[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by miharbe

I gave my car for the 4th service (60,000 kms) today. I suspected brake disc and brake pads would have to be replaced and also some parts of the suspension. I asked the SA to run the necessary checks and come back to me with an estimate of the work needed and associated costs.

I have a few questions prior to getting to the estimate given.

1) Has the car met with an Accident?

2) Have you reported any issues with the car to the ASC when giving the car for 60K service?

3) What is the current status? Is it serviced or waiting for a green signal from you?

4) Why is the brake disc being changed? Is it damaged/worn out? Brake pads is understandable.

5) Steering rack - suspected. Avoid unless there is a problem.

6) The fender lining?

Why are all these parts getting changed?

I suggest you to go another VW ASC or best is visit an FNG in your city and get a second opinion. If i am not wrong, your car would be out of warranty?!

[coolboy007]

Originally Posted by miharbe

P.S. I even have half a mind of selling the car in as is condition given that these expenses have really given me a shocker

Buddy your service centre is taking you for a big ride. Even if your suspension is worn out, the rates quoted are too much. Parts such as lower arm are only replaced if you have met with an accident or banged your card so hard in a pothole that lower arm got bent.

You can see my thread where i got TRW struts installed in my Vento (it is a german company), cost of all 4 struts was 8800 and you are being quoted same amount for 2, even VW struts are not so expensive. Steering rack need not be touched unless you are facing any issue or noise from it. Brake discs need a change of they are warped, heck they can be made right on a lathe machine for 400 bucks.

Once the warranty is over, try searching for an independent garage and you will be amazed at how much you save on jobs such as brake or suspension. VW labour is too expensive and even a new mechanic will do a better job than their idiots roaming around the service area.

Get your car checked outside and change only what is necessary. You can get synthetic coolant outside.

I got all 4 of my struts changed and paid just 800 labour outsid with work done in 2 hours, VW would have charged me atleast 4000 and made me wait for 2 days.

[Gannu_1]

Fender lining might be the wheel well lining. Coolant used by the VAG group (G13 or G12+) is a mix of ethylene glycol/glycerine and distilled/demineralised water in a 50:50 ratio.

Why are both the tail lights being asked to be replaced? Looks like the service center is proactively trying to replace the unwanted parts and fleecing you into doing so. Please get the parts from outside (Opera House?) and get it done from a competent FNG.

[H_Dogg72]

Try to get the steering rack under warranty.
See if the tail lights require to be replaced else scrap it.
Suspension should be done outside.

Voila. You'll save a ton of money.

[SS-Traveller]

Originally Posted by miharbe

The below is what i have received from them
Attachment 1339806

Well, you gave the SA carte blanche, and he gave you a suitable estimate! Let's see if your questions can be answered...

Assuming all this is required, should I get this done at VW or outside?

If within warranty, some of the work ought to be done free of cost by the service centre. Otherwise there are enough good FNGs to do it cheaper, as well as differentiate between the essential and non-essential work.

What is the difference between Strut and Strut Kit?

The strut is the complete assembly of coil spring and damper, with its associated rubber components. When changing a complete strut, a strut kit (which comprises only the rubber components) is not required at the same time. However, the coil spring usually lasts the lifetime of the car, so only the damper portion of the strut is changed - in which case the strut kit is also replaced at the same time. 6500 INR for the strut kit sounds very expensive.

What is Lower Arm and Linkage?

The lower arm is the metal part that connects the strut to the chassis, and on which the suspension swivels. It has a ball joint to allow for the suspension to move as well as rotate while you turn the steering (thus allowing the wheels to turn). Not unusual for this to wear out.

What is the Steering Rack and he was not too convincing on this and has even mentioned it as suspected which i dont understand why as they have the car with them

Cannot comment on whether the steering rack needs change/repair unless the vehicle is examined. Best to get the opinion of an independent garage about this.

