Team-BHP - Accidents in India

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarrySky (Post 5627665)

I think the Swift driver actively contributed to the accident.

Both the Thar driver and the Swift driver had full view of the approaching pick-up from about 00:13. From the first frame when the Thar's brake lights are visible, they are ON. So I assume, the driver started braking as soon as he saw the pick-up. But the Thar was probably going so fast that even though he was braking, he was still going past the Swift.

The swift driver, hence, was required to be Robert Downey from Sherlock Holmes.:)

In my opinion, and in hind- and fore-sight, and others, the Thar driver is a criminal nincompoop. Yes, that fits. Should be arrested, and made to pay for all damages and trauma.
100% responsible.

Quote:

Originally Posted by binand (Post 5627920)

Actually, I sort of agree with @StarrySky's opinion (only disagree with the word "active"). The Swift driver might have missed doing something - slowing down - that could have prevented the accident from happening (even though it is possible that the Thar would have then gone ahead and crashed into the house at the corner).

It is not sufficient to be simply law abiding oneself; one has to be prepared to bend over backwards so that if it is within one's control, one saves even the most reckless driver from causing an accident.

Thar is 100 % responsible. No question. Swift is innocent as far as I see but as binand pointed out we should ask the question (mostly for academic purpose) what could we have done as a defensive driver if we were in the position of Swift. That is what defensive driving is about. Arm oneself with additional knowledge and be prepared in the next drive.

To be frank I don't see myself doing anything better here other than slowing down even further to allow the moron (Thar) ahead of me. I generally slow down at a curve considerably because I have often had oncoming traffic doing blind overtake on curves and had many instances when I was saved just because of this SoP. But in this case it is a matter of luck to escape unhurt (for the swift that is). Let us see what could have happend if the swift had slowed down even further

1. Thar would have pushed ahead and hit the pickup any way but the swift would have
been saved.

2. Thar would have slammed the brake to avoid the pickup and swerved to the left and hit the swift instead somewhere around the C-B pillar. The swift would have escaped
if it had not slowed down.

To make matters worse what would have happended if there was another idiot trying to overtake the pickup. I shudder to think about the consequences.

Quote:

Originally Posted by true_sedan (Post 5627907)

I’m shocked you call the swift driver “not an innocent party” in this accident. This is the problem here in India. In addition to meeting with an accident and not doing anything wrong we are “actively” blamed for the accident because we just happened to be following all the rules. I’m just plain outraged that some one can blame the swift driver who was minding his own business in his lane within the speed limit can be called out as being “not an innocent party” and “actively contributed” to the accident.

Exactly. I dont see the swift driver to be remotely an active contributer. The swift driver needs to have a pheripheral vision of a bird to notice the Thar overtaking and braking. I would say he did a good job of saving himself without getting hit by the Thar bouncing after the crash.

These things happen in an instant. Humans dont have the ability to react at this speed. The only way the swift could have not been a party to the accident is to see this video, get into a time machine and go back to the time of accident to make way for the the Thar. I dont see any other way.

That said, its very hard to follow the continous line rule in Kerala. You hardly get any gap in the lines. Follwing them very strictly is very hard here. That said, not abiding to it at such curves is damn stupid

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarrySky (Post 5627665)

The blame for the accident rests mainly with the Thar driver, as he was doing an illegal overtake. But the Swift driver is not an innocent party, in my view.

The pick-up also moved towards the center line rather than away from it. It seems that its tires were pointing to its left just before the collision. So it may be that the driver was braking hard, but the pick-up was still going straight due to wet roads + locked brakes.

All your observations are spot on. Though I don't agree that the Swift driver contributed to the accident, but I agree that he should have been more defensive for his own safety.

The blame is on Thar driver, all his judgements were wrong right from the overtake move. When he committed to the overtake (which was wrong), he had plenty of room to his left to get past Swift and avoid the Tata pickup and he expected the pickup to give way, which did not happen due to the lock up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom (Post 5627738)

Hard to blame the poor Swift driver there, who has ended up with a damaged car through no fault of his own.

The Thar driver is a reckless dangerous lunatic.

Swift driver was unfortunate. No way he could anticipate what thar driver is going to do.
Thar is the new fortuner who wants to bully everyone on the road. Especially here in NCR I encounter a lot of such thar drivers. Why can't people realise how dangerous it is to do an overtake on a blind curve. Bad luck for pick up truck and swift but Thar driver should be booked for multiple offences and made to pay for it.

Swift didn't move left. Pickup didn't give way. All for what? So Thar can complete its dangerous overtake? Was there a trophy to be won?

If Swift had moved left and Pickup had given way, could the Thar have completed 60 degrees left, followed by immediate 60 degrees right and be stable?

PS 1: In case the Swift driver noticed Thar, he/she expected the Thar to back off the impossible overtake attempt.

