[nr07]

My first post here. I know I am a bit neurotic, but I hope some of you can see how small things can affect our lives when sometimes we can't undo the wrong we have done.

It starts with Speed 400
I rode my Duke 200 BS6 for 10,000 KMs, and my BS4 Duke 125 before that, and have gone on long trips. Last November, I went to Meghalaya and hurt my tailbone, which gives me problems to this day. I ride leaning slightly forward, taking pressure off the tailbone, and it works.

I had an accident around 1.5 years prior (my first fall from a running motorcycle which needed plates and screws on my wrist to fix). This made me a very safe, conservative rider, not riding out of passion. However, the Meghalaya trip brought back my riding passion, and I was seeking an upgrade from my Duke.

This made me test ride the Speed 400. After a 60 km trip to the nearest showroom on my Duke and hopping onto the Speed 400, it felt like sitting on a sofa.

The first seat mod
This was in December 2023. I decided to keep my Duke and applied a gel pad to my Duke 200 BS6 seat on an impulse decision (as I later learned how soft seats, like those on the Speed 400, are not actually good for long rides). The gel pad mod did not feel like a great upgrade at that time and only felt like a slight improvement. However, it caused a series of unfortunate events.

This mod was done without cutting the seat. A 12mm gel pad was added to the original seat, and on top of that, a soft foam was added. I did not have any problems with comfort, but seat height was an issue. I could manage the seat height as I was barely tiptoeing, but sometimes I would be in uncomfortable situations.


Attempt at a fix from someone who does not know what he is doing
Six months later, I needed a second surgery to remove plates and screws. After two months off the bike and thinking about fixing the seat height problem, as that would put me at risk, I got the original seat cut from a local shop. I live in a small town, and going to the first modder with my bike, 55 km away, was not an option at that time. This was the first mistake

Here's what he did:
Opened the seat, removed the gel foam and the soft foam cover on top, cut the original bike seat, put the 12mm gel pad back in, and the soft foam cover on top. It hurt me badly, but I wasn't sure as I was off the motorcycle for two months, so I thought maybe I was not used to it. I rode for another two weeks and ended up hurting my testicles (I lean forward while driving because of the tailbone issue I mentioned earlier, and the seat was messed up). This was terrible. How do I describe this new seat? It felt more comfortable to sit on a wooden chair after sitting on this seat for 10 minutes and driving.

Going back to the original modder with mixed results
I took the seat to the original shop which did the first mod. He said the original foam was cut too much and there wasn't much he could do without ridiculously increasing the seat height. He ended up putting foam from another bike on it. It felt softer, but the soft part sank in, and after an hour or two of riding, my sit bones got sore, which wouldn't happen previously. Plus, I feel that the soft foam sinks, and after that, I am sitting on the hard part. I wasn't sure of its efficacy on longer rides.

Starting from scratch with Sahara seats
I ate the loss and decided to start from scratch. This is where Sahara Seats comes in.

To remove all variables of previous mess-ups, I ordered a new original seat online and sent it to Sahara Seats directly, as I can see they have a very good reputation.

I thought this would be the end of my worries if I ate some cost. I said the budget was not a constraint, and the seat height increase should not be too much. They initially suggested that a rubber foam would be enough. They scrubbed the original seat slightly (nothing was cut as I recommended against it), put a rubber foam and another soft foam on top of it.

Opinions on the gel pad were mixed, and fearing too much increase in seat height, I decided not to go with the gel pad.

They took 1500rs, which was lower than what they quoted initially, and overall their support was good.

This is the photo after scrubbing.



This is the photo after adding rubber foam.




Did Sahara Seats mess up?
I received the seat, and it felt hard. I said okay, I don't mind if it's firm, as it is actually good for long rides. I rode a few small distances locally, but my sit bones started getting sore from day one after riding on this seat. Even though I have done only small rides, my sit bones have been sore since the day I installed the seat (it has been around six days).

I am a little afraid after all the money spent and all the hassles, I don't want to get another injury because of this. I know Sahara Seats is very good with classic retro-type bike seats that come with thick foam, but I rarely have seen other people get their sports bikes done from them, and I am not sure how many Dukes they have done.

