[FLYBOYSID]

Originally Posted by handsofsteel

I disagree respectfully. I am a proud biker and a keen driver as well. I have noticed that my tendency to overspeed is more in a car (where it’s easy to get carried away unknowingly) rather than on a bike where I am much more aware of my speeds/surroundings/blind spots and limitations.


The car owner in me would obviously want to downplay the two wheelers’ logic. Considering neither is fair to the other, makes me wonder why are we so keen on banning this and banning that and do not focus on first principles of educating and tightening the license norms if we were so truly concerned about safety.

I never suggested a ban on anything friend. I am also a keen biker with a fair deal of experience on touring as well as fun things like wheelies etc. All I want is better enforcement and awareness amongst people to ensure safety. We both are on the same page on this aspect. We cannot and should not generalise biker or car drivers. Both have their share of types and all road user have their share of experiences.

Originally Posted by ebonho

An SUV takes the road space of 6 bikes. 6 riders, minimum. And most of them have a single occupant, the driver in them. Do the math. On the congestion. On the fuel that we as a nation spend precious foreign currency reserves now (we are a long long way from paying for crude in rupees). And the pollution per human that is put into the air of our choking cities. Diga makes a good point. One that has already been implemented for years in London.
Cheers, Doc

It won’t be practical in our country to ensure only cars or only bikes. Absolutely in agreement with your logic. It was the first time I experienced the ‘give way’ culture in London, thus I was suggesting enforcement and culture changes to improve things with the current set of wheels on the road. Following rules does help in reducing congestion. I live in an environment where discipline is enforced strictly even on the roads. It works perfectly

[handsofsteel]

Originally Posted by FLYBOYSID

I never suggested a ban on anything friend. I am also a keen biker with a fair deal of experience on touring as well as fun things like wheelies etc. All I want is better enforcement and awareness amongst people to ensure safety. We both are on the same page on this aspect. We cannot and should not generalise biker or car drivers. Both have their share of types and all road user have their share of experiences.

The ‘banning’ part of my comment was not with reference to you at all but to the overall sentiment of the thread and amongst the law makers.
IMO It’s a pretty foolish, short sighted and entitled move which is probably legally questionable as well given everyone’s paying the same road tax (amongst other taxes).
Cheers!

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by doga

I already written on this thread, but a new train of thought compelled me to come back.
I was stuck in congestion the other day in the car watching bikes filtering and zipping past and cursing my luck and then I thought what if we ban cars in the city completely.

I was stuck in a bus one day and looked at all the swarming vehicles around the bus that was blocking the movement of the bus and cursing how 60 plus passengers inside the bus were suffering for the convenience of straddlers and cagers.

Got down and cursed how there was little space for me to walk and vehicles were filtering and utilising space by taking up the footpath (or whatever is left of it).

Originally Posted by doga

. My point was on the prospect of banning a mode of travel for whatever purpose - reducing congestion is one very plausible reason. Assuming everyone is strictly following traffic rules then the same number of bikes would always occupy far less road real estate than the same number of cars for a given average number of passenger per vehicle. .

Assuming everyone is strictly following traffic rules. We know how that works out in our country. Every level crossing in our country is a witness to how the traffic works in maximum space utilisation and successfully making a one minute affair into a 10 minute one.

[doga]

Originally Posted by DicKy

Got down and cursed how there was little space for me to walk and vehicles were filtering and utilising space by taking up the footpath (or whatever is left of it).

Good. Did you also happen to curse the big barges parked on the side of the road despite a no parking sign prominently displayed?

Originally Posted by DicKy

Assuming everyone is strictly following traffic rules. We know how that works out in our country. Every level crossing in our country is a witness to how the traffic works in maximum space utilisation and successfully making a one minute affair into a 10 minute one.

OK, don't assume everyone is following rules. Or may be let's assume no one is following rules which is more like it. I remember few posts about bhpians' joy rides on the Atal setu and few had actually stopped by the side to soak it all in! Or maybe you're implying it's mostly motorcycles which break all rules?
May be we should be thankful that people are out and about on bikes. If they switch to cars and suddenly become perfectly law-abiding citizens, you'd get rid of those pesky filtering bikes but maybe it won't be too nice just sitting all alone in a cage and and not moving an inch!

