[livyodream]

Originally Posted by HammerHead

First of all have you owned any Fiat recently? I mean GP or Linea? If you do then have you also owned say Swift/i20/Polo or SX4/Verna/Vento so that you can tell me X part of Y brand is Rs. Z cheaper then similar parts of C brand?

I have been searching this info since long without much luck!

Forget about owning as it may not be feasible, if you have rough idea about the pricing of parts and service cost, you may post it here.

Thanks.

No, I havent.
In a recent test drive on one of friends linea run 18K, I found out that theres some problem in clutch. On inspection the service guys found out that the clutch is more or less burnt (he knows how to drive and not resultant of poor driving habit). Estimation was give for 16K and no promise on the replacement part arrival.

ok, let me put it your way - Hell with faulty parts.
But what about the replacement parts? how many days should I have to dump the vehicle in the service bay to get the replacement. I havent heard clutch parts costing 16K (in a normal sedan). Gypsys costs 1.7K, Accents costs ~4K etc.

I wanted to test drive punto (I have booked Swift) just to know what punto is all about. Even if I had called Atlas cycle showroom, they would have got me a cycle for a restride but not in case of Punto. I called multiple times n all in vain. Finally I had to go to showroom to test drive it.

In the showroom - (honestly i have very less info about these diesel engines) I wanted to drive the normal one (not the 90 HP one) and all they had was 90HP vehicle. I have driven Swifts extensively and know the trubo kick. When I drove punto 90 there was no kick at all !!! I was like . I asked the sales guy about the turbo which every diesel car has nowadays. Finally he told that Punto does not have a Turbo in it !! (Is it true ???)

I came home and the story ends.

I have nothing against you or punto or Fiat. What does one think after experiencing the above horror stories? And no, its not just me this is the case with majority of the customers who wants to buy a punto.

[StarrySky]

Probably this post will seem off-topic considering the discussions on-going now

Drove my friend's new 90HP Punto today. The most apparent change that I felt compared to my car is the noise levels in the cabin. Surely, his car is a lot quieter than mine. I think Fiat has worked on this aspect and improved it.

I think Fiat's big problem is inconsistent A.S.S experience. There are quite a few people (including me) who are satisfied with the car and service. Some others have bad experience with their A.S.C. Sometimes, I guess, people even have very different experience at the same A.S.C.

Originally Posted by MCR

Yes, Swift is a fast car thanks to the BHP/ton advantage.

I think that's only true for the 75HP Punto. The 90HP Punto probably has better BHP/Ton than the Swift.

[sdp1975]

Originally Posted by StarrySky

Drove my friend's new 90HP Punto today. The most apparent change that I felt compared to my car is the noise levels in the cabin. Surely, his car is a lot quieter than mine. I think Fiat has worked on this aspect and improved it.

So you did not feel the extra power/torque in the 90 hp punto compared to the 75 hp one ?

[Soccerfan]

Originally Posted by livyodream

In the showroom - (honestly i have very less info about these diesel engines) I wanted to drive the normal one (not the 90 HP one) and all they had was 90HP vehicle. I have driven Swifts extensively and know the trubo kick. When I drove punto 90 there was no kick at all !!! I was like . I asked the sales guy about the turbo which every diesel car has nowadays. Finally he told that Punto does not have a Turbo in it !! (Is it true ???)

There is no hard and fast rule like the rubo should kick this much. It depends on the way the manufacturer has tuned the engine. Maruti has gone for an aggresive tune with more lag. Fiat has gone for a normal tune with lesser lag. And about the sales guy who said no Turbo, its morons like this who are destroying FIAT

[sourav21]

Originally Posted by livyodream

And what about service, parts replacement, warranty etc after a heavenly ride in punto ?
I know for sure that Fiats are drivers car. But one has to think about A.S.S first as we are buying a machine and no matter how well a vehicle is built, it will have problems and have to rectified in so called A.S.S. Everytime I think of Fiat or Tata cars, those sales reps come in my mind. Gosh, a vegetable vendor is better off in selling vegetables compared to these reps.

My experience with A.S.S. and the car has been good so far - needed prodding sometimes but did their job well - before buying the car, I did read many reviews of TATA A.S.S. handling FIAT cars and majority of them had something good to say. Personally I feel this whole issue has been blown out of proportion. People don't stop buying Skoda inspite of Skoda horror stories. People buy WV inspite of unproven track record. You will have good and bad in every organization - I have had problems with Hyundai - having changed disk brake rotors twice within 8000 kms - this not counting the pads which were changed sometimes in the middle - all within 25K kms.

Whether TATA or Honda, the things I learned are:
1. You need to know your car
2. Get community help
3. Better trust your own intelligence and instincts rather than the Service Advisor's - listen to everybody, but make your own decision.

