[Torque250]

While some of us here were happy, Maruti scored just one point less than Toyota, Maruti was happy that there was no negative marking.

[Ajay_the_Don]

Another Baleno / Maruti bashing thread. We enthusiasts know about its build quality as well as its customers. They have a working product at an affordable price which is in great demand. Why should Maruti change it's way until the customer 'demands' for more safety?

[shashank.6766]

Safety is an important aspect across the board, including automobiles.

While buying a car, safety is a parameter just like features, affordability, resale value and cost of ownership. Since there is no single way to balance these parameters while making a purchase, people go with their priorities based on thier spending power and make an informed decision.

Now if manufacturers are also playing with these parameters based on market demand and internal cost/margin guidelines, I do not see a point bashing them.

There are 100 different things putting our life at risk every single day. I feel it is important to highlight things from a neutral viewpoint so that other readers are aware and take an informed call.

[Lobogris]

Originally Posted by shashank.6766

There are 100 different things putting our life at risk every single day. I feel it is important to highlight things from a neutral viewpoint so that other readers are aware and take an informed call.

This is an automobile forum. Hence we are concerned about safety in cars. If we were an architecture forum, we would discuss safe buildings. There is nothing more risky than driving in our daily lives. Please take safety seriously. It should be the absolute number one factor above everything else like mileage, power, features and design. Using your logic we shouldn't wear a helmet or a seat belt or even look while crossing the road as many do as there are "100 different things putting our life at risk every single day".

[FHW]

Most probably the results would be same for the Baleno sold in India. Infact as per past practice the manufacturers export cars safer than the ones sold in India. On the results of this Baleno, we have to think about the safety of the version that is being sold here in India.

All prospective car buyers please choose a safer car that fits in your budget. Safety has to be given a paramount importance while the decision for finalizing a car purchase is being made. There are safer cars available in the market that come in almost every price segment with equally good features as are available in the competition. Although the decision 'Which Car?' is not as simple as we think (Me... these days), but safety should be placed above all in the priority list.

[k_kumar]

Originally Posted by ron178

Latin NCAP has tested the Suzuki Baleno and the Toyota Yaris sold in the Latin American market.

Beyond the star ratings, intricacies of assessment protocols etc. there's something noteworthy in Latin NCAP's comments.

Baleno: "Footwell area was rated as stable. The bodyshell was rated as stable..."

Yaris: "Footwell area was rated as unstable. The bodyshell was rated as unstable..."

So, a lightweight Suzuki can be structurally superior to a well built Toyota! I hope this will help shape future discussions in our forum as it reaffirms that structural integrity of a car cannot be judged from its kerb weight, sheet metal thickness.

[for_cars1]

Originally Posted by k_kumar

...

Yaris: "Footwell area was rated as unstable. The bodyshell was rated as unstable..."

So, a lightweight Suzuki can be structurally superior to a well built Toyota!

A light weight car could be structurally rigid and strong if there is proper use of high tensile/boron steel at atleast critical places or even better if used more generously.
The fact that the Indian Yaris failed in the bodyshell integrity test clearly indicates cost cutting measures and skimping on the use of high tensile/boron steel.

So while the structure will be heavy if ordinary low cost steel is used, it will not be rigid enough. Weight is not an indicator of strenght.

[Knighted06]

Originally Posted by Aditya_Bhp

I don't this deserves a thread. This was always expected. Nothing surprising or shocking here. The Heartect platform will always perform poorly in a crash test.

The only Maruti crash test that surprised everyone was the Vitara Brezza 4 star GNCAP. It must have shocked the Maruti engineers as well and only that deserves a special thread.

True, infact, the Maruti engineers were so furious when they came to know about the 4 star rating achieved by Brezza, that they got very disappointed with themselves and immediately started working on a the next generation so that it will continue their legacy in safety (Just kidding. Couldn't resist taking a dig on Maruti, especially after reading your comment. Really hope the next gen Brezza is safer and gets better interiors than the current one)

Originally Posted by theAutomaniac

Latin NCAP is seriously being very tough on budget car manufacturers in the past one year! Not just Suzuki, even cars that had received good ratings earlier have now been reduced to 0 or 1 star rating! e.g. Ford Aspire went from 4 to zero!



They can't come up with anything! With just dual airbags and no standard ESP, even their entire product portfolio will receive a 0 star rating just like the Baleno and Swift etc. The Nexon might receive a 1 star due to it's standard ESC.


