[avira_tk]

Originally Posted by CCRider

Disappointed to see the quality of discourse dropping to Twitter levels what with trolling and mocking the OP for asking what is a very valid question/suggestion - If the max speed limit across the country is 120 KMPH and there exists technology to limit it why not enforce it

- Finally if you can maintain an average speed of 80 kmph, you can cover around 650-700 KM in a full day of driving (10-11 hours) including breaks. That's a pretty good distance to cover in a day which would get most people to their destination (looking at the average distances between different cities across India).

But on the whole I believe it will make the roads safer.

The OP standard is below twitter levels, just clickbait and didn't bother to respond to any of the comments on this thread. Members are right to question the delusional take, it's all over the place - poor self control of Indians to the autobahn, luckily there was no reference to Bollywood. The idea of making cars that are limited to 120kmph means the entire industry will drop quality standards, German cars are built for the Autobahn and it shows.

I have done a Bangalore - Cochin trip without exceeding 80kmph, the average was about 55kmph, so a total driving time of 10 hours. Tiring and it got really late by the time I reached, total time taken was about 14 hours.

80kmph is the speed limit, you can't multiply that by 10 and say you'll cover 800kms in a day because you can drive for 10 hours. The average speed you achieve will be about 70% of the speed limit provided it's a clear run. There was a 170 km stretch of road where I have averaged 85kmph circa 2012, today, you can barely keep the cruise control at 95kmph for more than 5 minutes on the same stretch.

Achieving an 80kmph average run will need speeds in excess of 120kmph on highways if the roads are deserted , access restricted expressways will allow for better average speed even if the limit is capped at 100kmph.

[tilt]

[quote=CCRider;5457028]*SNIP*
- Data shows Clearly that "Speed Kills"

The following documents
2020 Accident Stats
2019 Accident stats from the "Ministry of Road Transport" have very detailed statistics and analysis on yearly accidents. *SNIP*

- Finally if you can maintain an average speed of 80 kmph, you can cover around 650-700 KM in a full day of driving (10-11 hours) including breaks. *SNIP*/quote]

1. I question the method of collection of said data. If the cop take the easiest way out of doing any genuine investigative work and just writes down "overspeeding, that gets recorded as gospel truth and contributes to "data".

2. Do you have any idea as to what speeds one would actually have to drive at to achieve an "average speed" of 80 kph? Try it out for yourself on any of your long drives.

Cheers

[vedirah]

Originally Posted by SS_36

Then why allow car manufacturers to make and sell cars that can go faster than 120 kmph? Can the Govt. not mandate ECU controlled speed limit of 120 kmph on all new cars?

I agree, but this is crude. What happens when we build highways that are designed for more than 120 kmph?

A better approach would be through toll gates. If toll gates could wirelessly communicate to the car's ECU and let it know that for this stretch of the road the maximum speed is X kmph. That would remove the need for speed cameras. Of course emergency vehicles like ambulances should be able to get an exception.

I agree with other BHPians who say that speed is not the sole reason for accidents, moronic drivers are. But we have to consider that a moronic driver at 120 kmph is more dangerous than one at 50 kmph. Fatality in accidents is correlated with speed. Speed does kill, like it or not.

On a humorous note: I see that many people on the road just want to overtake. That's a very weird obsession. They'll speed up just to overtake another vehicle, even though said vehicle might be at the same speed as them. Seen this so many times that now whenever I see this I proclaim in my mind, 'look! One more possessed by the 'overtake pisaasu' (overtake ghost)!'

[CarNerd]

Originally Posted by clevermax

There are so many basic issues that needs to be addressed first. Limiting all cars' ECU to 120kmph may be reducing the accident rates by what, 0.001%? Whereas proper enforcement of helmets and seat belts will have a huge impact on the reduction of deaths/injuries from road accidents.

This is how I see the idea proposed in this thread:

Attachment 2389453

Nice graphic but how exactly did you come up with the order of steps? Why do you think that limiting speed should be done only after other issues like seat belts, helmets, etc? Why can't they be done simultaneously? In an examination, will you answer the 1 mark questions first or go directly to 10/15/20 mark questions?