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by doga

Good. Did you also happen to curse the big barges parked on the side of the road despite a no parking sign prominently displayed?

After 20 years of driving to work and back, I've been riding a bike again. Loving it. Its fast. Its cheap. As long as you have a jacket on zipped up, its reasonably clean as well for your work shirt. Of course mine is not a big distance. 10 kilometres one way. In my car it used to take me 30-40 minutes. On my bike I do it in 15 to 18 depending on the time and the traffic. 18 is in peak late evening Solapur Road Hadapsar to Fatima Nagar to Race Course traffic for those who know. So that is literally like a hot katana through congealed molasses.

The problem with single driver cars, and on office routes there are really way too many, is that they use up all the real estate there is on the road. And once they take a spot, no one else can use it till they move. And they move sooooo slooooowwww. There is simply no road left for two wheelers. Ro the extent that there are certain stretches where two wheelers (as well as autos) are literally climbing on to pavements for 100s of metres, just as an escape calve to this impossible gridlock of jigsaw spaced cars who are not even in orderly lanes, so that bikes can move through in between them. Rather, they are arrayed across all three lanes like paver blocks, making two wheeler progress impossible.

Cheers, Doc

[hikozaru]

Originally Posted by ebonho

On the fuel that we as a nation spend precious foreign currency reserves now (we are a long long way from paying for crude in rupees)
Cheers, Doc

Just playing devil's advocate, this is actually a good point for banning motorcycles on highways because how rubbish motorcycle aero is, to the point where bikes making 50+hp return almost car levels of fuel economy. And lets be honest, not many people tour two up on these bikes, so the actual fuel economy per litre per person for bikes is worse than cars.

It is refreshing to see talks about walkable cities on a car forum. No matter what car fans say about following rules, the simple fact is a car occupies more space on the road. What works in London won't work here because we have far more people here. You can see this with roundabouts on british roads. Multilaned roundabouts are yield hell even for their levels of traffic, that is why many of the 'circles' in Bangalore like Hudson circle were converted to normal intersections with signals. It would be better if governments simply allocate road tax to buy more buses to improve public transport and ban cars. All of us could certainly use that exercise too.

My sincere apologies for wasting words on this forum on sticking it to cagers but the other day I had 2 cars overtake me when I was behind a garbage lorry on a two lane road on a turn. These cars are barely faster than 125s, with awful 30-80kmph rollons were stupid enough to tailgate each other and overtake using the oncoming lane on a turn with zero visibility. Surely they should have known better if even a 'two wheeler' wasn't overtaking no?. It is certainly dishearting to hear about 'biker cutting lanes' when car drivers pull stunts like this. Let's also not forget about cars which have stuff loaded behind their backseat killing my visibility and forcing me to overtake for a better line of sight.

The world would be a better place if all the people on one person SUVs decide to rip around on xpulses.

[SidharthaN]

Two wheelers are comparatively safer on an expressway or national highways than city roads. They mostly stick to the left lane at slow speeds and trundle along. In the hands of ******* and overconfident rural folk motorcycles become dangerous on the highways.
With cities expanding expressways have become part of regular commute. For example in NCR anyone not living in Delhi has to be part of an expressway or highway commute. It is here that the problem arises. There is utter lack of disrespect for motorcyclists by car owners. Even if a biker is on the extreme corner of the road leaving all three lanes to cars, the four wheelers do not leave an inch on the road to tailgate and intimidate bikers. To the context of the thread the poor motorcyclist is at the mercy of his safety endangered by a car driver. Prime example is the constantly overcrowding Noida - Greater Noida expressway.
I have faced the brunt on the other side too, same behaviour while driving a car. The SUV's or matter of fact anything from pseudo SUV's, Eeco's, Boleros, sedans, hatches, etc will not let you drive peacefully in a straight line on the left, middle lanes. Even if you are in the right overtaking land at fairly decent speeds of 100, they pull up to you and flash those irritating LED's or honk the nuts out, irrespective of whether they you have space to move out or not.
It all boils down to human brain conditioning or values. Some on this forum say India car population is 14% or so, does not look so on the roads. Anyone and everyone is affording a car nowadays with lack of value, respect and road sense. And matters will just become worse as we move forward. There is no solution to boiling matka on our necks, and scant regards for human life.