[Alvis]

All,

There was a Lagonda V 12, Drop head coupe very similiar to the car owned by awini in Lahore. It was grayish/silver when I saw the car in 1968 (then being 13 years) with my father who wanted to buy it. Even then it was very close to what awini's car looks like except it had so much fine dust and the roof was in tatters.
The car and the palatial house " Rose Palace" belonged to Khan Bahadur Taj Muhammad Khan of Badrishi ( Frontier province ). His other house in New Delhi was at 6, Tees Jan Marg, which was at one time the British High Commission and is now the National Defence College. He was a civil contractor and horse race lover. The house in Lahore was sold off in 1972 and sadly it was demolished.
No idea of what happened to that Lagonda, I will try to get in touch with his son and see if it has survived.

[TractionAvant]

Hello Awini,

You have got a beautiful & rare car. Just one question. Did you get it from Ahmedabad?

I remember seeing a similar lagonda (i think it was a v12) in the old city around 12 years ago . The owner (it might not be appropriate to reveal his name) attended the same school as my cousin and so, was more than happy to show me the car and his collection of scale models (2 cabinets full!). I am not sure if I have got a picture.

If that is not your car or Mr. Bhogilal's then there is a third v12 in India.

[Julian UK]

The photos of this magnificent car seem to be floating about the web in a few places so I see no reason to think they should not be here in this thread also. A wonderful car belonging to the wonderful Autoworld collection. I understand that this collection is open to the public so any publicity will be beneficial to it. So I am posting these in good faith for the benefit of all, the car and the collection and Lagonda admirers. The photos source is an excellent site and is also well worth a visit, compiled by a notable enthusiast and member of this forum. I already see several of the photos from this site on the forum.
One of the Lagonda V12s in India




Roop Gills Classic Motorcycles

[DKG]

Originally Posted by TractionAvant

Hello Awini,

You have got a beautiful & rare car. Just one question. Did you get it from Ahmedabad?

Yes Awini's car came from the Nath family of Ahmedabad

PS Lovely machine Julian albeit painted in the horrendous colours so typical of Bhogilal!

[TractionAvant]

Originally Posted by DKG

Yes Awini's car came from the Nath family of Ahmedabad

PS Lovely machine Julian albeit painted in the horrendous colours so typical of Bhogilal!

Now that the name is out, I saw it when it was owned by Mr.Subodh Nath.

[DKG]

BTW where has Awini disappeared? Haven't seen him around for quite a while now.

[karlosdeville]

Originally Posted by DKG

PS Lovely machine Julian albeit painted in the horrendous colours so typical of Bhogilal!

These pictures were probably taken from an early article in BSMotoring, pictures probably taken by the late great Deepak Tolani. Regarding the colours, methinks these were Baroda state colours, I remember it being mentioned in the article. It is also the last pre war Lagonda as I remember a car was on its way to be delivered but was torpedoed on the way. So a replacement was hurriedly put together and delivered mid war.

[karlosdeville]

Harit has this to say on Lagonda's he recalls.

Today the subject is Lagondas.

