[MileCruncher]

Wikipedia says ECA are harmful or banned in many countries due to deaths linkedto it.

[alpha1]

Originally Posted by 1-Testosterone

Vegan Bodybuilders - If they compete, they do it with Vitamin S. The nearest one to me is Varinder Ghuman, the only IFBB Pro from India. Soy makes great business sense BTW.

Doesn't everyone in India?

[1-Testosterone]

TSK, are you kidding me? Do you trust FDA?
For god's sake, scroll through bodybuilding.com forums, 10 years back.
I've been into this industry for the past 10 years. Getting Ephedra out of the supplement hands was FDA biggest feat and pharma bigwigs were behind that lobby.

[Parthasarathig]

Hello bhpians I was going through this thread when i noticed talks about ephedra. Yes its a fat burner but my advice would be please dont try it. I dont need FDA or anyone else's word. Ive seen its effects personally. My friend lost 2kgs in the first month itself but then he became weak, became vitamin deficient, started having migraine, tinnitus, vertigo. His keratoconus problems also increased.

Im not denying credit to ephedra regarding its efficieny in burning fat.Yes ephedra is a wonderful fat burner but it has a lot of side effects. Why not simply exercise and lose weight?
Perhaps im the only one here who doesnt have much knowledge regarding weight loss. But my friend has gone through its side effects. It is now after 6 7 months that he is healing.

The choice is perhaps left to the individual how he wants to loss weight.

[ethan3686]

Originally Posted by Parthasarathig

Hello bhpians I was going through this thread when i noticed talks about ephedra. Yes its a fat burner but my advice would be please dont try it. I dont need FDA or anyone else's word. Ive seen its effects personally. My friend lost 2kgs in the first month itself but then he became weak, became vitamin deficient, started having migraine, tinnitus, vertigo. His keratoconus problems also increased.

Im not denying credit to ephedra regarding its efficieny in burning fat.Yes ephedra is a wonderful fat burner but it has a lot of side effects. Why not simply exercise and lose weight?
Perhaps im the only one here who doesnt have much knowledge regarding weight loss. But my friend has gone through its side effects. It is now after 6 7 months that he is healing.

The choice is perhaps left to the individual how he wants to loss weight.

Thank you so much for your input.are you sure your friend didnt over use it? If not then i guess most of the articles (including wikipedia) are true about these drugs.

[1-Testosterone]

Originally Posted by MileCruncher

Wikipedia says ECA are harmful or banned in many countries due to deaths linkedto it.

Fair enough.
Do you rely on Team BHP or Wikipedia when it comes to inside out and true info regarding automobiles and the science behind it?
ECA is not a child's play and is meant to be consumed by healthy individuals only. It's definitely not a short cut for fat loss.
Professional athletes use it for pure energy and not for fat loss. Fat loss is just a bonus which is associated with (via release of NE).
Now the question to use it or not clearly is a personal one. Check out your medical history first whether you are susceptible to hypertension and related disorders. You need to eat, train and rest sensibly when on EC. Before taking it you need to assess the tolerance and it's meant for those who push to their limits and it's definitely not a short cut towards fat loss.
Most of the long term side effect bearers are usually who do DIET, fail to take in their macro-nutrients, micro-nutrients, fluids and rest.
Calling it dangerous is just like calling squatting heavy will ruin your knees and bones as many doctors say.

[KSM-Vtec]

Originally Posted by 1-Testosterone

Fair enough.
Do you rely on Team BHP or Wikipedia when it comes to inside out and true info regarding automobiles and the science behind it?
ECA is not a child's play and is meant to be consumed by healthy individuals only. It's definitely not a short cut for fat loss.
Professional athletes use it for pure energy and not for fat loss. Fat loss is just a bonus which is associated with (via release of NE).
Now the question to use it or not clearly is a personal one. Check out your medical history first whether you are susceptible to hypertension and related disorders. You need to eat, train and rest sensibly when on EC. Before taking it you need to assess the tolerance and it's meant for those who push to their limits and it's definitely not a short cut towards fat loss.
Most of the long term side effect bearers are usually who do DIET, fail to take in their macro-nutrients, micro-nutrients, fluids and rest.
Calling it dangerous is just like calling squatting heavy will ruin your knees and bones as many doctors say.

Thats some really good information on the precautions.

Will be great if you can share some published documents/articles/papers on how ECA should be administered? for what kind of people it is suitable? what are the precautions? and that there are no side effects...

[Parthasarathig]

Originally Posted by ethan3686

Thank you so much for your input.are you sure your friend didnt over use it? If not then i guess most of the articles (including wikipedia) are true about these drugs.

Nope. My friend took one tablet a day. When the headaches increased he tried to take half tablets but the body craves more and more. His situation kept worsening. He had to quit work for 3 months and for a guy of 22 years of age having vitamin deficiency is unthinkable. And he isnt a vegetarian so definitely unthinkable all the more. And when body gets deficient in vitamins it gets very and i mean very weak. He couldnt even use the computer. Thats nothing. Ive seen patients who just lie in bed with drips of vitamin and only become normal and have energy to move around after days of replenishment.