Like the engine oil is there a specific coolant that is used by VW or can i use any brand?

Many manufacturers have co-branded oils and other fluids recommended for use with their cars, but it is not binding on you to use these - fluids of equivalent specifications are equally good, whatever reputed brand they may be of.

What is "Fender Lining"? What are the disadvantages of fixing it?

The fender lining is the plastic lining of the wheel well. It can come undone and break/crack, but then again, whether it needs to be changed or repaired and put back can only be judged after examining the vehicle. Ergo, a trusted FNG person would be in a better position to judge.

I am more inclined to get the Discs and Brake Pads changed and thats about it.

Disc change is not compulsory every time pads are changed - they can also be 'skimmed' on a lathe and reused with new brake pads, which ASS are generally averse to doing. And 1200 rupees as labour for changing discs and pads also sounds very expensive.

I am not getting the tail lights fixed as there are only a few minor nicks on them.

Tail lights with broken/cracked/perforated lenses result in dust & water getting in, and dulling of the shiny reflector surface - and reduced light output. Not sure what you mean by a nick, but before you deem it not essential to change them, check if the lenses are intact and the reflectors reasonably shiny.

Hop this helps.

[Mohan Mathew A]

Originally Posted by premc44

This is a copy of the email sent by me to Customer care at VW India. Do you think I should wait for the response or send copies to the higher ups, whose email id-s are not known to me. I hope my mail will be self explanatory. Responses are most welcome

Pls take it up strongly with phoneix cars and VW. it could be easily that the part had to be replaced because of being manhandled. Now that you have paid you have to get the amount back. it would have been easier if you had fought before making the payment. I too bought my vento from Phoenix cars, thrissur and is making me wonder about them

[premc44]

Originally Posted by Mohan Mathew A

Pls take it up strongly with phoneix cars and VW. it could be easily that the part had to be replaced because of being manhandled. Now that you have paid you have to get the amount back. it would have been easier if you had fought before making the payment. I too bought my vento from Phoenix cars, thrissur and is making me wonder about them

Yes, I should have refused to pay the amount. I have already got a reply from Phoenix cars that the part was already broken (How?) and that it is not covered under warranty. I am continuing to take up the matter with VW. Shall keep the forum updated.

[miharbe]

Thank You to each and everyone who responded to my query on a Sunday when India was playing Pakistan in a World Cup match! It means a lot!

Originally Posted by a4anurag

1) Has the car met with an Accident?

2) Have you reported any issues with the car to the ASC when giving the car for 60K service?

3) What is the current status? Is it serviced or waiting for a green signal from you?

4) Why is the brake disc being changed? Is it damaged/worn out? Brake pads is understandable.

5) Steering rack - suspected. Avoid unless there is a problem.

6) The fender lining?

Why are all these parts getting changed?

I suggest you to go another VW ASC or best is visit an FNG in your city and get a second opinion. If i am not wrong, your car would be out of warranty?!

Responses below:

1. No, the car hasnt met with any accident
2. I felt some issues with the suspension and also with the brakes
3. Current status is it is being serviced. At the time of the earlier post they were waiting for my green signal
4. Brake discs had lots of lines / grooves on them and had lost all smoothness. i even checked it with a Passat and Jetta nearby
5. Yes i have avoided that
6. Fender lining is damaged. The image below might help clarify why

Yes my car is out of warranty as it is over 4 years old now and even the extended warranty is over. I did visit a spare parts shop in Navi Mumbai and will be getting the "necessary" stuff done from there.

Originally Posted by coolboy007

You can see my thread where i got TRW struts installed in my Vento (it is a german company), cost of all 4 struts was 8800 and you are being quoted same amount for 2, even VW struts are not so expensive. Steering rack need not be touched unless you are facing any issue or noise from it. Brake discs need a change of they are warped, heck they can be made right on a lathe machine for 400 bucks.

