[swissknife]

Originally Posted by audioholic

I would like to cook dum biriyani and all this while I would finish it off on the stove, meaning not that slow cooking that should happen towards the end. Hence I wanted to do this in the electric oven. I prepare the masala on the stove, boil basmati separately and then layer it and then plan to put it in the oven. Any tips and tricks from those who have done this? Would this be a good idea or a bad one? Since this is the first time I am cooking rice separately, how would the salt part be taken care of?

I use an electric rice cooker. It comes out well. When it switches to the "keep warm" mode, it stimulates the dum. I add another lid to seal the cooker since the electric cookers lid has holes for steam to escape.

[Chetan_Rao]

Originally Posted by audioholic

...how would the salt part be taken care of?

Add salt (per your taste) and a spoonful of ghee to the water while cooking rice. Optional, add a few pieces of aromatic spices (cardamom, cloves, star anise etc.) if you'd want fragrant rice for your preparation.

[Kulin_Shah]

Originally Posted by audioholic

I would like to cook dum biriyani and all this while I would finish it off on the stove, meaning not that slow cooking that should happen towards the end. Hence I wanted to do this in the electric oven. I prepare the masala on the stove, boil basmati separately and then layer it and then plan to put it in the oven. Any tips and tricks from those who have done this? Would this be a good idea or a bad one? Since this is the first time I am cooking rice separately, how would the salt part be taken care of?

I do the same way. Separate masala with vegies, separate basmati (mixed with curds and finely chopped mint and coriander leaves) and then layer them in a non stick soup pan greased with ghee. Then I place this whole dish on top of a non-stick dosa tava which is on the smallest and lowest gas burner, and slow cook for 15-20 minutes.

[JMaruru]

Originally Posted by Kulin_Shah

Then I place this whole dish on top of a non-stick dosa tava which is on the smallest and lowest gas burner, and slow cook for 15-20 minutes.

Doesn't this make the non-stick pan lose it's property? I always used the regular thick 'tava', if another vessel had to be kept on top of it.

[tilt]

Originally Posted by srini1785

I am not much of a "Cooker" but isn't Kovakkaai / Donadakaya supposed to be half cooked when its dropped into the Vaanali/Baanali?. That's always the way its done in our house. Probably 15-20 mins in a micro would provide the required tenderness. I am assuming that you cut it into slices before it goes on to the flame or micro. Further, its never pressure cooked.

Thank you for the prompt response.

Yes, that "half-cooked" or more is what takes such a long long time. Yes, I do slice it (quite thinly in fact) while still raw, but instead of bunging it in the microwave I use the vaanaLi to do the tenderising too.

How do you achieve the half-cooking in your house? And more importantly, how long does it actually take?

Thanks again and cheers

[KPR]

Yes Kovakkai takes time to get full cooked. I usually put a glass/plate lid for the kadai on which it is being cooked/fried for the initial 15 mins. Then in open kadai I allow veggie to get fried with additional oil. The initial 15 mins will keep moisture trapped inside which will help in cooking well.

[NetfreakBombay]

How to roast raan (leg of mutton) in OTG ?

I am planning to :

1. Marinate (without tenderizer) overnight
2. Cover in foil and roast at 170 C for 2 hours
3. Uncover and roast for 15 - 30 mins to brown

Hope this will not turn out to be dry or uncooked

[Kulin_Shah]

Originally Posted by JMaruru

Doesn't this make the non-stick pan lose it's property? I always used the regular thick 'tava', if another vessel had to be kept on top of it.

Yes, you are right. I do not have any other thick tava. But I always keep the old worn out one for such a job. Sorry, didn't mention that.

[Aroy]

Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay

How to roast raan (leg of mutton) in OTG ?

