph owners from across India!

Obvious question arises, why was this not escalated to Triumph India? Reality was most of the owners had attempted to take this up with India as well as the UK Headquarters, but eventually like most brands, that does not care about their customers once the sale happens, Triumph also routes the owners back into the running around mode with dealer. People who have good contacts or connects at dealership will have better experience, whereas unassuming customers will take the brunt, often landing in very expensive bills based on the whims and fancies of the dealer. When things got hotter owners even had mass walk in meetings at dealership to take up the matter. I was part of two meetings here in Bangalore with the dealer, and abundant assurance was given on how things are changing and would improve for the better. Reality was apart from the sweet talk nothing much changed. The last one I remember was in April 2019 here in Bangalore.

Few owners even went one step ahead and tried roping in Triumph India senior folks into meetings with aggrieved customers, I remember a meeting with Marketing and Dealer Development Head(If am not mistaken) Puneet, in one of the 5-star hotel in Bangalore on 16 Sep 2019. There were close to 70-80 customers who landed at the venue after the meeting was disclosed on the whatsapp group a few hours before. He was patient enough to listen to the folks to close to about 2 hours and we were really positive of the outcome. It was a free flow of experiences that was shared. by the customers. Owners even listed out items which if addressed by Triumph India and the dealer will make it a great brand. We all were assured that we will hear back some good news and things will be set in motion to fix. Leave the assurance away, not even an acknowledgment of the meeting or the points discussed has arrived even till date (Mar 2020).

The reality today is that there is an absolute lack of trust on the service and technical capability at workshops and absolute lack of will from Triumph as a brand to get involved and resolve issues. Fear is such that customers video shoot the entire bike before giving it in for service, insist that they stand along their bikes during service to monitor work is being done, most of the loyal owners (some repeat customers) will not even recommend the brand to their friends.

Only handful of dealerships across the country have had positive service feedbacks (real life and not based on some customer satisfaction survey, we all know how it goes), Mumbai, Cochin, Vijaywada and Pune also recently are I believe the better ones as per feedbacks. There are customers who ride from other states to these service centres to get their vehicles maintained speaks volumes about their service quality Vs others.

Few questions comes to my mind and I hope these are reasonable expectations, after paying Lakhs of hard earned money to purchase these premium bikes!

• Is it too much to expect a decent and timely service from a premium brand like Triumph?
• Why is Triumph India NOT putting its foot down and getting things in order at each and every dealership?
• After selling thousands of bikes why can’t the brand ensure common parts required for service and repair are made available at dealerships at reasonable time frames?
• Why is the brand not investing on training the technicians when they come into dealerships and is the process so bad that dealers are able to get away with whomever they recruit?
• Why is it that dealers are not monitored for their labor billing practices? Shouldn’t a standard job have a standard labor bill?
• Last but not least, is there any commitment from the brand to the customers when it comes to after sales support? Apart from selling RSA or Insurance.

No, we don’t want any sweet-talking executive to call us and take feedbacks, we want the brand and the dealers to act on what is already shared by so many of us and get things fixed!

I will now start with my personal experience at service, and share few from other owners who responded to my request while taking this public. You might be wondering why the sudden post?

I just realized I have my bike which has done 20,000 kms parked at my basement unable to be taken for a long ride (not coz of Covid) but due to the pathetic feedback of local dealer service, due to which I am unable to convince myself to risk the work on my bike. For the 20,000 kms service also I waited since Sep 2019, for some good news to come from other customers, when this never happened I had to use another dealership in another state to get the work done in Feb of 2020.

Unfortunately, again the bike is down due to a normal wear and tear part (fork oil seal), so the choice is to get the parts procured and then do it at a known independent place (since bike is not rideable for long distance to the other dealership), ie if I manage to get the OE seals somehow. Add to this the risk of the local guys not having full grasp of what needs to be done. Travails of owning a Triumph India Motorcycle!

[Jaggu]

My personal experience with Triumph Motorcycle India service. Dealer Keerthi Triumph, Bangalore.

Bike 1 Street Triple 675 2014 model.

First Service – It was basic oil and filter change and was done fast and efficient. Mind you the service set up was small and along with the showroom at that time at Keerthi Triumph, Bangalore. Maybe this was one of the reason work was good, since everything was under one roof and prospective customers could easily see what the current ones experience lol

First repair – While returning from Conoor and after a long ride in the rain, bike started erratic idle at low revs. Spend half a day cleaning throttle body and swapping sensors from demo bike. Finally I stepped in and google the error code and narrowed it down to atmospheric pressure sensor. Bike was rideable but it took 4 to 5 weeks (weekly follow ups from my side) for the part to come. Triumph was in it's second year and this was not a fast moving part so will give them benefit of the doubt.

First annual service – My bike at that time had about 6000 to 7000 kms done but to ensure warranty is honoured I agreed to get the service done. Again normal oil and filter change stuff, but while returning I felt the gears were notchy and some noise from the drive chain. Came home and realized they had tuned the chain tension like a guitar string! It was too tight, rode back to the service and got the chain loosened. Gear change became ok, but the noise remained at low speed. It used to make the trademark “kachak kachak” sound, later realized that the over-tightening had messed up the O rings in the chain. Being an expensive replacement, I let it be till the day bike was sold at around 11,000 kms.

Bike 2 Tiger 800 XRX preowned 6700 kms.

Though I booked a brand new one at my dealer, current bike popped up on the riding group and since I could save on EMI opted for it. I had paid 50,000 INR as advance, but instead of refunding I bought accessories and remaining was adjusted for the service. Mind you inspite of this and being a repeat customer, they deducted 5000 INR for cancellation. I didn’t bother much since it might have been an incentive for the sales guy, so let them be.

