[fhdowntheline]

Originally Posted by kunalkhandagale

I recently took test of the same model but I ended up being totally unimpressed by what Citroen had to offer. Maruti 800 styled flaps to open the door, rear passenger power window buttons placed near gearbox, no reclining option for rear passenger, key seemed way too outdated etc.

I own 16 years old Corolla Altis along with Nexon EV Max top variant. Seating in that Citroen felt way different compared to modern cars I'm driving right now.

Only 10/10 point was the mechanics. The steering, braking and acceleration for a CVT transmission was quite impressive. But for the price point, I don't think it'll have us Indians into buying these cars from Citroen until they understand Indian customers needs.

First of all its a torque convertor AT and not CVT, and second, how many hatchback cars in the sub 10 lac category offer rear reclining seats ?
Third, a simple mechanical key is the best thing about this car, rather than fancy push start buttons which have ZERO value.
Citroen may have various other issues but the product seems to be a mechanically sound package with just the right kind of conveniences.

[SARP912]

Hi Team BHP family, Namaste. My parents are planning to buy the 2024 updated version of C3 Turbo Shine MT which is planned for delivery in the next few weeks. We live in Mysore. Looking for medium to long term feedback on performance, any maintenance challenges & fuel efficiency.

[rajukamal]

Originally Posted by SARP912

Hi Team BHP family, Namaste. My parents are planning to buy the 2024 updated version of C3 Turbo Shine MT which is planned for delivery in the next few weeks. We live in Mysore. Looking for medium to long term feedback on performance, any maintenance challenges & fuel efficiency.

I was looking at the C3 as well but with the impending Kylaq launch, I am on the fence.

[sjain2054]

No cars for old men?

Background
Need to buy a car for my 75 year old parents for city use only. Current ride is a 2017 Grand i10 AT Sportz that has done 20,000km in 7 years.

Requirements
1. Naturally aspirated engine for city use. Turbo may not even spool by the time the destination arrives. We live in a small town. Plus, father will not remember to idle before shutting engine - simply not used to it.
2. High sitting because of lower back issues and good suspension. Roads are bad in our town.
3. As compact as possible.
4. Only torque converter and CVTs. I do not want DCT/DSG troubles or AMT experience
5. Car will run an average of 200-250kms per month. Therefore, mileage does not really matter but more the better
6. As many features as my budget allows
7. Budget - up to Rs 15-16 lacs. Lower the better (obviously). Will (very) grudgingly go to 20 lakhs if needed.
8. EVs make for best city cars but parents do not want EV in current stage of evolution. Resale/depreciation is important and so is cost of purchase and reliability.

Research done till now
1. Citroen C3 Automatic: Ticks requirement numbers 2,3,4,5,7. That's 5 out of 7. Main issue is with Turbo petrol problems in city use, no useful features such as 360 cam, UV cut glass, auto dimming IRVM, ventilated seats and dash cam which are useful for India. In the after market, I can fix all but 360 cam and ventilated seats. Reliability of turbo, after sales service and resale remain a problem.

2. Nissan Magnite: Ticks requirement numbers 2 (except for good suspension),3,4,5,6 and 7. That's 5.5 out of 7. Main issue is with Turbo petrol problems in city use and reliability of turbo, after sales service and resale remain a problem. Like Citroen, I am not sure of Nissan.

3. Maruti Brezza: Seems to tick all requirements except for a good suspension. That is 6.5 out of 7. But, we do not really like it! The drive/looks gave a feeling of "meh". Also, Ventilated seats are not available, interiors are bad.

4. Hyundai Creta IVT SX(O): Ticks points 1,2,4,5,6. That is 5 out of 7. It is not compact. It is costly at 21.5 lakhs. But it has the best of all other requirements. Size one might get used to and price one might make peace with?

5. Honda Elevate: Ticks requirements 1,2,4,5,6 but only half of 6. That is 4.5 of 7. We kept reading "car from 2017 being launched in 2023" and that is putting us off quite a lot. But maybe for our simple requirements of NA engines, we must not overthink?

