[k_kumar]

Like Ashir mentioned, most (if not all) universities are keen to provide support and flexibility to international students; they are going to offer some classes in hybrid or in-person mode. It's in their own interest as well since these students contribute immensely, both financially and intellectually. So, this policy will not have much impact though it will definitely cause some (more) inconvenience, uncertainty and anxiety.

On the other hand, the current suspension of several visa categories is actually having more far reaching impact. Many families have been separated due to this. I also came to know about a person whose mother fell ill and subsequently passed away in India but he could not go as he won't be able to come back for his job.

[Aceman82]

Originally Posted by funkykar

If authorities are sure that they wont reopen for over a year, this could be a good move. The students can return to their home country and take up the classes online. They can visit again when on-prem classes resume. It may be cheaper for the non-Us students and can have comfort of being in their homes with their family. Of course, they will have to bear a ticket cost, it may still be cheaper.

Most students study in USA with the idea of employment after their studies. More specifically the OPT program (Optional Practical Training) needs a minimum of one full academic year with a valid F-1 visa. This allows students to get jobs and finally apply for H1B visa within the 3 year limit for the OPT program (for STEM degree's).

Paying in-person fees and doing the course online in India is not practical for majority of folks who are pursuing their studies in USA.

[funkykar]

Originally Posted by Aceman82

Most students study in USA with the idea of employment after their studies. More specifically the OPT program (Optional Practical Training) needs a minimum of one full academic year with a valid F-1 visa. This allows students to get jobs and finally apply for H1B visa within the 3 year limit for the OPT program (for STEM degree's).

Paying in-person fees and doing the course online in India is not practical for majority of folks who are pursuing their studies in USA.

Being in the US and attending online classes doesn't make sense. Hence if government/university confirm this would be for over a year, then why not do the same from the comforts of home country and family is my point. Of course, the cost of ticket to and fro would come into picture, but savings being home may be much larger. For VISA etc, necessary amends should be made.

Fees anyway they have to pay right? I mean paying in-person fees and doing online course from US is no different.

I would oppose this only if this is being framed to get rid of the students. If so, it would be inhumane and probably unlawful.

[twin_turbo]

Originally Posted by funkykar

Fees anyway they have to pay right? I mean paying in-person fees and doing online course from US is no different.

It is slightly different from employment perspective. Only if you complete a year of study here, a student is eligible to do CPT (Read Internship) and OPT(Read full time job). If you are doing courses from India, that time does not get added to the above mentioned one year required for internships and jobs. Only if you get a full time job, most students can repay the loans they took (in many cases 40-50 lakhs) and then hope to get a H1B visa enabling them to work longer. Also, if a student completed the number of courses required to graduate from the home country, he/she will never get an i-20 reissued again (cannot return to US) unless they secure admission and re-enroll for another program, totally losing the potential job opportunity and ending up with a big loan. Not to mention the access to libraries, labs, and in general other benefits that come with being in school here.

[landcruiser123]

I don't want to get too political about this, but this administration has made it a point to put H-1B, F-1, and other non-immigrant visa holders under the bus for political mileage.

As a student on F-1 OPT, I'm not sure the US is as welcoming as it was in the 70s, 80s, and 90s. I know a few people who were personally invited by professors and fully funded to do their MS. MS today is a cash-cow for universities.

What is USAs loss will be Canada, Australia, and NZs gain in terms of skilled migration. China is also incentivizing American educated graduates and post-graduates to return. India should also implement such a system supported by a good political and business-oriented atmosphere.

Originally Posted by funkykar

Being in the US and attending online classes doesn't make sense. Hence if government/university confirms this would be for over a year, then why not do the same from the comforts of home country and family is my point.

Make no mistake, this a move to make international students the scapegoat. I'm in the scene as I completed by MS a year ago and I see emails from the International student office at my school.
There are a lot of challenges:
1. This presents some technical challenges to applications for OPT/CPT
2. The atmosphere in India is too laid back
3. Attending meetings/interviews in weird time zones is hard

[McLaren Rulez]

It's just political grandstanding from the person running the country. Pretty sure the universities will simply work around his policy and the foreign students will end up staying there.

