[CArspeed]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

SS_36,
Thank you for this suggestion. Welcome to Team BHP where any suggestion to do with speed, smaller engines will be met with derision as you can see from the first few responses.
These views are likely going to be deeply unpopular on Team BHP.
Peace.

I 100% second this.

According to me enthusiastic driving is loving to drive under any circumstances and not driving beyond the speed limits at all. If some bus goes at 115 KPMH, wait for the bus to slow down somewhere and before he picks up speed you can safely overtake him within the prescribed speed limit. Safety to passengers and others on the road is the most important than anything else.

[MT_Hyderabad]

Originally Posted by SS_36

Given the following:
1. Poor self-control of speeds by drivers of India
2. Little to no speed enforcement on highways
3. Large % of accidents on highways linked to speeding

Although, I agree to your intention, but the suggestion will soon become outdated.

With GPS enabled fastags on the way, I will encourage the authorities to set up a fine cum ban mechanism when someone crosses 120 km/hr. First few offences by the speeding car is fined. After that, the car registration is terminated. Driving license cancellation etc can also be included.

Point 2 is not entirely true. Many highways have speed guns now and the corrupt police party attending to it wants you to drive faster!

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

And then what happens when you want to overtake a speeding bus travelling at 115? Go at 120 and spend more time in the process of a risky overtake?

This is the biggest challenge I see Indians face.
They want to overtake everything and are not ready to follow anyone.

Respected Sir, if the bus is doing 115 km/hr (on a road where 120 km/h is allowed), you stay back and keep driving at 110 to 115 km/ hr. Is it a slow speed?
I would love to follow such a bus at a distance. It slows down, I slow down, it spots and moves over a speed breaker, I move over a speed breaker much more comfortably.
If someone in a hurry occupies the space I kept in between, I slow down a little, this person than overtakes the bus (remember he is having the same genes when he overtook you few seconds before, he will do it again :-))

Few days back I shared my daschcam video. The bus was at a respectable speed for the narrow road on which it was, but still the lady wanted to overtake it!

https://youtu.be/tITQ7M19Yrc

[revsperminute]

Originally Posted by AYP

I completely agree with this. But then, I am reminded of the poor law abiding taxi/commercial car drivers who have a 80kmph speed limit. Don't they fear of such a situation? What's worse is that the government didn't think of this factor when dictating a speed limit of 80kmph for these folks. Having a speed limiter is definitely not the solution.

Exactly! 80 kph is definitely too low for cabs, especially those that are well maintained and ply on our highways. However, some old WagonR Uber cabs have had me clutching my grab handles going 40 kph. Hence, defeating the whole purpose of a speed limiter. What really needs attention is our process of obtaining a licence, road infrastructure, enforcement of road laws (not just parking tickets and speeding challans).

The only sector where the limiter is understandable is for heavy vehicles because of their dynamics.

[Gansan]

Why allow sales of cars and bikes capable of 250+ kph speeds at all? Impose a speed limit on them electronically or make them street illegal. Let the owners take them to the track and have their adrenaline rush. If they lack self restraint that is the only way. Many a time I have felt angry at the manner some cars overtake me on the highway while I myself am doing 90-95 kph. Which itself is slightly above the speed limit of all toll highways in TN. The way they disappear from my sight, they must be doing at least 150 if not more. They leave me standing. Why should they be allowed to endanger me and my family?

I too encounter vehicles moving slower than me. I take a little time and pass them patiently. They can't be barred from the toll highways, especially when the only option connecting the towns from Chennai to Kanyakumari is a toll road. What other route can they take? Do they have a non toll road option? Many of them are two wheelers exempt from tolls. Because most of them are aam aadmi who can't afford to pay tolls. Already a lifetime road tax has been collected from them. The government can't bar them from toll roads. It will cost them the next election.

I understand in the west there will be both a toll road as well as a non toll road to go from one town to another. There the slower vehicles have an option. But here?

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by CArspeed

According to me enthusiastic driving is loving to drive under any circumstances and not driving beyond the speed limits at all. If some bus goes at 115 KPMH, wait for the bus to slow down somewhere and before he picks up speed you can safely overtake him within the prescribed speed limit. Safety to passengers and others on the road is the most important than anything else

Originally Posted by MT_Hyderabad

This is the biggest challenge I see Indians face.
They want to overtake everything and are not ready to follow anyone.
Respected Sir, if the bus is doing 115 km/hr (on a road where 120 km/h is allowed), you stay back and keep driving at 110 to 115 km/ hr. Is it a slow speed?

