[gauravdgr8]

Originally Posted by flameofforest

yes, in Aparna Cyberzon to be precise. Same here, not able to PM you too (or anyone else as a matter of fact).

Ok, I thought Zenith as there is a new Cosmic Gold Safari here too. Let's catchup some time.

[Thinking_Slow]

Safari 2023 facelift purchase and ownership thoughts

This is my first post ever on TBHP! Thanks to mods for accepting the membership request. I have nothing but gratitude for this forum. Have learnt a lot about cars, routes and quite a few other things over the last 15+ years. Hoping to have a good time here :)

Got the Safari (Accomplished plus 7 seater AT) delivered on 9th December 2023. Previous car was a 2008 Petrol Swift Dzire (manual). It was still going strong when I sold it (with a heavy heart and a lot of emotions) with ~1.3 lakh KMs on the odometer. Thank You Maruti, you did not fail us even once!

Summary:
Have driven ~1600 KMs so far. Ownership experience has been very good and I am happy with the purchase.

Before talking about the new family member, noting a few points about the car purchase research below.

Requirements:

• Automatic transmission. Have driven manuals all the time. The comfort and convenient of an AT is just too good to ignore at this stage of my life.
• Must be SPACIOUS. I don't mind driving a big-size car in traffic. The comfort and assurance of a spacious cabin/boot was more important than the convenience of driving a small car. Had rejected the Jeep compass for this very reason when I had first set out to upgrade my car. Also, I feel, a 7 seater in India is basically a 5 seater with an extra large boot. So, was more inclined to acquire a 7 seater.
• A design that looks good in white color. I don't like the infamous swirl marks on dark colored cars but they are inevitable regardless how well one maintains the car. So, next car had to be white where the swirl marks are not easily visible.
• Powerful engine but with well controlled NVH.
• Must have premium looking interiors.
• Must be fuel efficient. Greater than 10KMPL in city and 15KMPL on highway. I soon realized that this filtered-out almost all petrol cars in the segment. More on this below.
• Must be loaded with features. Required all possible comforts and electronics so that we are set for at least the next 5 to 7 years.

Budget:
Not more than 45 lakhs

Cars considered:

• Hyundai Tucson - Ticked most check-boxes. A very refined car and absolute pleasure to drive. But at 43 lakhs (on-road in Bangalore) for diesel AT, did not feel value for money.
  
• VW Tiguan - The low-mileage petrol engine was a deal-breaker. Besides, the interiors are too plain. Just did not feel like a >40 lakh car.
  
• Skoda Kodiaq - Very good car on all parameters. Most premium looking car of the lot. Actually it is one segment above the other cars mentioned here. However, again the low mileage petrol engine was a deal breaker.
  
• MG Hector - The petrol AT drives very well. Cabin feels plush and premium. But, MG does not have a diesel AT for some weird reason. MG’s Petrol AT is a known fuel guzzler. Plus, I did not like the exterior design elements, Hector looks a bit blingy IMHO.
  
• Toyota Hycross - The petrol-hybrid engine is a big plus. Amazing mileage. My friend consistently gets above 15KMPL in Bangalore traffic. However, felt that interiors should have been a lot better. Cabin does not feel like a Rs 38 lakh car. Also, did not like the MUVish stance (expected as it is an Innova afterall).
  
• Mahindra XUV700 - An almost-complete package. But alas, it misses some important features. Also, did not like the tacky design elements like the C shaped head lamp and XUV700 badging on the rear. Missing features like ventilated seats, auto-dimming IRVM, and passenger window sunshades were difficult to ignore. Deep down, I knew I am going to miss those features during ownership. But, this was the best choice of the lot and so booked it.

Enters the late-2023 Safari facelift:
The XUV700 (AX7 L Diesel AT) got allotted within 9 months of booking it. Just a few days before allotment, facelifted Safari was released. Tata was not even in consideration till then as I never felt right about owning a Tata car. Except Harrier, I felt all Tata cars are designed as if they try hard to get noticed (just my juvenile view, no offense to existing owners). IMHO, there is a lack of subtlety and elegance in designs of most offerings by Tata.

