[gameonrwind]

none of the news channels have diagnosed the problem as yet, there were also claims of a "short circuit" ,,,i do not know how and were

[ankit.jhamb]

i think with if safety is the concern then both (lpg/cng) are safe.
reason::if lpg/cng would have been dangerous then maruti/hyundai wouldnot have launched WAGONR-DUO/SANTRO CNG

the point is the initial cost
generally a local mechanic would charge 30-40% less than an authorised fitment centre.so in order to save that part,they generaaly choose the cheaper option..

[tsk1979]

The news is that there was no gas in cylinder.But the wiring was faulty and so was the installation etc., leading to petrol burning and causing explosion

[motorheadinc]

I believe the CNG option is a safer one.
All the local buses in delhi run on CNG.
It has been doing a great duty in delhi and i haven't heard of any major accidents due to gas leak and all.

I would refer to my earlier post in the same thread regarding LPG:
""The domestic cylinders are made of thinner metal and the rise in pressure and forces of impact are too much for them to handle.
Hence they explode.""

The same is not true for CNG.

[elfhelm]

Originally Posted by GTO

Spot on, TSK! Each CNG / LPG related fire that I have personally heard about, have had questionable after-market kits installed.

Yeah, I've got 2 cars running on LPG for more than 2 yrs now, and no problems so far. They are certified LPG kits fitted by authorised dealers of the kit manufacturers - not local guys.

[saintsinner]

My Accent runs on CNG. RC endorsed, Tomasetto Achille Kit with a 14 KG tank - Closed loop. I got it installed infront of me, making sure everything is perfect.

If installed professionally, i beleive CNG is very safe. Spend 3-4K extra but get it done by an authorized installer.

[dockap]

last week a maruthi van running on a lpg kit carrying 8 people in mangalore rammed into a electric pole and the lpg cylinder exploded 6 out of the 8 people were killed instantly

[phamilyman]

Hit by a trailer truck, and the omni's quite trashed. the cylinder's still sitting peacefully.

[phamilyman]

Bump!

Where are the CNG naysayers?

[jagan0677]

Ok this is not quite exactly about LPG/CPG vehicles.

I have noticed on quite a few occasions, autowallahs carrying industrial gas cylinders(those long/slim ones- abt 4' in length and 1/2' in dia.) Now the sad part is, in most cases, i have seen this cylinder is laid transversely, in the passenger compartment, where 1/2' of the cylinder projects out of the body into the road
, on both sides. Well, the bottom end is pretty immune to impact. But the top end,where you have the valve, if hit by something, a vehicle or a barricade could be quite disastrous; and this doesnt have to be a major hit!!( I have heard of cases where, when there is a damage @ the valve end, the force of release of gas through the valve opening could actually propel the whole cylinder a good distance, with good momentum. Something like a water sprinkler effect,if you had to imagine it, multiplied many times over. ) I guess, safety is not so welcome in India.

OT, but couldnt help bringing it up!!

[jaysmokesleaves]

If you cant put petrol in a car.. then dont buy it.( my personal opinion)
Cng/lpg is certainly intrinsically not safe...
The probability of risk in a cng/lpg equipped car is really high.
In the event of a fire in the car for whatever reason, our investigating agencies are certainly not equipped to correctly ascertain the cause.
Until such a time that safety features are designed to a point where the probability of risk can be reduced to a very negligible percentage, in my opinion gas vehicles should not be legalised. Besides, is there a system in place where every gas kit vehicle has to be periodically certified by a concerned authority. How many people owning gas vehicles, including the numerous travelling time bombs(mumbai taxis & autos) actually service these kits unless there is a problem. A gas kit problem is mostly associated with smell. But cng aint got no stink. So ....??

[paras211]

how imune is the lpg container (authorized ones) from a rear collision?

[phamilyman]

@Jagan:true that, but its completely irrelevant for CNG/LPG powered vehicles. And coming back on topic:

Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves

If you cant put petrol in a car.. then dont buy it.( my personal opinion)

My personal opinion is that a bulk of us don't need a car. its just that our public transport system is non-existent (compare the smallest german town). But well, others have their opinions, and their pockets.

Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves

Cng/lpg is certainly intrinsically not safe...
The probability of risk in a cng/lpg equipped car is really high.

Your profile incidentally reveals you're an engineer. Care to elucidate technically what is the root cause? At the same time, please click the pic I posted above - the Maruti's rear is smashed but the tank is completely intact. NOTHING. eh?

Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves

In the event of a fire in the car for whatever reason, our investigating agencies are certainly not equipped to correctly ascertain the cause.