Thank you for saying it aloud even if at the risk of getting booed by the speed brigade. I for the life of me would not want to overtake someone charging at 115 kmph. Whatever for? We Indians, far too many of us, get driven by some switch in our minds and habits that possess us that come what may we must overtake.

Originally Posted by revsperminute

Exactly! 80 kph is definitely too low for cabs, especially those that are well maintained and ply on our highways.

In my now almost four and a half decades of driving I have rarely needed to drive at over 80 kmph to reach my destination on time. Driving at 120 kmph is not needed in inter-city travel to get to the other end on time. What is needed is two ounces of planning not speeding.

Originally Posted by Gansan

Why allow sales of cars and bikes capable of 250+ kph speeds at all? Impose a speed limit on them electronically or make them street illegal. Let the owners take them to the track and have their adrenaline rush. If they lack self restraint that is the only way.

+1 A road is a public asset much like electric supply or water supply. It is not there for entertainment, adrenaline rushes or showing off.

Originally Posted by revsperminute

What if you’re being chased by some mafia corporation and the only way to escape with your life is to go 200kph through the dark of the night? I feel this question is as unrealistic as the scenario I just came up with.

You may need more than speed to save yourself from a mafia, Brother.:-)

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by SS_36

Given the following:
1. Poor self-control of speeds by drivers of India
2. Little to no speed enforcement on highways
3. Large % of accidents on highways linked to speeding
4. Highest speed limit anywhere in the country is 120 kmph
5. We don't have Autobahns like in Germany
6. Cars have advanced ECUs today
.

What I find the most absurd is trying to solve issues with people and their mindset by creating solutions in highly engineered automobiles. This shows a very narrow minded thinking where we always want to restrict freedom thinking that it will solve a problem of a bigger magnitude. In today's highways thanks to the infra development that has happened in the last decade, 120kmph is also not a big deal. Likewise, even with this 120kmph limit, lives can still be easily lost inside the car and outside it in the hands of a poor driver. The only workable speed where fatalities won't happen both inside the cabin and outside is 30kmph, which is the speed limit in western countries inside urban populated living areas.

This whole idea about having fun while accelerating will be washed out when you suddenly reach that speed limit and that feels like hitting a wall. No other developed country would think of such stupid ideas and the closest is how Volvo limits some cars to 180kmph, which is far higher than the recommended top speed in most countries.

So we as a developing country should focus on what's different elsewhere and then work towards sorting them out, instead of thinking of ideas to just restrict ourselves in the illusion of being safer. One should understand the limits of the car, the limits of the surroundings and also one's own state of mind and experience to determine what they should do in terms of driving fast. It won't be the same everywhere. Otherwise it's comparable to always staying home to prevent getting robbed on the road, not driving to prevent accidents and so on.

Originally Posted by Gansan

Why allow sales of cars and bikes capable of 250+ kph speeds at all? Impose a speed limit on them electronically or make them street illegal. Let the owners take them to the track and have their adrenaline rush. If they lack self restraint that is the only way. Many a time I have felt angry at the manner some cars overtake me on the highway while I myself am doing 90-95 kph.

I understand in the west there will be both a toll road as well as a non toll road to go from one town to another. There the slower vehicles have an option. But here?

That's not always the case. At least in Europe, the non tolled road will not be preferred even by trucks or buses which are the slowest on the highway at 100kmph. Its just that in those countries drivers are trained better, they have a better driving sense and etiquette and the slower vehicles voluntarily make way for faster vehicles and that's it. Issues like lacking self restraint, rash driving etc need a different way of tackling than imposing limits on vehicles.

I guess it's only in our country that having a fast car or bike is considered as a crime and everyone wants to blame that for roads being unsafe.

[Sankar]

120KpH is way too high, its too much for us because we aren't tested at 120KPH during license tests. I would suggest a ECU coded speed limit of 64KM/H on all cars because they (GNCAP) don't crash test them at higher speeds. License tests also happen at city speeds so no one knows the drivers skill at 120KM/H.

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Anyone noticed this very old thread (Abu Dhabi: Speed limit increased to promote safety!)?

I'd suggest a uniform top speed of 50 kmph for all vehicles in India, irrespective of urban roads or highways; the death rate due to road traffic accidents with fall drastically, and as an aside, it will teach our citizens the virtues of immense patience. Of course, for demonstration purposes relating to how fantastic our new highways are, concerned dignitaries will be permitted to drive at 170 kmph and more.

