[scopriobharath]

Originally Posted by sridhar-v

Any news on whether they plan an Automatic gearbox variant on the Petrol?

- Unfortunately the Taxi segment in india still prefers a manual over the automatic.

When Chevy has missed out things like MID, Steering mounted wheels, bottle holders etc, I doubt whether they would work an auto box in the near future.

They proudly claim that they have priced it 40K - 70K cheaper than Ertiga / Xylo. I would have provided MID & Steering mounted control + climate control and said we provide the same features of Ertiga at 20k-50K less. I am sure this sounds better than 40K for a plain jane box.

[ramesh]

Originally Posted by avira_tk

The perception of GM's diesels is that they have poor life and reliability,

Once they use Fiat 1.3 multijet why will anyone doubt the reliability ?

[avira_tk]

Originally Posted by ramesh

Once they use Fiat 1.3 multijet why will anyone doubt the reliability ?

The problem is with perception about GM, similar situation arises between Maruti's diesel versions and Fiat's. People with high usage have had bad experiences with the powertrain in Chevy.

The Fiat engine bit won't be noticed here as this is every bit a GM engine as much as it is a Fiat one because of the old partnership.

[drsnt]

Originally Posted by avira_tk

The problem is with perception about GM, similar situation arises between Maruti's diesel versions and Fiat's. People with high usage have had bad experiences with the powertrain in Chevy.

The Fiat engine bit won't be noticed here as this is every bit a GM engine as much as it is a Fiat one because of the old partnership.

If this was true then how come market is flooded with travera as taxies. I have been in travera with 3L+ kms many times and driver said it was fine for many more kms. I cannot say same for cruize engine as i have not come across high mileage example and also for Beat diesel

[ganesc]

Originally Posted by figo_mba

I seriously was put off by the engine (diesel).

Is GM seriously thinking that they can sell Enjoy with 76 bhp engine at 70K INR less and people would not call their bluff? Suddenly Maruti Ertiga seemed value to me.

There is space in the bay, People are ready to pay extra, please plonk the VGT.

You being ok with the rest of the negatives of this car, why don’t you visit Chevy showroom and take all their sales staff for a drive and see how it performs under full load?

I am planning to do that but once in my hometown 2 weeks later.

this is becoming a new Tavera.

+1. Unless Chevy stops dealers to sell it to Taxi buyers for some time.

I still think it will not be that bad as it has received good comments from some of the auto reviewers on Ride and Handling, Space, Diesel engine's performance and efficiency. It’s just that they could have redesigned the rear (top & bottom) to be a bit curvier like Ertiga/Innova to break that boxy look. This however requires more investment on dies but could have still resulted in better sales for sure.

I think this is nice as a chaffuer driven long distance cruiser.

Someone was asking for this. As per thier website, Captain seat is available in all variants. May be this is how they would like to show that they are targetting family audience and not Taxi segment. :P

Feature list against price is actually better than the rest: VFM. And with their 3 years/1 lakh KMs warranty.

Chevy Enjoy Seating Configuration. Source
LT, LTZ- 7 seater.
LS - 7/8 seater option.

[avira_tk]

Originally Posted by drsnt

If this was true then how come market is flooded with travera as taxies. I have been in travera with 3L+ kms many times and driver said it was fine for many more kms. I cannot say same for cruize engine as i have not come across high mileage example and also for Beat diesel

The Tavera uses an Isuzu engine which is legendary for its reliability, I don't think that is the engine in question. The Isuzu engine was one of the big reason for its popularity besides the VFM proposition. This is the VM Motori engine series that is used in the SAIL and Enjoy.

My friend's family had a Captiva it conked out completely at 50k, heavy running not usually seen with regular customer, something like 10k in the first month alone. Anyways GM replaced the entire car after the service folks couldn't fix it, he got rid of his Cruze soon after. The Captiva I guess has also been sold off. I don't know about Beat diesel although GM has given buyers a modern diesel at quite a reasonable price.

We are completely at this point, the Enjoy is a staid car that even the taxi market will ignore, eagerly waiting for EcoSport now.

[figo_mba]

Originally Posted by avira_tk

The Tavera uses an Isuzu engine which is legendary for its reliability, I don't think that is the engine in question. The Isuzu engine was one of the big reason for its popularity besides the VFM proposition. This is the VM Motori engine series that is used in the SAIL and Enjoy.

