[lalittalwar]

Originally Posted by cool_dube

Which color did you book? White is usually available sooner than the other two.

Here is a list of stuff you'd miss out on

White it is. I can't maintain black in Gurgaon, and don't like the diffused silver.

As I pointed out in my original post, the stuff I'll really miss is front parking sensors, electrochromic IRVM, and one touch up-down for all windows. Other stuff I can live without and most of them I won't even notice.

Originally Posted by PrideRed

If you love your Audio, would recommend to spend 4Lac if possible, just for that Subwoofer.

Audio is something I would likely upgrade; the speakers atleast. I'll scout for good Focals to go in the car. I'm not sure of the brand and size of the stock drivers yet. But, these things will be done over time. Took me 2 years to get my GT to where it is . And a good set of components doesnt need a sub, as my music preferences don't go deep down into the bass range. Rather it is the mids which are more important. Thanks you for your suggestion though buddy, but Vitamin M is always in short supply

[PrideRed]

Originally Posted by GTO

Although I am a total engine guy, I would make a rare exception here and still pick the Endeavour over the Fortuner. The Fortuner makes more power, but in almost every other area, I find the Endeavour to be superior. Especially the comfortable ride quality, nicer steering, looks, interior, features, sound system etc.

I would request team bhp to test drive/review/compare regular 4x2 AT and 4x4 AT Fortuner. Former, because it has a better ride due to 17 inchers(though not as good as Endeavour's front seat). 4x4AT for audio, off-road kit and if you like beige, should check chamois interiors.
While there is no denying that Endeavour has its strength, but the area where it dominates has reduced such as Engine/gearbox, 4x4 kit,insulation, AC, fuel efficiency, interior space on offer. And in some areas it's even steven- Audio, features and safety. Ride quality, build quality, easy to drive, cheaper price tag continue to remain Ford's strong points. Despite variant spread , one mistake from Toyota is they don't offer a model which offers 4x4, better ride(17 inchers) and bling features(Legender).

I am not saying one is better, but with facelift, Toyota has upped the game significantly where as Endeavour stayed same since 2016 or even went down in some areas. Post facelift, I know of folks who spent sleepless nights to finalize their ride between these two segment toppers.

I am sharing this after driving close to 6K in Fortuner and 60K in Endeavour both which continue to share my garage and love both for what they offer.

[lalittalwar]

Ford India actually helped to solve a dilemma. I said earlier that I had spent many hours thinking of whether to go for Titanium or Titanium plus variant. Now it seems that it can only be the Titanium Plus. Got a call from my dealer today that Ford factory is working under constraints and will not produce the Titanium variant of Endeavour for some time. They cannot give an idea when they could deliver my vehicle if I stick to Titanium. It would definitely not be delivered before September/October.

So, being out of options, I agreed to change my booking to Titanium plus. They will now let me know by 5-6 June as to when my car can be allotted, as Ford will finalize their production schedule for the next month by then. I am told that my booking will have a priority since the change was suggested by Ford.

my guess is that in keeping the price for the titanium variant under 30 lac ex showroom, the profitability on it is much lower. Hence, higher variants are being produced by the factory to maximize the margins in the current times of constraints.

[cool_dube]

Originally Posted by lalittalwar

my guess is that in keeping the price for the titanium variant under 30 lac ex showroom, the profitability on it is much lower. Hence, higher variants are being produced by the factory to maximize the margins in the current times of constraints.

Yeah, I believe that is it. And I also believe that this is a blessing in disguise for you I am sure you will not regret going for the T+ over T.

BTW, here is the latest on manufacturing status at Ford India's Chennai plant - https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...adu-plant.html (Ford suspends production at Tamil Nadu plant)

[manasmadaan]

Hello everyone,

I am in the market for an SUV in the 30-40 lakh bracket.

Requirements (Not in any particular order):

1) Proper SUV
2) Diesel (obviously)
3) Premium feel and interiors
4) Ability to go almost anywhere.
5) Features list (obviously after spending such money)
6) Decent to good after sales experience
7) Good enough ride quality
8) Audio experience should be good
9) 4X4 is welcome, although not a necessity

The choice now is between Ford Endeavour 4x2 AT Titanium plus and Mahindra Alturus G4 4x4 AT. Fortuner is already ruled out.

