[bhpfaninblr]

Yes
sound insulation-wise:
Best is Hyundai 1.4 CRDI > Hyundai 1.6 CRDI > DDiS200 > DDiS320 > Volkswagen TDI > Honda iDTec aluminium engine
Aluminium engine is more noisy than the cast iron DDiS engines

However DDiS320 has better torque than Hyundai 1.6 CRDI at any useful rpm 1000-3500 rpm

Originally Posted by Dr.Naren

I do not agree. Amaze IDTEC is very crude. S-Cross DDIS 200 is more silent than IDTEC and even VAG TDI.

During TD of 1.3 and 1.6 S-Cross, I had observed that engine noise inside cabin was lesser in 1.3

[sunejarahul]

Originally Posted by Sree73

Taking rest @courtyard after a Monsoon run to Thrissur - Kerala yesterday.

Mileage - 35000 KMs, FE on this trip - 24KM/L, still running on stock JK Elanzo.
Not much of a cabin noise if run with AC on / slight music.

You've already run it for 35k kms and your car looks amazing! My premium silver has got a million swirls and a dozen dings here and there at 27k Kms thanks to the Delhi traffic and Indian Road sense. In comparison mine looks like a 2 year old while yours merely 6 months. Probably a difference in car wash care too, mine is washed by the regular car wash guys in the colony. Yours looks detailed, in contrast. Good job.. If only I were half as careful about the car as you there! 😁 👍🏻

[Sree73]

Originally Posted by sunejarahul

You've already run it for 35k kms and your car looks amazing! Probably a difference in car wash care too, mine is washed by the regular car wash guys in the colony. Yours looks detailed, in contrast. Good job..

Thanks for the compliments Rahul.
I do take care of the car to greater detail. But, this has got negative implications also. Regularly get complaints from better half and kids that car is attended to more than the family.

I got rid of the car washer guy as I was not satisfied with the service. Now, car wash is restricted to once in a while whereas the dusting is (Jopasu duster) is done regularly.

By the by, the most hated and the most criticised JK Elanzo NXT which completed 35K KMs (22 months) is running strong without much of any troubles for me.

[Keynote]

Originally Posted by deetjohn

An engine with a flatter torque curve will be more giving or flexible with the response. For an engine like the 1.6 MJD, one will have a very narrow window. You get that right and nothing will come close in terms of engine performance. But its a narrow window and that can drive you nuts at times.

Very well said. Something on similar lines which I had mentioned in my ownership review and after having driven the 1.6 MJD engine for few thousand kilometers.

• The way it picks up speed is proportional to the RPM at which you change gears. If you change gears too early then the massive turbo lag will catch you off guard and gets scary. Change gears at around 2500-2700 RPMs and you will be rewarded with impressive acceleration and you can ride the torque wave to unmentionable speeds.
• Car does not feel jittery or scary even at these speeds and you will feel in complete control of the vehicle.
• The only places where you will be caught off guard is when down shifting while slowing down for approaching traffic or speed breakers or intersections. During these times you have to ensure you are in the proper gear/rpm. Else you will drop speeds like you have hit a brick wall and chances of getting rear-ended are very high. I had to slow down from triple digit speeds to around 60 Kmph. Shifting from 6th to 4th put me in the dead zone with the turbo lag and the vehicle almost felt like it has come to a standstill. Once you understand the speeds and gears to downshift to, it becomes second nature and you will not have these scary moments of getting caught off guard.

If this is of any help, full report can be read here : http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...rsonified.html

[torquehead]

Originally Posted by Sree73

Taking rest @courtyard after a Monsoon run to Thrissur - Kerala yesterday.

Mileage - 35000 KMs, FE on this trip - 24KM/L, still running on stock JK Elanzo.
Not much of a cabin noise if run with AC on / slight music.

Hey Sree73,

Your car seems to be totally devoid of any mid-life crisis after 35(k)

Need some inputs(please excuse if the questions are lame) :
- What's that unit where the original exhaust is supposed to be? Looks good, is that a completely modified exhaust-system or only a cosmetic mod and how much did you pay for it?

- I want to buy chrome door handles but apparently they don't come as an MGA accessory. Where did you buy yours?

Getting my car delivered next week, want to ensure it's delivered in its best attire.

[renownedalmond]

Took the 'Silver Surfer' for a little bit of off-road. There were a few times when I had to use the hand-brake as it refused to move from 1st gear at an incline. Had a few scary moments as there was a huge army truck behind me and I was afraid that the driver would get impatient and just give me a 'little push' from behind.

