[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Question - if coronavirus only infected those who are malnutritioned would it have sparked so much press. I doubt it.

You asked two questions. First answer. Yes, when things happen in the first world, it spooks the markets. This is because markets give importance to the dollar value of the impact. I,e what kind of impact on consumption economy etc., will that have. This is how it is. IS it bad? Yes, quite unfortunate that humanity has become a slave to money and power. But that's how it has been forever. 2000 years ago it was sticks and stones, and today is green and missiles.

Getting that out of the way, the danger of Coronovirus. That point, it would be very very unwise to underplay it.
If you have every played "Plague Inc (A very very accurate game)", you would find out that to create the perfect disease it has to have the following characteristics

1. Is not very potent or Fatal - Eg Ebola can never be a world ending threat
2. Is not dependent upon a living carrier - For example mosquito borne diseases can be controlled in most places when there is a will
3. Has a long incubation period - So it gets detected after a large number of people are infected
4. Has a low fatality rate, but not very low

COVID ticks all these boxes. Spanish flu killed 50 million people worldwide.
COVID has a much lower fatality rate, so hopefully it will not be as deadly, but still with 7 billion population, and similar infections rate as the Spanish flu(assuming), if we take 2 billion and then take 2% fatality, you are talking about forty million people. That is unprecedented.

Now 2% of 30% of world population would actually have nil impact on capitalistic system if nobody took any precautions. But precautions like travel bans and quarantines are taken, so the economy shuts down. This is what is causing the markets to panic. So its not the actual deaths, but the risk of government taking steps to save lives is what is tanking the markets.

So to sum it up, the markets are sinking due to a fear of an attempt to save human lives. Don't you love humanity

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

Surprisingly, death rate in South Korea is extremely low - while Iran has much higher death rate than Wuhan.

I wonder if this has something to do how early an infection is detected? Although there is no cure, post hospitalization care helps?

It’s about identification and control measures. Here we get a WhatsApp update every evening on the statistics for the day with information on New cases, confirmed, cured and discharged, how many in hospital, and in that how many in intensive care etc. The update also mention details on the contact tracing. It is transparent and structured, and also give the citizens and residents a sense of comfort. This also help people to get better equipped and informed of the symptoms. Could be different in some other countries where people probably just dismiss this off as common cold and spread around unknowingly.

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

This is a counter point of view. You are welcome to disagree. Total cases so far 82,589. Total deaths 2814. Total recovered 33,314. Every death is a tragedy for the loved ones of the deceased. I am not for a minute belittling their loss.
…
…
Question - if coronavirus only infected those who are malnutritioned would it have sparked so much press. I doubt it.

When something happens out of the ordinary or against an expected behavior or situation, it’s natural to have added attention to that situation. We have close to 40 pages of discussion on an XUV500 accident where in the airbags did not deploy and the driver got critically injured, and recently another thread on a Volvo XC90 catching fire. If we go by the logic mentioned above, we are overreacting to these first world incidents because daily there are hundreds and thousands of people getting injured (or dying) on Indian roads, and most of them cannot afford a car.

Just saying that the press and global attention is not just an overreaction to a first world problem. The impact can be devastating if it hits lesser privileged countries or malnutritioned population.

[vibbs]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

This is a counter point of view. You are welcome to disagree. Total cases so far 82,589. Total deaths 2814. Total recovered 33,314. Every death is a tragedy for the loved ones of the deceased. I am not for a minute belittling their loss.

As a social impact worker in the area of child health care for the poor and the very poor I see these tragedies unfolding often ie every week some times everyday. In the same 3 months TB and Malaria have killed 600,000 poor in South Asia and Africa mainly. But you wont hear of it. Because those are diseases the First World and the well off in the Third World are protected from or can cure. For the person who cannot afford a cure for TB/Malaria it is as dangerous and terrifying as coronavirus is to us because we have no cure. Not having a cure or not being able to afford a cure is as debilitating and traumatizing if you are at the receiving end. Coronavirus poses some risk to humankind but the reason this thread has 7 pages is because it could affect you and me i.e. the rich.

Question - if coronavirus only infected those who are malnutritioned would it have sparked so much press. I doubt it.

Sir,

My answer to your question.
//Question - if coronavirus only infected those who are malnutritioned would it have sparked so much press. I doubt it.//

Maybe, Maybe not- depending on where your are.
Maybe- If you are in a part of the world where this has a big impact.
Maybe not- If you are in a developed nation.
Most of the chatter regarding the Novel coronavirus is basically with countries, companies etc taking measures to limit the spread thereby affecting everything from markets to free movement of goods and people.
So if this hypothetical new disease does not affect your region, it wont be news there. Other places it should be, but it wont be a global news concern.