I know that ford's is probably a superior product as compared to mahindra's but the catch is that there is a massive 3 lakh discount going on for Alturus bringing the 4X4 OTR to around 33 lakhs whereas Endeavour does not have any discounts and is priced around 37.89 lakhs OTR for 4x2.
So there is around 6 lakhs cost difference between the two and i also get the 4x4 in Alturus vs 4x2 in Endeavour.

Before everyone says that Mahindra's ASS is a hit or miss, i have driven XUV 500 for 7 years and have never faced any problems there and i have a good repo with most of the service advisors there.

I am really confused between the two.

Kindly help me in deciding between the two.

Thanks

[PrideRed]

Originally Posted by manasmadaan

Before everyone says that Mahindra's ASS is a hit or miss, i have driven XUV 500 for 7 years and have never faced any problems there and i have a good repo with most of the service advisors there.

I am really confused between the two.

Kindly help me in deciding between the two.

Thanks

Between the two, Endeavour should be the pick easily.
Unless you don't want to spend extra 4-5L, I can't seem to understand why would anyone pickup Alturas. Ssangyong has filed for bankruptcy, and Mahindra will most likely sell until stocks last.
Other than possibility of being discontinued, Alturas Engine ain't any better than Endeavour, and ride isn't that great(Check the short review in TBHP). Alturas has better interiors, some features and you get to save some money Also do note, Alturas doesnot have brand value of Endeavour.
XUV500 was made in India by Mahindra and over 10years Mahindra sold these in good numbers, Service center folks have been trained well. Alturas is a rebadged Rexton, and the experience hasn't been great for many.

Note: If you are looking for early delivery, as somone pointed out, Titanium is not available and you might have to stretch to Titanium+.

[CEF_Beasts]

Originally Posted by manasmadaan

The choice now is between Ford Endeavour 4x2 AT Titanium plus and Mahindra Alturus G4 4x4 AT. Fortuner is already ruled out.

Before everyone says that Mahindra's ASS is a hit or miss, i have driven XUV 500 for 7 years and have never faced any problems there and i have a good repo with most of the service advisors there.

Whatever you save with the Alturas at this time will easily be recovered by the Endeavour while selling . I would recommend the Endeavour.

Regarding service advisors at Mahindra, ask their views on the Alturas, if you end up choosing it.

[Livnletcarsliv]

This is the story of Ford in India - Ford's India books were never positive. One of the biggest reasons that Ford is still continuing its operations in India is because of the exports. Ford's base in India contributes to a major share of the global revenue.

Ford will never go aggressive all alone in India. Augmented by the break-up with Mahindra, ford's frustration continues to spike.

Coming to Endeavour (even though I don't own one), one of the main reason I think it still takes the 2nd spot in the sales charts in the segment is due to the lack of alternatives. Fortuner is the only other appropriate alternative. Ford's DNA of Build, Driving experience, Ride and Handling and Performance are mostly missing in the BS6 version (even though it still tries to maintain that).

Now that Honda is gone (even though it was never a proper alternative to Endy), Alturas will be gone (SsangYong is a huge loss for M&M - eventually in the pipeline to be sold off), VW/Skoda opting for petrol only models, Mitsubishi gone - I consider that the Fortuner is the only alternative to Endy in this segment. Not a big fan of the Laptop on Mobile (Gloster) which is definitely a value for money but still has a long way to go to build the trust and base in an anti-Chinese market like India.

So ford is well aware that overtaking Fortuner can never happen. So they are playing safe cards with the Endy and trying to maintain the no.2 slot even though they strongly have potential to make the Endy the leader in the segment (by offering what's the missing pieces - better engines, more features, etc.)

[46TheDoctor]

Originally Posted by manasmadaan

Hello everyone,

I am in the market for an SUV in the 30-40 lakh bracket.



I am really confused between the two.

Kindly help me in deciding between the two.

Thanks

While i believe that Alturas and Endeavour both are good products with good kits, we need to remember that Alturas is a flopped car which may create parts availability issues in the long run clubbed with the eventual sale of Ssangyong by Mahindra. Endeavour also has a superior ride handling balance over the Alturas.