But at the end of it, was quite rewarding.

[bhpfaninblr]

one more thing to note is that as we see below, the fall in torque at higher rpm from peak is much lesser for the Fiat 1.3 multijet vs. the Fiat 1.6 multijet

[Sree73]

Originally Posted by torquehead

Hey Sree73,

Your car seems to be totally devoid of any mid-life crisis after 35(k)

- What's that unit where the original exhaust is supposed to be? Looks good, is that a completely modified exhaust-system or only a cosmetic mod and how much did you pay for it?

- I want to buy chrome door handles but apparently they don't come as an MGA accessory. Where did you buy yours?

Hi torquehead, Thanks for the compliments. I consider 35K as early teens

The exhaust tip is a double square barrel stainless steel accessory. Just for aesthetics and no modifications. It goes over the original exhaust tip and tightened over it by 3 bolts. Bought from Amazon India. It was around Rs 1300.

The chrome handle cover also from amazon and costed me Rs.900.

Congratulations on the S-Cross ownership. One of the best cars available today in the budget segment. Which trim you are getting into the garage?

[torquehead]

Originally Posted by Sree73

Hi torquehead, Thanks for the compliments. I consider 35K as early teens

The exhaust tip is a double square barrel stainless steel accessory. Just for aesthetics and no modifications. It goes over the original exhaust tip and tightened over it by 3 bolts. Bought from Amazon India. It was around Rs 1300.

Hope this doesn't impact the performance and mileage. Link please..

The chrome handle cover also from amazon and costed me Rs.900.

How is the quality? Link please..

Congratulations on the S-Cross ownership. One of the best cars available today in the budget segment. Which trim you are getting into the garage?

Thanks, I went for S Cross 1.3 Alpha in Premium Silver.

It was a difficult decision as it may sound a bit strange, but I didn't really have a budget and could go upto 25 lacs.
- The 'heart-vs-mind' battle(which 'mind' won) landed me on S Cross 1.3 (1.6 was good too, but didn't suit my sedate driving needs).
- Alpha was about 1.7 lacs more than Zeta. I didn't want to use a car for the next 5 years without those awesome-looking projectors, though they do not add any real value in terms of performance & driving experience. Since the 'mind' had already won the first round, I thought I better let my 'heart' win the second one.

Maruti just made it easier towards the end by adding 40k additional benefits to those that I was already getting.

[bhpfaninblr]

Interesting point as to why Hyundai 1.6 CRDI has a flat torque curve vs. the Fiat 1.6 Multijet. Did some research and here are the technicalities:

Engine torque is a function of:
a) Dynamic Features: amount of air ingested and the air to fuel ratio combusted in cylinder
b) static features like compression ratio, bore/stroke, crankshaft design, intake length, cam profile, intake and exhaust sizing.
The ECU can control a) but not b). so there is a limit to the flatness of the torque that can be achieved with only the ECU

All CRDI engines can do a variable mass of air charge across the RPM range with a turbocharger and the ECU injecting corresponding amount of fuel. What the Hyundai 1.6 CRDI is doing is that it is holding the peak torque constant by intake pressure regulation system. The Fiat Multijet is not able to do it because the turbocharger is not able to provide the amount of airflow the engine requires at higher RPMs and this is due to variances in temperature and flow characteristics of the intake and cam systems at various RPMs which lead to slopes and peaks.

Due to design constraints mentioned above, the Fiat Mulitjet is not able to produce a flat torque. Why they did'nt change the design then?
Because of the price to build components, potential hit in reliability and fuel economy, ...etc. If we see, though the 1.6 CRDI is locally produced by Hyundai, the Hyundai engines are way more expensive than the Fiat 1.6 Multijets - while this maybe due to other reasons, there are costing pressures as well into the design

Good video on this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgLNO3ThGD4

So just by remapping one cannot get a flat torque curve because of the static features involved

Originally Posted by Dr.Naren

Maruti has given us an explosive Fiat engine, but a flatter torque curve would have been brilliant. I am not sure if I could make it possible with remap.