First annual service - As soon as I took the bike it was bout 10 months old, I took it for a full checkup and annual service at 7000 kms. Since I had the advance amount lying with the dealer, I gave them a full go ahead and asked them to replace whatever is needed. The service called and informed I need to replace air filter and brake pads. Pads were not in stock so placed an order and got the bike back. It felt good apart from those tyres which got buggered due to the long idle time out in the sun the bike previously had. Got the accessories also fitted.

Repair visit – Brake pads had arrived and got them fitted, some discount thing was running and I got decent rates too. While installing the trainee technician wedges screw driver between the pads to move the calliper pistons back and nicely scars one set of pads. There are some standard procedures that needs to be done, which was not done hence the wedge method. Result a screaming front brake right after change. Got the pads lightly sanded from outside and decided to live with rest.

Got the cone set adjusted (was too tight) and this really helped in handling though the tires were bad. Fortunately this was done by a senior mech at that time and I was standing and checking on the tolerance lol

Tyre replacement - Like a fool I took the brand new tyres to dealer to fit and they charged me some 1500 per tyre for mounting and took an entire day for this. I was told tyres were being fitted and balance at an external place and hence the additional cost. Later I realised I could have got the job done at Madhu's myself and got the retorquing of axle done at dealer for free lol. Lessons learned.

Second Annual Service – Though bike had just done about 12,000 Kms, to have a clean service record and to retain the warranty I went ahead and got it done. I had left clear instruction to call me if any parts need replacement, and hence I was informed that air filter is clogged, was even sent a pic so I approved the same. I clearly don’t remember and have lost the bill, but either the filter was replaced or I was told it was cleaned and put back. More of this air filter replacement later. I had reported a slight hesitation at lower revs right from day 1 I took the bike, like something was choking the engine which remained even after service. This was reported at previous service also, as soon as I bought the bike. Both times I was assured it was normal Tiger behaviour, and since I was used to the more powerful Street, I was observing the issue. Was not convinced but let it be.

Things got progressively worse over the months and years with regards to service feedback on various whatsapp groups, and with my previous experiences I was wary of taking the bike back into dealership. So I decided to skip the annual service then on and get the bike to workshop only at 20,000 kms and 4 years. Honestly the bike never skipped a beat and ran flawless those 18 plus months, that is the bike for you and why we love it so much. Meanwhile all the drama meetings we happening but on the other hand things never improved in reality, apart from more follow up calls.

Finally I decided to get the bike serviced at dealer from a neighbouring state and that was a major revelation in itself.

20,000 kms + 4th year service (done at another dealership)

The way in which those technicians worked, carefully taking out each part, cleaning and inspecting it and doing the necessary changes in itself was refreshing. Downside it was a small dealership with just two folks, so it took its sweet time and I could not complete two of the planned work and decided to put it off for later. After the service I took the bike home and the change was phenomenal. Yes I had new synthetic oil which I was experimenting, that would definitely not add to BHP. Yes new plugs, but my old plugs were in very good shape somehow. So what would be the reason for the transformation? Remember the air filter fiasco and engine hesitation the bike had from day 1, and reported at first and second annual service. That had disappeared completely and the bike was pulling like it should, clean, crisp and nice. The brakes, though the pads were at the end of the life, never felt so good! and am referring to right from day I picked up the bike. I always used to envy my friends bike on how it behaved in these two aspects and my bike was just like that bike now!

That was the final coffin on my faith in the great Bangalore dealership and swore I would never risk going back.

One of the major reason for the engine performance improvement was the air filters. Mind you this was replaced at around 7000 kms and then again replaced / or to give benefit of doubt cleaned at around 12000 kms. Now I will let this one image do the talking, you can be the judge if I was conned or it is normal for a bike with about 8000 or say 13000 kms to have such a filter.



I had neglected the annual service so I blame myself for not changing the coolant at 3 years, ideally 2 years for our Indian conditions. The OE coolant would be bluish.



When I shared my frustration on whatsapp and how I would be taking this public so that people know what this brand has become, few of the other group members shared their experiences with me to be posted here, sharing the same in the subsequent posts.

[Jaggu]

Email shared by another customer who had raised the issue of engine noise from the bike.

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Customer Care <Customer.Care@triumphmotorcycles.in>
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2018 at 7:00 PM
Subject: RE: Ongoing issue with my Triumph Tiger 800 xcx
To: xxx@gmail.com>
Cc: prasanna@keerthi.co.in <prasanna@keerthi.co.in>, service@keerthi.co.in <service@keerthi.co.in>


Dear Sir,

Greetings from Triumph Motorcycles!

This is with reference to your query regarding the Triumph Tiger 800 XCx motorcycle.

Triumph have thoroughly investigated this concern and can confirm that this noise does not represent a reliability, performance or safety concern. The noise is caused by the normal interaction of the balancer driven gear and backlash gear with the balancer drive gear on the crankshaft. Due to the torque variation on the crankshaft during the different phases of crank rotation, these gears very briefly come out of mesh. The noise then occurs when the gears come back into mesh.

Due to the manufacturing tolerances on the crankshaft, balancer shaft, balancer drive gears and crankcase the level of this noise will naturally vary between bikes. This tolerance is within all Design limits and does not indicate a manufacturing or warrantable defect. No repair is necessary.

For further queries request you to contact your local dealership.

Thank you for communicating with us.

Sincerely,

Triumph Motorcycles Customer Support

Email: Customer.Care@triumphmotorcycles.in

Toll Free Number : 1800300 00051

From: Customer Care
Sent: 06 November 2017 10:16
To: 'xxx@gmail.com'
Cc: prasanna@keerthi.co.in; 'service@keerthi.co.in'
Subject: RE: Ongoing issue with my Triumph Tiger 800 xcx



Dear Sir,

Greetings from Triumph Motorcycles!

At the outset we regret for the inconvenience caused to you.

This is with reference to your email regarding the query with your Triumph Tiger XCx motorcycle.

We have shared your email with our local dealership in Bangalore and have apprised them on the concern. Our dealership will share the update with you.