But it would be counter productive to trivialise Novel Corona virus concerns by comparing them to Malaria and TB. Novel Coronavirus is contagious, has potential to spread across the globe (millions of potential infected), we have no imunity to it and there is no drug (deaths numbering in tens of thousands at least if it spreads like above).

Malaria and TB kill a lot of people worldwide. It's a known fact and governments are working on it. But all said and done, there are medicines and drugs to treat both these diseases and checks put in place by various governments to prevent it's spread.

The fact that they do not receive the same kind of hype in media, does not mean there is no action on it. For example, when you apply for a work permit to many countries, you have to actually sign an undertaking certifying that you have never had TB.

Also here in Singapore (where I stay) the government is very active in ensuring that mosquitoes are kept at bay. You are penalized heavily if during inspections the authorities see traces of mosquito breeding in your premises. Last week in the locality that I stay, they lifted the Dengue red alert after almost 3 weeks. The red alert was issued when there were 10 cases of dengue fever in the locality. There were awareness drives carried out by Government and a lot of banners and information popping at public places about Dengue.

So it's not that there is no concern about these diseases. In affected regions there is -of course depending on where you are. A normal person does not get to hear it because.

a) it's not global and you are not staying in one of the affected regions.
b) In regions where the impact is high, the local administration is lackadaisical.

The difference with Novel Coronavirus is that it has a potential to be a global outbreak. Vector borne diseases can be contained by limiting the population of these vectors.
TB is eradicated in most parts of the world. Coronavirus on the other hand is like a normal Viral flu. When you get Viral fever, normally doctors prescribe symptomatic treatment and the virus runs its course within 5-7 days because your immune system kicks in and works. Unfortunately against Novel coronavirus there is no immunity. Which is why the level of supportive care given needs to be very high specially when the lower respiratory tract is infected.

Many patients need critical care. In case of a huge outbreak, this puts a massive strain on the health infrastructure.
This is the link I use to follow the situation.

https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/a...23467b48e9ecf6

3.4% of people infected by Novel Coronavirus die globally (This is slightly higher in Mainland China)
However if you dig deeper you will see that when you remove china the percentage drops drastically to below 1%.
The reason is that while the other countries have managed to control the outbreak, in China it was not so specially when it all began. Of course from Jan onwards the authorities have literally shut down the affected cities.

In China 83% of total deaths happened in Hubei Province - the most affected province. Outside Hubei, less than 1% of patients have died. Hubei is literally a locked city. A colleague of mine is from this place and I know from him that the lockdown is pretty harsh. Hospitals are full. Houses are literally sealed by Government to prevent people from venturing out. This is also the reason why the death rates are much higher in Hubei province. This is a disease which mandates that a higher percentage of patients need intensive care. This is what strains the infrastructure and thereby leading to deaths . Most who receive this care recover.

If you are worried about the diseases of the poor in countries like India, just imagine what an outbreak like this can do to these very people. Dont go by the 3 recovered cases in Kerala. Kerala is by far the most equipped states in India to deal with such outbreaks due to superior public healthcare facilties at primary level and a higher than average public awareness. And there was no widespread outbreak either.

Here in Singapore, out of 31 people still with Novel coronavirus, I think 5 are in ICU. Extrapolate this proportion into 1000s and see what absolute number of ICU beds will be required in case of a widespread outbreak.
And this is a disease that can be spread easily - way easier than say Malaria.

[vivek95]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

This is a counter point of view. You are welcome to disagree. Total cases so far 82,589. Total deaths 2814. Total recovered 33,314. Coronavirus poses some risk to humankind but the reason this thread has 7 pages is because it could affect you and me i.e. the rich.

Question - if coronavirus only infected those who are malnutritioned would it have sparked so much press. I doubt it.

The simple answer to your question is - Yes, a big Yes !! Had this novel Coronavirus outbreak occurred somewhere even in the backward regions of African continent, it definitely would have sparked a similar level of attention by press. Period !

When H1N1 (Swine Flu) epidemic occurred in Pune,India in 2010 or so, it had garnered similar media coverage to the extent that people were advised against travelling to Pune. Today H1N1 outbreaks still do occur in pockets but there is a vaccine strain coming out every year and the antiviral drug ( Osealtimivir) has proven to be very effective ever since its discovery in 2010. The fatality rate went down significantly.

2018 Nipah virus outbreak had happened in developing countries like Indonesia, India etc. Didn't it spark similar attention by media back then ???

You are not differentiating the nature of illness caused by Malaria, TB and that by Novel Coronavirus. Travel advisory for Coronavirus has been issued because of its rapidity of spread by droplet infection. Mankhurd, Govandi in Mumbai are the Extra-drug resistant TB hubs of our country, but are we prohibiting people from travelling to Mumbai ? No, because, even though TB also can spread via droplets, the rapidity is not as severe as this novel Coronavirus and more over we have a definitive treatment for TB on hand but not for Coronavirus.

