[Ulysses]

Originally Posted by condor

I think mutuation would be for agriculutral lands. In case of apartments, the land ownership be transferred from the landowner(s) to the apartment owners association, which in turn can be deemed to be owned by the current owners of the apartments.

For urban immovable properties, Encumbrance Certificate or EC is the document to be obtained. Here is a link to know the process in Karnataka

https://www.commonfloor.com/guide/ka...arnataka-57176

[fordday]

Originally Posted by charanreddy

Bottom line : depends on how the sale deed is drafted as legal rights stem from this document

There is a no bottom line line. Its a complicated web of things especially when apartment land is concerned.

Ours is an apartment with A khatas and all seems clear. But if you dig deep there are many issues.

Land record for the entire parcel of land will still show the owner as the previous landowner/landlord. The khata is a mere tax paying document at municipal level.

Apartment owners association is there but it does not have any hold over land or the common assets as per law. It is a society registered under Kar Societies Regn Act (KSRA).

Govt has clarified in court that the apartment associations cannot collect maintenance if registered under KSRA.

There is another act called Karnataka Apartment Ownership Act (KAOA) which mandates that the builder should facilitate the flat buyers to register under this act. There are some action items from builder also. Very very few builders did it.
Finally Kar govt admitted in court that the association formed under KAOA is not a valid association.

In both the cases above there were never any conveyance of the land by the builders.

So now flat owners in Kar are left with forming Cooperative housing society or a company to get deemed conveyance of the land. Not sure how far this is going to help.

Unless Govt comes up with strict implementation of law to convey the land by the builders there is very little that the flat buyers can hope for.

And we all know who runs the govt between the flat buyers and builders.

All the owners can peacefully enjoy their possession now. But when the time comes for redevelopment they will face all sort of issues. And with the construction quality prevalent nowadays, time for redevelopment will come sooner than we may think.

[charanreddy]

Originally Posted by fordday

There is a no bottom line line. Its a complicated web of things especially when apartment land is concerned.

Ours is an apartment with A khatas and all seems clear. But if you dig deep there are many issues.

Land record for the entire parcel of land will still show the owner as the previous landowner/landlord. The khata is a mere tax paying document at municipal level.

In your sale deed is there a mention of undivided land share ? If yes , then you are the rightful owner of the land. I understand it’s complicated as there are multiple owners for the full parcel of land and how it reflects in the system. For example I bought a plot of land recently . If you search by the underlying survey number, it shows the builder name . But if you search by plot no, it shows customer name.

The exact terms of your ownership of the flat is guided ONLY AND ONLY by your sale deed. If there is a mention of undivided land share, no one can attach this property.

[Romeo_Mike]

Don't housing societies issue share certificates to flat owners in KA? My understanding is a society can go for issuance of share certificates only after the conveyance deed is signed between the developer/land owner and the society.

[macbeth]

I stay in Navi Mumbai and own a flat here. The society has issued share certificates however the land is on a 99 year lease from CIDCO (in fact the whole of Navi Mumbai is). Issuance of share certificate has got nothing to do with land ownership.

[fordday]

Originally Posted by Romeo_Mike

Don't housing societies issue share certificates to flat owners in KA?

No, its not the practice in KA. Because to issue share certificate the association should be a cooperative society or a company. Very very few are registered as cooperative society in KA. So the original problem.

Originally Posted by macbeth

I stay in Navi Mumbai and own a flat here. The society has issued share certificates however the land is on a 99 year lease from CIDCO (in fact the whole of Navi Mumbai is). Issuance of share certificate has got nothing to do with land ownership.

I believe the society in your case collectively owns the land where the building is built, even if it is for 99 year lease. Please clarify if I am wrong here.

Being a CHS owning the land makes them eligible to issue certificate and also go for redevelopment as and when the need arises.

Sadly all these are bypassed in KA.

[Romeo_Mike]

Originally Posted by macbeth

I stay in Navi Mumbai and own a flat here. The society has issued share certificates however the land is on a 99 year lease from CIDCO (in fact the whole of Navi Mumbai is). Issuance of share certificate has got nothing to do with land ownership.

Yes, Navi Mumbai and some other urban areas (e.g. BKC in Mumbai and NOIDA in UP) are under the leasehold ownership model as opposed to the freehold ownership model at most other places. But even in that case, the share certificates issued to flat owners are representative of their propertionate share of the 99 yr leasehold rights that have been vested in the name of the housing society. Share certificates for apartments constructed on freehold land work in the same manner.

Originally Posted by fordday

No, its not the practice in KA. Because to issue share certificate the association should be a cooperative society or a company. Very very few are registered as cooperative society in KA. ....

Sadly all these are bypassed in KA.

I am surprised this is a widespread practice and people are chill about it

[srini1785]

I don't know if this is the proper thread for it.

Any idea when the Akrama- Sakrama scheme of BBMP will come into effect?. The scheme was sub-judice in Supreme court but GOK had made a statement that they would seek permission to implement the scheme and had targeted 1000crs for conversion from B Khata to A Khata.

https://www.deccanherald.com/city/to...a-1132159.html

[deehunk]

Originally Posted by srini1785

I don't know if this is the proper thread for it.

Any idea when the Akrama- Sakrama scheme of BBMP will come into effect?.

https://www.deccanherald.com/city/to...a-1132159.html

This scheme was initialy proposed to help people who had constructed houses on revenue lands (600sq.ft). Later it became controversial as encroachers wanted their properties to be included in the project.

[charanreddy]

Looks like there are ongoing customer cases against mantri developers. Since the last few years Mantri has got into the news for all wrong reasons and it looks like they have some ED cases against them as well.

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/bu...53651.html/amp

It is almost accepted that apartment owners get UDS calculated on overall site area , unless explicitly mentioned in sale deed. Please refer to a competent lawyer to get reliefs.

[DigitalOne]

This news item typifies the issue that is discussed in this thread.

Speaking on behalf of the residents, Abdul Aleem, a homeowner and president of Changemakers of Kanakapura, told TNIE, “We were handed over our flats in 2007 with space left for constructing small commercial complexes enveloped by greenery left vacant. Our apartment has four towers with a total of 240 houses. In 2017, H M Builders had approached BDA and got the plan modified so that they could construct two additional towers in the vacant space.”