Thank you for communicating with us.

Sincerely,

Triumph Motorcycles Customer Support

Email: Customer.Care@triumphmotorcycles.in

Toll Free Number : 1800300 00051

From:xxx@gmail.com]
Sent: 04 November 2017 22:59
To: Customer Care; After.Sales; TMA After Sales
Subject: Ongoing issue with my Triumph Tiger 800 xcx



Hi All,

Last year I bought a Tiger 800 xcx after a long wait for a good adventure bike to live my riding dream with brand name like Triumph, but with recent experience with the bike and overall experience with the dealers technical knowledge not only spoiled my dream, it made me think whether I did a mistake by trusting brand name like Triumph.

I bought this bike to have good time with it but with the current situation it became more of headache rather fun of having Triumph bike.

Below are the detailed explanation of what sort of experiance I am going through.

This issue is that my tiger 800 xcx ( VIN-xxxx) had engine noise from day one after purchasing in April 2016, initially I have been told that it's initial noise and post first servicing it will vanish.

After first service also the noise continued and they convinced me that this is how triple cylinder bike runs, later when I compared my bike with other Tigers around I raised my concern, by that time bike was seen over 5000 kms, I did the checkup at service station and went on long ride and when I returned bike had over 10000 kms on odo meter. Again I raised the issue during 2 nd servicing but it has been avoided big time and only servicing was done. Post that bike developed serious noise and by that time bike had clocked 12000 kms and service center came up with plan of replacing timing chain and told me to ride till the parts lands up. I did few more rides and after 16500 kms they replaced the timing chain with came, bike felt better only during cold start and post warm up again the noise was evident. I have been advised to test it for another 300 kms, which I did and gave the bike to service station as the bike was suppose to be inspected by senior triumph technician Sachin Patil from Delhi, they also did all the tests and inspection. Today when I went to collect my bike it was having the same irritating engine noise and no changes at all. I am not sure what bike has been allotted to me and why triumphs senior technicians are not able to identify the issue forget solving. I have taken this bike on loan and just paying the emi for keeping it parked in service center without any resolution and no hope of the at-least having clue of what's wrong with the bike.I am running out of patience and don't want to wait further when triumph India has shown their technical capabilities.

I am not keen on anything apart from these two things in next one week, either solve the issue or let me know that what should I do with a bike which your own people are not able to identify the issue forget fixing it.

I have wasted easily 45 days keeping bike in service center, if you people are able to sort out the issue, as a goodwill extend my warranty for whatever days I wasted in service center with zero resolution.

I have a feel that you people are just waiting time by saying spares are on the way, we are getting technician from Delhi etc just to ensure the warranty period should get over and we will be with the mercy of triumph.

Consider this as highest priority and provide me resolution in next one week before it escalates further which might impact the image of triumph worldwide.

I don't have any issue with the dealership but a defected bike is also not acceptable when I am paying my hard earned money as an EMI every month without enjoying the bike. At least I have expected the dealer to have the technical capabilities to identify the issue and fixing it, rather trying to hide and do a trial n error on our bikes with patching up job.



We are organizing All India Tigers Meet again this year during 2018 Jan 25-30th just like last year but in bigger scale with minimum 100 tigers around, hope we are not preparing to have a bad name during that time that the core organizing committee member is riding a defected Tiger which Triumph is not able to identify nor able to fix the issue.



Waiting for positive response, hope you people have time to go through complete mail rather just sending automated response.Also very keen on service history as I have a strong feeling that most of the complains raised during servicing and regular checkups are not been recorded.



Thanks,

xxxxx





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Another email on same issue.

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: xxxx@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2018 at 7:09 PM
Subject: Ongoing issue with my Triumph Tiger 800 xcx
To: <nick.bloor@triumphmotorcycles.co.uk>, <nick.bloor@triumph.co.uk>, <john.bloor@triumphmotorcycles.co.uk>, <john.bloor@triumph.co.uk>, <lee.maggs@triumphmotorcycles.co.uk>, <paul.stroud@triumph.co.uk>, <paul.stroud@triumphmotorcycles.co.uk>, <guy.masters@triumph.co.uk>, <guy.masters@triumphmotorcycles.co.uk>, <garry.clarke@triumph.co.uk>, <garry.clarke@triumphmotorcycles.co.uk>, <info@triumphmotorcycles.com>, <triumph@ownersurveys.com>, <after.sales@triumph.co.uk>, <john.eastham@triumph.co.uk>, <john.eastham@triumphmotorcycles.co.uk>
Cc: <vimal.sumbly@triumphmotorcycles.in>


Hi All,


I am formally logging this case since I am helpless and couldn’t get the problem resolved with “TRIUMP INDIA” and BANGALORE dealer “KEERTHI”. I am a proud owner of TRIUMP TIGER XCX delivered to me on 5th APRIL 2016 and I have experiencing the below problem from the day 1 which was reported back to the dealer on 14th MAY 2016 during my first scheduled service. Bike VIN number xxxxx.



Issue Description:



There is a unusual noise / weird coming out of the ENGINE when the engine is running COLD and the noise level only increases when it’s in optimum temperature. While I rode the bike in the initial stages (0 – 5000 KMS) with assurance from the dealer initially the problem is not very critical and it’s a normal phenomenon in many of the bikes I started noticing the problem persisted and with repeated visits to the dealer I returned without any resolution which is frustrating and lead to humiliation as I never enjoyed my rides and ended up with a very bad start from an experience perspective with TRIUMP.