So go for the Alturas only if:
1. Your average annual running of the car is not more than 15k km so that you wont need significant parts replacement apart from normal wear and tear and occasional accidental damages in the 7-10 years of ownership period.
2. You intend to keep the car for a long duration 7-10 years so that you wont have to take big depreciation hit once the Alturas is discontinued and Ssangyong is eventually out of our markets.
3. You are saving minimum 7 Lakhs over the equivalent Endeavour variant in the aquisition cost.

Otherwise, Endeavour is a safer bet among the two but it is also due for generation change within a year or two.

[Fiestaboy]

Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv

Coming to Endeavour (even though I don't own one), one of the main reason I think it still takes the 2nd spot in the sales charts in the segment is due to the lack of alternatives. Fortuner is the only other appropriate alternative.

Ford's DNA of Build, Driving experience, Ride and Handling and Performance are mostly missing in the BS6 version (even though it still tries to maintain that).

Hi Livnletcarsliv,
Are you sure Ford DNA of build, Ride & handling are missing in BS6 version?
I also don't own an Endeavour, but with the drive I did on my friends BS6 version, I don't think so & the character remains same except for the Powertrain. I will leave it to the Endeavour owners to comment further.

I will still vote for Endeavour & I think it will loose only to Fortuner on reliability & excluding that, its a really well rounded car.

[cool_dube]

Originally Posted by manasmadaan

The choice now is between Ford Endeavour 4x2 AT Titanium plus and Mahindra Alturus G4 4x4 AT

Mahindra Alturas G4 is an excellent VFM proposition, especially given the discounts you mention. However, do note that SsangYong has gone belly-up and it is just a matter of time before the SUV is discontinued in the Indian market. A key challenge you will face few years down the line would be lead time for procurement of spares and below-average resale value. At this point, in all the excitement of selecting a new car, you might not see that as a major issue but believe me, after-sales support will prove to be a BIG factor very soon after the purchase. I would not have sold my impeccably maintained Pajero SFX had it not been for the same issue being faced with Mitsubishi after-sales. So, net-net, my vote would go for the Endeavour unless you are smitten by the Alturas and do not mind the cons cited above!

Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv

Ford's DNA of Build, Driving experience, Ride and Handling and Performance are mostly missing in the BS6 version

Not sure if you have driven the BS6 version but I would politely disagree on that front. Except for a relatively lower-powered engine, the Endeavour is a brilliant SUV that would bring a smile to your face every time you get behind that wheel.

Originally Posted by Fiestaboy

I will leave it to the Endeavour owners to comment further.

Agree

[Livnletcarsliv]

Originally Posted by Fiestaboy

Hi Livnletcarsliv,
Are you sure Ford DNA of build, Ride & handling are missing in BS6 version?
I also don't own an Endeavour, but with the drive I did on my friends BS6 version, I don't think so & the character remains same except for the Powertrain. I will leave it to the Endeavour owners to comment further.

I will still vote for Endeavour & I think it will loose only to Fortuner on reliability & excluding that, its a really well rounded car.

Hi Fiestaboy,

Not completely missing. Missing I meant is compromised in some way due to the performance mismatch. For such a heavy car and for ford fanboys (even for other car enthusiasts) under the hood specs are not as expected even though it manages to do its job otherwise. And this mismatch negatively impacts the driving dynamics of the car (Even though it still could have improved). Even my choice is Endy hands down.

Originally Posted by cool_dube

Not sure if you have driven the BS6 version but I would politely disagree on that front. Except for a relatively lower-powered engine, the Endeavour is a brilliant SUV that would bring a smile to your face every time you get behind that wheel.

Agree

It's the best handler in its segment though. However, there's still room for significant improvement.

[ulhas.ahirrao]

Originally Posted by Livnletcarsliv

Coming to Endeavour (even though I don't own one), one of the main reason I think it still takes the 2nd spot in the sales charts in the segment is due to the lack of alternatives. Fortuner is the only other appropriate alternative. Ford's DNA of Build, Driving experience, Ride and Handling and Performance are mostly missing in the BS6 version (even though it still tries to maintain that).

With all due respect, completely disagree with you. I don't have any baggage of 3.2 so can't compare. But the ride, handling and the driving experience of the Endavour are SUPER. I personally find power and pull absolutely fine (may be because I have 4x2).

