[pepega]

At such intersections where I am stopped at the red light or passing on green but the light turns, I usually press the emergency recording button on my dash cam.

I have heard that there is a way to dispute the fines by emailing them dash cam footage of you being stopped whereas their record might say that you've crossed based on a still image, or where you passed on green but their record says you passed on red.

If we don't actively dispute these fines, we'll all get needlessly fined out of thousands of rupees every year. Especially since a lot of these cameras are at "trap" junctions. A lot of the speedcams are also in similar spots, where the speed suddenly goes down from 80 to 50 right where a camera is, with little warning or even a bush covering the official speed limit sign. Well, that's a discussion for the "Are indian roads poorly designed?" thread.

I think they're designed quite well, if the intent is to create revenue for traffic departments. The more ambiguity in road design and rules, the higher chances of someone getting fined arbitrarily, and that's where the system profits from road drivers. Traffic police tax is an additional tax that we pay along with GST, Cess, Road Tax and Tolls. Unspoken cost of driving a car in India.

[Revvatron]

By going through the posts above I realize there are Amber lights still in operation. It's been ages since I saw one. In Hyderabad, the areas where I stay and work amber light doesn't exist. It turns from Green to Red directly without any indication. And this is for signals with manual intervention as well as timers.

[cdrajeevkumar]

I was charged INR 5000 for jumping red light in Delhi. It was a farce as at that point in time, the traffic light was malfunctioning (Stuck on RED) and a cop was regulating the traffic. The challan that I received had the photo of 1 car ahead of me (past the pedestrian crossing), the police guy to my right with his right hand stretched out, which in my opinion meant that it was a manual control.

But, I had no option but to pay up! I had a fleeting thought that this is a "nice way to make money"

[satish.gawai]

Originally Posted by RahulNagaraj

Thanks to the Team-BHP fan (he prefers to remain anonymous) who sent this in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP share page!

Now you have two possibilities:
1.Follow through and cross the intersection.
2.Stop as soon as you find outcrossing is not a good idea.

Attachment 2541851

You would have gone for option 1 according to me. Signal time delay could have allowed you to pass the intersection before the oncoming traffic from another direction meets you.

[Lobogris]

Considering the appalling lack of adherence to traffic rules in India and an almost total lack of enforcement, any fine should be welcomed. Anything that would make people follow the rules is good. I would be happy if similar fines were introduced for speeding, not following lane discipline, wrong way driving etc.

[SlowDough]

Originally Posted by RahulNagaraj

Thanks to the Team-BHP fan (he prefers to remain anonymous) who sent this in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP share page!



Attachment 2541851

My car has multiple fines like this. I understand your predicatement, because it is not easy to judge whether or not you will be able to cross an intersection. I would consider myself as still under training, and I still make this mistake sometimes.

Originally Posted by mygodbole

As far as I know, traffic rules dictate that (a) look before you enter an intersection; and (b) enter only if you have a path ahead that will allow you to clear the intersection.

Traffic cameras 'assume/presume' you are aware of the above; thus the violation.

I however side with this.

I walk a lot everyday and cross at least 10 such intersections on a daily average. In my area alone, these fines have lead to a HUGE improvement in my sense of safety as well as availability of the Zebra Crossing to walk on. On intersections where this automated system is not present, I have to wait a few seconds after a red light for traffic to stop, and even then when I walk through, drivers are eager to inch forward.

We must all take care and approach intersections with precaution.

As for the fine, you can pay it at the Virtual Court's website. You do not need to visit. There may be a small extra fine of a couple of 100 bucks. Only when the status says Court, and not Virtual Court, is when the matter needs to be addressed at the Lok Adalat level, where again, as per what I have heard, you just need to pay the fine.

[HTC]

I feel that the exorbitant amount for traffic fines is only serving two purposes. Firstly filling government coffers. They have to give freebies to their vote bank people which they promised during election (a.k.a 'bhagyas' in Kannada). Secondly, it increased the minimum bribe amount. before people used to give 50rs or 100rs bribe and escape. But now, stakes are high. minimum files are around 1000rs and cops will not accept anything below 500rs. All this applicable to well dressed, office going common man. Same cops will turn a blind eye towards traffic violations by lower income group citizens (eg mechs,labourers etc) as they are sure they will not be able to extract money from them and waste their valuable time to serve the country ahem .