The shop i visited had original VW Struts (didnt see them but he mentioned he does) for around INR 4,000. He even has the TRW struts with him. Now to decide between which one i have to go for.

Originally Posted by Gannu_1

Fender lining might be the wheel well lining. Coolant used by the VAG group (G13 or G12+) is a mix of ethylene glycol/glycerine and distilled/demineralised water in a 50:50 ratio.

Why are both the tail lights being asked to be replaced? Looks like the service center is proactively trying to replace the unwanted parts and fleecing you into doing so. Please get the parts from outside (Opera House?) and get it done from a competent FNG.

Any idea on the brand of the coolant? I have found out the engine oil replacement. Its Castrol Edge 5W - 40 I think!

One Tail light has a a few scratches and another one has a 1inch x 1inch x 1inch trianglular gap where the glass has broken. Recommended to be changed not necessary

Originally Posted by H_Dogg72

Try to get the steering rack under warranty.
See if the tail lights require to be replaced else scrap it.
Suspension should be done outside.

Voila. You'll save a ton of money.

Unfortunately my car is out of warranty and hence cannot claim that. Yes i am not getting the tail lights replaced and also getting the suspension and other work done outside.

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

The strut is the complete assembly of coil spring and damper, with its associated rubber components. When changing a complete strut, a strut kit (which comprises only the rubber components) is not required at the same time. However, the coil spring usually lasts the lifetime of the car, so only the damper portion of the strut is changed - in which case the strut kit is also replaced at the same time. 6500 INR for the strut kit sounds very expensive.

Thank You for the detailed explanation Sir! I am getting this changed outside hence hoping it will be considerably cheaper

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

The lower arm is the metal part that connects the strut to the chassis, and on which the suspension swivels. It has a ball joint to allow for the suspension to move as well as rotate while you turn the steering (thus allowing the wheels to turn). Not unusual for this to wear out.

Cannot comment on whether the steering rack needs change/repair unless the vehicle is examined. Best to get the opinion of an independent garage about this.

There is a rubber bush where the lower arm connects rotates which is damaged. it is visible in the image below.

Steering rack looked ok to me when i inspected the car at the workshop. Will get a better sense once stuff has been opened up.

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

The fender lining is the plastic lining of the wheel well. It can come undone and break/crack, but then again, whether it needs to be changed or repaired and put back can only be judged after examining the vehicle. Ergo, a trusted FNG person would be in a better position to judge.

Disc change is not compulsory every time pads are changed - they can also be 'skimmed' on a lathe and reused with new brake pads, which ASS are generally averse to doing. And 1200 rupees as labour for changing discs and pads also sounds very expensive.

Have attached an image of the fender lining i think its cracked in places but can survive. Will get this changed depending on the cost.

I was advised by the spare parts dealer to get the discs changed as well by looking at the image. Still not decided if that is needed.

Some images of the damages

Condition of the brake disc


Condition of the brake pad. Even though not much is visible


Front Fender Lining



Lower arm Bush (May have to zoom into the picture)


Linkages (Not sure what this is called)


I have just asked the Service Centre to get the basic servicing done and will get all the recommended work done outside. Will update this thread once done.

Thanks to Team-BHP that i will save a lot of money on these repairs. Thanks once again to everyone who responded.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by miharbe

He even has the TRW struts with him. Now to decide between which one i have to go for.

I'd say TRW if you need sharp handling. Do look at the thread by 'Coolboy007'

Unfortunately my car is out of warranty and hence cannot claim that.

Good. You should be happy actually.

Have attached an image of the fender lining i think its cracked in places but can survive. Will get this changed depending on the cost.

Do get it changed if there is shortage in Vitamin-M.

I was advised by the spare parts dealer to get the discs changed as well by looking at the image. Still not decided if that is needed.

Yup, I do feel it needs a change. Do prioritise the needs here. Apart from the fluids + filter changes do get the brakes and suspension changed as they are crucial both for the car and your safety.