Other points to note
- We have not considered any car that sits low.
- One might argue that if Turbo is considered in C3 and Magnite then might as well consider Venue/Sonet but we want to avoid DCT issues at all costs. Also, like someone on TBHP said, "Buying a Skoda/VW car with TC thinking that it will make it a reliable car is like going to Afghanistan for a safe holiday after the war is over". So not considering Skoda/VW cars.
- Sonet Diesel TC X-Line was tempting at slightly stretched budget of 18 lakhs but with our kind of driving, DPF issues are inevitable. Can one remove the DPF by hand, wash it and put it back..haha (I am joking. Wouldn't that make things easy instead of "regenerating" it? Obviously, I do not know how it works.)
- Jimny was considered but ruled out due to impractical interiors, strained engine and lack of basic good to have features that help elderly people drive.

At what stage of researching/buying we are at
We have not test driven anything yet. Test drives will start tomorrow. Having said that, after seeing all details on paper, at this stage parents are saying C3 is the best (primarily because it costs the least and has good reviews from you guys - BHPians). But after getting to know the unpredictability of after sales and resale value, now they are apprehensive about it. Brezza seems to be the only option left but it is not pulling the heart-strings at all. Lets see how things evolve after test drives.

Please help me think this through
Sometimes, one needs to hear it from other people. Should we wait another year for more launches from MG etc which might be good for city user and elderly folks? I don't know.

We are open to pre-owned route through Spinny etc.

One last rant
I am appalled at the lack of NA+proper AT+top spec+reasonably priced options in India. Why is everyone running after Turbos? For city use there is no use case for it. Example, a Kia Sonet X-Line with the 1.5L/1.2L NA engine and CVT can be sold for about 1 lac less than the 17.2 lakhs on road price it currently commands. No? What a perfect city car under 4m, high sitting and ALL the features one wants!

I was in Japan recently and the number of car options they have that will appeal to elderly people is crazy.

[KnK]

Finally got our C3 Turbo AT delivered

We had booked Citroen C3 Turbo AT single tone variant in white color. Even after 2 weeks of booking there was no idea about car allocation or even monotone variant production in plant.
Atlast decided to switch our booking to dual tone variant - after which got the car alloted immediately , infact 2 of such cars were in transit from plant and we got one alloted.

As accessories we had opted for engine underbody fiber guard and also the 'vibe pack' . Vibe pack basically involves side cladding with plastic inserts along with plastic inserts in front and rear bumper - for which we can choose color for the plastic inserts as well as rear view mirror. The color options included white , orange and grey. We requested the showroom guys to color the inserts with red color - which to our surprise the team at Citroen accepted - and it turned out to be really good and gave the C3 a mini C5 feel.

[b]But [b] the Citroen guys messed up the delivery big time.
All the paper works and formalities were done properly by the team and we took the delivery.
Just after I drove the car outside the showroom on to the road - car stalled. I was seriously confused about what might have gone wrong. I tried cranking 2-3 times but it was not getting started. Shortly after that check engine light also came on.
I immediately called the showroom guys and they came to the scene. We all suspected the car might have run out of fuel , filled the car with fuel brought by the sales team and thank god car started on next crank. Got the car filled with fuel from next station and drove to service centre to get the car scanned.
Scanning showed errors for low fuel level as well as signal from fuel pump. Fuel pump error was "voltage too low" - this has got me seriously concerned. Got the car back after logging the details and drove the car back - it did not have any issues and car is running fine now.

My concern is that I have heard that high pressure pump lubrication is mainly by fuel itself - so if the car runs out of fuel the pump will have to work without lubrication which may cause more wear and tear which in turn can cause premature pump failure. Should i be concerned about this issue ? Is there any indicator or engine behaviour pattern by which we can suspect an impending pump failure ?.

I was surprised to see the level of mismanagement from the part of dealer / showroom guys which spoilt the whole delivery event. The sales person confidentially mentioned the car has 5 litres fuel filled and my car stalled just outside the showroom - either they have forgot to fill the fuel or someone in the delivery team is not straight - either way the management is to be blamed for the whole fiasco.

I seriously hope and pray this event might not have affected the high pressure pump.

[kunalkhandagale]

Originally Posted by superblover

The C3 has a 6 speed Aisin torque converter transmission and not a CVT.