The side effects are different for every body but there are side effects. "1-testosterone" is correct too when he says that if you dont follow your diet properly without micro and macronutrients which essentially are minerals and vitamins. But then thats also like saying that taking to smoking increases fat loss(because you stop eating) but then smoking does have its side effects. In general in life taking shortcuts will always have side effects. Its left to you to get yourself protected against it.

If using these drugs please be careful. Id not advise them. Why not opt for cardio and other workouts, that strengthen the core of your body? In fact you can opt for mixed martial arts and parkour and with a proper diet your body will not only be flexible, but youd have learnt self defense tactics along the way.
But to each his own. Im not here to upset anyone by my opinions.

Regards

[mandheers]

Originally Posted by Parthasarathig

Nope. My friend took one tablet a day. When the headaches increased he tried to take half tablets but the body craves more and more. His situation kept worsening. He had to quit work for 3 months and for a guy of 22 years of age having vitamin deficiency is unthinkable.....
But to each his own. Im not here to upset anyone by my opinions.

Regards

Hi Parthasarathig, ECA is a simple fat-burner, much has been detailed earlier in this thread and in recent posts by 1-Testosterone.

Everything ingested has it's effects and side-effects, so let's not debate about the wrong being wrong.

I have used it a few times with decent results and had no side effects. The point is to know a reliable source since all substance that's so-called 'banned' is 1. more in demand, and 2. more often than not, fake.

The ECA stack (as it is called) comes in capsule form only, and never tablet; correct me if I am wrong people; and if your friend was consuming tablets then maybe there was something wrong.

Vitamin deficiency is a big topic and could happen to even people with adequate diets if the individual's body is not performing well, so the problem might not be ECA, but was coincidental, maybe again.

Originally Posted by alpha1

Doesn't everyone in India?

Everyone on stage has done at least one steroid cycle, nobody I know on stage who hasn't, even those who claim to be 'natural'.

Heck Jay Cutler claims he is natural.

Originally Posted by ethan3686

Isnt ECA stack harmful? I have heard a lot of bad things about it ranging from vomiting to heart failure. Can someone please theow some light on these tablets?

Answered above, I saw a documentary which listed Vitamin C as harmful too. It was titled 'Bigger Stronger Faster'.

Originally Posted by 1-Testosterone

Fair enough.
Do you rely on Team BHP or Wikipedia when it comes to inside out and true info regarding automobiles and the science behind it?
ECA is not a child's play and is meant to be consumed by healthy individuals only. It's definitely not a short cut for fat loss.
Professional athletes use it for pure energy and not for fat loss. Fat loss is just a bonus which is associated with (via release of NE).
Now the question to use it or not clearly is a personal one. Check out your medical history first whether you are susceptible to hypertension and related disorders. You need to eat, train and rest sensibly when on EC. Before taking it you need to assess the tolerance and it's meant for those who push to their limits and it's definitely not a short cut towards fat loss.
Most of the long term side effect bearers are usually who do DIET, fail to take in their macro-nutrients, micro-nutrients, fluids and rest.
Calling it dangerous is just like calling squatting heavy will ruin your knees and bones as many doctors say.

Touche!

-------

All said, I feel fat burners should be used only in conjuncture to some real hardcore training.

ECA is essentially Ephedrine+Caffeine+Apirin.

Supplementing with ECA, boosts metabolism significantly, and for a fairly long duration.

This is due to the increased levels of norepinephrine released due to ephedrine plus increased levels of cyclic adenosine monophosphate from caffeine and the prolonging effect that aspirin has on the first two chemicals.

Regular people and regular training can also work with slightly increased cardio yes, but if you want to get better results; no 'short cut' but just better bang for your training; one could even take Himalaya's Ayur Slim. It is safe, Ayurvedic and it works like a charm.

As with everything, you need to be On and Off. So if you are taking a supplement to training which is not subsistence like protein, you need to follow dosages strictly, and go off it once the dosage duration is done.

Case in point the ECA stack, the way I used it was maybe on for 4 weeks and off for 4. Those 4 weeks I would ensure to push like mad to make the best of it.

I would take 2 caps thrice daily, and the product was: NutraSport ECA Stack

Here's an old link on ECA: Bodybuilding.com - The ECA Stack!

I would strongly say, to use such 'banned' substances is individual choice, Ephedrine is still used for asthma patients, so dosage and manner would decide the outcome.

There are other fat burners I have used which in order of ranking are:
1. Nutrex Lipo6
2. Animal Cuts
3. Hydroxycut Hardcore (coupled with the Goa sun it gave me a bad case of facial pigmentation )

The worst I used was SAN Tight Extreme, and I will never recommend it to anyone. I had a lot of cholesterol and blood pressure issues post that. Also, my diet and training was all over the place owing to work, but it was my only time I tried a SAN product, and probably the last.

[BANDHAV]

Originally Posted by mandheers

1. Nutrex Lipo6
.

Hey mandheers, you seems to have extensive knowledge on the subject matter. I am working out (read mix of cardio, weight training, ground exercise etc) for last two and half months. I have coupled the exercising with streamlined diet like fruits, salads, no fry stuff and all etc. I have lost almost 9 kg weight in past two months.

