[mobike008]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Do you do warm up exercises and streaching before you jump in to the pool ?

Swimming is streanuous in begining because it activates minor muscles which never see any activity in gym routine. Swimming alone won't give your sculpted body like gym workout can give but free form of body movement and activation of minor muscle ensures a total workout.

I do a 60 mins gym work-out followed by the swim. So yes, the body is stretched and warmed up. I take a shower before and after the swim too

I still have a slight numb feeling in the same fingers of left feet making me bit worried of getting in the pool. Iam thinking its due to the cold water. Maybe i should change my timing to swim in the morning at 8am when sun is up instead of 8pm

Originally Posted by MileCruncher

Cramping happens when the body is running low on salts and not only dehydration. The best way to avoid cramps is to have small sips of electrolytes before you feel thirsty. You can use Gatorade, Electral or plain salt and sugar solution. One should avoid too much of plain water after a strenuous workout as that may lead to hyponatremia which is very dangerous.

Thanks. Will try this as well. Someone was suggeting probably iam low on potassium and maybe one banana a day will help

Originally Posted by carboy

Why? Is this for some medical reason?

None as such. About 2 years ago, my BP had once shot up to 160/100 after a heavy bout of partying and i got scared and ever since I consiously take low salt. Now its acceptable range (130/85-90). Btw, never took any medication and neither iam diabetic ( touchwood)

[bblost]

Originally Posted by mobike008

I still have a slight numb feeling in the same fingers of left feet making me bit worried of getting in the pool. Iam thinking its due to the cold water. Maybe i should change my timing to swim in the morning at 8am when sun is up instead of 8pm

Please correct me if I am wrong but the swimming pool water will be colder at 8 AM compared to 8 PM.

[AbhishekB86]

Originally Posted by mobike008

I do a 60 mins gym work-out followed by the swim. So yes, the body is stretched and warmed up. I take a shower before and after the swim too

I still have a slight numb feeling in the same fingers of left feet making me bit worried of getting in the pool. Iam thinking its due to the cold water. Maybe i should change my timing to swim in the morning at 8am when sun is up instead of 8pm

Avinash I would suggest you to search for symptoms of 'Chilbains'. It is a condition when the toes swell up and might burn due to the reaction to the cold weather. I suffer from Chilbains every winter and my toes swell up. Running has helped control it. Also keeping yourself in warm clothes help. If it is indeed similar to chilbains soak your feet in luke warm salt water and forget all about swimming for a bit.

[mobike008]

Originally Posted by bblost

Please correct me if I am wrong but the swimming pool water will be colder at 8 AM compared to 8 PM.

Iam not quite sure. But, I assume evening at 8pm in this month will be definetly colder due to cold breeze and general chill in the air

8am, the sun would have risen for almost 2 hours making the water warm as the pool is not shaded.

I could be wrong, though

Originally Posted by AbhishekB86

Avinash I would suggest you to search for symptoms of 'Chilbains'. It is a condition when the toes swell up and might burn due to the reaction to the cold weather. I suffer from Chilbains every winter and my toes swell up. Running has helped control it. Also keeping yourself in warm clothes help. If it is indeed similar to chilbains soak your feet in luke warm salt water and forget all about swimming for a bit.

oh boy! now your scaring me....My feet/fingers are not swollen nor any pain...its just that in those 2 fingers of the feet i feel a vague difference than rest of the fingers of left and right feet

Will look up Chilbains....and, i too decided to lay off swimming till summer arrives.

[carboy]

Originally Posted by mobike008

None as such. About 2 years ago, my BP had once shot up to 160/100 after a heavy bout of partying and i got scared and ever since I consiously take low salt. Now its acceptable range (130/85-90). Btw, never took any medication and neither iam diabetic ( touchwood)

https://www.google.co.in/search?q=%2...is+bad+for+you

If you are currently healthy and want avoid diabetes, shift to a pure fat + meat diet - you will never get diabetes.

[carbookie]

Originally Posted by amitk26

This but is really big one , Excessive protein in diet is known to cause excessive ketone formation in body. Ketones are toxic substance and to flush them out more water is used from your body also it stresses your kidneys.
For processing proteins Calcium is used and it can cause osteoporesis.

http://www.livestrong.com/article/50...xcess-protein/


Many posters here have advocated ketonic diet for weight loss but personally I am skeptical about the long term effect of such diets.

I am one of the posters who had recommended Ketogenic diet. I have been following it now for some time. It is a low carb, moderate protein and high fat diet.

Can you please tell me why you think Ketogenic diet is harmful for body.

[carbookie]

Originally Posted by carbookie

I weighed around 132 KG in March 2012. I am at 112 Kg now. Next target 92 Kg by year end. I was inspired to go into this diet by this girl. http://imgur.com/a/ZzM0r#0

I thought I will post a update to this thread. My last update was in September, 2012. It has been 4 months. I had to stop eating Ketogenic diet for 3 months because of religious festivals and travel. Missed my year end target.

I started back up in January 2013. Dropped another 8 Kgs. Currently at 104. Next update when I hit double digits. Should happen in another 1-2 months.