I have gone through this thread and will start with DKG’s search of a Lagonda he saw 30 years ago in a rally in Hyderabad.
I think that is the car in link 11. I made 2 phone calls to 2 previous owners to get the full story. There is also a bit of my early spotting.
In around 1976, this Lagonda was green in colour, boat tailed and lying on the Nathwani Indian Oil Petrol pump on Warden road. Then it was shifted to the first lane off Nepean Sea Road on the left side. One headlight had fallen down, lying next to the mudguard face to the sky. Shortly thereafter it was advertised in the Times of India for Rs 30K. We phoned them, they asked us to come to their office near Khyber restaurant but as we did not have the money we left it. Then it appeared in a rally in Hyderabad. A young collector based in Chennai also participated and pestered the owner till he sold. Then it came to Chennai. The collector changed base to Mumbai and sold his 16 cars, and the Lagonda went to another collector who promptly sold it to V. Mallya. The body of this car is not original. The car had serious problems of brakes seizing when hot.
In Ahmedabad there were 2 Lagondas, one bought by the family of the person who started this thread. There is history of royalty of Rajasthan. The other car, more sporty went to Indore. In Indore there is a second Lagonda. This came originally, from the time the history is known to me, from a farm in Thane. There were 4 cars, this Lagonda, a Rolls, a Humber and a 170V. The Lagonda and Rolls were bought by Vohra. The Rolls went on to Hyderabad in the 1980’s partially restored. The Lagonda was languishing on this farm, Vohra had gone aboad and the owner offered me to take it. I have never ever snatched a car from anybody and left it. Later Vohra came and took it. The car had no body from the cowl onwards and it was partially built up. The engine was air cooled, there was no water pump. The Humber I bought and the 170V got scrapped.
The 5th picture of a Lagonda in the thread is also a car where the body is not original. This car had once participated in a rally in Mumbai and then went to Delhi.
The sporty Lagonda of Pranlal did indeed belong earlier to Mr. Pesi Shroff. Even after selling to Pranlal, Mr. Shroff used to drive the Lagonda in Mumbai’s Rallies. I think that this is the same Mr. Pesi Shroff mentioned in the Rolls thread link 461.
One Lagonda remains a mystery. There are several Lagonda’s in Delhi, perhaps someone can do research and find out if any one of them was ever used for racing in Bengal. This should be a car without an original body and thrashed mechanicals. I have tried to trace this car but it has gone into thin air.
So much for Lagonda’s.

I vaguely recall Manveder's book carrying a photo of the Nath's other Lagonda, GJD regd I think.

[speedy]

Originally Posted by DKG

PS Lovely machine Julian albeit painted in the horrendous colours so typical of Bhogilal!

DKG with all due respect, if the owner likes to paint his cars in a certain colour or in a colour scheme he has all the rights too. i dont think it is fair for anyone to label the person. you might not like it but he does. please i do not intend to start a debate on this. i do not mean to offend you in any way. sorry if i have.

like the picture posted by julian MRW4123 is Mr Bhogilals
1938 Lagonda V12
1926 Lagonda convertible
1936 Lagonda
cant get any other in mind right now. will go through the albums to confirm.

[vintageman]

Thank You Speedy .

For being the only one to agree with me on a very old debate on this subject on this forum.( The cosmetic appearance of the car and the owners prerogative to maintain the car in original mechanical and physical condition , with colours which please him).

&

Welcome Back !!

[DKG]

Originally Posted by speedy

DKG with all due respect, if the owner likes to paint his cars in a certain colour or in a colour scheme he has all the rights too.

I deeply appreciate the efforts of some of the country's big collectors like Bhogilal in saving the splendid treasures that graced India, and had it not been for a public museum opened I would have kept my views to myself. I do believe his taste is horrendous both in standards of restoration applied and colours and the combined effect detracts from the overall quality of a museum exhibit. But that's just one person's opinion and I don't expect anyone to be persuaded to it. And I think its perfectly okay if we are going to disagree over it There's no need for anyone to get offended.

Originally Posted by vintageman

For being the only one to agree with me on a very old debate on this subject on this forum.

Its okay if people have differing views on the subject. BTW how's that lovely Packard of yours coming along?

[speedy]

Originally Posted by vintageman

Thank You Speedy .

For being the only one to agree with me on a very old debate on this subject on this forum.( The cosmetic appearance of the car and the owners prerogative to maintain the car in original mechanical and physical condition , with colours which please him).

&

Welcome Back !!

thank you Vintageman. i have been busy traveling hence the gap. now i am trying my best to be in touch with the cars again.

Originally Posted by DKG

I deeply appreciate the efforts of some of the country's big collectors like Bhogilal in saving the splendid treasures that graced India, and had it not been for a public museum opened I would have kept my views to myself. I do believe his taste is horrendous both in standards of restoration applied and colours and the combined effect detracts from the overall quality of a museum exhibit. But that's just one person's opinion and I don't expect anyone to be persuaded to it. And I think its perfectly okay if we are going to disagree over it There's no need for anyone to get offended.