Now my train has suggested me to go for the product I have quoted from your post, I am little apprehensive about going this way but results suggested are two tempting to ignore. Can you give me a little low down on this product, this will help me in making up my mind regarding the same.

Thanks in advance.

[csateesh]

Originally Posted by mobike008

" Weight Loss" mission.

Problem areas : Waist area, big back and a little fleshy back ( not the back, but, the actual back, below the shoulder)

I reduced only 2kgs in 45 days so i am quite disheartened.

Here is my exercise regime

Warm Up - 2 mins ( stretching for legs, back & hands)
Treadmill - 15-20 mins ( almost all of it at either 6.8 or 7kmph)
Cross Trainer - 10 mins
Cycle/Sitting Cycle : 5-10 mins
Ball exchange
Ab Crunches
Leg crunches for Abs



Breakfast (9:00AM) : 1 Phulka and 1 Egg White and Small glass of sugarless cold milk

Lunch ( 1:30pm): 3 Phulka and Curry

A handful of nuts or sprouts for late afternoon

Dinner (9:00pm) : 2 Phulkas with curry. Small bowl of dal and one drink later in the night.

I have stopped eating fries like chips, peanuts, etc.

What ya'll think?

Avinash

I see that you are doing quite a lot of cardio work out but I see absolutely no weight training

Strengthening muscles will help accelerate the weight loss and get you the toned look,

Since you have highlighted problematic areas I would suggest the following

1. Sumo deadlifts
2. Seated cable row - Take care of the back and shoulders
3. Forward lunges - Core abdomen
4. Iron man - Fantastic for abdomen

The key is to develop core strength and you will be able to push yourself more.

This link should help in core strengthening work outs. Overall strengthening exercise can be found here

Hope this isn't too late

With regards to food eat normally but reduce fat intake and increase proteins.

Cheers

[SohailPistawala]

Originally Posted by BANDHAV

Hey mandheers, you seems to have extensive knowledge on the subject matter. I am working out (read mix of cardio, weight training, ground exercise etc) for last two and half months. I have coupled the exercising with streamlined diet like fruits, salads, no fry stuff and all etc. I have lost almost 9 kg weight in past two months.

Now my train has suggested me to go for the product I have quoted from your post, I am little apprehensive about going this way but results suggested are two tempting to ignore. Can you give me a little low down on this product, this will help me in making up my mind regarding the same.

Thanks in advance.

Bandhav : I know the post is directed to mandheer, i just thought il take the liberty to reply too. Well as you stated that you have lost 9 kgs in past two months, why dont you just continue doing the same thing, and see the results flowing. Probably just increase the exercise regime and continue getting the results.

Have some cheat days in between so that you dont get bored of the diet.

Keep repping

[BANDHAV]

Originally Posted by SohailPistawala

Bandhav : I know the post is directed to mandheer, i just thought il take the liberty to reply too. Well as you stated that you have lost 9 kgs in past two months, why dont you just continue doing the same thing, and see the results flowing. Probably just increase the exercise regime and continue getting the results.

Increasing the exercise regime will be a little difficult as I am already doing almost 7 days a week, more than an hour of exercising.

Originally Posted by SohailPistawala

Have some cheat days in between so that you dont get bored of the diet.

Keep repping

Yes, I do that, I am a big time Rice fan but have shifted to chapati diets so on alternative Sunday I take a rice meal.

[SohailPistawala]

Bandhav : By Increasing the exercise regime i meant, to increase sets, reps, reduce rest periods between sets, do some circuit, some alterations in the plan. But yes please include some rest in between the 7 day routine.

Keep Repping

[arup.misra]

Hi friends, Need your help to fine tune my workout session.

About me - I'm 5'9" weighing about 73kg. I have lean frame with run-flat tyres on the stomach / lower abdomen area . That's about the only place where fat (a lot of it) has accumulated

Current Work out - (started a month back)

Mon / Wed / Fri - Cardio / Abs / Lower Body

Tues / Thurs - Upper Body

Cardio

Warm Up - 6 mins (on tread mill between speeds of 2-6)
Treadmill - 20 mins (H.I.I.T with speeds of 8,9,10 i.e 4 sets of 1 min running @ 8 then walking @ 4 for a minute, 3 sets of 1 min run @ 9 then walking @ 5, 2 sets of 1 min run @ 10 then walking @ 6) almost all of it at incline 2
Cross Trainer - 16-17 mins (with resistances varying between 1-9)
Cycle Cycle : 5 min

Abs - Stomach crunches, Plank, Leg crunches for abs

Lower Body - Leg Curls (front & back), Thigh Weight Press, Squats

Upper Body - Chest, Biceps, Triceps, Forearms, Wrist

Completely stopped rice, potatoes, fried stuff & sweets. Haven't felt the need to do cheat days yet.

You think I'm doing ok? Do I need any protein supplements (currently taking ProvitX - OTC local protein shake)