I repeat, this has absolutely nothing to do with the disparity between first world and third world countries. Media's attention for COVID-19 at present is warranted by all accounts.

Regards
Dr. Vivek

[KL01toKA03]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Question - if coronavirus only infected those who are malnutritioned would it have sparked so much press. I doubt it.

Lives of different people have different news value. That is nothing new, and not restricted to coronavirus. Even if you look within a country, you will see the same thing. If you look within India, it is easy to find areas affected by militancy or some other form of armed rebellion. The death of a commoner in those parts of the nation would be treated less seriously than the death of a similar person in a relatively peaceful part of the nation. In other words, expectations are different for different types of people (type can be nationality, species, religious or political affiliation, dietary choice, or anything else).

It is well accepted that people from certain parts of the globe are vulnerable to diseases, and there is a perception that some other parts of the world are reasonably better off. When the supposedly safe are at risk, fear crops up in the minds of those people and also those who were anyway considered to be living a risky life.

[Mohan Mathew A]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

This is a counter point of view. You are welcome to disagree.

I am honestly not sure what your point is

Is it that the media coverage is more when it is something related to the influential or the rich? Yes, of course it is

Is it that diseases affecting the poor are less prioritised? To some extent true

But this is not true only for healthcare but equally true for Education, Jobs Access to state services etc etc.
In an ideal world this probably shouldn't happen but the planet that we inhabit has a long distance to cover before becoming Utopia

Also TB and Malaria has been in existence for many decades (if not centuries) this virus is novel (pun intended). If this becomes a routine affair, i am pretty sure it will also follow the path of TB/Malaria and won't attract much attention

[volkman10]

Geneva Motor Show canceled after coronavirus causes government to ban large events.

Switzerland bans gatherings of 1,000 or more people.

The ban is effective immediately and runs at least until March 15th. The 90th edition of GIMS was scheduled to start next week.

Link

[digitalnirvana]

First cases reported in Northern Ireland, Wales and very worryingly Lagos. Nigeria wouldn't be able to cope and effectively contain I presume. Also Japan closing all schools early for the summer vacation.

Pakistan apparently has approximately 1500 people who have travelled back from Iran - surely that's criminal negligence not to screen them and quarantine when they were at the border.

[SilentEngine]

Think of the higher order effects this will trigger! Most of the shutdowns will cause massive impact to financial system, effects of which will be felt across the social structure. It's certainly not a first world problem alone.

[SmartCat]

Coronavirus may be ‘once-in-a-century pathogen we’ve been worried about’: Bill Gates
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/28/bill...-pathogen.html

Many low- and middle-income countries’ “health systems are already stretched thin, and a pathogen like the coronavirus can quickly overwhelm them,” Gates wrote

Covid-19 is transmitted quite efficiently. The average infected person spreads the disease to two or three others — an exponential rate of increase.” World health leaders say the disease is spread by people who are mildly ill or don’t show any symptoms at all, making it harder to contain and more contagious than other types of viruses.

The World Health Organization said the mortality rate of COVID-19 can differ, ranging from 0.7% to up to 4%, depending on the quality of the health-care system where it’s treated.

[rohittunga]

You guys have to watch this video. This guy was recently quarantined, coughs all over his daughter, grabs her water bottle to have a drink and hands it back. Way to go man spreading the virus to his daughter. It almost seems like he was trolling everybody

https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1...286211585?s=20

[digitalnirvana]

Originally Posted by rohittunga

You guys have to watch this video.

I've seen that. It is absolutely mind boggling how negligent one can be!

In other news it appears 38% of the US population won't drink Corona beer due to fears of the virus.

https://www.businessinsider.com/coro...rmation-2020-2

I'm rapidly losing faith in people.

[BoneCollector]

This is the recent travel advisory as issued by the Ministry of Health and Family Welfare as well as the Global Travel Restrictions.

[Zed]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

In the same 3 months TB and Malaria have killed 600,000 poor in South Asia and Africa mainly.

Question - if coronavirus only infected those who are malnutritioned would it have sparked so much press. I doubt it.

There is rarely discussions, outside the circle of those involved in its eradication, about the 2 million preventable deaths - from TB and malaria - in 2019. And I understand the perspective that the apathy is on account of the profile of the victims.
But neither is there much discussion about the 1.3 million cancer deaths in Europe. Sure, it isn’t communicable but lifestyle and food choices (awareness) have significant impact (preventable). So more conversation would certainly help.

The bottom line is that we are indifferent to death unless there is a new killer on the block. Or if our loved ones are involved.

[M35]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

This is the recent travel advisory as issued by the Ministry of Health and Family Welfare as well as the Global Travel Restrictions.

Thank you for the updates. Could you provide a link to the government official site for the Consolidated Travel advisory issued
EDIT: Found it https://mohfw.gov.in/node/4904