As I see it, ECU restricted speed is easier to implement than seat belts, helmets, DLs, etc as it's the job of car manufacturers to tweak the codes. Once such a law is passed, the authorities can move on to other issues.

Originally Posted by tilt

Please do go through a study that I posted earlier that has a different outcome.

Could you please summarise the findings of that study?

I wasn't saying that earlier, but now that you suggest it, I do think it is a very good idea.

So what exactly were you saying earlier?

[clevermax]

Originally Posted by CarNerd

Nice graphic but how exactly did you come up with the order of steps?

The order of steps is pretty simple - basic hygiene first, and then the million-dollar ideas that could possibly have a minute impact.

Originally Posted by CarNerd

Why do you think that limiting speed should be done only after other issues like seat belts, helmets, etc? Why can't they be done simultaneously? In an examination, will you answer the 1 mark questions first or go directly to 10/15/20 mark questions?

This cannot be compared to the order in which you'll answer the questions in an exam.

It is only logical to address those points first, that will have the highest impact on the reduction of accidents and deaths.

Capping the max speed of cars to 120kmph will have a very low impact on the reduction of road accidents. If you don't believe me, check out the 'Accidents in India' thread in this forum.

Capping the max speed of cars to 120kmph is a very oppressive and illogical solution to an illogical problem, as stated by venkyhere in this thread.

"Let him who is without sin cast the first stone." - Holy Bible
Who doesn't enjoy speed? I do enjoy it. Capping my ability to go beyond 120kmph on a safe stretch of highway is totally unacceptable for me. I've legally done 220kmph on the German Autobahn. I could have gone beyond that if the car allowed. As I stated earlier in this thread, if all cars came with a speed cap of 120kmph, I will not mind paying up someone - who knows what he's doing - to unlock the speed cap for me. Even if costs a sizeable portion of the cost I coughed up for the new car. To summarize, I am an automobile enthusiast from the times I could remember.

When I was young, I used to think everyone is an automobile enthusiast. Because, why not? How can anyone not like the car? How can anyone not like the thrill of driving, the thrill of speed?

Now I've come to the realization that only a micro minority of people are actually auto enthusiasts. This holds good for members of any auto-forum too.

I may have my own subjective definition of 'auto enthusiast'. Everyone probably has theirs too. It will be a futile exercise to impose views.

[PatchyBoy]

I had no intention of participating in this thread, till I stumbled across this. Leaving it here for people to ponder

[GrammarNazi]

IMO Speed isn't a lone factor for accidents, it's the combined effect of poor braking, poor/immature vehicle handling, poor overall condition of vehicle & most of all - poor road design.

All these factors need to be worked upon, else you're just stifling the most relevant part of the whole scenario, the car owner. And when that happens, car usage will plummet & large sections of people would be forced to shift to Railways & Air travel.

I'm sure Govt realises this, and that is partly why they're building superior expressways. The warning sounds upto 120kmph are an advisory that the vehicle is over speeding, and people need to learn to understand this advisory based on their vehicle & the driving conditions.

Ofcourse, limiting speed to 120kmph will have some positive effects, but that's not the way to correct the entire issue. It'd be like saying that demonetisation of 85% of circulating currency will eradicate black money & stop corruption. It won't.

Apart from all this, there will be those "chosen ones" who will get to unfairly drive their cars at higher speeds. It'll only work to the detriment of the honest common citizens.

[giri1.8]

Originally Posted by avira_tk

Achieving an 80kmph average run will need speeds in excess of 120kmph on highways if the roads are deserted , access restricted expressways will allow for better average speed even if the limit is capped at 100kmph.

Keeping the topic of average speed in mind, heavy vehicles are limited to 80km/hr for safety reasons, but ave seen few bus drivers trying to keep the speed close 80 all the time! They are trying to maintain high average speed by driving pedal to metal all the time, even while passing towns on the highway.