Is it possible they have messed this up? Maybe removed some support layer during their scrubbing of the seat? Or does the seat really need a break-in period since it's new? They said it needs a break-in period, and the seat was even harder before they scrubbed.

I do not remember having butt issues when I had the original seat or when I bought the bike.

I have now ordered a 6mm gel pad from them and am hoping to get it added to the seat locally without cutting anything (God help me!). Basically, at this point, I am willing to compromise on the seat height problem, but my seat comfort issues are not sorted. Haha. All of this was a total waste. :-(

TLDR
Modded the original seat of Duke 200 BS6 without cutting the seat and added a 12mm gel pad and soft foam on top. Did not have comfort issues but did have a height issue. Tried to fix the height issue by cutting the original seat, but it actually messed up the support from the seat and ended up injuring me.

Went back to the original modder who did a "jugaad" and put soft foam from another bike, but I was not happy, plus the bones hurt as the seat sank in on longer rides. It was also really tall!

Started from scratch with Sahara Seats with a brand new original seat sent directly to them. My butt is sore since the day I installed the seat (it has been 5-6 days).

Piling up of cost:
3000rs for the original mod which worked but had a height issue.
300rs for cutting the seat, which ruined the seat.
Another 800rs to the original modder to somewhat fix it with some compromises that are not working for me.

1500rs to buy and get a brand new original seat.
1500rs to Sahara Seats for their mod of rubber foam.
1150rs sent to Sahara Seats to get them to ship a 6mm gel pad and one soft foam <--- I am here.

I might have to end up selling the bike. Very upsetting situation.

[scorpian]

Instead of doing all this experiments just order a brand new factory seat and be done with. You will end up spending more and more with all this after market seat stuff and never get it perfect.

[Captain Slow]

I'm sorry to say this but the OEM's are not stupid! they must have done enough R&D on the seats before releasing it on a motor cycle! I find it amusing that people think some Rao or pao seats can fix their seat and make it better!

Stick to the OEM's! Royal Enfield does offer better quality seats on a variety of their bikes!

What done is done -

Just get your self a brand new OEM seat and settle with it. While you are at it, buy yourself a good pair of cycling shots to help save some important organ's!

[shyamg28]

Originally Posted by Captain Slow

I'm sorry to say this but the OEM's are not stupid! they must have done enough R&D on the seats before releasing it on a motor cycle! I find it amusing that people think some Rao or pao seats can fix their seat and make it better!

Stick to the OEM's! Royal Enfield does offer better quality seats on a variety of their bikes!

What done is done -

Just get your self a brand new OEM seat and settle with it. While you are at it, buy yourself a good pair of cycling shots to help save some important organ's!

Yes OEMs do a whole lot of research to come up with a design. But just as is the case with all designs, there are compromises.
This is true of all designs and architecture. It's a 101 when we talk about software architecture as well
OEMs typically design for a maximum use case. That's never 100%. I see nothing wrong in one attempting to solve a situation and personalize a vehicle for themselves. Yes, despite the intelligence and R&D of OEMs. Is there potential risk - definitely.

I see that OP has already procured a 2nd OE seat and modified that too. Which tells me that the OE seat is just not cutting it for him anymore. And he's talking about a medical condition that occurred after using the OE seat itself.

My thought for the OP is this - a new bike costs a lot more. Experimenting with a good seat is near nothing, comparatively. It is obviously totally up to you how much further you're willing to go.
Math isn't going to help too much.

Maybe as folks have suggested, you can try getting the OE seat one last time again. Then try an air float seat. Play around with air pressure. At least you have an OE seat to go back to.

Either ways, I wish you solve this issue for yourself and get back to enjoying riding

[davelok]

I'm thinking of getting the quilted seat from Triumph for my Speed 400. @AulusGabinus says it's better for longer rides, and as it is flat, one doesn't tend to slide forward (and squish the family jewels) so much.

Per my experience, Speed 400 pillion riders complain of a sore seat and numb legs due to the nature of the seat and the high set rear footpegs within 30 minutes of riding. This needs to be solved.