Ideally, high fines should serve as deterrants. But what can you do when the infrastructure, technology and the people are not prepared to implement the laws. I have seen traffic cops violating rules blatently. not wearing proper helmet, not wearing helmet properly, using one way to avoid round abouts ( example - at audugodi police quarters gate just before forum signal) and many more. Now where doesn't the law apply to them. Even more, I have seen cars parked at no parking zone even blocking and choking the junction near Jayangar 4th block police station. Looks like some kind of understanding between the cops and hotels around that traffic cops can't notice the violations right outside their station gates. The list goes on.

The free left turn rule is so pathetic. As per them, at only those signals having board saying free-left-turn, one is allowed to take free left turn. But they have not put such boards where all its applicable. also, to add to the confusion, they have boards like 'no-free-left-turn' at select few signals. its all left to their interpretation to put fine or collect bribe. Even the traffic signals do not work as intended. from green, they turn to red directly. It is difficult to take split second decision as to stop or continue as there will be vehicle tailing you.

To add to this, they are installing high quality cameras which will put fine 24/7. there are two such signals on double road between lalbag gate and jayanagr metro station. Even though I had stopped little close but well behing the stop line at that signal, a cop on a two wheeler asked me to move a little back as the camera would still consider me as stading on the stop line due to the angle of camera which is positioned from behind.

In a nut shell, I am all for strict rules provided they are implemented uniformly and after thinking through the realistic scenarios. till then - its clearly a money making tool for men in power. I rest my case

[.sushilkumar]

Originally Posted by PaddleShifter

During moderate to heavy traffic in Delhi-NCR and Chandigarh, I have been in situations where the amber light stayed for very short duration compared to the crawling cars and we failed to clear the intersection.

Happened with me in Noida. The light turned RED from GREEN in a matter of 5 seconds and policeman was just waiting for us. Countered him with short switch time and he refuse to budge in the hope of making quick bucks. To show him, we waited for next green to turn red and voila we were correct. He sheepishly said some issue with light & let us go, waiting for next guy to fall in trap.

This is more of a scam by local police folks for their extra income than anything else.

[The Rationalist]

I was caught for crossing an intersection while it was Amber, it was in 2013. The police officer was very polite and told you are not supposed to go ahead while it is Amber. He didn't issue the challan although I had taken out the wallet, maybe he was surprised that I took out the wallet without arguing and accepted my mistake. From that time onwards I never try to speed past the amber, also there is the risk of the second counting drivers in the other side who move ahead when amber glows or the second timers reaches 2-3 seconds. I don't think it's difficult to escape traffic fines if you are patient enough. Not that I haven't got any other challans, I have got many speeding tickets (this year have already paid ₹3000 for 2 tickets!), Radar bot have saved many times, these two happened when I forgot to turn it on!

[ABHI_1512]

There is a big problem as regards the understanding of the amber light scenarios in our country and hence this problem of stop line violation. Many a times motorists try to jump a amber light scenario without realising that they can't really cross a major intersection without jumping the signal. Worse is when there is no amber light at all.

When one is already past the stop line and the light turns amber, one is supposed to cross the intersection but not many people know that. Someone who knows the rule will go ahead but the one who doesn't, will stop and in turn make the vehicle behind stop as well which is already past the stop line, resulting in a violation. The cameras will obviously trap them. The amber light is supposed to slow you down, the ones ahead of the stop line should go ahead but the ones who are behind the stop line should definitely stop. Most of the motorists are hardly aware of this rule.

In Calcutta, stop line violation is in vogue since many years and hence one will find the traffic maintaining the stop line at most of the major intersections. The presence of cameras have added to the already strict adherence including speed limits.

There is a very good article regarding the understanding of amber lights and which was published in The Telegraph some years back, sharing the link here:
https://www.telegraphindia.com/my-ko...ls/cid/1838016

Originally Posted by HTC

I rest my case

I have some points to make regarding your reply. Quoting them for better readability.

I feel that the exorbitant amount for traffic fines is only serving two purposes. Firstly filling government coffers. They have to give freebies to their vote bank people which they promised during election (a.k.a 'bhagyas' in Kannada)

How is a government spending for their own less privileged citizens makes them giving freebies in a developing country like us ?? At least some empty stomachs are getting filled. Still better than the money wasted on someone's security detail or the money wasted on the perks of a minister or MP !!

All this applicable to well dressed, office going common man. Same cops will turn a blind eye towards traffic violations by lower income group citizens (eg mechs,labourers etc) as they are sure they will not be able to extract money from them and waste their valuable time to serve the country ahem .

Because the well dressed and office going common man is expected to be more educated and knowledgeable about the traffic rules than the laborer or the mechanic !!