Maybe I've been misinformed by the sales executive about it. She claimed to be part of Tata group for a decade before joining Citroen. Yet she didn't know that Nexon's EV variant weren't 210 mm on ground but 160 mm, I had to show user's manual to prove my point.

I jokingly told her that my Altis has more ground clearance than Nexon EV Max. To which, she bluntly refused to accept the fact. That's when I thought no point in digging for Altis' manual and showing her.

So I totally agree with you, I might be misinformed about the vehicle.

Thanks for correcting my knowledge.

Originally Posted by fhdowntheline

First of all its a torque convertor AT and not CVT, and second, how many hatchback cars in the sub 10 lac category offer rear reclining seats ?
Third, a simple mechanical key is the best thing about this car, rather than fancy push start buttons which have ZERO value.
Citroen may have various other issues but the product seems to be a mechanically sound package with just the right kind of conveniences.

First point, I totally agree with you it's torque convertor not CVT, I was misinformed by sales executive.
Second, automatic variant exceeds 10 lakhs category. It's almost 12 lakhs on road. With that amount of money, I'd personally expect things to justify the price tag.
Third, no doubt mechanical keys are the best, no doubt about it. They are foolproof, time tested things but you can't say that new tech push start buttons have zero value. If they had zero value then N2O (nitrous oxide) controls would have been turn keys instead of push buttons. With all due respect to your emotions, new age tech saves time. I can say that because I own classical 16 years Altis and a year old Nexon EV Max which is on the other side of the spectrum.

Cars in my opinion aren't just machines for petrol heads like us but an emotion. So I'm happy that your happy with your choice. Happy motoring!

[vamsi.vadrevu]

Originally Posted by sjain2054

Please help me think this through
Sometimes, one needs to hear it from other people. Should we wait another year for more launches from MG etc which might be good for city user and elderly folks? I don't know.

Your thought process on the research is accurate in most parts. But you're ruling out turbo engines.

I have a Magnite CVT and I don't find it underpowered in the city at all.

The Citroen C3 Automatic has even better driveability because of the torque converter. And the engine on Citroen C3 is much superior to Magnite's.

If citroen had released the C3 Automatic back in 2023 June, I'd have bought it. I still feel like I missed out.

Citroen C3 engine is an award winning puretech 1.2 gasoline direct injection engine. What this means is that it's peak torque starts at around 1700 RPM. it'll push you into your seat basically. This kind of torque is addictive and very much fun. Almost diesel like in nature. You really should test drive it to experience it. Stellantis has fixed the reliability issues with the puretech 1.2 engine by putting a timing chain in it. So essentially you have a reliable, torquey and comfortable hatchback with high ground clearance and excellent value for money.

I'm advocating for c3 turbo automatic despite owning a Magnite. I think your research was spot on. I'm actually considering the C3 automatic for my father to replace our aging Alto K10 which is giving him trouble getting in and out.

Happy shopping and test drive everything before you buy.

[echo77]

I would suggest that team-bhp to do a follow on review of the C3 1.2 Turbo AT as it ticks most of the boxes from the "what you won't like" list in the old C3 review. It is as if Citroen went through the team-bhp review and made a checklist:

1. Electric ORVM adjustment, auto folding too
2. Manual IVRM dimmer
3. Climate control (AC is a chiller and goes down to 14C)
4. Rear wiper and defogger. Has a separate button for front windscreen defogging also.
5. Reverse camera (a bit grainy, but workable)
6. Alloy Wheels
7. Tachometer (in a separate screen)
8. Multiple variants and options
9. Torque Converter AT (Aisin)

Car has a punchy turbo engine, smooth AT and great suspension and handling.

I am also led to believe that the 1.2 Turbo AT no longer comes with a timing belt, as the belt is mentioned in the service manual only for the NA engine and not for turbo engine. I will try to confirm this.

The base Shine AT variant comes at 9.99L with OTR approx 11.5L to 12L depending on your state.

[Bhokal]

Originally Posted by vamsi.vadrevu

Citroen C3 engine is an award winning puretech 1.2 gasoline direct injection engine.

Is it GDi or MPFi? Strangely there is hardly any info available on it, or at least I could not find one.