Case History:



The problem was first reported to KEERTHI during first service and I was informed this is because the bike is having Triple cylinder engine and this is normal. While I was convinced when I checked on the other bikes, I realized there was something drastically wrong with my bike engine characteristics and was not diagnosed properly.
I then rode the bike for next 10000 KMS with the persisting problem and reported the issue back to KEERTHI during 2nd scheduled service. I was repeatedly told this is normal behavior and everything in order and nothing wrong with the engine per say. While I didn’t have an option to escalate further I decided to take the bike back and clocked 15000 KMS but the sound levels only increased which was really annoying and humiliating and eventually I stopped enjoying my RIDES which is the key objective of owing a TIGER, this led me to situation in regretting to have bought the bike from TRIUMP which is a recognized company globally and lost confidence in making the option to have bought the bike from my 10 years of savings.
I dropped my bike with KEERTHI in JULY 2017 with the same issue and KEERTHI finally diagnosed the issue with timing chain and decided to replace under warranty. The dealer ordered for the part and replaced after 8 weeks post which I started riding and clocked 600 KMS post which the issue was reported back to KEERTHI and the bike was dropped back at the service center on 14th Oct 2017.
The Bike was stationed from 14th Oct to 9th Dec at the service center and finally was informed the issue has been resolved and the Dealer requested me to take the bike back and try the following which is really frustrating and humiliating. I still decided to give it a try and wished the problem will be resolved which was really bothering me for over 18 months…here is what happened:
As advised I rode for 600 KMS and during the ride the noise level was persisting while engine was cold and its only increased and became worst as I rode during the day. While I cooperated and accepted the decision from the dealer to try the option I was end of the day completely disappointed and humiliated with no options to fix the issue which is completely mechanical.
The dealer who has been reviewing my issue also recorded the issue but then he couldn’t conclude / help with a resolution end of the day and not sure of his limitation which I prefer not to deliberate at this point as its completely out of my per view.


I am now completely frustrated and humiliated with so much of a compromise my problem had not been resolved while I have been highly patient and cooperative for last 20 months. I decided to bring to this notice basis my understanding as below and I need your kind attention and immediate action else will be forced to go legal if no one from TRIUMP is coming forward to fix this issue as the staked are really high at my end considering investment and dreams of owning a adventure bike:


Why was the problem reported not analyzed during the first service?
Why was the problem reported not analyzed during the second service?
Why am I forced to ride the bike for 600 KMS while I have clocked 17000 KMS on speedo to get an assurance the problem is resolved?
This Saturday 6th of January again I have been asked to do a test ride with Triumph technician, my point is if issue is not identified by them till now why again test ride?It's all adding to my frustration and I am yet to hear from the dealer on their findings from the first ride and they are not sharing any info on any of their findings.
If bike is mechanically fine why the timing chain with other components has been replaced, don't we have qualified technicians to identify the actual issue rather shooting the arrow in the dark?
My bike was with the dealer from last two months and I was just paying the EMI without riding the bike, is the dealer is OK to pay for my bike's EMI's? If not do they have justification for retaining the bike without any action plan?

I am not sure what next Triumph is having as an action plan for my noisy bike, but sure I am loosing patient and slowly trust on brand known as Triumph.
I have made another friend(Mr. Satish Rao bike VIN number xxxxx) of mine to pick the tiger at same time and he is also going through same issue, and I am not able to face him don't know whether I did a mistake by referring them to Triumph or issue is with the dealer.

Not sure how the customers feedback is treated in Triumph, but I am not happy with overall experience and the way I have been treated till now. My warranty of 24 months is also coming to expire in April 2018 and somehow I am feeling that Indian dealer is buying a time and they are looking forward to wash their hands post warranty.

It's really tough time for a guy like me who waited for such a long time for his dream bike which turned out to be nightmare now.

Expecting a positive response along with solution for my bike, I am not expecting anything else. May be expert advice from UK Triumph to Triumph India technicians as I found them to be very poor specially with big bike's, but I am leaving all that decision to Triumph.

I hope the issue is going to be taken care on urgent basis along with extended warranty for two years as bike had issue from the day of purchase.

Regards,
xxxx

[Jaggu]

Second customer who shared email interaction with me, mind you he is again a repeat customer to the brands

Dear Vishnu,

Please refer our conversation of date on the discussion below.

You did mention that even though Triumph does mention that they will give a Pannier Kit worth INR 1.5 lakhs free, a portion of the value has to be borne by Keerthi Triumph. That is your business model and I have nothing to do with it. As against giving me a pannier kit worth INR 1.5 lakhs free (as per assurances) you have given me a cash discount of INR 25000.

Please do let me know, if an accessory of INR 1.5 lakhs can be offset with a cash discount of INR 25000?

Best regards,

xxx

From: xxxx
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2019 10:15 AM
To: GOWTHAM S R <worksmanager@keerthi.co.in>; 'VISHNU V P' <smtriumph@keerthi.co.in>; pca@keerthi.co.in
Cc: customer.care@triumphmotorcycles.in
Subject: RE: After sales service issues - KA 50 EB 9883 Tiger 1200 Xcx

Dear Vishnu,

It is very frustrating that after several discussions and emails, as an Organization I neither get a response nor a solution to my issues highlighted.

As part of the initial discussions that we had prior to me making the booking amount for the bike under reference, I was assured a complete aluminum adventure pannier kit with my motorcycle at no cost to me. As we progressed in the discussions and got closer to me making the full payment for the motorcycle, Triumph India confirmed to yourself (as a representative of Keerthi Triumph) that an aluminum adventure pannier kit compatible with the Tiger 800 would be given at no cost to the undersigned.

Considering that I was buying a brand new Tiger 1200 Xcx, it did not make sense to me that I receive a pannier system that is compatible with a Tiger 800.

I went ahead and purchased a pannier mounting kit from World of Triumph with no further reference to Keerthi Triumph.

Upon all the issues as in my email below were overcome, it has come to light that the panniers as such are a common component for both the Tiger 1200 as well as the 800 series of motorcycles.

Now that this has come to light, I realize that I was intentionally not given this vital piece of information. If I were told, I would have at least availed the panniers as part of free kit that was promised.