Its okay if people have differing views on the subject. BTW how's that lovely Packard of yours coming along?

Deepakji i do understand that there would be differences in opiniouns about alot of topics and everyone is entitled to their own views. i am glad you atleast appriciate the efforts made by Mr.Bhogilal and others. you yourself being a collector and passionate about cars should realise the efforts that go into maintaining them. alot of friends on the forum would agree and so would you, when i say it is not easy and cheap by any means. this we talk of a few cars and Mr.Bhogilal tries his best at his age to keep 300 odd cars standing for people to see. i think it is the effort and not a colour or restoration job in his case. i dont find any shame in it or for people to ridicule the effort of atleast ensureing the future generation gets to see the cars. like they say something better than nothing.

[DKG]

Originally Posted by speedy

Mr.Bhogilal tries his best at his age to keep 300 odd cars standing for people to see.

Many of us today and I'm sure of generations to come would be indebted to people like Mr. Bhogilal who not only saved these treasures but have made an effort to display them for public viewing. That is truly commendable. I have been trying unsuccessfully at times to suggest to some of the collectors here in Hyderabad and once to Mr. Sanghi to convert their splendid collections into museums but to no avail.

India has already lost an unimaginable collection of treasures. The efforts of these few gentlemen who have saved up whatever they could of automotive heritage deserves special recognition.

I just wish a little more care and attention to detail is lavished on the splendid cars in Mr. Bhogilal's possession.

[speedy]

Originally Posted by DKG

Many of us today and I'm sure of generations to come would be indebted to people like Mr. Bhogilal who not only saved these treasures but have made an effort to display them for public viewing. That is truly commendable. I have been trying unsuccessfully at times to suggest to some of the collectors here in Hyderabad and once to Mr. Sanghi to convert their splendid collections into museums but to no avail.

India has already lost an unimaginable collection of treasures. The efforts of these few gentlemen who have saved up whatever they could of automotive heritage deserves special recognition.

I just wish a little more care and attention to detail is lavished on the splendid cars in Mr. Bhogilal's possession.

that is why i did mention the fact of maintanance and finance that goes into this cars. the right trustworthy people. at his age manageing the show alone is not possible. his trusted people have expired and the next generation does not care too much. manageing to keep the cars in their current state is in itself an effort for him. he too is aware of the fact that all his cars are not displayed with the right garnish but parts for some cars are not available and some have been stored aside to prevent them from being stolen. many parts and bikes have been stolen in the past. that is why i say something is better than nothing.

we had gotten permission for opening museums all over india and a few collectors had agreed to display their cars there on monthly basis. we then had issues with the government not giveing land to do so. in bombay we were given land under the flyover at reclamation.

[DKG]

Without a doubt the logistics of managing such a vast collection is to say the least mind boggling. Not to mention the massive costs involved. But then a collection of this calibre and size does consume truck loads of money and monumental efforts. I hope he is able to figure out how best it can be managed and improved over time. I should think one would need a full team of highly competent staff with a full fledged inhouse workshop to be able to do justice to the cars.

Speedy along the lines of what Steve has done for the PIII's would it be possible for you to attempt doing that (time permitting) for the RR's in Mr. Bhogilal's collection? Coupled with pictures I can see that as material for a fabulous coffee table book, not to mention the contribution toward educating people and preseving factual information on the provenance of the RR's in his collection?

Infact there should be so many tales to tell by Mr. Bhogilal himself on how every car was acquired etc. I wish someone actually documents it all. I once heard an interesting story (not sure how true it was) that often he'd send his staff in a brand new Fiat to the Maharajah as inducement to exchange an old Roller. Sounds too fanciful eh??? Never know what people may have needed to do to acquire these beauties. Those Maharajahs definintely were an eccentric bunch.