PS 2: Thar's driving is quite typical on Indian roads. People drive blind and when they see the vehicles, they are surprised (while going against one way, turning right on to on-coming traffic).

If Thar isn’t completely and solely responsible for the wreck, then driving on Indian roads and coming home safe is purely based on your luck on that day. And generally luck is your last resort between life and injury/death. You don’t have to keep pushing the envelope till one day your stars aren’t favorable. There’s a reason for the bold line on the blind curve road, so can’t put finger at the design of the road.

Poor driver of the swift and pick-up, will have to bear the consequences for no fault of theirs. I don’t know how swift driver could have been more defensive in the whole scenario unless he/she had a Mr INDIA watch to become a ghost with car and give space to Thar.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarrySky (Post 5627699)

What I meant is that in this particular instance, in hindsight, given that the Thar was still going faster than the Swift despite braking, he would probably have made it past the Swift and avoided the pick-up, if he didn't brake or had gone faster. I am not advocating overtaking on blind curves.

It seems we are missing one very obvious thing in this video.

Thar is not overtaking one but two vehicles, also with a curve clearly visible. How foolish is that?

Swift guy would not know it easily that a Thar is coming to overtake because it is not the vehicle immediately behind Swift and probably Swift driver is fully focused on making the turn.

How many times do we do a lane check when exactly on the curve with a one-lane road? the focus is 100% on the road, especially with non-supportive weather in these situations.

At even slow speed, Swift driver might not have known a Thar overtaking till the last moment - further, even if he had known, he might not be able to take a right decision with the curve coming ahead.

Also, it doesn't seem that Swift doesn't want to give the way - because for that to happen, Swift driver should have known that Thar is overtaking. But Thar was not immediately behind the vehicle - clearly this is a case where Swift driver easily gets benefit of the doubt!

Thar is clearly to blame - now we don't know whether it was a case of bullying or he had to reach somewhere that he made such a stupid decision. But one point is clear - Thar owner would be accountable for the damages.

Time and again, I have seen various Thar owners behaving very stupidly on highways and driving as if they were driving a hatchback or an FWD compact vehicle.

When people transition to RWDs (as usually 4WDs behave until 4H is engaged), they must know what they are getting into and must take proper driving lessons, and understand how RWDs differ from FWDs which are safer for a normal day to day driver.

Quote:

Originally Posted by motorsan (Post 5627633)

Overtaking in a curve! Rashly driven Thar collides with pickup in Kerala.
.

By seeing the video am more concerned about driving in Kerala where the roads are mostly winding and having a lot of blind turns. I faced blind turn overtaking a bit more in Kerala ghat regions compared to north and north east. My questions are following assuming me in the place of Bolero driver

1. Is there any way the Bolero driver can avoid a crash ?
2. Do radar based forward collision warning system will be helpful ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMichael (Post 5628058)

Similar incident, a police vehicle overtaking on a blind curve. Luckily, I was in sedate speed and had just enough room towards my left to move to.

Thats a police escort vehicle, you can see the 'VIP' vehicle just behind. I hope you read about the ambulance accident. You are extremely lucky that its a narrow miss. If it were an accident, you'd probably be charged for endangering the life of a 'VIP', whose life apparently has more value than common folks like us.

Accidents in India | Pics & Videos-20230919_14h10_51.jpg

Swift driver was not paying attention to the warning from his "Moron within 50 mts of your vehicle" detector. High time drivers actually use the tools meant to compensate for other dimwits.:Frustrati

This is something one has no control of. If you have to keep looking in your rear view mirrors even when you are not changing lanes or turning to help such rash drivers, driving would become too stressful.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sandeepmohan (Post 5627810)

Out of habit. When I say 'hard", I don't mean that I redline the car. Its a pretty large roundabout with an "S" sort of exit. I go in turning right and exit left on a curve. Nice feeling of the car lean from side to side when you go hard on the gas pedal. Its usually at <50kmph speed.

Oh, as in accelerating out of a curve. Right.

Quote:

Its instances like this that have made me think twice over what I do going forward. It may not be a case of a angry or an ego centric driver. Misjudgment of the driver waiting for you is enough to cause a crash, add discomfort for your co-passengers.

Yes. We cannot expect others to do what we expect or what they should. But there's a point where all this simply spoils the driving. What can we say? "What to do?" I suppose! Simply, we must avoid that accident that the other guy is trying to cause.

Thanks for your reply. Stay safe! And, hopefully, enjoy :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by nettooran (Post 5627959)

That said, its very hard to follow the continous line rule in Kerala. You hardly get any gap in the lines. Follwing them very strictly is very hard here. That said, not abiding to it at such curves is damn stupid

It's only hard for people who cannot wait.

The line means it's dangerous to overtake, right? And people should be able to see the danger even without the line. Can't overtake? Drive at the speed of the people in front and be content. Or at least, put up with it.