[venkyhere]

I can't believe this thread has gone to 11 pages !!
Take a step back and "actually think" about the notion of ECU locking a vehicle to 120 kph. If that's done, right from an entry level car to a super/hyper car will have the same top speed, where is the incentive to aspire for 'more performance' ? Anyway a human being has basic needs like food, shelter, clothing - let's go back to U.S.S.R style socialism - any work anyone does, it's the same salary, same ration of food and same sized house/quarter to live in. Why not ? it's the same logic.

Does anyone really think OP is the first person to think of this, anywhere in the world ? Why hasn't this happened to any 'non-public-transport' vehicle anywhere in the world ?
Developed countries with access controlled highways with strictly enforced speed limits, are prime candidates for ECU speed lock. Why hasn't it been done ? Why-o-why ? Is TBHP the smartest resource on the planet entrusted to come up with the answer ?

There has to be a reason, right ? A human reason. A matter of freedom of choice, a matter of the concept of 'ownership' , a matter of litigation.

What next, are we going to see a team-BHP thread asking for a law to deny entry to fat people in restaurants, as part of 'world health program' ?

[keroo1099]

I would love to hear what the mods think about this thread.

Or maybe just take a poll?

[clevermax]

Originally Posted by venkyhere

What next, are we going to see a team-BHP thread asking for a law to deny entry to fat people in restaurants, as part of 'world health program' ?

Before that, I have an idea to improvise on the suggestion put forward in this thread.

Almost every road in India is mapped. Why not have a database of speed limits for every segment of the road? Why not have a better system than a blind cap at 120kmph?

This is how it can be done:

1) Sense the location of the vehicle & detect which road segment it is plying on, using the car's GPS module.

2) Since most vehicles are connected cars now, let the vehicle look up the designated speed limit on that road in the Central Database of Speed Limits, or CDSL. Not to be confused with the Central Depository Services Limited.

2a) For the non-connected cars, the entire CDSL can be saved within the car just like offline sat-nav data. This can be updated during periodic services at the A.S.S.

3) Once the road-segment-specific speed limit has been fetched by the car, let the ECU dynamically limit the speed to that figure, until the car crosses over to the next road segment.

This is mostly a software solution, leveraging the existing hardware capabilities of most new cars. Once this is implemented, there is no need for speed limit warning sign boards, speed cameras, and associated infrastructure. Some money is saved right there.

[theabstractmind]

Originally Posted by clevermax

Before that, I have an idea to improvise on the suggestion put forward in this thread.

Almost every road in India is mapped. Why not have a database of speed limits for every segment of the road? Why not have a better system than a blind cap at 120kmph?

This is how it can be done:

1) Sense the location of the vehicle & detect which road segment it is plying on, using the car's GPS module.

2) Since most vehicles are connected cars now, let the vehicle look up the designated speed limit on that road in the Central Database of Speed Limits, or CDSL. Not to be confused with the Central Depository Services Limited.

2a) For the non-connected cars, the entire CDSL can be saved within the car just like offline sat-nav data. This can be updated during periodic services at the A.S.S.

3) Once the road-segment-specific speed limit has been fetched by the car, let the ECU dynamically limit the speed to that figure, until the car crosses over to the next road segment.

This is mostly a software solution, leveraging the existing hardware capabilities of most new cars. Once this is implemented, there is no need for speed limit warning sign boards, speed cameras, and associated infrastructure. Some money is saved right there.

I think the tone of the thread actually is that folks don't want that kind of a limiting or any kind of limiting. The tone is that if someone is willing to take the risk of breaking the law by overspeeding, so be it. It is a calculated risk of having to pay a fine if caught, or suffer any other eventuality if it does occur.

[CarNerd]

Originally Posted by clevermax

The order of steps is pretty simple - basic hygiene first, and then the million-dollar ideas that could possibly have a minute impact.

Never knew that limiting speed is a million dollar idea involving enormous complexity on a 24x7 basis! But making sure millions of people wear seat belts, helmets properly is child's play right?