[Cyborg]

Originally Posted by nr07

My first post here. I know I am a bit neurotic, but I hope some of you can see how small things can affect our lives when sometimes we can't undo the wrong we have done.

Nr07, feel for you as I know these things can be painful - literally and figuratively as well. At the outset I say, forget what happened and get a new seat from the factory which will close this chapter.

The Duke family is not best known for comfort be it seat or suspension wise. Your best bet would be to take this loss as experience and get a new bike which fits your parameters.

Cheers

[nr07]

Originally Posted by Captain Slow

I'm sorry to say this but the OEM's are not stupid! they must have done enough R&D on the seats before releasing it on a motor cycle! I find it amusing that people think some Rao or pao seats can fix their seat and make it better!

Stick to the OEM's! Royal Enfield does offer better quality seats on a variety of their bikes!

You are not wrong but they also do a lot of cost cutting. The original seat only costs 1200rs while mods cost over 3k. Also, my first mod was perfectly fine and actually worked good so it felt a little disheartening going to the stock seat again.

Originally Posted by shyamg28

Maybe as folks have suggested, you can try getting the OE seat one last time again. Then try an air float seat. Play around with air pressure. At least you have an OE seat to go back to.

Either ways, I wish you solve this issue for yourself and get back to enjoying riding

This is what I was going to do. I almost did it but considering that my first mod was great and I saw a lot of discipline and positive reviews from Sahara Seats, I thought this would work well.

Originally Posted by davelok

I'm thinking of getting the quilted seat from Triumph for my Speed 400. @AulusGabinus says it's better for longer rides, and as it is flat, one doesn't tend to slide forward (and squish the family jewels) so much.

Per my experience, Speed 400 pillion riders complain of a sore seat and numb legs due to the nature of the seat and the high set rear footpegs within 30 minutes of riding. This needs to be solved.

You are giving me panic. I am actually thinking about switching to Speed 400 and I already have issue with my family jewels because of this situation. Do you think this will be problematic? I was again looking at Sahara Seats because they have some good covers and also brand new seats for touring, etc. for the Speed 400 with 7 days return policy. But, I am a bit nervous about trusting them again.

Do let me know what you end up doing. I think the quilted seat is overpriced and doesn't do much.

[prakash_ajp]

I agree with the thought that bike manufacturers are not stupid in general, but
as shyamg28 just said, there are compromises. Nothing wrong in compromises. I am in the same boat with my otherwise fantastic CB350 Hness and have been going through a similar thought process. Just recently telling someone jocularly that I am going to try and change things one by one, starting with the seat then the bike and perhaps eventually the Butt too . FWIW, I have tried the padded bicycle shorts, one of the expensive ones from Decathlon. It seemed to help initially, but it brought other issues, such as being very uncomfortable on a hot day.

In short, if the seat doesn't help, then may be it is time to change the bike.

[nr07]

I have problems with my tailbone (back) and now testicles (front) and instead of quitting, I have doubled down and decided to buy Speed 400, another bike that has problematic seat. And thinking of getting Sahara Seats pre-made seats (trusting them again because of the reviews). Do I need to go to the asylum?

[Cyborg]

Originally Posted by nr07

I have problems with my tailbone (back) and now testicles (front) and instead of quitting, I have doubled down and decided to buy Speed 400, another bike that has problematic seat. And thinking of getting Sahara Seats pre-made seats (trusting them again because of the reviews). Do I need to go to the asylum?

Nr07 buy the Speed 400, good bike but I would suggest holding out on doing any modifications seat or otherwise till you get a few 100 kilometres under your belt.

No doubt the family jewels and tailbone are a priority but be patient and evaluate things yourself before doing anything.

Congratulations in advance on your Speed 400. Happy riding with comfort for all your body parts

Cheers

[nr07]

Originally Posted by Captain Slow

I'm sorry to say this but the OEM's are not stupid! they must have done enough R&D on the seats before releasing it on a motor cycle! I find it amusing that people think some Rao or pao seats can fix their seat and make it better!

