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Originally Posted by Mpower Good point. They never brought the CBR150 to India. Emissions may have been the issue. |
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Originally Posted by IronWolf Honda, Are you watching this tread? Your numbers game will play off if you price this thing right.
Being a Yamaha guy for 13 years.... This part gave me more goosebumps.
IMO - R15 is such a badly positioned confused bike. I always felt that should have just boosted the price by another 20-30k and got a 'R25', which would have made more sense. Looks like Honda got the picture.
Looking at the HMSI's current portfolio, price bands, considering it would be made here I think this is possible. No real logic. Fingers crossed.
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Hi,
Just sharing my thoughts. (Because I don't really agree with a lot of views being aired!)
Recently the ASEAN countries framed some common rules for motorcycles. (Something like the K-car norms, or our own small car norms). The lowest class (affordable commuter bikes) have a max displacement of 250cc. If you are going to be a serious player in the ASEAN markets (BAL, TVS, where art thou?) you cannot ignore this class. I think we are going to see "affordable flagship 250s" (my nomenclature) from all serious manufacturers.
Now comes the question of pricing and whether these will be launched in India.
In the first world, bikes are a lifestyle item, and priced accordingly. Even the small displacement bikes are small displacement to cater to regulatory norms (learners have a lot of restrictions in terms of capacity or power), but are supposed to excite these learners into going for "real" bikes. Economy is not one of the goals of these bikes. Converting $$ to Rs. for these bikes does not make sense.
The situation is very different in the ASEAN economies. The smaller bikes are not lifestyle items. Economy (total coo) is important. These bikes can be introduced in the Indian market, but for two things. Our emission norms are different, tougher. And we are not yet at ASEAN levels of affluence. Meeting our emission norms will not be difficult for any major manufacturer, but will require reengineering. And of course market size.
From a manufacturers pov, I don't think there is much difference in bringing out a 100,a 150, or a 250. The question is what makes more sense to them. In the near term Indian market, a 250 will not be introduced for marketshare, but to increase the marketshare of its smaller brothers. (remember the P180 and P150 used to look almost identical. The idea of not differentiating those was to make the 150 buyer feel better, that his bike was essentially a 180 with better FE.) It is a marketing and brand building exercise.
It is because it is a marketing exercise that I expect an energetic response from Yamaha (unless its management has gone catatonic again). It is not going to let its hard re-earned crown of being the "performance bike" be snatched from it. (Of course they tried very hard to erase all traces of it between the RX and R15 days).
Regarding the cost of producing a bike,I would like the views of any production engineer on the relative cost of ANY popular small car vis-a-vis a bike (ASEAN and First world). In my view, the CB250R will be costlier than say the Dazzler because of a) FI, b) Extra camshaft and valves, c) need for a radiator. d) ABS. If compared to a R15, should not really cost much more.
Incidentally, AFAIK, FTA rules do not apply to the Kawasakies (250, ER6) built in Thailand.
Enough rambling
Regards
Sutripta
PS. Why can't Honda manufacture in India and export to Thailand. FTA's work both ways, don't they?