[Dr.Naren]

Originally Posted by bhpfaninblr

So just by remapping one cannot get a flat torque curve because of the static features involved

Yes, you are right. But I have little hope because few Alfa Romeo / Fiat cars with same 1.6 MJD engine have more flatter curve than the 1.6 DDIS in S-Cross

[bhpfaninblr]

The Nexa folks had called me as I mentioned in an earlier post with the 70K discounts on existing models. When asked, they said the facelifted S-cross will have a petrol avatar as well. Both the 1.0 Boosterjet and 1.4 Boosterjet are likely. These will have the refinement of a petrol engine and also a flat torque curve across the RPM range starting from 1500 rpm. The 1.3 Multijet is likely while 1.6 is going to be discontinued

So if you have not made a purchase already, you have a gem of an engine waiting in the facelifted S-cross. The 1.0 Boosterjet should be cheaper than 1.4 Boosterjet and great in the S-cross as well.

The 1.6 L Multijet will be discontinued and will be eventually replaced by the in-house 1.5 L Suzuki diesel engine when it is ready. If Tata can make 2.2 DiCOR engine for Hexa, there is no reason why Suzuki cannot make a larger engine. The problem with the Celerio diesel was that it was too risky being a 2 cylinder diesel and tiny engine.

Originally Posted by adi_petrolhead

I took a test drive of the 1.6 and I was so excited I immediately sat down for the final negotiations and quotation.

That's when I told him my offer, I told him to round it off at that number which was almost same as the BRV i-VTEC. That's when he asked me to make a quick Google search for 1.4 booster jet, and then he tells me that this is already being deployed in the international face-lift which is being exported from India and soon we expect the same to hit our showrooms. So pls wait till April.

As I told him that I plan to take immediate delivery, why would he push me till April? May be they have no stocks of 1.6, or company has asked them to push for 1.3, and may be actually the 1.4 will indeed hit showrooms in April with a much better price tag than the diesel.

[Sree73]

Originally Posted by torquehead

Hope this doesn't impact the performance and mileage. Link please..

The exhaust tip does not affect any performance. While installing, it should be placed slightly protruding so that the rear silver plate does not get blackened by the exhaust fumes.

I bought that almost 2 years before and the exact item is not seen now. However there are similar items available at the following link.

http://www.amazon.in/s/ref=sr_pg_1?r...qid=1497081270

The handle chrome cover is available here.

http://www.amazon.in/Auto-Pearl-Prem...ss+door+chrome

[swiftdiesel]

Originally Posted by bhpfaninblr

The 1.6 L Multijet will be discontinued

That's sad to hear if it were true. If I ever considered the S-Cross, it'd be for the 1.6 diesel. I'm sure it'd be another decade for MSIL to completely transition from the 1.3 Multijet.

Originally Posted by bhpfaninblr

and will be eventually replaced by the in-house 1.5 L Suzuki diesel engine when it is ready. If Tata can make 2.2 DiCOR engine for Hexa, there is no reason why Suzuki cannot make a larger engine. The problem with the Celerio diesel was that it was too risky being a 2 cylinder diesel and tiny engine.

Suzuki have always excelled at making petrol engines. For any manufacturer, diesel engineering is a heavy investment in R&D, testing and ensuring reliability. I've been hearing about the impending Suzuki's 1.5 diesel since 2011 and I reckon they are nowhere near being market ready. Suzuki has a huge reputation for reliability and I don't think they'd be putting their own success story to the test with a relatively new engine and a diesel at that.

It's not easy to develop a common rail diesel from scratch and Suzuki have never made diesels before. Their maiden 2 cylinder diesel attempt didn't go too well. Honda too struggled with the idea and only in the recent past, jumped into the diesel world and you'd find they are still nowhere close to their own petrol engine's finesse and NVH. Suzuki is a small player in the international market and it'd be interesting to watch their diesel engine timeline.

Tata's 2.2 Dicor was an engine developed by AVL Austria. Tata have fine tuned it in recent years but Tata's 2.2 and Mahindra's 2.2 were developed by AVL and interestingly, if you noticed, their engine blocks are eerily similar.

[Dr.Naren]

Originally Posted by bhpfaninblr

Both the 1.0 Boosterjet and 1.4 Boosterjet are likely.

1.0 booster jet / downsized M16 petrol is more likely. 1.4 booster jet, I don't have any hopes.

The 1.6 L Multijet will be discontinued and will be eventually replaced by the in-house 1.5 L Suzuki diesel engine when it is ready.

Not anytime soon. Maruti has made fresh deal with Fiat for more engines. Also, some of my reliable sources have said that there is not much progress regarding 1.5 Suzuki diesel engine. Remember Nano diesel engine?