Stick to the OEM's! Royal Enfield does offer better quality seats on a variety of their bikes!

What done is done -

Just get your self a brand new OEM seat and settle with it. While you are at it, buy yourself a good pair of cycling shots to help save some important organ's!

Originally Posted by shyamg28

Yes OEMs do a whole lot of research to come up with a design. But just as is the case with all designs, there are compromises.
This is true of all designs and architecture. It's a 101 when we talk about software architecture as well
OEMs typically design for a maximum use case. That's never 100%. I see nothing wrong in one attempting to solve a situation and personalize a vehicle for themselves. Yes, despite the intelligence and R&D of OEMs. Is there potential risk - definitely.

I see that OP has already procured a 2nd OE seat and modified that too. Which tells me that the OE seat is just not cutting it for him anymore. And he's talking about a medical condition that occurred after using the OE seat itself.

My thought for the OP is this - a new bike costs a lot more. Experimenting with a good seat is near nothing, comparatively. It is obviously totally up to you how much further you're willing to go.
Math isn't going to help too much.

Maybe as folks have suggested, you can try getting the OE seat one last time again. Then try an air float seat. Play around with air pressure. At least you have an OE seat to go back to.

Either ways, I wish you solve this issue for yourself and get back to enjoying riding

Originally Posted by Cyborg

Nr07 buy the Speed 400, good bike but I would suggest holding out on doing any modifications seat or otherwise till you get a few 100 kilometres under your belt.

No doubt the family jewels and tailbone are a priority but be patient and evaluate things yourself before doing anything.

Congratulations in advance on your Speed 400. Happy riding with comfort for all your body parts

Cheers

Thanks. I have actually learned from my experience and I am not messing with any OEM seat ever AGAIN. My plan is basically to fiddel with seat covers, or new seats (that sahara provides) or seat accessories.

[b16h22]

Originally Posted by nr07

I have problems with my tailbone (back) and now testicles (front) and instead of quitting, I have doubled down and decided to buy Speed 400, another bike that has problematic seat. And thinking of getting Sahara Seats pre-made seats (trusting them again because of the reviews). Do I need to go to the asylum?

I can understand your pain. I somehow picked up a bad tailbone injury in 2022 and the recovery was painfully long. My pelvic floor muscles were also affected by it and I still have issues when sitting on a motorcycle for a long time. I struggle with my current bike, the Gixxer 250's slanted seat design because it puts pressure on all the wrong areas and hurts my tail bone and pushes me on to the tank. My old D390 was better with a flatter but harder seat.

You can only do so much to fix the seat comfort on a sports naked like a Duke or Gixxer. Aftermarket seat modification is a trial and error process. It might work or it might not. It's very hard to get OE quality and comfort. If it's too uncomfortable for you, think about switching bikes. But, do a long test ride or rent a bike before you make a decision. It's hard to enjoy the ride if you are constantly in pain and you can't do anything about it due to a medical condition. You need to find a bike with a level seat with space to move around but also with a mildly agressive upper body position so you don't put a lot of pressure on the tailbone.

[Freespirit27]

Lot of sane advice for a painful problem. But going back to further basics may I suggest, you to check the size of your pants and underpants, especially for the family jewel issue.
And while, starting from stock is the way to go, do sit and see if pulling back the handlebars helps, especially if you are trying a aggressive forward biased seating. The balance on your arms and wrist will also have to be assesed by you. You are working with a lot of restrictions brother, for a within the box solution!

[Sebring]

If you take my new Himalayan, the improved seat costed me Rs 10,000. So they give us OK seats to save money

Originally Posted by Captain Slow

I'm sorry to say this but the OEM's are not stupid!

[raiuday]

Why not try some bicycle shorts from Decathlon with the hard seat from Sahara seats on your Duke? These shorts come in handy on long rides and help abit when it comes to pain in the back side. If itdoesn’t work, they’d still be useful when going on long rides on any other bike.

Also, if it’s possible and doesn’t hurt alot on short distances, ride for few kms for the seat to break in after you mod any seat in the future to adjust to your form.