Interesting aspersion. Pray again clarify why - the final nonsense that's published in the newspapers does not mean the relevant trained people don' know their jobs.

Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves

Until such a time that safety features are designed to a point where the probability of risk can be reduced to a very negligible percentage, in my opinion gas vehicles should not be legalised.

Nice sounding, but completely incorrect. Your entire post presumes they are unsafe, without the minutest shred of evidence towards the same.

Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves

Besides, is there a system in place where every gas kit vehicle has to be periodically certified by a concerned authority.

That is the RTO rule. Details I'd post later, or maybe wolfinstein.

Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves

How many people owning gas vehicles, including the numerous travelling time bombs(mumbai taxis & autos) actually service these kits unless there is a problem. A gas kit problem is mostly associated with smell. But cng aint got no stink. So ....??

Oh it does. Word of the day: Ethyl Mercaptan.

No offence, but as an engineer, I'd expect you to be more logical in questioning CNG cars' safety!

[straight6]

Originally Posted by Dippy

The news report on the school van explosion says that it happened because the LPG was over and the driver was switching over to petrol forgetting that there was indeed some gas left in the pipes. I didnt quite get this. can some one explain?

That's rubbish. I had an Esteem with an LPG kit and I ran out of lpg many times and immediately switched to petrol and my car didn't blow up. In fact, I have even done it at a very high speed on the expressway while going to Pune.

[jaysmokesleaves]

@ PHAMYLYMAN


My personal opinion is that a bulk of us don't need a car. its just that our public transport system is non-existent (compare the smallest german town). But well, others have their opinions, and their pockets.

Actually yes…. We need a better PTS. But thats another issue.




Your profile incidentally reveals you're an engineer. Care to elucidate technically what is the root cause? At the same time, please click the pic I posted above - the Maruti's rear is smashed but the tank is completely intact. NOTHING. eh?


Engineer tag does not certify engineering intelligence. Me or anyone else.
Don’t be misled.
An intact tank does not mean that a system is safe. It only speaks for the integrity of the tank design which again incase of an accident is subject to many factors( tank positioning/placement in the vehicle, angle of impact during accident,etc) A fire can result due to failure of valves(including safety valves). In fact tank integrity in case of explosions is hardly suspect. Tank failures in most cases have been caused due to valve failures. Im quite sure that design engineers today design tanks that are intrinsically safe wrt operational integrity.




Interesting aspersion. Pray again clarify why - the final nonsense that's published in the newspapers does not mean the relevant trained people don' know their jobs.

I didn’t mean it the way you read it: They surely may be relevantly trained, but it does not mean they ‘always’ do their job. Without going into details, it is a well known fact, how facts are conveniently manipulated by investigating agencies. Also, there is no certainty that being apart of an investigating agency makes that officer/agency accurate in their investigation. Just look at all the official investigating agencies around us. Even the few good men in these agencies lose their virtue due to systemic apathy.



Nice sounding, but completely incorrect. Your entire post presumes they are unsafe, without the minutest shred of evidence towards the same.

For me, my friend, sitting in and passing by a gas leaking/stinking cab in Mumbai is evidence enough of a disaster waiting to happen. I don’t need an investigating agency coming up with its safety report to tell me how safe I am in the present rickety gas taxi cab.



That is the RTO rule. Details I'd post later, or maybe wolfinstein.

We have all the rules in place – in the books.
You need to go to an RTO office and see how these vehicles are ‘passed’.
There is ‘no’ safety check for the gas kit. Im sure the officer doesn’t even know how the system works. I say this because I have ‘bin ther and seen that’
Again I will not get into details as it is subject enough for another thread.
Besides, do you live your life by a rule book.- NO OFFENCE.
I live mine by common sense.



Oh it does. Word of the day: Ethyl Mercaptan.

Thanks for enlightening me on - Ethyl Mercaptan.
Uno, that’s what I like most about this site.

No offence, but as an engineer, I'd expect you to be more logical in questioning CNG cars' safety!

It seems to me that you are easily misled by titles: - What if I say im an IT engineer.
My logic is based on what I see in reality around me and not my engineering background.
With all the systems in place there can be total failure if not correctly implemented.
Consider the percentage of private ownership gas driven vehicles with the transport ones.
With the number of taxis, autos, buses and trucks now running on gas – I will not feel safe to find myself boxed in at a signal with a leaking gas cab with a compulsive smoker in it.
Again - before someone points out - i aint got nothing against cabbies.
Lastly, safety starts with prevention.