Well, that Heartect chassis has scored consistent 3 and 4 star ratings in Europe and even the Ertiga has scored a 4 and 3 respectively in Indonesia and India (Child Protection was still better than the Tata Nexon!). Hence, I would disagree that the Heartect can't score well! It's just that Latin NCAP's protocols have been too stringent these days and hence every new budget car there is receiving a zero or 1 star rating!


I mean, I hope you do know that Maruti engineers are not related to this thread! And yes I do agree that this does not deserve a special thread because this Baleno is a Latin America spec car while only Global NCAP results are applicale to India!

Bro, that's progress. The NCAP tests will be updated every few years, and they will only get stricter. That's how you get safer cars. Maruti is getting so much hate because the have almost 60% of the market share, and its not like they can't make safe cars, still they don't care about the lives of its customers. I was really disappointed when I saw Swift's safety rating, it was selling like hot cakes. Maruti is banking too much on its good will. They will start loosing their market share if they don't react quickly to the changing market trends. People are beginning to understand the importance of having a safe car. Just like Nokia, it'll be too late before they can take any action. The only mistake Nokia did was, not doing anything. They did not react according too the changing market. They don't even have a diesel engine in their portfolio. Things can't get worst than that. I know many people who are gonna jump in and say diesel has no future. But, maruti has such a high sales that even if 10% people change their mind and go for a totally different brand, that is a very huge number. I know close to 20-30 people who went ahead with Hyundai-Kia and Tata because Maruti was not selling diesel vehicles. Really hope Maruti starts coming up with more innovations.

P.S. I'm ranting about all this while my dad has a Swift Dzire parked in his garage. Yes he loves Maruti but might go for a different brand next year when we change it, as Maruti does not have a diesel engine in any of its models.

[ron178]

ET Now reports that Maruti Suzuki is aiming at producing safer cars with higher target scores on Global NCAP tests, anticipating a potential loss in market share due to heightened competition in this regard and positive market response towards safety. It is rumoured that the new C-segment SUV they have co-developed with Toyota is aiming high on NCAP tests, and it is rumoured that safety improvements are planned for the (Maruti) Suzuki Ertiga people mover.

After @Maruti_Corp's #Baleno and #Swift received poor ratings in the Latin NCAP tests, sources tell us that the car maker has started working on safer, more connected cars fearing a potential market share loss in future.

Watch the full news broadcast here.

[ron178]

Two new Latin NCAP results will be released at 7:30 p.m. IST today:



Stay tuned to Latin NCAP's English homepage (https://www.latinncap.com/en/) and to their social media channels for the release.

I'm hoping for better results this time. Fingers crossed.

[ron178]

Originally Posted by porsche_guy

OT: Why does the Baleno have a projector headlamp on the passenger side and a halogen headlamp on the driver side? Looks so out of place

The press release of the latest Latin NCAP result of the Latin market Hyundai Tucson should answer your question.

It appears Latin NCAP order replacement bumper parts after conducting the pedestrian headform and legform impactor tests and use the car for side impact. It looks like they ordered a reflector-type replacement unit in the Suzuki Baleno's case.

[ron178]

Old but missed news:

Toyota Argentina and Brazil reacted to Latin NCAP results and confirmed that the 2022 Yaris will come equipped with Toyota Safety Sense as standard in those two markets.

Source: motor1

(Translated by Google)

Originally Posted by Toyota Argentina

"Safety is always a priority for Toyota. The Yaris model manufactured in Brazil and sold in Argentina is equipped with a significant number of safety features from its entry-level versions, such as 7 airbags, stability and traction controls, ISOFIX system for fixing and anchoring child seats, ABS brakes with EBD and emergency braking assistant, among others.

However, we will continue to work to further increase the safety performance of our model. Following the philosophy of continuous improvement that guides our brand, the incorporation of new equipment is also planned in the short term, such as the Toyota Safety Sense active safety package".

Originally Posted by Toyota Brazil

Safety is always a priority for Toyota. We understand the new Latin NCAP evaluation criteria and value their contribution to the region's industry, which helps us improve the safety performance of our vehicles. The Yaris model sold in Latin America has a significant number of safety features, from entry-level versions. However, we will continue to work hard to further increase the safety level of our model, following the philosophy of continuous improvement that guides our brand".