[NMS]

Originally Posted by carbookie

I thought I will post a update to this thread. My last update was in September, 2012. It has been 4 months. I had to stop eating Ketogenic diet for 3 months because of religious festivals and travel. Missed my year end target.

I started back up in January 2013. Dropped another 8 Kgs. Currently at 104. Next update when I hit double digits. Should happen in another 1-2 months.

Thats quite some weight loss and huge commitment. I was reading about this diet for quite a few days and Viola !! I see your post here
Just wondering, This is quite an extreme diet, what are the results when one gets back to the regular eating habits, say regular sugar consumption etc...? Not the excesses, lets say regular and sane dietary habits, cause I cant imagine living on this diet forever.

[carboy]

Originally Posted by mobike008

None as such. About 2 years ago, my BP had once shot up to 160/100 after a heavy bout of partying and i got scared and ever since I consiously take low salt. Now its acceptable range (130/85-90). Btw, never took any medication and neither iam diabetic ( touchwood)

Questioning conventional dietary wisdom

Salt
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/03/op...nted=all&_r=1&

One could still argue that all these people should reduce their salt intake to prevent hypertension, except for the fact that four of these studies — involving Type 1 diabetics, Type 2 diabetics, healthy Europeans and patients with chronic heart failure — reported that the people eating salt at the lower limit of normal were more likely to have heart disease than those eating smack in the middle of the normal range.

Eggs
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/0...mid=tw-nytimes

Fat
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/op...es-us-fat.html

[amitk26]

Originally Posted by carbookie

I am one of the posters who had recommended Ketogenic diet. I have been following it now for some time. It is a low carb, moderate protein and high fat diet.

Can you please tell me why you think Ketogenic diet is harmful for body.

Well Ketogenic diet was used for treatment of epilepsy , Later it became a tool to fight obesity but most physicians now consider Ketogenic diet more as a therepy with known side effects rather then a general weight reduction diet.

Some of the well documented adverse effects of this diet are osteoporosis , gout, kidney stones and gall-bladder colic.

http://www.meschinohealth.com/blog/w...ects-concerns/

http://www.news-medical.net/health/K...e-Effects.aspx

I feel normal restricted calorie intake with workout is better then a diet where I need to moniter the side effects.

[carboy]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Well Ketogenic diet was used for treatment of epilepsy , Later it became a tool to fight obesity but most physicians now consider Ketogenic diet more as a therepy with known side effects rather then a general weight reduction diet.

Are there double blind studies from where these 'known side effects' are taken? I doubt it.
Most double blind studies don't show any harmful effect of low carb and very low carb diets. On the other hand, most recent double blind studies show that low fat diets are unhealthy.

[amitk26]

Originally Posted by carboy

Are there double blind studies from where these 'known side effects' are taken? I doubt it.
Most double blind studies don't show any harmful effect of low carb and very low carb diets. On the other hand, most recent double blind studies show that low fat diets are unhealthy.

Opposit to Ketogenic is not necessarily low fat.
In fact most traditional diets around the world are moderate fat and moderate/high carbohydrate along with protein. In Ketogenic diet carbohydrates are eliminated almost totally.

The studies talk about side effects of high carb and high fat diet. Well most of these studies are papers published in peer reviewd journals and not just uncited magazine/newspaper articles. You can search on it.
Most of the pro-ketogenic material is from weight loss industry where they have big trademarks for these diets where as side-effects are almost always buried in papers related to epilepsy research.

[carboy]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Opposit to Ketogenic is not necessarily low fat.

I didn't say it was.

Originally Posted by amitk26

In Ketogenic diet carbohydrates are eliminated almost totally.

Very low carb diets can be ketogenic. You can check your urine with ketone strips to confirm if you are passing ketones.

Originally Posted by amitk26

The studies talk about side effects of high carb and high fat diet. Well most of these studies are papers published in peer reviewd journals and not just uncited magazine/newspaper articles. You can search on it.

I have done so many times. You can also do so at http://scholar.google.com
Though most of the peer reviewed journals are paid, the abstract itself is mostly available free.

I have not found any double blind tests which show the 'known side effects' of ketogenic diets. OTOH, I have found studies which show very low carb diets are good for you.

I think low carb diets are the best way to go, may or may not be ketogenic. All I am saying is I haven't seen double blind studies showing that they are bad.

[carbookie]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Some of the well documented adverse effects of this diet are osteoporosis , gout, kidney stones and gall-bladder colic.

http://www.meschinohealth.com/blog/w...ects-concerns/

http://www.news-medical.net/health/K...e-Effects.aspx

I feel normal restricted calorie intake with workout is better then a diet where I need to moniter the side effects.

Well documented adverse effects? Can you quote something other then newpaper articles and blogs?

Lets see some actual studies done in medical field for reference.

- New Scientist "Longest scientific study yet backs Atkins diet"

- Stanford Study - "Atkins Fares Best in Study Of Four Weight-Loss Regimens"

- Journal of the American Medical Association - "Reduction of the resting metabolic rate as a result of dieting, a known factor in the failure of dieting, was the least in the very low carbohydrate diet."

