[audioholic]

Originally Posted by gauravdgr8

If Maruti cared much, they would have launched the 1.6 DDiS on the Ciaz and slotted against the Honda. They try to flog a car with the same engine as usual. No news on the Ciaz hybrid till July and therefore this is no reason for its sales to be as low as 2099 vs Honda at 5k+.
.

If they really put the 1.6 under the hood of the Ciaz, forget the city, the car would have made the German twins run for cover. The city wouldn't come near it in any of the aspects.

I would have considered the city to be a better bet a few years back, but not now. Especially the diesel. If you see the recent trends in the market we can clearly see that attitudes have changed. When Maruti on one hand is becoming more and more aggressive, and improving upon standards, Honda on the other hand is relying upon the value it has built over the last decade. A considerable portion of the city sales would be because of the brand value it has got. Hence we find users complaining about various issues in it.

Still, being priced lesser than the city, the compromise with lesser power has been compensated fairly with a lesser prove yeah.

[itsashishsharma]

Originally Posted by reihem

You might be totally correct about the City being a better bet

Originally Posted by PrasannaDhana

Honda city was a better bet, when esteem was there

It was a better bet, when baleno was there

City vs Ciaz, I think that both of them are pretty similar, light weight, acres of space, economy oriented tuning of engines, built for masses with no oomph factor, very plain jane cars that work and do the job with good reliability.
Of these two, if its a petrol, it got to be the City for better, more powerful iVtec. If diesel, it can't be City, reason - that crude noisy iDtec, so Ciaz wins here. A friend just switched his booking from diesel City to a Petrol one.
Though it is true that a Tata Zest at 9L OTR offers the same 90ps engine that the Ciaz does, so it won't be wise to declare that Ciaz diesel is much better over City diesel. Its just that City diesel is not for humans to have and Ciaz is better in NVH dptt.
On an unrelated note, I have driven back to back my father's 2006 Baleno and my cousin's 3rd gen 2010 City which was better built than the current gen City, and City felt dead to me, its not just the 0-100kmph timings that matter. Baleno was better in suspension, steering so much so that it gave the driver super confidence to take on everything. For me, after the 1st gen City, nothing really appealed.
Even my 2011 old shape 1.2 k series Swift was more fun and gave more confidence at illegal speeds than the likes of Ciaz and City.
And now I am being spoilt by my new one month old Fiesta. How on Earth can I like any other car feom that segment now? Sorry guys, no offence, had to flaunt my ride. Its new, so hope you understand.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by audioholic

If they really put the 1.6 under the hood of the Ciaz, forget the city, the car would have made the German twins run for cover. The city wouldn't come near it in any of the aspects.

Bingo!

With our response for the DDiS 320 on the S Cross, to empty off stocks, they should plonk it into the Ciaz. People will definitely jump at that deal.

I hope the 3.5K engine inventory (DDiS 320) will vanish IF priced right. The Ciaz has a lot of potential in it if trapped right by Maruti-Suzuki.

I hope SCross 1.6 Alpha still would be on sale for 1 year at least. Hope I get mine and then let them discontinue it. Go r

[PrasannaDhana]

Originally Posted by itsashishsharma

And now I am being spoilt by my new one month old Fiesta. How on Earth can I like any other car feom that segment now? Sorry guys, no offence, had to flaunt my ride. Its new, so hope you understand.

Haha! I understand the feeling. Fiesta will be any enthusiast's favourite despite the lower power figures. I have driven the fiesta classic briefly (100km). I must say, it felt like it was on rails and the steering was lovely. I just felt bad that my friend bought the diesel instead of the 1.6S, that lovely motor! btw baleno was never vfm. My friend bought his baleno for a whopping 11lakhs in 2000!! It was not fuel efficient too, at least his car was not.

I did consider the classic before purchase, but we being tall tall people and the cramped rear did no good. How I wish a car with footprint/space like city/ciaz, steering like ford classic, in-gear acceleration like the Vento, refinement like the Verna, safety like the aspire, build quality like the linea and top speed like the cruze

Originally Posted by a4anurag

I hope the 3.5K engine inventory (DDiS 320) will vanish IF priced right.

That is the problem. Maruti doesnt know how to price that 1.6 right. :-(

[itsashishsharma]

Originally Posted by PrasannaDhana

Haha! I understand the feeling. Fiesta will be any enthusiast's favourite despite the lower power figures.