No top university will allow stupid government policies like this to handicap them. There are enough smart people to find ways around them.

[maddy42]

As someone who has faced the current Rulers whims and fancies with regards to the H1b initially and now the F1 visa i just want to give a word of caution to anyone looking at job opportunities there through education.

Majority of employers already do not employ H1b which is milked by a bunch of IT firms to their advantage. You are given Visas which is mostly valid for a year, every visit to india has a visit to the embassy to get stamping, half your time is spent in the country with your visa having expired and you being unable to even travel to mexico or canada with peace of mind.

I had to pack my bags with a two week notice after staying there for 9 years and the scar is pretty deep. I cannot buy anything of value today as i had to dispose anything i had in two weeks time. I fear for people who have houses and a family in the states during these uncertainties.

There is a quota on green cards and indians who have applied for it will have to wait 120 years to be eligible for one.

Coming to students: Go there to study or do your research or phd, but do not expect to get employed easily. You need to network and hit up all your distant relatives in the US to get referred to companies. No college guarantees employment unlike colleges in india. The fees for online classes is not worth it as the entire college experience is missed out (example like going to the library, college games, meeting classmates from diverse countries, the learning culture unlike the mugging culture).

Lastly colleges and university towns will loose out big time. My apartment complex only housed indians and chinese students, my class of 150 had close to 120 students who were international with almost 80% of that being india and china.

Hope better sense prevails and the guy is shown the door. Also students look at other countries or even europe for that matter.

High time india starts a process of attracting such talent back, similar to what China does. Majority of my classmates from china went back. Majority of my indian classmates stayed till they could manage to get the visa yearly.

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

I don't want to get too political about this, but this administration has made it a point to put H-1B, F-1, and other non-immigrant visa holders under the bus for political mileage.

As a student on F-1 OPT, I'm not sure the US is as welcoming as it was in the 70s, 80s, and 90s. I know a few people who were personally invited by professors and fully funded to do their MS. MS today is a cash-cow for universities.

What is USAs loss will be Canada, Australia, and NZs gain in terms of skilled migration. China is also incentivizing American educated graduates and post-graduates to return. India should also implement such a system supported by a good political and business-oriented atmosphere.

Hang in there and look at options elsewhere frankly. The early 2000s was also a good time to be in the states. Now its going to be harder.

[Amrik Singh]

Originally Posted by maddy42

There is a quota on green cards and Indians who have applied for it will have to wait 120 years to be eligible for one.

If moving to US is for permanent immigration :-
To shorten this anticipated eternal period, one must not be contented with Graduate studies, but aim for PhD for better prospects. Though it means additional 5 Years or so at a low funding. The stipend is sufficient to live a simple life, though a loss of the same time in being on actual job and a much higher emolument.
Secondly, with a good track, try for EB1 Category for permanent immigration. This is a separate category for persons with exceptional qualities and has a considerably shorter period to permanent immigration.
What I have seen is the desire to take up a job immediate after Graduate Academics to recover the expenses incurred.

[maddy42]

Originally Posted by Amrik Singh

If moving to US is for permanent immigration :-
To shorten this anticipated eternal period, one must not be contented with Graduate studies, but aim for PhD for better prospects. Though it means additional 5 Years or so at a low funding. The stipend is sufficient to live a simple life, though a loss of the same time in being on actual job and a much higher emolument.

EB1 is available, but with the future of H1B itself in confusion, is it worth a risk doing a PHD just for the EB1 hope? I have a close friend who did is phd but was unable to get his H1b and is back working for a US corporation from india. Work for a firm which has a tonne of H1b rejections with folks having to even list their homes in the US for sale and waiting for more than a year to get it sold.

Luckily our firm was able to give us a position from here, but on a salary scale with no negotiation room.

Maddy

[landcruiser123]

Update: It was just a matter when and not if ICE(Immigration & Customs Enforcement) would reverse its decision for international students.

https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...s-from-foreign

[mohansrides]

Originally Posted by funkykar

..Fees anyway they have to pay right? I mean paying in-person fees and doing online course from US is no different..