However, these markets already have the Yaris with seven airbags as standard, while the version made in Thailand and sold in Mexico is still equipped with only two, a decision made by Toyota's regional branch there, something Latin NCAP expressed their displeasure at during the press release (see end of Presentation of Results in Post #1) due to their belief that such decisions should be taken by the manufacturer's global headquarters.

For equipment without minimum fitment rates, Latin NCAP only evaluates a car of the most basic safety specification available in the whole of Latin America and the Caribbean. Hence, without action from Toyota Mexico, the rating result is unlikely to change.

A factor for this improvement of specification for Brazil and Argentina is believed to be the impending arrival of a new Honda City in Brazil, to rival the Yaris.

Toyota has another reason to improve its model besides a reaction to the Latin NCAP: we are talking about the arrival of the new generation of its rival, the new Honda City. Honda's novelty will soon be launched in the Brazilian market and should bring an equally high safety package, as the brand will try to position City at a higher level (which should also raise the price). It will be the most appropriate time for Toyota to "fight back" with its news.

Unlike Toyota, who actively participated in Latin NCAP voluntarily during their 2016-19 protocols, Honda's last Latin NCAP result was in 2015 under much older protocol, when the City was equipped with only two airbags! It remains to be seen whether the new model will be able to renew its predecessor's five star rating under much more advanced evaluation protocol.

As always with Latin NCAP results, this is international news and means nothing for Indian consumers.

[ron178]

Originally Posted by Carma2017

The Baleno got a zero star due to the structuring of scoring of NCAP for Latin market. As per Latin NCAP, a single zero star in any of the sub heads leads to a zero overall. I guess issue was related to Child seats and Child occupant protection. The same logic is not applicable to Indian version of NCAP.

Easy to blame it on the lack of a CRS nomination from Suzuki but you're blatantly ignoring the fact that it reached EEVC limits (high risk of life-threatening injury) for rib deflection in the side impact (whose configuration is identical to 2016 Latin NCAP) so the LatAm car would have achieved a zero star result for adult occupants even under Latin NCAP's 2016 protocol.

Plus, Suzuki is the last manufacturer I would trust with CRS recommendations even if they had made an official nomination. Considering how their partner Toyota (even Honda) are following latest i-Size recommendation and putting even the Q3 rearward-facing of late, Suzuki does something no manufacturer would dare to: put the Q1.5 forward facing (in all cars with ISOFIX - Ertiga, Swift). Forget i-Size, that has never been the recommendation even under R44 (and if the Q1.5 was a child it would meet criteria for sitting rearward facing under both regulations).


To their credit, In India they at least recommend child seats unlike Hyundai/Kia who are content losing all dynamic points and don't even attend the test (I think Maruti does).

It doesn't mean anything for the car sold in India. Even assuming they were selling the same car, first of all, Global NCAP only did the frontal impact in India and it's not possible to extend an LHD result to RHD without evidence (though I would not be surprised if the Baleno scored well). It could potentially score up to four stars just with a good frontal impact (eg. the LHD car if tested to 2013 Latin NCAP protocol (i.e., Global NCAP 2014-22) would score a comfortable four stars for adults). Five stars, I'm not quite sure. It's not impossible, because the ECE R95 test and the Indian Government's AIS-099 (which the Baleno passed during homologation) have the driver seated differently than in the Latin NCAP side impact so it could possibly show lower injury but I'm not entirely sure whether the Government's test is identical to Regulation 95. But Maruti would also have to present kneemapping verification for the frontal impact. They didn't do it with the Brezza, not sure if they would with the Baleno.

Global NCAP will do the 2016 Latin NCAP side impact from in India starting July this year. Hopefully the new Baleno does better than the old one (or at least the one that was exported).

If the Government side airbag mandate comes into force on schedule it's unlikely that there will be a lot of zeroes just based on the side impact (eg. Ka, Onix) but there might be a ton of two star results because of no ESC (Punch, Altroz, Jazz, old City, Kiger) and three stars because of no head protection (Thar, Nexon, Polo, Magnite)

[ron178]

Originally Posted by ron178

Five stars, I'm not quite sure. It's not impossible

Correction: The Baleno had a door opening in the side impact, and the barrier spec, speed and impact location are identical to R95, so it's very unlikely it would have been able to achieve the fifth star.