[vamsi.vadrevu]

Originally Posted by Bhokal

Is it GDi or MPFi? Strangely there is hardly any info available on it, or at least I could not find one.

It is a GDI engine. MPFI can't achieve such high torque ratings at such low RPMs. Only GDI engines have very high torque at low RPMs like 1750RPM onwards. They get their peak torque very early making them very diesel like.

The engine model is specifically EB2DT and it is gasoline direct injection with a turbo. It is also called Puretech 110.

And yes, even I could not find official documents on this but this information is available pretty much on every European website for puretech 110 engine. I think the Japanese are more diligent in documenting their specifications. I couldn't even find the Citroen's official user manual to download online. But this is what I found from some other website that seems to have the necessary information. I hope any existing C3 owners can confirm if this is how the official user manual looks like.

https://service.citroen.com/ACddb/mo..._045_en-GB.pdf

[BraveArc]

The Citroen C3 automatic is on sale in India at a price of between Rs. 9.99 - 10.27 lakhs (ex-showroom).

What you'll like:

• Smooth & competent 6-speed automatic transmission
• All the features that should have been there are now there. Electric ORVM adjustment, IRVM dimmer, climate control, rear wiper & defogger, reversing camera, alloy wheels, tachometer
• Striking looks

What you won't:

• AT is only available on top end variant
• Some of the funky colour combinations are no longer available
• Long-term reliability & after-sales service quality are still big unknowns; Dealer network has become smaller with the struggles of sister brands

Since the Citroen C3 has already been reviewed by Team-BHP, this report will only focus on changes made to the AT variant.

The C3 gets a 6-speed automatic transmission, which is a welcome addition for city driving. The automatic variant is priced at a premium of around Rs.1 lakh(On-road) over the manual versions, but after the test drive, I feel it is worth the extra cost for the convenience it offers.
The AISIN sourced 6-speed automatic gearbox in the C3 is smooth and when paired with the really nice to drive 1.2L turbo, makes this a very enjoyable city car to drive around in. While it may not be the fastest in terms of shift times, it is well-tuned for city driving and did not miss a beat during my short time with the car. The accelerator pedal is feather-light but sensitive. Feather the pedal and the gearbox shifts up the gears early, keeping the revs low, push it and after half a second it's down a gear or two and you are climbing speeds very rapidly with this gem of an engine. The shift quality is very smooth as well, making this AT that much nicer to drive.

If in the market for a somewhat small AT, then this has to be on the list. Plus, with Citroen, due to their not so great sales numbers, you are in a position to bargain more and get a good deal.

LED Projector Headlamps add to the looks of the car


Electric ORVM with integrated indicators. The old indicator slot now has a chrome Citroen badge


ORVM controls are to the right side. Twist the knob downwards to fold the mirrors


Climate control


IRVM has manual dimming


Grab handles for front passengers


Instrument cluster has been upgraded and shows multiple things


Interiors now get only one trim colour called Anodized Grey

[jinojohnt]

Originally Posted by BraveArc

[*]All the features that should have been there are now there. Electric ORVM adjustment, IRVM dimmer, climate control, rear wiper & defogger, reversing camera, alloy wheels, tachometer

Any possibility of getting a 360 degree camera in the next update?

[ByKaizen]

It's a competent product with a good engine, transmission and suspension. Poor sales is due to limited dealership/service network, Citroen survival in India and resale value. If this car has a badge of Suzuki/Hyundai/Kia it will easily sit among top 10.

[JunkyardHunter]

I genuinely feel bad for Citroen. They launched the C3 as a car with sorted basics, but with no features. It bombed and now when they are trying to remedy it, they are still not successful. Botched launch + almost nonexistent dealer network = failure.

[vamsi.vadrevu]

Can you let us know how the ergonomics are? The dead pedal positioning, distance between the brake pedal and dead pedal. And steering reach adjustment (is it available?).

Also, how was the manual mode? Did the gearbox have delay when asked to shift up or down in the manual mode? How high does it let the RPMs rise to and how low can engine RPM go in each gear when using it in manual mode. Could someone please shed some light on these aspects of the automatic gearbox.

Researching this as an option for my father to replace his aging Alto K10.