[furyrider]

Originally Posted by mk600

The only thing that strikes a bit odd is why Mahindra decided to go for a crash testing in AUS on Scorpio-N knowing fully well it would be abysmal without AEB/ADAS.

From what I read online, Australian NCAP selected the vehicles. Mahindra did not sponsor the test.

[revsperminute]

Safety is all the more important in cars of this segment as most consumers buy these hulking big SUVs to drive on the highways on long trips. Comparing two cars with similar construction, it’s baffling to see just how much of a difference there is. Attaching the ANCAP reports of the Fortuner and the ScorpioN for reference.

Also, a huge reason a general consumer prefers going with an Indian manufacturer such as Tata or Mahindra is due to the safety component built into their cars. I don’t see the point of buying these niggle-ridden unreliable cars over a Maruti or Hyundai if they start compromising on the quality of their safety equipment. This is just plain shoddy.


ScorpioN ANCAP.pdf

Fortuner ANCAP.pdf

[MotoDrive]

Now how do we look at the Jimmy sold in Australia which had scored 3 Stars in ANACP? can we assume Jimmy is better than Scorpio N in terms of Safety? Will the one sold in India (5Door) is safer?

[bobbyblr]

Originally Posted by MotoDrive

Now how do we look at the Jimmy sold in Australia which had scored 3 Stars in ANACP? can we assume Jimmy is better than Scorpio N in terms of Safety? Will the one sold in India (5Door) is safer?

The 2018-2019 3-Door Suzuki Jimny in Australia is already having the following safety features:

• Autonomous emergency braking
• Lane departure warning
• Weaving alert
• High beam assist

Also see below images and videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkiKID-zZM4

[rosh_aveo1.4]

If GNCAP's 5 star rating equals 0 for ANCAP (and for 'all' versions), makes you think of the Tata cars and how we bought them with confidence on the safety front (this includes me). Wonder what would Mahindra say on this finding.

[arnav17]

Originally Posted by viper33

My biggest fear is unlocked. If GNCAP's 5-star scored Scorpio-N is rated for 0 stars in ANCAP with 44 points for adult protection, what will happen to the 3-star scored Ertiga, Carens etc?

I agree. Does this also mean that we can no longer go by GNCAP ratings? Considering the new Safari/Harrier facelifts, can we trust the GNCAP rating just because we have seen other tata cars hold up well in accidents?

[turbowhistle]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

I recently used a car with active safety aids and honestly I wasn’t too pleased at the excessive ‘nannying’ that I experienced with it.
But then, I suppose these aids are meant for the largest cross section of drivers with the least number of driving skills.

They can be very handy in first world country where driving is not an adventure sport like India and you can predict how the traffic is flowing. Even for best drivers, it helps a lot reduce the general fatigue.

But the whole suite has a relatively minor learning curve and you need to let go of the initial apprehension and trust the car. My Cooper S was relatively barebones and raw so when bought my next car with ADAS, I had same views as you in the first month and used to turn if off at every chance I had. On a 2000km cross country drive, I realised how much of a boon it was and how it made me a more aware driver as the car caught things before I could react. My current car doesn't have the full suite and I end up missing it on really long drives.
It's simply new tech we have to trust and accept slowly, nothing else.


Nothing against Mahindra here, but it's a good thing for them I would say. They already have the tech and can easily retrofit into the export cars if they still want to sell in Australasia region.

[vjbox]

Leaving the technicalities of GNCAP, ANCAP or WhateverNCAP aside, these crash test videos of the Scorpio N doest look good from what we see. The passengers seem a lot more vulnerable which doesnt inspired confidence. Somehow people end up falling for the butch looks and give full marks to these vehicles with an imaginary parameter called "Road Presence". I dont think "Road Presence" of a vehicle would save anyone but its solid build quality followed by the electronic safety aids. Curious to see Mahindras comment on this.

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by rosh_aveo1.4

If GNCAP's 5 star rating equals 0 for ANCAP (and for 'all' versions), makes you think of the Tata cars and how we bought them with confidence on the safety front (this includes me). Wonder what would Mahindra say on this finding.

Now imagine scores for 0 star GNCAP Maruti cars, better buy a 0 star Tata then a -5 Maruti for safety point of view .

[vishnurp99]

Can we forget about the ratings for a bit and look at the actual test reports for GNCAP & ANCAP?. From a first quick look, the results across both these tests are actually similar.

The key difference in actual ratings are because of reasons :

1. Essentially the maxiumum 8.00 point penalty was applied since Scorpio would cause more damage to the passengers of an oncoming vehicle.
2. Scorpio doesn't have features like lane departure warning, autonomous emergency braking which are given weightage in the ANCAP.
3. The test assesses the chances of whiplash injuries for rear passenger and also the level of seat belt loading for rear passenger. Since scorpio is a heavy car with a lot of forward momentum, without specific adjustments it will be difficult to pass this test.