- Journal of the American Medical Association

- New England Journal of Medicine - "the low-carbohydrate group showed both the greatest weight loss and the most improvement in lipids

- Journal of the American Medical Association - "overweight and obese women assigned to follow the Atkins diet, which had the lowest carbohydrate intake, lost more weight and experienced more favorable overall metabolic effects at 12 months than women assigned to follow the Zone, Ornish, or LEARN diets."

- European Journal of Clinical Nutrition - "Prolonged consumption of diets low in carbohydrates and high in protein is associated with an increase in total mortality."

- International Journal of Cancer - "A significant direct trend in cancer risk was found for bread (OR = 1.94 for the highest versus the lowest intake quintile), and a modest excess of risk was observed for pasta and rice (OR = 1.29), and milk and yoghurt (OR = 1.27). Poultry (OR = 0.74), processed meat (OR = 0.64) and vegetables (OR = 0.65) were inversely associated with renal cell carcinoma risk. "

- New England Journal of Medicine - "Our findings suggest that diets lower in carbohydrate and higher in protein and fat are not associated with increased risk of coronary heart disease in women."

American Journal of Epidemiology - "In conclusion, results from our study suggest that daily dietary glycemic index is independently and positively associated with BMI [Body Mass Index]. This finding is consistent with the hypothesis that with increased glycemic index, more insulin is produced and more fat is stored, suggesting that type of carbohydrate may be related to body weight."

- Cancer Epidemiology, Biomarkers & Prevention - "In this population, a high percentage of calories from carbohydrate, but not from fat, was associated with increased breast cancer risk."

- Annals of Internal Medicine - "Compared with a low-fat diet, a low-carbohydrate diet program had better participant retention and greater weight loss. During active weight loss, serum triglyceride levels decreased more and high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol level increased more with the low-carbohydrate diet than with the low-fat diet."

- Annals of Internal Medicine - "Participants on a low-carbohydrate diet had more favorable overall outcomes at 1 year than did those on a conventional diet."

I can go on and on about actual long term studies done, books written, guest lectures, Gary taubes, Robert Lustig and many others. But instead of trying to sell low carb, I want to hear more about why you feel otherwise.

[carbookie]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Some of the well documented adverse effects of this diet are osteoporosis , gout, kidney stones and gall-bladder colic.

http://www.meschinohealth.com/blog/w...ects-concerns/

http://www.news-medical.net/health/K...e-Effects.aspx

I feel normal restricted calorie intake with workout is better then a diet where I need to moniter the side effects.

Well documented adverse effects? Can you quote something other then newpaper articles and blogs?

Lets see some actual studies done in medical field for reference.

- New Scientist "Longest scientific study yet backs Atkins diet"

- Stanford Study - "Atkins Fares Best in Study Of Four Weight-Loss Regimens"

- Journal of the American Medical Association - "Reduction of the resting metabolic rate as a result of dieting, a known factor in the failure of dieting, was the least in the very low carbohydrate diet."

- Journal of the American Medical Association

- New England Journal of Medicine - "the low-carbohydrate group showed both the greatest weight loss and the most improvement in lipids

- Journal of the American Medical Association - "overweight and obese women assigned to follow the Atkins diet, which had the lowest carbohydrate intake, lost more weight and experienced more favorable overall metabolic effects at 12 months than women assigned to follow the Zone, Ornish, or LEARN diets."

- European Journal of Clinical Nutrition - "Prolonged consumption of diets low in carbohydrates and high in protein is associated with an increase in total mortality."

- International Journal of Cancer - "A significant direct trend in cancer risk was found for bread (OR = 1.94 for the highest versus the lowest intake quintile), and a modest excess of risk was observed for pasta and rice (OR = 1.29), and milk and yoghurt (OR = 1.27). Poultry (OR = 0.74), processed meat (OR = 0.64) and vegetables (OR = 0.65) were inversely associated with renal cell carcinoma risk. "

- New England Journal of Medicine - "Our findings suggest that diets lower in carbohydrate and higher in protein and fat are not associated with increased risk of coronary heart disease in women."

American Journal of Epidemiology - "In conclusion, results from our study suggest that daily dietary glycemic index is independently and positively associated with BMI [Body Mass Index]. This finding is consistent with the hypothesis that with increased glycemic index, more insulin is produced and more fat is stored, suggesting that type of carbohydrate may be related to body weight."

- Cancer Epidemiology, Biomarkers & Prevention - "In this population, a high percentage of calories from carbohydrate, but not from fat, was associated with increased breast cancer risk."

- Annals of Internal Medicine - "Compared with a low-fat diet, a low-carbohydrate diet program had better participant retention and greater weight loss. During active weight loss, serum triglyceride levels decreased more and high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol level increased more with the low-carbohydrate diet than with the low-fat diet."

- Annals of Internal Medicine - "Participants on a low-carbohydrate diet had more favorable overall outcomes at 1 year than did those on a conventional diet."

I can go on and on about actual long term studies done, books written, guest lectures, Gary taubes, Robert Lustig and many others. I can also give a point by point rebuttal of your claims (muscle loss for example)But instead of trying to sell low carb, I want to hear more about why you feel otherwise.