The free left turn rule is so pathetic. As per them, at only those signals having board saying free-left-turn, one is allowed to take free left turn. But they have not put such boards where all its applicable. also, to add to the confusion, they have boards like 'no-free-left-turn' at select few signals. its all left to their interpretation to put fine or collect bribe.

It's simple actually and not really pathetic. When the board says- NO FREE LEFT TURN, you are supposed to stop and when it says- FREE LEFT TURN, you take the turn. I don't really see any ambiguity here !! I agree though that whenever possible, free left turn should always be given.

To add to this, they are installing high quality cameras which will put fine 24/7.

The cameras are being put up for a reason. They are being put up so that they can identify rogue vehicles and most often than not, the cameras help bigtime.

[Starwar19]

The fine amount is enormous, and there's no denying the heavy penalty imposed by the government. Whether it's your mistake or you're entirely innocent depends on the situation in which the car was present. I also believe that the amber light provides sufficient time for cars that have already crossed the zebra crossing, but it's us who often drive away impatiently.

On the flip side, the government imposes penalties without mercy. I am willing to pay all fines and adhere to regulations, but its a pity on authorities for irresponsibility to address issues like traffic jams, signal malfunctions, and indifferent policemen standing by during jams, as well as poor road markings and sign boards.

On the Mumbai-Pune expressway, we are fined 2000 for every camera capturing our over-speeding. While I'm willing to pay, who is accountable for the long queues and standstill traffic that lasts for hours? Shouldn't authorities deploy extra personnel for the security, safety, and convenience of passengers? Despite being an expressway, we often find ourselves crawling for at least half an hour during ghat intersections, not to mention the hefty tolls we pay.
If they have complete authority and charge to fine us mercilessly for our mistakes, we should have a proper easy and quick way to fine the authorities as well. (Impossible dream to have!)

[kaushalswarup]

Interesting thread.

I’ve had a few instances like this, but have been able to deal with cops to get them to understand.

I remember this one incident at Shoolay circle / Vellara Junction in Bangalore, where I had about 6 seconds on the timer while it was green. More than ample time to cross the junction. But, it turned amber at 4 seconds, rather than after the countdown was over. I’d still crossed the line while green and completed crossing the intersection while amber, but the cops were present to flag me down. Upon discussing with them, they agreed that this junction is different from the typical practice of having amber come on after the timer countdown is fully complete. One of the cops still tried to pull a fast one, by entering a random reg. number on his device and showing me the fines saying it’s linked to my car. Funnily enough, the fines were from 2018/19 while my car was bought and registered in 2021. I laughed at him, and then with him, and went on my way.


I agree with the general opinion of the other BHPians, that we should proceed only if there’s a clear path to go through the intersection while green. If there’s no clear path, better to stop before the line. What will help here, is to have countdown timers that actually work. This would help us gauge the available time to completely move past the intersection.

[sukarsan]

I have generally had positive experiences in Delhi. However, I have encountered situations where I was stopped by traffic police on three separate occasions. Each time, it was for a minor infraction that might typically go unnoticed in other cities.

The traffic police in Delhi are surprisingly vigilant, catching drivers off guard, such as on weekend mornings at a T junction where the traffic signal seems unnecessary even in broad daylight. These experiences have heightened my awareness, prompting me to strictly adhere to all traffic rules. Despite driving an out-of-state vehicle, I have managed to avoid any fines by maintaining a heightened sense of awareness.

[Nav-i-gator]

I was once fined for crossing the line while stopping in Gurgaon (under IFFCO chowk metro station). I would have easily crossed the intersection before light turning yellow but had to brake hard to avoid a cyclist coming from left side in front of me and taking a right turn. By the time I managed to stop, front tires were just ahead of stop line and signal turned yellow, and then red.

Nonetheless, the photo attached on the e-challan shows the cyclist as well. I raised a dispute (there is a link on the e-challan web page to do that), just to try my luck as I don't think I was on fault. It was rejected with another wide angle photo attached. I disputed that too, and didn't pay. few months later when I was selling my car, I thought of paying the challan first and checked the website again. The challan was no longer there!

The dealer who bought the car also checked and told me all is ok, there are no pending traffic violations to pay.

[subuiyer]

Several years ago I had missed the parking timeline by 4 mins and my car was towed out.
Ended up paying $120 for cabs and $220 at the impound. No questions entertained. Only question I asked was if they accepted foreign cards. One can imagine what the amt converted to rupees did to my psyche.

Unfortunately, the state of law enforcement and law abidement will continue to remain absymal in this country. As a people we are lacking the mindset and discipline needed for things to work like above example. Maybe the huge diversity/ inequality is also a factor.