Given the above, since giving me the aluminum panniers is pending from your end, as part of the sale agreement, I suppose I do not really have to pay for the panniers. Please ask Triumph India to compensate Keerthi Triumph to the extent of the panniers.

Best regards,

xxxx

PS: With regard to the issue of the stock OEM mirrors supplied with the motorcycle, I have spoken at length at Keerthi’s service center and also a few times with Puran of Triumph India on 9599196301, I am not receiving any approach to a solution. I have now installed Double Take mirrors at a considerable cost to myself and the mirror vibration as in my email below is non-existent. This is a severe safety issue and is alarming that none of you even bother to address the problem.

-------
From: xxx
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2019 4:39 PM
To: GOWTHAM S R <worksmanager@keerthi.co.in>; 'VISHNU V P' <smtriumph@keerthi.co.in>
Subject: RE: After sales service issues - KA 50 EB 9883 Tiger 1200

Dear Both,

In confirmation of our discussions of date, basis Triumph India’s instructions, Vinod from Keerthi Triumph has communicated that the panniers would be replaced as a warranty replacement, along with new lock barrels.

Please consider the following;

I accepted the silver panniers to accommodate the errors at Triumph India’s manufacturing end as well as errors at Keerthi Triumph’s installation end.
This was as against my requirement of anodized black panniers
Please provide me with Black panniers on both sides
I will also need a common key for the whole bike which means you have to provide me with five lock barrels
I have placed an order for a spare key fob with key. This should also be matched with the replacement barrels

I have a ride in the first week of June, 2019 and I would like these rectifications to be done by then.

Best regards,

xxxx


From: xxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2019 8:40 AM
To: GOWTHAM S R <worksmanager@keerthi.co.in>; 'VISHNU V P' <smtriumph@keerthi.co.in>
Subject: After sales service issues - KA 50 EB 9883 Tiger 1200

Dear Both,

As you are aware, as on 12th May, 2019 I have just completed three full years of my Triumph ownership experience. Two years and eight months on the Tiger 800 XCX and now five months on the Tiger 1200 XCX.

While both Tigers have amazed me, and helped me enjoy life, it has helped me be more agile both physically and mentally. However, the after sales experience has been quite horrendous if I may say so.

I have sold the Tiger 800 much against my heart, and hence will focus on the after sales service issues I have faced with my Tiger 1200 XCX in the last five months and 9731kms of ownership.

Date of delivery of cited motorcycle 14th December, 2018
Pannier kit
As part of the purchase of a new 2018 model Tiger 1200 XCX, I was assured a full pannier kit at no cost to me
This was also confirmed by Keerthi Triumph Sales team (Vishnu) with Triumph India
Triumph India later clarified that the free pannier kit that was being offered to me was compatible with the Tiger 800 family of motorcycles and not with the Tiger 1200 family of motorcycles
Since the pannier kit being offered was not compatible with the Tiger 1200 motorcycle I intended to purchase, I did not pursue this further. Keerthi Triumph offered me a small cash discount (not comparable with the value of a pannier kit)
Subsequently, I went ahead and purchased a set of Triumph Expedition Pannier Mounting Kit from www.worldoftriumph.com and installed the same
A couple of months later I spoke with Keerthi and agreed to purchase a pair of Triumph Expedition Panniers
Wednesday, 8th May, 2019 On confirmation that the panniers were available, I carried the lock barrels for installation with the Triumph Expedition Panniers
i. After three hours of waiting, I was told that the lock barrels were not compatible with the anodized black (my preferred color) Triumph Expedition Panniers, and that Keerthi Triumph would approach for a solution
ii. I was later told that Triumph India would send a new set of lock barrels compatible with the anodized black Triumph Expedition Panniers
iii. Saturday, 11th May, 2019 Keerthi Triumph informs me that the fresh lock barrels would be available by the evening of Monday, 13th May, 2019
iv. Monday, 13th May, 2019 No lock barrels received. I was told that they would arrive the next day by 11am of Tuesday, 14th May, 2019
v. Tuesday, 14th May, 2019 No lock barrels received. Keerthi Triumph asks me if I would be willing to accept a pair of silver Triumph Expedition Panniers. With no choice, I agreed.
The panniers were installed by about 1.30PM and demonstration of the mounting was made
On returning to my residence some 25 kms from Keerthi Triumph Service Centre, I realize that the key opens only the RH pannier and not the LH pannier
In discussion with Keerthi Triumph, I ride again back to Keerthi Triumph showroom to realize that Keerthi Triumph had no solution to offer
I have now been told that in consultation with Triumph India, I would be provided with a solution by today Wednesday, 15th May, 2019
In all these exercises, I realize that the Triumph Expedition Panniers that have been provided to me are in fact the same panniers that are a common pannier for both the Tiger 800 family and the Tiger 1200 family of motorcycles. It may please be noted that I was offered a pannier kit at no cost as part of the discussions during purchase of the cited motorcycle
Radiator / Coolant / Engine temperatures
At this juncture I would like to state that I always carry out a 5000 kms engine break-in regime on all new engines. And I followed this on the cited motorcycle
A couple of days after beginning to use the motorcycle, I realize that the time taken for the radiator to cut out was very long and that the duration was about 8 to 10 minutes. AS an engineer and applying logic I always wait for the radiator fan to cut out before switching off the engine. But waiting for ten minutes would mean that the engine wear would be higher
I then realized that the coolant level in the reservoir was dropping drastically
I made at least two visits to Keerthi to carry out a coolant top up
Thursday, January 3, 2019 On a third visit to Keerthi Triumph in Bangalore’s treacherous traffic the TFT display showed Critical Engine Temperature alarm. I allowed the bike to cool for a few minutes and proceeded to Keerthi Triumph Service Centre
i. The engine was allowed to cool for a few hours and the coolant was drained out to realize that of the 2.4 litres of the full capacity of the cooling system, only 800 ml of coolant was drained. This was an alarming situation for me.
ii. Keerthi confirmed that it did not appear if the coolant was escaping into the engine through gaskets. Nor did it appear like the engine oil was getting contaminated
iii. The complete coolant was replaced afresh with Triumph’s Hybrid Oat Coolant with no explanation whatsoever as to what could be the reason. Please note that I had to bear cost of labor and coolant.
iv. Over the next few days the frequency of fan operation was very high and the coolant was continuously dropping.
v. 22nd January, 2019 I embarked on a long ride of 1550 kms with two overnight stops. The upward journey was completed with no issue. And I was under the notion that my coolant issue / engine temperature issue has been sorted.
vi. Unfortunately, my relief was extremely short. 28th January, 2019 I reached Nagpur, Maharashtra, India and at the hotel where I parked I realize that the radiator coolant had boiled over and the coolant level in the reservoir was again low. But considering I was yet ridding slow due to my extended engine break-in regime I was confident that if I rode on open roads early in the morning, I’d not have a coolant boil over.
vii. I reached Rebel Triumph Hyderabad by 10am. By about 7PM the same day, Rebel Triumph concluded that the radiator cap was faulty and needed replacement. Fortunately, this was available in stock and was promptly replaced
With this, the above issue was promptly sorted.