Yes, I agree. But I would suggest 32KM/H soft limit with irritating beeps and chimes and an upper 50Km/H or 64KM/H ECU hard coded limit. The world is moving too fast for comfort, a little slower would do everyone a bit of good.

[V.Narayan]

Dear @audioholic, permit me to differ.

Originally Posted by audioholic

What I find the most absurd is trying to solve issues with people and their mindset by creating solutions in highly engineered automobiles.

This whole idea about having fun while accelerating will be washed out when you suddenly reach that speed limit and that feels like hitting a wall.

What I find absurd is well educated people like us thinking the public road, created for all, is for our speed thrills and driving revving. It is not. It is there for all segments of society and economy to use from big cars to all forms of motorized and non-motorized. The non-motorized and the economically weaker sections have an equal right as us to use that road. On Team BHP, over dominated as we are with well paid young upcoming professionals, there is an unspoken assumption that first rights on a road belong to the car owner. That is not so.

No other developed country would think of such stupid ideas and the closest is how Volvo limits some cars to 180kmph, which is far higher than the recommended top speed in most countries.

Nothing stupid about the idea just because someone disagrees with it. As it is in parts, as I have written on other threads, we at Team BHP are at risk of becoming an echo chamber. Our needs, our problems, our history of road transport are dramatically different from Europe and USA. Their solutions cannot apply here. We all understand that the factors needed for improving our road safety extend way beyond just speed but that does not mean we should not have ECU implemented speed limits for all motorized vehicles.

[amartya_bhp]

I think that we should not allow the Govt to micromanage our lives - all of us becoming droids in the process. What we should stive for and push the govt to do is probably the following:

1. Educate the people of India so that we learn the etiquettes of the road, bring this road and traffic safety into the main curriculum so that everyone is aware of this (including pedestrians)
2. We, as Indians, should learn to value our lives and not take chances - it is much better to take a U-turn 100m away than travel on the wrong side of the road
3. Weed out corruption and fine defaulters heavily - I have seen the same Indians outside following all rules and when in India, they don't bother and just want to get the job done.

We should embrace and cherish our freedom and learn to use it the proper way. As they say: With Great Power comes Great Responsibility.

[d-g-p]

Emergency situation for some mafia chasing us ? So we need more than 120 km per hour speed ? I guess if Mafia do not get us in that race, one accident might ! And by the same logic we all deserve Gun license like in USA.
Can we drive to a Hospital with a Patient at more than 120 km per hour? Most patient's would not tolerate that speed and we also risk a road accident in the process.

120 km per hour is a lot for any road other than a race track in India. For any effort from Govt to reduce road traffic accident all suggestion needs to be welcomed. The one O P suggested here is one.
The house would be divided in this suggestion for sure

[clevermax]

Originally Posted by SS_36

Then why allow car manufacturers to make and sell cars that can go faster than 120 kmph? Can the Govt. not mandate ECU controlled speed limit of 120 kmph on all new cars?

IMO, this is an 'unenthusiastic' view on an enthusiast's forum

In a 3x3 expressway, 120kmph is not too high a speed. So I will not buy a car that's limited to 120kmph, or I'll buy such a car and avail the service of someone like Wolf to unlock it in the car software.

Do all accidents happen post 120kmph?

[Hayek]

We certainly DON’T want more such ideas to be given to the control freaks who run our government. The fact is that safe speeds vary a lot depending on the type of road and the vehicle you are driving. And one size fit all limits using technology that violates the right of drivers to choose is the worst of these ideas.

There is of course a lot we can do to make our highways safer.

The first step that we should take is that all vehicles on highways are “highway-worthy” - capable of traveling safely at 80 kmph (a bare minimum highway speed limit, which is used as the limit when road works are on in German autobahns), and stopping within a reasonable distance from such speeds. This of course includes banning three wheelers and underpowered four wheelers with auto rickshaw engines from highways.

Two ensure that lane discipline is followed - slow vehicles stick to the slow lane, and leave the passing lane free for faster vehicles.

Three, ensure that highways have proper road markings - with proper lane marking, speed limit signs that make sense (as opposed to 60/80/100 signs within meters of each other)

Four, enforce wearing seat belts.