Used to have a wishful thought that if XUV700's interiors and features are mated with Harrier's exteriors, it will make a perfect Indian SUV. With facelifted Safari, the wishful thought became reality! It had almost everything that XUV700 was offering plus some more. So cancelled the XUV700 and booked Safari.

Some images of the car (With the serene and very beautiful Begur lake in background):








Accessories:

• 3D mats from the dealer. Got it at a discounted price of Rs 3.8K as it does not perfectly fit the car. I assume it is meant for the old Safari and Tatas have not manufactured the new one yet. Will eventually replace it with GFX mats (By Galio India). Found that Galio too has not manufactured mats for the new Safari yet. Will keep checking with them.
• A car dustbin (fits perfectly in the bottle holder as shown below) from Amazon.
• That’s it. Did not need anything else with this car. Also, I am someone who doesn't like to accessorize too much.

Car dustbin:


Likes:

• Solid road presence. A real head-turner. The 19” alloys look sick.
• Much better looking compared to the outgoing model. The exterior creases and curves have been done right this time. Makes the car look more like next generation than a mere facelift.
• Powerful enough for me. Drove it to Pondicherry. Never felt short of power on the highway.
• The electrically powered steering makes city driving so much convenient. Had heard lot of complaints about the hard steering of older model. Very happy that Tata fixed it.
• Interiors look and feel premium. Love the laminated wood panel look on dashboard. I don't mind the light-colored seats, they make the cabin look very welcoming and peaceful.
• Always wanted a white car. Some colors look better on certain designs. I feel the white and black dual tone combination looks very good on this Safari. For comparison, XUV700 in white did not look as good to me.
• Excellent ride quality. NVH is very well controlled. Family loves being driven around in it.
• Infotainment interface, response and usability. Buttery smooth to use. Have heard issues like wireless android auto disconnection in other cars. Not here. It works every single time. Good to see software quality control done right.
• Excellent music setup. Sounds very nice and covers all parts of the cabin quite well.

Dislikes:

• Poor radio reception. The audio is frequently intercepted with a static noise. I know I am not the only one because a lot of folks have complained about it. Tata, how could you miss something so basic during quality checks?
• Flimsy bonnet cover release pull-tab below the steering. With each use I feel I am going to break it!
• No dedicated sunglasses holder.
• Uneven panel gaps around the bonnet and boot cover edges.
• No option to turn wireless charging off. Wireless charging makes the phone hot and it is not good for battery in the long term. Hate that I cannot use the charging pad just to rest the phone. However, have found a pretty decent alternate way (shown in image below) and using it that way all the time.
• Apprehensive about the service experience as most Tata service centers are poorly reviewed on Google. Fingers crossed. The ones with decent ratings are always crowded. Service center expects that service appointment is booked at least 1 to 2 weeks in advance! Is this normal for Tata cars?

Phone resting vertically near the wireless charging pad:


Niggles faced:

• The digital MID has got stuck 3 times already. Once, the speedometer got stuck at 0! When it is stuck the settings button cannot change anything on the screen. Surprisingly, sometimes even an immediate car restart does not fix it. Will mention it during the first service.
• Saw the “FCW-AEB failure, contact nearest service center” warning on MID once. Ignored it and have not seen it since.
• Saw “TPMS failed” error once. Ignored it and have not seen it since.
• Feeling of brakes slipping when applied hard at a relatively high speed (~45KMPH) - Difficult to describe but this niggle bothers me the most. When the car comes across an unexpected pothole or speed bump, I naturally brake very hard to go over them as smoothly as possible. In some instances, a very annoying sound comes from under the front part of car as soon as brake is applied. The sound feels as if the brakes have slipped (not sure how else to describe it). It’s loud enough to startle the passengers. Has anyone else faced it?