[amit_mechengg]

Originally Posted by livyodream

No, I havent.
In a recent test drive on one of friends linea run 18K, I found out that theres some problem in clutch. On inspection the service guys found out that the clutch is more or less burnt (he knows how to drive and not resultant of poor driving habit). Estimation was give for 16K and no promise on the replacement part arrival.

ok, let me put it your way - Hell with faulty parts.
But what about the replacement parts? how many days should I have to dump the vehicle in the service bay to get the replacement. I havent heard clutch parts costing 16K (in a normal sedan). Gypsys costs 1.7K, Accents costs ~4K etc.

I wanted to test drive punto (I have booked Swift) just to know what punto is all about. Even if I had called Atlas cycle showroom, they would have got me a cycle for a restride but not in case of Punto. I called multiple times n all in vain. Finally I had to go to showroom to test drive it.



I have nothing against you or punto or Fiat. What does one think after experiencing the above horror stories? And no, its not just me this is the case with majority of the customers who wants to buy a punto.

these are so cooked horror stories by FIAT bashers.

getting the fact right below are the prices, here are the Lineas clutch prices

1. Part no 0059089643 - Clutch KIT - Rs. 2124.44
2. Part no 0055218037 - Clutch sleeve bearing Rs.524.44

beat that price anyone?

[StarrySky]

Originally Posted by sdp1975

So you did not feel the extra power/torque in the 90 hp punto compared to the 75 hp one ?

Mine is a 90HP Punto too - I don't have much experience with 75HP Punto. However, my car does feel more responsive than his. Everyone says the MJD opens up by the time you put 10K kms on it. Frankly, I haven't really felt much difference in my car after 14K km. But I guess, it's probably because I've been driving the car everyday, so I've grown used to it. Now when I drove my friend's brand new Punto, I can appreciate the difference between a new car and one that has a few 1000 kms on the odo.

Two other differences I noticed:
1. Clutch - Is lighter than in my car
2. Front seat - Somehow the seats in the new car felt a little bit narrower. Or maybe the seats in mine have grown wide enough to accommodate me

[livyodream]

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[sidindica]

While I wont comment on outright 0-100 acceleration on GP 90, the i20 is still quick on straight line and so is swift, which is actually closer since the later punto 90s have a weight reduction of like 30-35 odd Kgs. But when it comes to highway, just roll down the window, pump up the music, and cruise all day long without any hitch and enjoy its rock solid stability. Who cares about 0-100 anyway when the fiat gets great in gear timings which the i20 can only dream of?

Want 0-100 timings? get a sportscar and race in the F1 circuit. Diesel cars should be bought to enjoy their torque, fuel efficiency and mile munching capability. Then what are high revving petrol hatches meant for?

[hemanth.hg]

Originally Posted by Arkin evoisrevo

Now that's pure bull. I'd booked the red myself, and they just needed to procure it from Ranjangaon.

@Muni: I guess you know who other party buying a white GP 90 is.

Congratulations Arkin. Did you get the delivery? which model did you get? or any news on VIN of the vehicle allotted to you?

He knows that August/September models are available for 90HP, but not sure of Red colored 90HP. Hence checking if latest models are being delivered.

[hemanth.anand]

Originally Posted by livyodream

.........

And why is that Fiat bashers work in Fiat ? You dont know something, resign and try some non techincal job. Being a sales man you are supposed to know what you are selling. Test drive ford or toyota vehicle to feel the difference. This was exactly what I said after he said there is no turbo in punto.

.........

I can bet 9 out of 10 who are willing to take an extra step to buy fiat will be shooed off by sales team.

They are not fiat bashers, but they are tata salesmen asked to sell fiat cars as well.
This has been discussed umpteen number of times in many threads related to fiat problems.
You are right, such people should resign and take up non-technical jobs or continue selling cabs

Anyways, i can understand how bad it feels if the initial dealer experience is bad. I had the same feeling in the VW dealership

[livyodream]

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

They are not fiat bashers, but they are tata salesmen asked to sell fiat cars as well.
This has been discussed umpteen number of times in many threads related to fiat problems.
You are right, such people should resign and take up non-technical jobs or continue selling cabs

Anyways, i can understand how bad it feels if the initial dealer experience is bad. I had the same feeling in the VW dealership

Oh, I did not know that it was a common thing in Fiat (That was my 1st and last visit to Fiat). I would never had set any expectation then. I don't check car threads, especially fiats. I soo wanted to buy it but it really doesn't make sense to loose peace of mind over a machine.

1Lakh people patiently waiting for new swift perfectly makes sense .

@MCR : Call up and schedule a test drive. If they really get a vehicle for TD then ask very basic questions during the drive. Go to repair section and ask any mechanic few basic questions (where is the turbo, where is intercooler, what RPM does turbo kicks in, is it a VGT). You will know what I am talking about.

FYI : I have given a looong feed back when I went there for a TD. As usual they apologized and told it will never be repeated. I called up the same number for new vista TD few weeks back, still awaiting a response from them. Some things never change.

I never talked about delivery schedules or false promises, did I ???