I am planning to :

1. Marinate (without tenderizer) overnight
2. Cover in foil and roast at 170 C for 2 hours
3. Uncover and roast for 15 - 30 mins to brown

Hope this will not turn out to be dry or uncooked

I have been making RAN for ages. If it is the rear leg then
. Goat takes time to tenderize, so marinate it well for at least two days.
. Marinate is mostly - Turmeric, Chilies, Curd and spices to taste.
. Cut deep slits in the leg for the marinade to penetrate.

To get moist meat I use a pot with lid to hold the leg.
. Initially the leg is cooked by heat and steam.
. The time taken in my Gas Oven is between 2 to 3 hours at low heat. This time is required to melt the fibre covering, hence do not reduse the time.
. After the meat is soft, take it out on a plate and brown each side for at least 10 minutes.

As you will be using aluminum foil, make sure that
. There is space for the steam to circulate.
. The foil is wrapped two or three times to prevent steam/liquid escaping

[tilt]

Originally Posted by KPR

Yes Kovakkai takes time to get full cooked. I usually put a glass/plate lid for the kadai on which it is being cooked/fried for the initial 15 mins. Then in open kadai I allow veggie to get fried with additional oil. The initial 15 mins will keep moisture trapped inside which will help in cooking well.

I add water in the kadai to the kovakkaai and cover it and cook it on a low flame, and it takes at least forty minutes for the kovakkaai to cook, and even then it is a bit crunchy.

So, another twenty minutes covered and some more added water on a low flame, then after that, uncover, turn the flame high and keep cooking until the water disappears (around 8 minutes) and then roast for another 15 minutes.

So, a total of around an hour and twenty, which seems ridiculous.

People I am acquainted with tell me they manage to cook perfectly roasted kovakkai in twenty minutes, and I find it impossible to believe.

Cheers

[NetfreakBombay]

Originally Posted by Aroy

. The time taken in my Gas Oven is between 2 to 3 hours at low heat. This time is required to melt the fibre covering..

Thanks, this looks amazing.

Do you aim for any specific range of temperature ? and
Do you cover it with something while it is in oven ?

[Aroy]

Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay

Thanks, this looks amazing.

Do you aim for any specific range of temperature ? and
Do you cover it with something while it is in oven ?

Use the lowest heat initially.
Yes the vessel is covered, so that steam circulates and cooks the leg.

For browning, I just take it out, put it on an oven proof plate and let it brown at high heat. 10-20 min per side, you have to monitor it every 5 min.

[proton]

Originally Posted by Aroy

I agree that going by the number of whistles is wrong. What matters is the total cooking time. As mentioned a higher heat will have more whistles per minute while lower heat will have less,resulting in either overcooking in a low heat burner or under cooking on a high heat burner.

What we must realise is that water boils at a constant temperature a a give pressure. Higher the pressure higher the boiling point, but no amount of heat will increase the temperature. Some people think that boiling at high heat will speed up cooking, but all that does is evaporate the water faster.

Boiling food cooks it. Pros: soften and disinfect. Cons: it's slow, and can lead to loss of nutrients.

Frying allows higher temperatures, because oil has a higher boiling (cracking) point than water. Pros: faster cooking, less gas used. However, it introduces cholesterol and other harmful ingredients into the food.

Pressure cooking raises the pressure, and increases the temperature at which water remains a liquid. Pros: higher heat (pork needs it to remove trichinosis germs, tape worm) , faster cooking, lesser loss of nutrients.

The trick to efficient pressure cooking is to reduce the gas flame when the weight lifts, and then adjust it so that it just maintains the higher pressure. This may require observation and recording of the best gas settings. Electric pressure cookers do this automatically but are prone to failure.

I am part of a group that travels for food. We often book tables a year ahead. Some of my friends have eaten at the French Laundry, the Fat Duck and El Bulli, before it shut down. I'm sure you know who runs these places. The pandemic put a stop to travelling. Now we are trying to recreate gourmet food at home, quite successfully, I must say!

This may be a part of a different topic or a topic on its own, but I have been tracking the retail scene closely, restaurants in particular.