I had to spend over multiple visits and spending over 24 hours on multiple visits at Triumph Service centers
Wrong spares provided
As in the previous point, I embarked on a long ride and thought it judicious that I carry a set of brake pads. I picked up a set and fortunately did not have the need to replace the pads and returned to station with no incident (excepting the radiator coolant boil over and radiator cap replacement).

A week after my ride, I get a call from Keerthi Triumph that incompatible brake pads had been provided and they needed to be exchanged.

Once again, I had to ride in treacherous traffic to get the brake pad set exchanged.
Spare Key fob
I requested a price estimation for a spare key fob and was told it would cost about INR 4000. I asked Keerthi Triumph to place an order
After the customary waiting period of two months I was shown a smart key (not the fob with a key)
On further explanation and Keerthi discussing with Triumph India a key fob with a pre-cut key has been ordered and this is expected to be delivered by the end of May, 2019 or first week of June, 2019
Mirrors
Several complaints on vibrating mirrors, I was forced to initiate an email on 12th April, 2019 to which I have not yet received a solution. The mirrors become unusable at high speeds due to the extreme vibrations. In my opinion, they need replacement.

The overall after sales service experience has been nightmarish to say the least. I intend charging Keerthi Triumph / Triumph India for the time I’ve wasted at your service stations, so also the cost of running and maintenance, as attached. Please take conscious note that due to the inefficient service you have put my motorcycle at risk of extreme wear and tear and so also put me in a gravely unsafe situation.

I expect a response from Keerthi Triumph and Triumph India.

Best regards,

xxxxx

PS: I hope the panniers issue will be sorted today without any further delay.

------------

From: xxxx
Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2019 10:15 AM
To: GOWTHAM S R <worksmanager@keerthi.co.in>
Subject: Re: Tiger 1200 mirrors - KA 50 EB 9883

Gowtham,

I do appreciate your efforts. But thi habeen highlighted much earlier, and iwroteanemail.only because i did not gtany revert.

Now also, other than verbal assurances I have no other feedack.

It is a potentially dangerous situation and needa resolution.

Can you take me on call with Triumph?

Best regards,

xxxx

Get Outlook for Android

From: GOWTHAM S R <worksmanager@keerthi.co.in>
Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2019 10:11:38 AM
To: xxxx
Subject: RE: Tiger 1200 mirrors - KA 50 EB 9883

Dear Sir,

Very Good morning,

Greetings from Keerthi Triumph!

With referring to below mentioned concern, it has already been shared with Triumph India.

We will update you in further..

Thanks & Regards,

Gowtham S R
Works Manager
Keerthi Triumph
No 223, 4th cross,
Lalbagh Road
Bangalore - 560 027.
MOB: 080-41477227
Mail Id: worksmanager@keerthi.co.in
Description: k1
-----------
From: xxxx
Sent: 25 April 2019 09:31
To: GOWTHAM S R
Subject: RE: Tiger 1200 mirrors - KA 50 EB 9883

Dear Gowtham,

Is Triumph going to give me a resolution? The mirrors start vibrating at 104 kmph and by the time I’ve touched 125 kmph there is nothing I can see.

This is a very unsafe condition if I do not have a clear view of site in my rear view mirrors.

Can I speak with somebody at Triumph India?

Best regards,

xxxx
_____________________________________________
From: xxxxx
Sent: Friday, April 12, 2019 11:10 AM
To: GOWTHAM S R <worksmanager@keerthi.co.in>
Subject: Tiger 1200 mirrors - KA 50 EB 9883


Dear Gowtham,

Please refer the multiple occasions I’ve spoken with you. The mirrors installed on the bike vibrate so much at high speeds (beyond 125 kmph) that I cannot see anything in the mirrors.

This is a very unnerving situation which needs to be addressed.

It appears that the mirrors housed in the plastic housing may be a little loose causing a vibration. I state this because the mirror sticks and associated nuts are all tight.

As suggested by you, I cannot take a video of the bike at this speed. Nor am I willing to accelerate the bike whilst on stand to demonstrate this vibration.

Please arrange for a replacement under warranty.

Best regards,

xxxx

[Jaggu]

One more who came forward sharing the experience.

I met with an accident april 2017 and it took them close to 10 months to return my bike. They crossed 10+ promised dates to deliver my bike. I even went there and stayed till they close the centre. Sidhart (who was the service manager) at that time tried several ways to get me out. I insisted to stay there and will leave only if they promise me a date in writing. Finally when they told me the bike was ready for delivery, I went to pick up lot of stuff wasnt ready.