Tail lights, fender lining can be postponed if and when vitamin-M is available.

I have just asked the Service Centre to get the basic servicing done and will get all the recommended work done outside. Will update this thread once done.

Good decision. Just get the regular work done at the ASC. Rest repairs can be done at an FNG.

Also please do post a comparison of the costs incurred at the FNG as compared to the rates quoted by the ASC. I want to see how costly the ASC is and well they loot customers.

[bosporus]

I was at the VW workshop today with a friend to pick up his car, and while chatting with the service manager, discovered that the alloys that first came with the Vento / Polo now cost Rs. 3,800 only! Methinks that is the deal of the century

I remember when they used to cost Rs 23,000 a piece.

Does anyone have experience with using Brembo brake pads on their Vento?

My pads are due for replacement and was considering these. The service manager was advising against them, saying they are long lasting, but grabby, and the brakes will no longer retain the nice progressive feel that they have with the original brake pads. But then, he is expected to say so, so would discount the criticism.

Any personal experiences would be helpful.

[premc44]

Originally Posted by Mohan Mathew A

Pls take it up strongly with phoneix cars and VW. it could be easily that the part had to be replaced because of being manhandled. Now that you have paid you have to get the amount back. it would have been easier if you had fought before making the payment. I too bought my vento from Phoenix cars, thrissur and is making me wonder about them

Perseverance pays off. Finally, yesterday got a call from the AGM, Phoenix cars that they are willing to reimburse Rs. 8292/ that I was charged for the fuel return hose. ( Please see my mail to VW customer care in the previous page )
There were quite a few telephone conversation with the CRM of Phoenix cars and I was prepared to wait for the final word from VW. I have not directly heard anything from them yet, but I got to know from the conversations that a complaint that the dealer is not able to resolve within 48 hours is taken very seriously by VW and so the dealerships are anxious to somehow close the complaints.
I think this was the main reason behind the call from the AGM and the offer for refund.
Moral of the story: Take your complaint to the highest level
Get your facts right and present your case coherently with proof, where available, like the photos that I attached to my complaint and finally
NEVER allow yourself to be taken for a ride.

[Gannu_1]

Originally Posted by bosporus

I was at the VW workshop today with a friend to pick up his car, and while chatting with the service manager, discovered that the alloys that first came with the Vento / Polo now cost Rs. 3,800 only! Methinks that is the deal of the century

I remember when they used to cost Rs 23,000 a piece.

The earlier batches were from Borbet, Germany/SA and the newer ones are from some unknown manufacturer based in China. Search around, you will find the images on the forum.

[thoma]

Originally Posted by premc44

Moral of the story: Take your complaint to the highest level

Glad to hear the dealer coming around.

How did you actually proceed after the e-mail to VW customer care? Did you contact any higher ups? What about the injectors, are they changing that too?

[bosporus]

Originally Posted by Gannu_1

The earlier batches were from Borbet, Germany/SA and the newer ones are from some unknown manufacturer based in China. Search around, you will find the images on the forum.

Thanks for the update, I figured as much.

Is there any evidence to suggest that these are qualitatively lower to the Borbet ones - on durability, weight, finish, etc.? I would presume that companies like VW would maintain similar quality, irrespective of the country of origin of the manufacturing of one of their products.

Also, why were you referring to the images? They still look the same, right?

[Gannu_1]

Originally Posted by bosporus

Is there any evidence to suggest that these are qualitatively lower to the Borbet ones - on durability, weight, finish, etc.? I would presume that companies like VW would maintain similar quality, irrespective of the country of origin of the manufacturing of one of their products.

I would assume as much. But no such evidence to prove that the quality differs.

Originally Posted by bosporus

Also, why were you referring to the images? They still look the same, right?

Yep, they look identical with no changes. I was referring to those images which indicate the manufacturer's names inscribed on the inside of the wheel and on the import sticker.