[hemanth.anand]

Originally Posted by livyodream

Oh, I did not know that it was a common thing in Fiat (That was my 1st and last visit to Fiat). I would never had set any expectation then. I don't check car threads, especially fiats. I soo wanted to buy it but it really doesn't make sense to loose peace of mind over a machine.

1Lakh people patiently waiting for new swift perfectly makes sense .

An anology that comes to my mind,

People wait eagerly, spend sleepless nights in the queue outside the store, try all their influences, sign contracts etc...just to buy a thick, good-looking-from-outside, not-high-on-features cell phone with a half eaten fruit logo from people who speak good English and explain its features in a polished way.
But they will not pick any other phone which might be twice as good looking, two times slimmer, double the features, available twice as faster, for half the price from a small cell-phone dealer who cannot say if it runs on android/symbian.

Originally Posted by livyodream

I called up the same number for new vista TD few weeks back, still awaiting a response from them. Some things never change.

See, they treat all their items similarly.They won't change.

Anyways, I have learnt one lesson
"Never have expectations from the people selling a product. But have expectations from the product and check out yourself if it meets the expectations"

[amit_mechengg]

Originally Posted by livyodream

LOL, its not a story. It was me who experienced when I was thinking of shifting to punto as the delivery period for swift was delaying by the day.
And why is that Fiat bashers work in Fiat ? You dont know something, resign and try some non techincal job. Being a sales man you are supposed to know what you are selling. Test drive ford or toyota vehicle to feel the difference. This was exactly what I said after he said there is no turbo in punto.

I dont work in Fiat so I wouldnt know what is the price of mentioned parts. A friggin service guy says saar clutch is burnt and will take sometime to replace. When asked for estimation the answer given was more or less 15-16K.

Go and check out AADYA motors near hebbal flyover and you will know what I am talking about.

I can bet 9 out of 10 who are willing to take an extra step to buy fiat will be shooed off by sales team.

seems there are fools at AADYA motors. or some idiot non technical sales man recruited out of his influence there.

in Pune the service centre guys trained by FIAT are legends i must say. very technical and no nonsense.

i faced the opposite in maruti. i also own maruti brand. and i must say folks at maruti also play nonsense. if you check my various threads i have faced lots of problems with maruti too.

you need not be working with FIAT to know the clutch prices. its just a general knowledge you get out of best forums like team bhp.

yes FIAT needs to go long way to get things right. but believe me they are taking every possible step. Shoot a mail to FIAT officials and you get a call the same day.

Dont be surprised if the CEO himself calls you.

in some last post you said 1 lac people waiting for swift. dont you think it was foolish on their part to book a car without even test driving it. i know many people who did it just because its a maruti.

our very own forum members are already complaining that there is a brake issue in new swift. one had breakdown 3-4 times in middle of the road.

also there are so many cases of blown turbo on old swifts.

so one should get deeper into what they are buying instead of just shying away from some brand.

in Europe FIAT outsells Suzuki.

people die to get a turbocharged petrol and we indians shy away from TJET.

Its just an irony.

at the end i feel all are good cars , swift, i20 and punto. each car has its advantage over other.

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

An anology that comes to my mind,

People wait eagerly, spend sleepless nights in the queue outside the store, try all their influences, sign contracts etc...just to buy a thick, good-looking-from-outside, not-high-on-features cell phone with a half eaten fruit logo from people who speak good English and explain its features in a polished way.
But they will not pick any other phone which might be twice as good looking, two times slimmer, double the features, available twice as faster, for half the price from a small cell-phone dealer who cannot say if it runs on android/symbian.



See, they treat all their items similarly.They won't change.

Anyways, I have learnt one lesson
"Never have expectations from the people selling a product. But have expectations from the product and check out yourself if it meets the expectations"

you know what Hemant, you have exactly narrated the truth and fact of and average indian customer. perfect. i coudnt agree with you more than this.


Edit: and i forgot to add one incident which happened at MARUTI. when i had complained that my steering is a bit tight, they had told me that my power steering unit is damaged and they have to replace it. replacement will cost Rs.15000 approx.
then i had to show them a finger and let them know that my car never had a power steering

[sriramr9]

Originally Posted by CliffHanger

Punto, when launched, never had any major niggles; nothing such as car breaking down on the middle of the road, AC conking off, etc. The issue initially was the sub-standard fit and finish in some areas of the car's interiors. Fiat, in fact, proactively replaced Clutch Save Cylinders for all the cars sold during the initial period. Remember, Punto had already been in other countries for a considerable period, and it wasn't a newly developed and launched product.

Agreed. I was mentioning about issues like falling off glove box lid, incomplete paintwork, rusted bolts and not related to drive train or Aircon.

Originally Posted by CliffHanger

Avoid Concorde Motors Chennai at any cost, the service stations overflow, and over worked man power treat your car like zilch, not that other Tata Motor's dealer provide excellent service, in fact all of them are pathetic. I had a fair experience with Tafe Reach, so I would suggest it for you.

Originally Posted by CliffHanger

Thanks a lot for your kind suggestions.