I think the new Tavera comes with the Sonalika engine for Rhino. Not sure if this is the same Isuzu engine that Sonalika is producing under some license arrangement.

[avira_tk]

Originally Posted by figo_mba

I think the new Tavera comes with the Sonalika engine for Rhino. Not sure if this is the same Isuzu engine that Sonalika is producing under some license arrangement.

The Sonalika engine is a revised Rover engine, it meets BSIV norms and allows the Tavera to be sold in cities where these norms have been enforced.

[400notout]

Originally Posted by Marauder

There is an interview of the MD of GM India up on IAB which shows exactly what these guys think of the Indian market http://indianautosblog.com/2013/05/m...y-launch-75298
A couple of points to note are that a facelifted version of the Enjoy was available but they did not not bring it here because they wanted to get it in India right now.So,like someone mentioned above that it is a half-baked product and GM hurriedly brought it has been proved by the MD himself.
Also,he says their compact SUV,Trax won't come to India because it is a product for the 'developed' markets.
Best of luck GM.

Hi thanks for the link, I think all automotive companies think that way about the Indian market, and they are not completely wrong are they? when Toyota an Honda launch an "affordable" (euphemism for cheap) product (read Amaze, Liva) the reviews always mention cost cutting, (integrated headrests, bad NVH levels) i wonder why it isnt the same when reviewing a Hyundai or a Maruti??

GM here instead of cost cutting by stripping of its good cars, brings us its tried and tested Chinese cars (supposedly best selling) to sell it in India at a particular price point where it can undercut Maruti and Hyundai..

They brought in sail twins and enjoy just because it were the only models which they could launch at their respective price points, that these products being not better than Amaze, Swift Ertiga is another matter.

They wanted to launch enjoy hurriedly before more players enter that segment which is understandable, it is not a very attractive product but if Mahindra can get away with Quanto why blame GM alone for trying this one on us?? If this works, the facelifted version will follow next year.

And yes, bringing the Trax to India at around 15 lacs (it starts 15495 pounds in UK according to their website, so this is my guess of an indian price) i dont think makes any sense, Its pointless to bring that car in India if they cant make it lesser than 10 lacs IMO.

So with Enjoy, i do agree there should have come with a chevy split grille than just stick a logo on the existing Wuling, and with features like atleast MID which nowadays is standard with any other brand. But it comes with space, seats, handling (as per most reviews) a diesel version and most importantly price.

It wont set the sale charts on fire but will bring in additions to GMs monthly/ yearly tally.

[apachelongbow]

Originally Posted by anu21v

Enjoy's Torque per tonne is in line with Ertiga and Quanto.... and better than Sumo and Xylo (Mdi) ... On-the-road performance of "Enjoy" seems would be pretty much on the mark. surprise..surprise ..surprise... who has got the best Torque per Tonne in the comparison .... its TAVERA. wow that was enlightening. No wonder Cabbies Love Tavera which not only is sprightly but also gives better mileage than innova.

Have you driven the Tavera? You call it sprightly? It is the most slow, dull beast that ever was. The 5th gear is not even in play until the car reaches an achingly slow 80kmph, then shift to 5th. And god forbid if you need to climb an incline say at 90kmph, you would see the speed bleed off similar to an Alto, back to shifting 4th or 3rd then. The happy zone seems to be 60-70kmph. And oh, the gearstick vibrates/dances as if its on drugs. I am saying this with experience. One of our pickup/drop cars is a Tavera unfortunately, and I rue the day this comes to pick me up, because it means an extra 10 mins into the commute, simply because its so slow.
Torque per bhp is a meaningless comparison, you need to compare what RPM band the torque is available, also what are the gear ratios to keep the car moving. Bhp/tonne is a far better comparision factor IMO

[Marauder]

Originally Posted by 400notout

Hi thanks for the link, I think all automotive companies think that way about the Indian market, and they are not completely wrong are they? when Toyota an Honda launch an "affordable" (euphemism for cheap) product (read Amaze, Liva) the reviews always mention cost cutting, (integrated headrests, bad NVH levels) i wonder why it isnt the same when reviewing a Hyundai or a Maruti??