I am not sure if you know this already; but it is not as simple as saying that everyone has to pay fees. Universities in the US charge international students somewhere between 8 to 10 times the normal feels. So, a student from their own state will pay USD 2000, while an international student will pay USD 20000. International students pay this fees because they want the experience of studying on-campus in the US with access to beautiful surroundings, massive and impressive libraries, amazing cafeterias, and the whole hog that one never got in India. So, to charge people these fees and then expect them to go and attend the course work from say, Udupi, is... well pointless.

Also, if one's goal is to only to learn the subject matter through online platforms, there are a zillion options today from YouTube to Coursera to Udemy to whatnot!! Many of them are free, and some of them cost only nominal amounts.

Originally Posted by maddy42

..I had to pack my bags with a two week notice after staying there for 9 years and the scar is pretty deep. I cannot buy anything of value today as i had to dispose anything i had in two weeks time. I fear for people who have houses and a family in the states during these uncertainties...

Sir,

As much as I would like to say otherwise, I have been in your shoes many many times over. My ten years in the US counted for ZILCH. Just like you, I had to wind up my life in a couple of weeks. I had nothing to show for the time that I invested in the US aside from a couple of degrees that have delivered very little value to me. I do my best to look on the bright side. And my Us stint would even have been worth it if I had at least enjoyed my time in the US while I was there. But, that didn't happen either. Every minute of every day was spent worrying and being afraid about status and all of my decision making was completely paralysed because of that. It is a horrible life -

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shift...ml#post4840136 (Studying: India vs Abroad)

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shift...ml#post4841291 (Studying: India vs Abroad)

[funkykar]

Originally Posted by mohansrides

I am not sure if you know this already; but it is not as simple as saying that everyone has to pay fees. Universities in the US charge international students somewhere between 8 to 10 times the normal feels. So, a student from their own state will pay USD 2000, while an international student will pay USD 20000. International students pay this fees because they want the experience of studying on-campus in the US with access to beautiful surroundings, massive and impressive libraries, amazing cafeterias, and the whole hog that one never got in India. So, to charge people these fees and then expect them to go and attend the course work from say, Udupi, is... well pointless.

Thats not what i meant. What i meant is, if these classes continue to be 100% online, its the same for the locals as well as those who came from other countries. If all have to attend only online for say next 12 months, ot doesnt matter if student is on US soil or Udupi.

[Durango Dude]

The best place to be in the current circumstances is "HOME". Those who have paid the fees by taking a loan would feel shortchanged and no school will have the resources to refund a cent. It's far better here in India, at least you're not allowed to arm twist students and parents to cough up the 'moolah' (fees) when schools/colleges are closed. Here in India a 5 year course can go on to become a 6 year course... Those who have really "stretched" (like Spandex) their precious resources and their capacity to pay for their wards education abroad, really had it... To top it all people are being asked to leave if they aren't attending regular classes and their visa status may be in jeopardy...

[mohansrides]

Originally Posted by funkykar

Thats not what i meant. What i meant is, if these classes continue to be 100% online, its the same for the locals as well as those who came from other countries. If all have to attend only online for say next 12 months, ot doesnt matter if student is on US soil or Udupi.

You said, and I quote “..Fees anyway they have to pay right?” That statement implies that fees would need to have been paid wherever the student avails of the education from. Yes, in principle you are right. But, the situation is not simplistic. And I was merely telling you why different fee structures exist and why many international students accept being financially burdened disproportionately; because they want the experience of studying IN the US, and not just get a degree from a US university.

So, if someone had to attend courses online, why would they have paid huge fees for on-campus education in the US? Specifically, why will they choose to pay 8 to 10 times more than a local student?

If international students are asked to go home to their countries to attend classes, then their fees should be refunded to the point where everyone is paying the same money.

[funkykar]

Yes, fees anyway they pay or already paid. Issues with fees to be dealt seperately. What i am saying is, if it boils down to online classes only, it doesnt matter where they connect from. I am also equating with how things are here. Be it WFH for IT jobs or school for children, they can do it from anywhere, they need not be in town where office or school is. Not heard anyone talk here about asking schools to refund as kids are not visiting school. We anyway have to pay.