Then i asked him, how did they do the test riding to see if the bike was ok or not - by not fitting the front discs? He then told me discs were fitted and test rode it, realised there is an issue after calling you. �� i can only believe what they are saying. Now back cowl isnt there (which he already told me couple of months back that the cowls have arrived). I asked him about it, sorry sir, we had given it to someone who was urgent and your bike had other issues to resolve so we thought we will order it again. Ok, but you havent ordered and i dont have one. What should i do. He was about to give me next date. I told him i will burn my bike infront of the service centre. I am taking it today or not taking it at all. Then he managed to get a cowl from some other bike which came for servicing ��. I didnt knew that.

He said pls just use it on temporary basis. Will get yours by next week. I left. My bike wasnt performing like it was before. And i lost the trust, so i went to the showroom in cochin.

When I was in cochin they asked me to courier the cowl back as the owner is asking for it. I asked the cochin showroom to ship it only after receiving the original red color cowl. They got the original cowl and shipped it. Then after few days i got this mail.

[Jaggu]

Next owner

Hi
I had left my bike for 1st service which was at 1000kms they had changed my rear brake pads with worn out pads from some other bike..I noticed it after couple of weeks so couldn't go and fight with them,they also gave my bike in dirty condition even after charging for wash and wax...
Sharing my bad experience with them attaching couple of pics for reference...
Regards

[Jaggu]

ps: all these are messages I received in first few on this particular WhatsApp group about Triumph India service issues, so don't think it is something against my "native" dealer

On an average 1 or 2 new such experiences every month is reported for dealership across India. That is about 24 unhappy customers a year in just one not so widely published "WhatsApp group", count similar numbers from all the riding groups and bike specific ones.... and their annual sales is??

No surprises I guess if Triumph can't keep their die hard fans happy, how do they expect any goodwill from the general public / market, where these existing owners are the best marketing tool otherwise! We all love their bikes, but sad to say the service side has lots to catch up.

Moving out from Assembly Line Section (More Information about this sub-forum)

[dkaile]

Very sad state of affairs. Though personally, I never trust any OEM completely. As of today I have even serviced my Harley Softail myself and also changed the tyres and/or removed the tyres to fixed permanent puncture on my Harley and Kawasaki Ninja 1000 myself. I own my complete set of tools, raising lifts and even a torque wrench for critical jobs. Though I understand it is not possible nor expected that a premium customer should ever need to touch his bike's entrails, it somehow always gave me peace of mind that I self taught myself to do those things. Hoping for prompt response from Triumph to sort out these issues lest we loose trust completely. And word travels very fast in India's premium bike fraternity.

Cheers...

[Red Liner]

Sadly, Kawasaki is no different. There were huge issues after the break up with Bajaj, and Kawasaki was very indifferent to what was happening at a dealership level.

This forced me to start servicing my versys at home, and I even serviced two other bikes (with collective help of course, that 21 litre tank is a menace to lift and put back to access the air filter). Now I will never buy a bike with the air filter under the fuel tank lol.

I don’t think I will ever return to an OEM unless I need a software update or keep some kind of warranty intact. And I think this is where we are caught between the devil and the deep blue sea. Doesn’t matter too much for peeps who clock big miles quickly. I was out of the warranty coverage of 24k/2 years in approximately 18 months.

Last I heard, the 310 GS crowd have similar issues, so this looks like a brand wide pandemic (a pun in light of the current terrible situation the world is going through). I think only Honda escapes this perception.

I think three services are enough at an OEM to understand if your bike is a lemon or not. Once that passes, it’s better to let go of so called warranty and walk out. Most folks abroad don’t even walk into the OEM for any kind of service. As long as they have bills to prove that oil changes were done at the correct mileage, their warranty stays intact like a factory warranty.

[moralfibre]

I am yet to come across a flawless service experience with a big bike dealer barring my experience at Wing world Honda in Bombay and my 2nd service experience with BMW's Pune dealer.

But, I've never had the guts to leave my bike alone and let them take their own decisions with regards to it's maintenance schedule. Additionally there are always conspiracy theories on repute and the usual back bitching among various brands.

Hope some multi-brand dealer is able to source OEM parts and keep maintenance guidelines as per factory spec. Wishful!

[bigron]

I am a strong advocate of the notion that one needs to take care of their own ride.

The dealerships here that sell these bikes just do not have the attitude, patience and understanding to work on a premium bike
.
Now I understand that not everyone has the necessary tools or know how to do extensive engine jobs but for regular service/ changing consumables etc one should be willing to get their hands dirty.

Also, this notion that just because one has bought a premium 2 wheeler, the service experience will be any different to a 100 cc commuter is wrong.

If you have one of the big 4 Japanese mark or the Brits , you literally can do without going to an authorized dealer for the entire duration of your ownership of the bike. Everything is available through 3rd party vendors OEM and superior to OEM. You can work on it yourself or find a competent garage outside.

Too all the current and prospective premium bike owners, be willing to get your hands dirty and your ownership experience will be far more rewarding.

[Axe77]

Thanks for this thread Jaggu. I have owned and sold a Striple 765 S (with admittedly a lowly 2800 kms on the clock and no requirements outside two routine services) and a more extensively used 2018 Tiger XRX (~ 9000 kms on the clock, with the odd standstill fall and other minor routine issues). I have actually found the Mumbai dealer quite decent on all service related matters although a friend who owns a used Speed has indeed had a sub par service experience as well.

I think in Bbay the issue is not lack of ability but a lack of attention to detail, particularly as servicing percolates down the channel. Atul is definitely quite competent, but you really need to ensure that he has personally supervised all aspects of whatever the issue is as the guys down the line are not that careful and a single issue can sometimes require multiple visits because of sheer carelessness. I acknowledge when it comes to riding two wheels, careless upkeep is a serious issue.

To moralfibre's point, I also have the perception that service is generally sub par with all the big bike cos. Even I have heard Honda Wing World is an exception to this and are quite competent. I have also heard great things about Triumph Pune. Curious to know if anyone else feels otherwise.