I think there is a difference between cost-cutting measures and a half baked product.Lot of companies use cost-cutting to price their products competitively(even Hyundai i10 has integrated headrests).Enjoy seems a half baked product because of the way it has been brought to the Indian audiences(interiors,not bringing the facelift etc)

Originally Posted by 400notout

GM here instead of cost cutting by stripping of its good cars, brings us its tried and tested Chinese cars (supposedly best selling) to sell it in India at a particular price point where it can undercut Maruti and Hyundai..

I don't think there were many cost-cutting measures in cars that they brought from their GM stable available in other markets and still they were priced on par with the competition(Beat,Cruze)

Originally Posted by 400notout

They wanted to launch enjoy hurriedly before more players enter that segment which is understandable, it is not a very attractive product but if Mahindra can get away with Quanto why blame GM alone for trying this one on us?? If this works, the facelifted version will follow next year.

I don't think it matters if it looks good or not(although it is subjective)it's more to do with putting enough thought into a product before launching it rather than just dumping whatever seems right.

Originally Posted by 400notout

And yes, bringing the Trax to India at around 15 lacs (it starts 15495 pounds in UK according to their website, so this is my guess of an indian price) i dont think makes any sense, Its pointless to bring that car in India if they cant make it lesser than 10 lacs IMO.

That's also true that they shouldn't price it out of the market but I wouldn't read too much into UK pricing as i20 starts at about £10k there.

Originally Posted by 400notout

So with Enjoy, i do agree there should have come with a chevy split grille than just stick a logo on the existing Wuling, and with features like atleast MID which nowadays is standard with any other brand. But it comes with space, seats, handling (as per most reviews) a diesel version and most importantly price.

It wont set the sale charts on fire but will bring in additions to GMs monthly/ yearly tally.

If GM are happy adding only a couple thousand(that too is optimistic)cars to their sales chart then nobody can argue with that.
P.S. All the cars you mentioned (Etios,Quanto etc) aren't doing particularly well.So,manufacturers should look into that and then come out with products accordingly.

[d_himan]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

Have you driven the Tavera? You call it sprightly? It is the most slow, dull beast that ever was. The 5th gear is not even in play until the car reaches an achingly slow 80kmph, then shift to 5th. And god forbid if you need to climb an incline say at 90kmph, you would see the speed bleed off similar to an Alto, back to shifting 4th or 3rd then. The happy zone seems to be 60-70kmph. And oh, the gearstick vibrates/dances as if its on drugs. I am saying this with experience. One of our pickup/drop cars is a Tavera unfortunately, and I rue the day this comes to pick me up, because it means an extra 10 mins into the commute, simply because its so slow.
Torque per bhp is a meaningless comparison, you need to compare what RPM band the torque is available, also what are the gear ratios to keep the car moving. Bhp/tonne is a far better comparision factor IMO

1. Your pickup/drop cab would have been the old 2.5 Isuzu. The comparison sheet has the Sonalika 2.0 specs.

2. Even with the old 2.5, my experience is different - unrefined, not very good above 110 kmph, but definitely not that slow, not even with a full load. At 80-85 kmph, the engine is in it's sweet spot - purring along quietly.

[tbppjpr]

Very detailed and crisp review there noopster and Parrys.

Few questions:
1. Isn't there enough space between the middle row captain seats to go towards rear seat?
2. The speaker grill in the doors looking very small, what size speakers those can accommodate?

[shinuak]

The quirky rear end looks little out of proportion and not to my taste, but the price is too tempting so that it can be forgotten. Anyone with a who wants a people mover can go for it unless you care too much for the design. I hope the design issue too will surely become a thing of the past like in the case of Ritz , erstwhile Santro etc.

[narayan]

I don't think this will compete with the Ertiga as many of you have pointed out. I'm sure GM would have known this as well because it doesn't have the brand equity in the Indian market at least which is plagued severely by the herd mentality, hence even if GM has brought in a better specced, better quality vehicle the masses would have preferred the Ertiga still. But this could be a good alternative to folks who think the Ertiga is over priced/can't afford it , people who are buying hatches like Vista, Liva or Quanto. They can consider this in their buying decision.

Great review by noopster and party's but just want to add that we have had the Eeco and the Omni which have been monocoque rear wheel drive UVs earlier all though I would like to understand why GM chose the rear wheel combination? Does this have a commercial application variant as well ?