So if you are an Indian owner who has the car, nothing to worry about. The above points are not really that relevant in India.

if you are in one of the western countries like me, I guess scorpio is worth it if you are short of money. I have seen some reviews compare this car favorably to much more expensive cars.

[harikrishnansp]

Originally Posted by enj0y_ride

Again, here it goes, the debate on how reliable GNCAP is and how they test these brand new vehicles ( not available with dealers ) when their policy is to buy directly from dealers. There was some conspiracy theory a while back on GNCAP trying to help OEMs ( Bosch, Takata etc ) penetrate Asian and African markets.

GNCAP has acted more like a marketing agency for some OEMs in the recent past.

[aryangh21]

Originally Posted by Tgo

Speculation: Did Stellantis secretly fund the purchase of those 6 cars?

I know right? If Mahindra didn't sponsor the test then why did ancap select the scorpio n for testing which they knew would do poorly because of the absence of ADAS. They could have chosen the xuv700 instead.

[Ph03nix]

Mahindra had called in a lot of Australia's YouTube reviewers over to their SUV proving grounds. I see a flood of YouTube videos about the Scorpio-N and Thar over the last two months or so.

The Scorpio-N undercuts the other 4X4 by quite a margin in terms of price. Could this be lobbying by existing players here as they are feeling a bit hot under the collar. The Scorpio-N pickup is forecast to do quite well. And this market is very price sensitive here.

[hdus001]

Originally Posted by aryangh21

I know right? If Mahindra didn't sponsor the test then why did ancap select the scorpio n for testing which they knew would do poorly because of the absence of ADAS. They could have chosen the xuv700 instead.

I think OP's first post has the answer to this, it looks like it was intentionally chosen in the interest of encouraging manufacturers to up their game, with the end goal of improving the accident fatality numbers:

ANCAP has observed a small number of new models entering the market with a safety specification lower than that currently expected by Australian consumers, and these models are a focus for ANCAP.
It is ANCAP’s role to encourage the highest levels of safety.
Pleasingly, the vast majority of vehicle brands continue to offer their customers high and improving levels of safety as new models and facelifts are introduced.
Unfortunately the number of lives lost on Australia’s roads continues to grow, with the most recent figures showing a 19.6 per cent increase in the number of road fatalities compared with the average over the previous five years.
It is important that vehicle manufacturers continue to prioritise the safety of their customers.

Whilst initially not a fan, I've come to love the ADAS and other active safety features like Lane Keep Assist, lane departure warning, adaptive cruise, blind-spot monitors, cross-traffic alerts, autonomous emergency braking, display of speed limits, etc. It takes a bit of time getting used to, but I think they genuinely improve safety, for ourselves and for others on the road. These are preventative measures to avoid accidents in the first place as opposed to airbags/crash protection etc that come into play once an accident occurs. It's great that ANCAP is giving good weightage to this.

[shancz]

Without going into the whole funding business here are some points I can list out reading through the posts :

• There is only one way to reduce the confusion which a lot of us seem to have, which is to read the protocols and the crash report. If we want to see what do the ANCAP vs EUNCAP vs GNCAP ratings mean, we'll have to do so for all of them. That's a lot of reading and understanding but there is no esy way around this
  Hence my immense respect to ron178 for actually doing that.
  At the minimum we'll have to read the crash test reports in detail(the pdf) and then compare it to other NCAPS to see the differences.
  
• For folks wondering if GNCAP(under the #safercarsforindia) was sub-standard to ANCAP all I can say is those are different protocols for different countries/markets based on prevailing conditions, purchasing power etc.
  If one really wants to get the "safest" car out there, please get the one which has 5 stars in Euro-NCAP and a TSP+ in IIHS crash tests, if that's available as they are the most advanced when it comes to crash test and ratings and the rest NCAPs aim to match up to them. Like ANCAP aligned itself with Euro-NCAP in 2018-19. But do note that they're targeted at US/Euro/AUS/NZ markets and driving conditions so the related realities and overheads will apply.

But what we should be but aren't discussing is :
- The things that existed but didn't perform as expected like the seats with showed poor whiplash protection or the seatbelt that got unlatched during the side impact test rather than stuff that wasn't available like ADAS systems.
- The things that we can learn from them like the checking whether the vehicle doors and windows were operable for a minimum time when submerged in water or the awarding of points on how safe the is vehicle to occupants of other vehicle and I quote from the report:

The front structure of the Mahindra Scorpio presented a high risk to occupants of an oncoming vehicle in the MPDB
test (which evaluates vehicle-to-vehicle compatibility), and the maximum 8.00 point penalty was applied.