You should first experience the vehicle though to see if what you said is actually missing

[lalittalwar]

Originally Posted by ulhas.ahirrao

But the ride, handling and the driving experience of the Endavour are SUPER. I personally find power and pull absolutely fine (may be because I have 4x2).

This is very much the case, as the difference in performance and mileage between the 4x4 and 4x2 Endeavour is due to 2 big factors

1. The weight of the car. 4x4 is 100 kg heavier than 4x2

2. The 4x4 drivetrain will have higher losses as it is powering 2 differentials compared to single differential in 4x2.

Both these would combine to give a decent edge to 4x2 in performance and mileage as well. so, if you aren't going to be taking your car to the sand dunes and really treacherous terrain, then 4x4 makes little sense.

Plus I would like to add that not each car is required to be a tarmac scorcher and a drag racer. how many would be taking a big body-on-frame SUV to the track and take corners at 100 kmph? Ride and handling would be as per the use case, and while researching, I saw a handling comparison between Endeavour, Fortuner and Gloster and, it was the Endeavour which still took corners best; unnecessary though in my opinion. As long as the car offers a soft and supple ride on the broken roads, and can have the poise at about 120 kmph on highways, it is good enough for me.

I also found queries on the thread regarding the ability of Endeavour to go uphill. I can understand where the question came from, but not so long ago, the Endeavour came with a 2.2 engine, which was lower than the 2.0 in power and torque, and the owners were able to take it everywhere, including uphill. I regularly used to take my 2 tonne Safari 3.0 Dicor with just 115 bhp to hills in Himachal with engine literally whistling (turbo whistle )

So for a 168 bhp vehicle, it should be a walk in the park.

[PrideRed]

Originally Posted by lalittalwar

Both these would combine to give a decent edge to 4x2 in performance and mileage as well. so, if you aren't going to be taking your car to the sand dunes and really treacherous terrain, then 4x4 makes little sense.

Plus I would like to add that not each car is required to be a tarmac scorcher and a drag racer. how many would be taking a big body-on-frame SUV to the track and take corners at 100 kmph? Ride and handling would be as per the use case, and while researching, I saw a handling comparison between Endeavour, Fortuner and Gloster and, it was the Endeavour which still took corners best; unnecessary though in my opinion. As long as the car offers a soft and supple ride on the broken roads, and can have the poise at about 120 kmph on highways, it is good enough for me.

I also found queries on the thread regarding the ability of Endeavour to go uphill. I can understand where the question came from, but not so long ago, the Endeavour came with a 2.2 engine, which was lower than the 2.0 in power and torque, and the owners were able to take it everywhere, including uphill. I regularly used to take my 2 tonne Safari 3.0 Dicor with just 115 bhp to hills in Himachal with engine literally whistling (turbo whistle )

Partly agree with your observations about 4x4 . My Endeavour is 4x2 and is good on tarmac. But I have no guts to take this to slushy road or even surface with grass. While I agree I may not use 4x4 majority of times, I miss this when needed, especially in a heavy SUV like Endeavour. An empty RWD car can get stuck in even slightest of slush and if you are stuck you probably, have to get a tractor to pull out the behemoth. If you love travelling, 4x4 is such a useful toolkit and lets you explore!.

When our 2.2 came home in 2016, 160 horses was decent even when compared to competition- be it previous gen Fortuner/MU7. Most of the lower segment cars made about 140 horses. Competition were slow too and did not make much difference. This is why 3.2 special, 197 horses and oodles of torque were unheard of in 2016.

Come 2021 competition and even cars from lower segment have moved on but Endeavour's engine went in opposite direction. As a standalone 2.0L is decent offering adequate power but when you compare, it falls short by big margin. That's not discounting other strengths of Endeavour and upto individual to pick based on their preference and if engine meets your needs, perfect. I did test drive of 2.0L and how good the engine is? Probably as good as ride in Fortuner for sake of comparison. Its somewhat similar to my 2.2, given its even lighter than 2.0L.

Ford management did not expect Toyota to bump up the price so much, had they known they would have launched Bi Turbo and priced at a premium of 2L in 2019, which in 2021 would have turned out to be great value.