All of this will reduce the number of accidents and serious injuries when accidents take place . It’s very easy for our semi literate cops to blame speeding for al accidents. The fact is that a Camry driving at 150 kmph on the Mumbai Pune expressway is far less risky than a badly loaded Ace driving at 60 kmph

[Bhargav7]

Originally Posted by CArspeed

If some bus goes at 115 KPMH, wait for the bus to slow down somewhere and before he picks up speed you can safely overtake him within the prescribed speed limit. Safety to passengers and others on the road is the most important than anything else.

As someone who rarely drives above 100, the need to overtake a bus going at 115 is beyond my comprehension. Excluding a handful of expressways, those speeds are not possible or legal on Indian roads.

As some BHPians pointed out, this will be a minority opinion on this forum. But again, I was mocked for many years by friends regarding seat belts, defensive driving, etc - so I am immune to criticism on my driving style.

[Gansan]

Originally Posted by audioholic

I guess it's only in our country that having a fast car or bike is considered as a crime and everyone wants to blame that for roads being unsafe.

Having a high powered and expensive vehicle is not a crime. It is a question of affordabiity, and everyone is aspirational by nature. That is not wrong. What is wrong is intimidating other road users with it. And trying to test it's capabilities on public roads, feeling angry and impatient when road conditions don't permit it. That is wrong.

But for that, "high powered and fast" is just relative. For a TVS 50 rider going calmly through a residential street, me zipping past at high speed in my Alto will appear arrogant! Time and place is what counts, and considering slower movers as a hindrance and being inconsiderate to them. That is what is wrong.

As for the highways and speed ways in the west, I understand apart from a speed limit, there is also a certain minimum speed which must be maintaned else the offending vehicle will be penalized. In our country there is a speed limit, and going even double that is rarely punished. But to my knowledge there is no specified minimum speed which is punishable. As long as I don't exceed the speed limit, I am good to go.

Speeds of 90-95 can hardly be called slow in our roads. While doing that I am already above the speed limit, though not by much. That is really enough to reach anywhere in time without tension. If I find a car or bus ahead of me doing slightly lower speeds, say 85 or 90, I just adjust my speed and keep them as my pilot vehicle! I don't pass them till they really slow down. And feel totally relaxed.

In various threads about various vehicles even in TBHP, note how many are gloating about "road presence" of said vehicle. What road presence, unless it means the vehicle ahead should become scared of them and immediately give way!

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Dear @audioholic, permit me to differ. What I find absurd is well educated people like us thinking the public road, created for all, is for our speed thrills and driving revving. It is not. It is there for all segments of society and economy to use from big cars to all forms of motorized and non-motorized. The non-motorized and the economically weaker sections have an equal right as us to use that road. On Team BHP, over dominated as we are with well paid young upcoming professionals, there is an unspoken assumption that first rights on a road belong to the car owner. .

Sorry sir, this view of yours is completely right, just that it doesn't warrant some arbitrary figure like 120kmph limit to be forced in a production vehicle. Thats because it isn't going to solve the problem of well educated people experiencing speed thrills in the middle of a road where an economically weaker person is walking to work. This person can be endangered even when the car hits him at 40kmph. So once we realise that the 120kmph limit isn't working, we will debate about a 40kmph limit. Thats why I call the idea absurd. Billions of money goes into automotive safety research and to improve safety of passengers as well as vulnerable road users and if a simple idea like a forced speed limit could solve such problems, the world would be totally different by now wouldn't it?

Issue is when we try to use the necessity itself as a tool to justify a solution. They both are separate. While I can understand the necessity, the solution is far from being an actual solution.

Originally Posted by Gansan

What is wrong is intimidating other road users with it. And trying to test it's capabilities on public roads, feeling angry and impatient when road conditions don't permit it. That is wrong.

But for that, "high powered and fast" is just relative. For a TVS 50 rider going calmly through a residential street, me zipping past at high speed in my Alto will appear arrogant! Time and place is what counts, and considering slower movers as a hindrance and being inconsiderate to them. That is what is wrong.

So isn't that proof enough to say that having a fixed speed would not solve all the issues you mentioned? If you are comfortable driving at 90, you will still find that person at 120 to be rash and arrogant. And like you say if road conditions don't permit, even 120 will be very high a speed. Thats all I'm trying to explain. Speed is a mathematical statistic. We can't set hard limits on what is safe and what isn't. There can only be relative conclusions. 120 is relatively dangerous compared to 80, compared to 40. Safest is 0 only until another vehicle at 120 runs into us. And this was what we decided to be a solution to road users being harmed

I don't know if I'm capable enough to debate further.