Notable mentions:

• Thanks to this thread. Knew how to get the number plate installed so that the radar plate does not get partially covered (Dealer had no idea about this design flaw). Pictures attached for reference below.
• “Kitna deti hai?”. It barely touches 10KMPL during city drives (full-tank to full-tank method). My driving style is sedated, I rarely go above 2K RPM. So, was expecting more. Hopefully it will get better with time. Got MAX of 17KMPL on highway as per MID. Happy with highway efficiency.
• Got a quote of Rs 40K for 2 Years (unlimited KM) extended warranty. This will start once the initial 3 years warranty period is over. Have decided to go for it for peace of mind, especially given that it's a Tata car which is not really known for reliability.
• ADAS works well. Was apprehensive about Tata's quality checks but happy to share that the ADAS features (Adaptive cruise control, front/rear/side collision warning, side mirror incoming traffic alert) work as expected. No complaints so far.
• Have not experienced AEB (automatic emergency braking) in action even once. Too afraid to test it :D. Car does come close often to other vehicles and shows the collision warning on MID. But never saw/felt automatic braking being applied. Ideas/Suggestions to safely test it are most welcome.

Front number plate installation:




That's it for now folks. Thanks for reading. Will keep updating my ownership experience here.

[prompt.ankitg]

Originally Posted by Thinking_Slow

With facelifted Safari, the wishful thought became reality! It had almost everything that XUV700 was offering plus some more. So cancelled the XUV700 and booked Safari.

This is very similar to what I analysed and chose Safari for the same reason. I also had Jeep Meridian on the list, but did not find it classy from inside

[ike]

Originally Posted by Thinking_Slow

Dislikes:[list][*]No option to turn wireless charging off. Wireless charging makes the phone hot and it is not good for battery in the long term. Hate that I cannot use the charging pad just to rest the phone. However, have found a pretty decent alternate way (shown in image below) and using it that way all the time.

Phone resting vertically near the wireless charging pad:
Attachment 2555850

Putting the phone upside down(glass towards the surface) will not charge it, no? I usually keep mine in the Centre console inside the cupholder. I drive a Harrier BTW

[Thinking_Slow]

Originally Posted by ike

Putting the phone upside down(glass towards the surface) will not charge it, no? I usually keep mine in the Centre console inside the cupholder. I drive a Harrier BTW

By force of habit, I never rest my phone on the screen. This is because I do not use any screen protector. But, thanks for the idea!

[Highh5]

Originally Posted by Thinking_Slow

Safari 2023 facelift purchase and ownership thoughts

[*]Feeling of brakes slipping when applied hard at a relatively high speed (~45KMPH) - Difficult to describe but this niggle bothers me the most. When the car comes across an unexpected pothole or speed bump, I naturally brake very hard to go over them as smoothly as possible. In some instances, a very annoying sound comes from under the front part of the car as soon as the brake is applied. The sound feels like the brakes have slipped (not sure how else to describe it). It’s loud enough to startle the passengers. Has anyone else faced it?[/list]

It looks like ABS is getting enabled. This is how the car behaves if ABS is enabled, I'm not sure if your previous car is equipped with ABS. Normally it happens when you brake instantly, and the wheels intend to lock up. It doesn't allow the wheels to lock giving the driver a feeling of slipping and since ABS keeps releasing and locking it does make a good amount of noise.
However, I will suggest you get the brakes checked thoroughly once your car gets in for service.

[sramanat]

The brake slipping - probably ABS kicking in. It is normal and doing its job.

[satish.gawai]

Originally Posted by Thinking_Slow

Safari 2023 facelift purchase and ownership thoughts

This is my first post ever on TBHP! Thanks to mods for accepting the membership request. I have nothing but gratitude for this forum. Have learnt a lot about cars, routes and quite a few other things over the last 15+ years. Hoping to have a good time here

Welcome to TBHP.

Got the Safari (Accomplished plus 7 seater AT) delivered on 9th December 2023.

Hearty congratulations on your purchase. Indeed SAFARIII is a good option looking at your requirements. I still feel Tucson or Kodiaq for that budget were good options but, yes Kitna deti hai does matter.

No option to turn wireless charging off. Wireless charging makes the phone hot and it is not good for battery in the long term.

I believe modern phones with wireless charging option stops charging once they reach 100%. Do you feel it is getting hot even after 100% charging?

Knew how to get the number plate installed so that the radar plate does not get partially covered

Ya, that's well know issue with Safari. Very soon Tata will replace radar with LiDAR in their upcoming fleet.

“Kitna deti hai?”

I have one Safari in a close friend circle and he is getting around 11-12 KMPL in the city and close to 18 on the highway. Maybe you will see improvement after the first servicing.

keep posting your observations over time.
Enjoy...