For Mumbai folks, the original tech head was Zubin Ponappa who runs his own aftermarket setup now at Kalina. He is absolutely superb and I trust him with a lot of stuff on my bike. Would encourage any big bike owner (Triumph or otherwise), specially those out of warranty to consider trying him.

[krishnaprasadgg]

Let me chime in with my experience.

Delivery Experince
Right from the get-go. As soon as we booked the Tiger 800XRX the quick responses from the Sales team stopped. Mind you the bike was not yet delivered.
If we call they do not pick up and if we text responses were after huge delays and a general lack of courtesy is what I would call it, my brother somehow was more tolerating with this behavior than me.

We did visit the showroom about 2 times again post-booking and before delivery and the attitude remained the same, not even a proper acknowledgment was there. I guess we did not warrant the "potential client" treatment anymore since we already had our booking in place.

Bike delivery went smoothly, nothing to complain there.

Warranty Claim
Now the fun part. Just about 2 weeks into ownership, the bike battery went dead, no cranking voltage. We called in for RSA for which we had paid for. And the usual message that no vehicle is available and that we have to wait for 1-2 days for a pickup. Image the plight of a rider mid-ride with a broken-down bike and this is what he/she hears. Luckily for us somehow they had a tow truck ready in a few hours and they came and collected the bike.
Now the ordeal starts, the bike was diagnosed with a faulty battery and warranty for the same was processed, the replacement battery is available in stock. Yet to get the warranty-approved and work done took 2 weeks. That too after multiple phone calls to Keerthi Triumph and Triumph India.

It is horrifying to realize that a warranty approval is not at the discretion of the service center but instead, the process includes dealer inspection, reporting to Triumph India, them getting back with a few more item list to check and dealer responding in positive then Triumph India to Triumph UK request is forwarded where they have to send approval, then Triumph India to the dealer the same has to be communicated and then the work gets done. All this while we had to cancel 2 ride plans we had and Keerthi was not even having the decency to provide a courtesy vehicle(read TD vehicle) for us to use, even after we requested for them to arrange one, the usual "let me see what we can do" response and no follow up.

1st Service

I booked an appointment well in advance and reached there well before the svc opened up. I was first in line and I let them know(was also mentioned while booking in the service) that I will be waiting along with the bike and I would like to see the bike being worked on.
They flat out refused to let me see the bike stating the svc bay was upstairs and no visitors are allowed.
Mind you this was a first service and bare minimum work needed to be done. I also had the high-security number plates to be fitted.

They made me wait from 9.30 till 1PM and yet the service has not been concluded. Now in between this, I had asked the Sales team who had yet to deliver the "Welcome kit" delivered to us to get it to the Service center where I was waiting and they informed me that they won't be able to do so. Even when they had to deliver the HS number plates to the svc(I just consider this outright lazy and uncourteous that they did so).
Now since I was sitting there killing time I asked them if they can give me the TD bike to go to the showroom and collect the welcome kit(The TD bike sitting right there, this was the same bike I rode while TD'ing the Tiger, I was also in the market for a new bike, I later got myself the R1). This request was also shot down and no specific reason was given.

Then came the most infuriating part for me. All the work was done and only the number plate riveting was left, this was told to me at about 12.30PM or so, even after 1.30PM when the bike wasn't ready I went and asked and got the response that the techs had left for lunch just now. They not only did not bother fitting the number plate and process the bike out in between the 12.30 -1.30 gap but left for lunch which meant I was stuck there for another hour or so.

It is to note that while this whole ordeal, many bikes that came in after mine was worked on and processed out.

And finally, the bike got processed out only at 3.30-45PM.
A full day of mine wasted. And the worst part absolutely no remorse from their side.

Just reading the google review for the service center and you'll see a lot of horror stories right there too.

So yeah, Triumph has a long way to go as far as customer post-sales treatment goes.

Cheers
Krishna

[quickdraw]

Oh man. I'm so sorry to read all this. But not at all surprised. Triumph went from bad to worse. I have been at the receiving end of this lacklustre service for a long time and probably it was a good thing that I parted with my bike since I just DID NOT want to deal with them anymore.

• Had to wait 7 months for delivery even after being the first one to book.
• Dealer representative was a complete imbecile
• Had to resort to social media to get my bike delivered
• Horrible service from dealerships and service centre in Delhi & Gurgaon
• Bad treatment from the company
• Teething quality issues with switchgear and other components
• Had to wait upto 6 months for parts once
• Detuning Fiasco
• Stalling Issue which caused Triumph to threaten me with legal action
• Blocked on Social Media & Kicked out of owner whatsapp groups
• Road Side assistance in city was a miss, they could not come get me when I was stranded on the way to the service centre (10 mins away). I had to call my BMW dealer who came and helped out

If you want you can read my whole ordeal on my ownership thread - https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/super...omes-home.html (Triumph Street Triple - Blue Lightning comes home)

This behaviour basically completely put me off the brand. Because of this I DID NOT pull the trigger on Thruxton R that they were giving BS4 deals on. As much as I loved the bike, I would rather not have to deal with them again. Triumph has great products but horrible service and customer experience.

[shan_ned]

Many riders in the Bangalore Street Triple whatsup group fear taking their motorcycles to the service Center. I feel this is a general sentiment across most of the Triumph motorcycle owners in Bangalore.

A couple of owners in the whatsup group posted photos about certain bolts missing right after the service. Seeing those photos is like watching horror movies. As part of a meeting (in a group of 60 to 70 people) with a Triumph India executive (Mr.Punit), we even showed him those dreadful photos. End of the day, all our feedback and concerns fell on deaf ears. As Jaggu mentioned, there was not even a single acknowledgement from Mr. Punit.

Triumph India needs to wake up and act on the inefficient dealer(s) (and also may be on their own executives for failing to act on the genuine concerns raised).