Fiesta's 1.5L diesel engine churns out 90hp and 205Nm. It is low for that fabulous chassis that begs for more but it can't be termed as lower power figures by segment standards. Power is decent and you never feel its lacking in any sense but yes, the chassis needs more and I will get it remapped to ~115hp & 240Nm. Sounds fun, doesn't it?

[PrasannaDhana]

Originally Posted by itsashishsharma

Fiesta's 1.5L diesel engine churns out 90hp and 205Nm. It is low for that fabulous chassis that begs for more but it can't be termed as lower power figures by segment standards. Power is decent and you never feel its lacking in any sense but yes, the chassis needs more and I will get it remapped to ~115hp & 240Nm. Sounds fun, doesn't it?

I was referring to the Classic's power figures. New fiesta is more than capable to be called underpowered. I wish they carried over the hps from classic to the new fiesta.. But new fiesta is one of the best EPSs around nevertheless!

115bhp and you can make a 1.6DDIS embarrassed

[sathya_g_m]

Any idea on the current offers for Ciaz. Sales guys are offering 40K Discount on diesel along with 25K exchange bonus. Any one hearing better discounts than this?

While I thought of waiting for Hybrid, these discounts are tempting and makes me lean towards it.

Hybrid could be 30K-125K more than current models and without discount it increases the cost by 2 Lakhs which I am not sure is worth for 3-5 KMs of mileage. With 2 Lakhs, I can fill 4000 Lts of Diesel which will cover 3-4 yrs of my drive :-)

I am really not sure if Hybrid is aimed at enhanced performance, if so it is probably worth investing than get a 1.6 with a hefty premium of 3 Lakhs.

[rockporiom]

Originally Posted by sathya_g_m

Any idea on the current offers for Ciaz. Sales guys are offering 40K Discount on diesel along with 25K exchange bonus. Any one hearing better discounts than this?

While I thought of waiting for Hybrid, these discounts are tempting and makes me lean towards it.

Hybrid could be 30K-125K more than current models and without discount it increases the cost by 2 Lakhs which I am not sure is worth for 3-5 KMs of mileage. With 2 Lakhs, I can fill 4000 Lts of Diesel which will cover 3-4 yrs of my drive :-)

I am really not sure if Hybrid is aimed at enhanced performance, if so it is probably worth investing than get a 1.6 with a hefty premium of 3 Lakhs.

Go for the current one. No point in waiting for the hybrid as it will be costlier than the current one without any change in features if you are going for top variant. If you are going for vdi+ then i would suggest you to wait since it would get dual airbags in the SHVS. Regarding discounts, you can get about 10-15k more at max nothing more than that.

[sathya_g_m]

Originally Posted by rockporiom

Go for the current one. No point in waiting for the hybrid as it will be costlier than the current one without any change in features if you are going for top variant. If you are going for vdi+ then i would suggest you to wait since it would get dual airbags in the SHVS. Regarding discounts, you can get about 10-15k more at max nothing more than that.

Thanks a lot rockporiom. I am going for zdi+. So current discounts are worth.
BTW, Did ciaz ever go for crash testing? What is its rating?

[rockporiom]

Originally Posted by sathya_g_m

Thanks a lot rockporiom. I am going for zdi+. So current discounts are worth.
BTW, Did ciaz ever go for crash testing? What is its rating?

Ciaz has never undergone crash tests but considering the cost cutting most manufacturers do, I wouldn't trust any car company's crash test rating unless they test a made in india car in india.

I would suggest go for the zdi+ the car is VFM. The only problem that you might face is rattling plastics but nothing on the mechanical side of things. I have driven the car at good speeds and it is pretty stable. Do note its nothing like the fiats, volkswagen's or ford's but it can hold its own.

I suggest push a bit more and you might get a good deal.

[sathya_g_m]

Booked Ciaz ZDI on Sunday. They had a carnival in Le Meridian , Chennai exclusively for Ciaz to flush out the current stocks to make way for Hybrid. I negotiated with couple of dealers and finally got 50K Cash discount, 11K accessories and 25k exchange bonus (and a good deal of 1.6L for my 2007 Santro, Even hyundai was ready to take it to 1.5L only :-) ). I wanted Glistening grey but as they are left with last few stocks, they dont have it available. Currently booked silver but might change it to Maroon.