It is a bit lagging compared to computer retail or clothing or even automotive, in the sense we still don’t get the best.

Let me illustrate.

We used to see shoe businesses in India that competed on cost. Khadims, Liberty used to compete on cost, but ended up making shoes that frankly no one wanted to buy. Finally, they flunked. People who wanted serviceable shoes could no longer get them. Then Clarks came. People who comparison shopped between Khadims and Liberty, quibbling about price, now buy a Rs 5000 pair without blinking. Even higher end brands have come. Don't even ask me how much a Louis Vitton pair costs, my eyes water just thinking it!

Have we reached a state in cheap food where a demand for higher end, even gourmet food can find a market? Singapore has. Locals and tourists wanted better food, and their market responded by upgrading hawker food (there are Michelin listed units!) and Alain Ducasse has a stand alone at Marina Sands.

What is the answer to my question?

[ksmrsm]

Originally Posted by tilt

I have been having quite a bit of trouble with cooking Coccinia (a.k.a kovakaai, thondakaai, tindora, kundru etc.).

The trouble is, it always takes around an hour of covered low-flame boiling just to lose its stiffness and gain some tenderness; and then it has to be roasted

It shouldn't take that long if you cut into quarters lengthwise. Again, it depends on what kind of roasting is being done. If it is deep frying, you could half cook in steam and deep fry. Or just allow the water to evaporate and then fry it in the kadai itself with oil.

[ksmrsm]

Originally Posted by proton

I am part of a group that travels for food. We often book tables a year ahead. Some of my friends have eaten at the French Laundry, the Fat Duck and El Bulli, before it shut down. I'm sure you know who runs these places. The pandemic put a stop to travelling. Now we are trying to recreate gourmet food at home, quite successfully, I must say!

This may be a part of a different topic or a topic on its own, but I have been tracking the retail scene closely, restaurants in particular.

It is a bit lagging compared to computer retail or clothing or even automotive, in the sense we still don’t get the best.

Let me illustrate.

We used to see shoe businesses in India that competed on cost. Khadims, Liberty used to compete on cost, but ended up making shoes that frankly no one wanted to buy. Finally, they flunked. People who wanted serviceable shoes could no longer get them. Then Clarks came. People who comparison shopped between Khadims and Liberty, quibbling about price, now buy a Rs 5000 pair without blinking. Even higher end brands have come. Don't even ask me how much a Louis Vitton pair costs, my eyes water just thinking it!

Have we reached a state in cheap food where a demand for higher end, even gourmet food can find a market? Singapore has. Locals and tourists wanted better food, and their market responded by upgrading hawker food (there are Michelin listed units!) and Alain Ducasse has a stand alone at Marina Sands.

What is the answer to my question?

Wow! Glad to know that you travel to taste and experience gourmet food. Let me try to answer your question starting with your comparison with Singapore.

General levels of hygiene in Singapore is much higher than in India. There are stories of pani puri vendors pissing into the pani in India that you could never dream of in Singapore.

Keeping the above in mind the above most upper class people would never eat in these joints even if the owner maintains hygiene. There are exceptions of course. These street carts are frequented by the budget class who can't afford to go to a decent restaurant. So food need to be inexpensive. So compromise in quality and the cycle repeats.

How many of us would have tea in a local tea shop with our family even though "Tea" is one of the safest thing that you could have in a street shop or even a vendor in a cycle?

Next with respect to the lagging of restaurants, when comparing please keep in mind that the computer retail or clothing or even automotive businesses that you are using as an comparison do not have perishables as a product.

The food business in India is very cost intensive, especially the fixed cost and the profitability is low. So unless you have a huge back up of finance and can sustain oneself for at least a year, a new restaurateur would not venture into exotic or gourmet food. We Indians like to eat outside but barring a few we are not willing to pay for it. How does a restaurateur sustain? There are exceptions of course, but they are exceptions. The question to be asked is - Why did the French Laundry, the Fat Duck and El Bulli shut down!