Originally Posted by clevermax

Almost every road in India is mapped. Why not have a database of speed limits for every segment of the road? Why not have a better system than a blind cap at 120kmph?

This is how it can be done:

Such an easy thing to do!

It is only logical to address those points first, that will have the highest impact on the reduction of accidents and deaths. Capping the max speed of cars to 120kmph will have a very low impact on the reduction of road accidents. If you don't believe me, check out the 'Accidents in India' thread in this forum.

Is anyone suggesting we shouldn't address those points? It's like saying we shouldn't eat starters before the main course arrives!

Capping the max speed of cars to 120kmph is a very oppressive and illogical solution to an illogical problem, as stated by venkyhere in this thread.

It's a statement, not a research report.

Who doesn't enjoy speed? I do enjoy it. Capping my ability to go beyond 120kmph on a safe stretch of highway is totally unacceptable for me. I've legally done 220kmph on the German Autobahn. I could have gone beyond that if the car allowed.

There is a reason why we have to follow traffic rules - To maintain discipline and prevent chaos. In the same way, limiting speed is necessary in India which has the highest road fatalities in the world. Not everyone can drive safely beyond 120 kmph. India with its population, education, socioeconomic status, culture, behaviour is quite different from a country like Germany. You should always mind your surroundings.

As I stated earlier in this thread, if all cars came with a speed cap of 120kmph, I will not mind paying up someone - who knows what he's doing - to unlock the speed cap for me. Even if costs a sizeable portion of the cost I coughed up for the new car. To summarize, I am an automobile enthusiast from the times I could remember.

It's not a good thing to break the law in the name of enthusiasm, is it?

Now I've come to the realization that only a micro minority of people are actually auto enthusiasts. This holds good for members of any auto-forum too.

Better late than never.

I may have my own subjective definition of 'auto enthusiast'. Everyone probably has theirs too. It will be a futile exercise to impose views.

Exactly!

[MT_Hyderabad]

Originally Posted by keroo1099

I would love to hear what the mods think about this thread.

Or maybe just take a poll?

Originally Posted by venkyhere

I can't believe this thread has gone to 11 pages !!
Take a step back and "actually think" about the notion of ECU locking a vehicle to 120 kph. If that's done, right from an entry level car to a super/hyper car will have the same top speed, where is the incentive to aspire for 'more performance' ? Anyway a human being has basic needs like food, shelter, clothing - let's go back to U.S.S.R style socialism - any work anyone does, it's the same salary, same ration of food and same sized house/quarter to live in. Why not ? it's the same logic.

Does anyone really think OP is the first person to think of this, anywhere in the world ? Why hasn't this happened to any 'non-public-transport' vehicle anywhere in the world ?
Developed countries with access controlled highways with strictly enforced speed limits, are prime candidates for ECU speed lock. Why hasn't it been done ? Why-o-why ? Is TBHP the smartest resource on the planet entrusted to come up with the answer ?

There has to be a reason, right ? A human reason. A matter of freedom of choice, a matter of the concept of 'ownership' , a matter of litigation.

What next, are we going to see a team-BHP thread asking for a law to deny entry to fat people in restaurants, as part of 'world health program' ?

I can't believe that we are so hell-bent in closing this thread, without even making a small effort to search what's happening around the world and make sweeping statements.

Reason 1 why no one has implemented these limits is that 93% of the road fatalities happen in low to medium income countries! India being on top.

India claims to be a world super power. I am expecting it to lead in innovative solutions to its road fatalities problem!

WHO has issued a guideline to promote road safety in 2017, updated in June 2022. Please have a look.

https://www.who.int/publications/i/i...hnical-package

An excerpt for the so called, self proclaimed, car (speed) enthusiasts is captured in the image from the same.

@mods, I have not edited the post while quoting as each and every line of the quoted text needs a response!

[prad]

Highways are meant to get you to your destination quickly and safely. Highways need to support the highest speed without compromising safety. If this principle is understood, the question can be evaluated better.