[greyhound82]

Originally Posted by satish.gawai

Very soon Tata will replace radar with LiDAR in their upcoming fleet.

Why are they changing RADAR which is computationally simple than a LiDAR which has got higher cost and range issues. Camera + Radar is the best solution out there, right?

[satish.gawai]

Originally Posted by greyhound82

Why are they changing RADAR which is computationally simple than a LiDAR which has got higher cost and range issues. Camera + Radar is the best solution out there, right?

I believe LiDARS are more accurate than Radar under different weather conditions. Lidar can detect the object's position more accurately. It also can create a 3 dimensional view of an object which helps in deciding the pedestrian and in which direction they are moving.

However, new-generation Radars are also catching up fast with LiDARs. Both have advantages and disadvantages like Performance vs. price.

As per my info, TML is installing Radar on Avinya and later.

Pl note - I am not an expert on this topic and all my views are based on my limited knowledge; so pl pardon if any mistakes.

[The_Warrior]

Can anybody owning the New Facelift Safari give an update on performance of Headlights with oncoming traffic at night. In complete darkness even my Hexa lights perform good but in driving conditions at night it is a mess with most of the people driving on High Beam. Am planning to shift to the new facelift safari and was a little apprehensive about the lights

[prompt.ankitg]

Originally Posted by The_Warrior

Can anybody owning the New Facelift Safari give an update on performance of Headlights with oncoming traffic at night. In complete darkness even my Hexa lights perform good but in driving conditions at night it is a mess with most of the people driving on High Beam. Am planning to shift to the new facelift safari and was a little apprehensive about the lights

I have driven 1700km between DEL and HYD and I did it in two days including significant driving at the night, didn’t notice any issue with the lights. It seemed ok and visibility was perfect

[Thinking_Slow]

Originally Posted by Highh5

It looks like ABS is getting enabled. This is how the car behaves if ABS is enabled, I'm not sure if your previous car is equipped with ABS. Normally it happens when you brake instantly, and the wheels intend to lock up. It doesn't allow the wheels to lock giving the driver a feeling of slipping and since ABS keeps releasing and locking it does make a good amount of noise.
However, I will suggest you get the brakes checked thoroughly once your car gets in for service.

I see. My previous car did not had ABS so I have no experience of when it kicks-in.

The slipping/grinding like sound is very loud and jarring. Today, it happened again. It was so loud that the biker next to me also got surprised and was looking at me perplexed.

It does not feel normal. Will mention it during the upcoming service.

[cosmicsafari]

[*]The digital MID has got stuck 3 times already. Once, the speedometer got stuck at 0! When it is stuck the settings button cannot change anything on the screen. Surprisingly, sometimes even an immediate car restart does not fix it. Will mention it during the first service.

Unfortunately, this is also an issue with my Safari (same model), where the speed had gotten stuck at 22 instead of 0

[greyhound82]

Originally Posted by satish.gawai

I believe LiDARS are more accurate than Radar under different weather conditions. Lidar can detect the object's position more accurately. It also can create a 3 dimensional view of an object which helps in deciding the pedestrian and in which direction they are moving.

Offtopic: LiDAR sensors generate a dense 3D point cloud, providing accurate depth information(do we need that precision for navigation? humans employ stereo vision and fuzzy measurements), for applications such as obstacle detection, localization, and mapping. However, LiDAR generates a significant amount of data(3d point cloud) which leads to increased processing and storage requirements, resulting in the need for more powerful and costly SoCs. While there are developments for solid-state LiDAR units with no moving parts, known as LiDAR on a chip, that can potentially reduce the cost of integrating LiDAR.

RADAR systems can be more robust in adverse weather conditions compared to LiDAR. Radio waves can penetrate through rain and snow, allowing RADAR to maintain better performance in challenging weather conditions.(Due to low frequencies compared to Lasers)

With recent advancements in computer vision algorithms, fusing cameras and radar into a single setup is more straightforward, considering the dimensionality of the data and incorporating multiple use cases into a single SoC. Cameras serve as a first principle and biologically inspired means of solving the navigation problem.

Tesla's Autopilot employs only cameras for navigation. May be for Avinya, they might be using Mobileye's system or Waymo's system while Bosch ADAS modules are for low end models. Thanks so much for the information.