Entire Ciaz sales team is busy in training since yesterday as the Hybrid is getting launched tomorrow. As far as they know, it could be somewhere 80k+ more than the current version.
I might change to Hybrid (Shying away from all the discounts ) if it is going to improve the performance, if it is only mileage, I will be happy with current Ciaz.

I am still thinking if I have made a sane decision. Final lap was between

1) Duster 110 - Too much bland inside, quite roomy/spacious with excellent ride quality, better for our roads. After a year or 2, might feel like sitting in a previous generations car. Current discounts are at 51k. If they could have offered more, I may have got tempted. At current price point (13.2 L OTR after discounts) cannot spend a penny more to add some nice interior. Price is the biggest enemy for this car.

2) I20 Active/Elite - Excellent Engine. Created real Wow feel while driving. Family rejected it for lack of space. I will really miss this. Looks and drives like a sports car!

3) S-Cross - Rear seat is not comfortable at all. Back rest is small and erect even when reclined. Add to that the head rest, which is really an ergonomic issue. Engine feels lethargic than Ciaz.

4) City Diesel SV - Like everything here, but the price. Variant to variant is 1.5 Lakhs more than Ciaz. Add to the problem, honda's costly service and irritating 6 Months service interval.

I am still not sure if I should cancel Ciaz and go for City. I could only afford SV without denting my financials, unless it is worth it. From all the reviews on City, I concluded City Diesel and Ciaz Diesel should be same interms of power/performance. City is a better choice only when it comes to petrol. I am getting it correctly?

Also, how expensive is Ciaz service/maintenance cost comparing to City/Duster? As it is MSIL, it must be cheaper?

[rockporiom]

Originally Posted by sathya_g_m

I am still not sure if I should cancel Ciaz and go for City. I could only afford SV without denting my financials, unless it is worth it. From all the reviews on City, I concluded City Diesel and Ciaz Diesel should be same interms of power/performance. City is a better choice only when it comes to petrol. I am getting it correctly?

Have driven the Ciaz diesel many times now. The car is adequately powered and won't disappoint you. Yes, you would have to work the gearbox a lot to get the best out of the engine but that won't be a problem as the gearbox is butter smooth, so is the clutch.

The city diesel has excellent in city driveability with next to no turbo lag but costs more than the ciaz. Quiet a lot more to be honest.

Go for the ciaz if you don't care much about the sunroof and cruise control. You can't go wrong with either of the engines but the city would be on the noisier side.

Regarding maintaining them. The city would be on the costlier side costing anywhere between 10-12k in a year. A ciaz would cost you about 6-7K in a year including the diesel filter. The ciaz would require one visit and the city would require 2. Overall difference would be about 5-6k year on year.

If budget is strict then go for the ciaz. No point in losing the features and later regretting. You get almost everything that a city vx gets at about 1.5 lakhs less plus you would gain lower maintainence costs, also you have to face comparatively lesser niggles. Only thing where the ciaz loses is seating comfort which no one has been able to beat Honda in.

City petrol is the best petrol NA engine in this segment of cars but since you are on the lookout of diesel would suggest you to go for the ciaz. You won't regret it.

[vinit]

Originally Posted by sathya_g_m

Also, how expensive is Ciaz service/maintenance cost comparing to City/Duster? As it is MSIL, it must be cheaper?

Maruti Service is no longer "cheaper" now. This has already been discussed in another thread.

[rockporiom]

Originally Posted by vinit

Maruti Service is no longer "cheaper" now. This has already been discussed in another thread.

Agreed that Maruti is no longer as cheap as it used to be but it is definately cheaper in comparison to some other manufacturers. Would give you an example of maintainence costs as per inputs from my friends here:

Vento TDI : 10-14k per year (1 visit)

City IDTEC: 10-12k per year (2 visits)

Ciaz ddis: 6-7k (1 visit)

[sathya_g_m]

Originally Posted by rockporiom

City petrol is the best petrol NA engine in this segment of cars but since you are on the lookout of diesel would suggest you to go for the ciaz. You won't regret it.

Thanks a lot buddy. You have been of great help with your suggestions. I am going ahead with Ciaz. Only fly in the ointment, the sales team came back today and said colours of my choice are not available in ZDI (Grey, Maroon) and they do have it available in ZDI+ model. I am not ready to spend 1.5L more for color nor I am going for the color which I dont like.

I told them that if my choice is not available with them, I am cancelling my booking and will relaunch my search (or wait for the Hybrid and see if it makes sense for the price I have to pay). They are yet to come back, I am waiting.