[Samarth 619]

Originally Posted by shancz

Congrats to Hero on the launch.
Question for anyone who can answer :
Please correct me if I am wrong but the liquid cooling will prevent overheating, aid FE apart from allowing the bike to run higher a compression ratio and delivering better power figures ?
Is this logic reflected in the compression ratios listed below :
Karizma XMR : 12.0
Xtreme 200S : 10.0
RTR 200 4V : 10.0
390 Duke : 12.88

Liquid cooling helps to cool by a big margin, but mostly companies negate the cooling benefits by running higher compression ratio.
So, overall, mostly liquid cooling just aids performance by higher CR.

Duke 390 for example runs so hot in city commutes (I own one).

A bike with higher compression ratio is also difficult to kick-start/ push-start (even in 2nd gear), so you better keep your battery in good condition while touring.

[sandeepmohan]

I gotto say, this new Karizma is hands down the best looking motorcycle to have come out from Hero.

Looking at this motorcycle in pictures, it feels as though its more a TVS RR310 class competitor, going by its profile. Appears to be a fairly committed riding position, unlike the first generation Karizma which had a nice relaxed riding position, with not a lot of body weight over your wrist. Made for a nice tourer, aided by that super smooth engine.

Lets see how things play out for this new bike. Highly competitive market in this segment.

[ashwin.terminat]

Reviews for the Karizma XMR are out:

1. Zigwheels
2. AutoCar India
3. Evo India

Initial feedback seems good. Curious to see how this affects the sales charts now.

[HTC]

There have been several launches recently. Still Hero's XMR launch brings smile on my face. I was wondering why? Is it because I root for underdogs? That is not a right inference because, Hero has been selling the most number of bikes with least amount of R&D. This bike should have been the output of their collaboration with Eric Buell bikes. But that was a disaster of its own kind.

Now, If we look at the bike, this ticks all the boxes. Style and tech are combined very well. Hero has been selling VFM bikes to indian middle class for ages. They have kept the success recipe intact for soo long. Why meddle with something which is working so well. keeping just one engine block, they have been the largest selling bike manufacturer in the world.They clearly know their customer base and have balanced the tech and cost very well with this offering. Cant believe the scooters like activa are selling upward of 1 lac with basic tech and this is offered at 1.7lac. This can be a good upgrade for those currently using 100+ cc bikes or wants something sporty but not too expensive. We will get to know about the real world FE once real buyers start posting thier reviews. Till then claimed 50kmpl FE looks good.

Hope the engine is well built to retain the compression for long considering this is a high revving machine. Hero deserves a pat in the back for bringing a sporty bike to the masses and wish them success.

[NiInJa]

When it comes to upgrading a brand name properly, only two bikes have done it right in my books.

1. Original Pulsar to Pulsar NS series in 2012
2. Karizma (original) to Karizma XMR in 2023

Old versions: Air cooled 2 valve SOHC engine, twin pipe cradle frame (Pulsar)
New Versions: Oil Cooled, 4 Valve, DOHC, Trellis or Perimeter frame, increase in power and torque figures for similar cubic capacity

Both moved up way above in terms of tech while keeping the emotions associated with that brand intact. It is a different story that the sales of NS didn't match with its original version due to many factors and Bajaj had to fall back to air cooled engine with oil cooler and an ancient frame again with their latest iteration.

The XMR on the other hand has done something opposite this time. The original Karizma was powerful but low tech for the asking price then (didn't even have rear disk brakes while Pulsar 220 had, not talking about the ZMR! ) and was an object of desire that only few could afford and others could drool. The new one has all the tech with a relatively affordable price point that undercuts most other rivals in the same bhp and torque figure group (not CC). If power figures are concerned, it even makes me wonder why one should get an R15 now.

I've owned the first gen R15 and ride my cousin's v3 R15 these days, and trust me, it has lost all the punch the first iteration offered, nowhere does it ride like a bike costing 2 lakhs on road.

I wish Hero sells this bike with proper marketing and good after sales service. They have a winner.

[shancz]

Originally Posted by Samarth 619

- Duke 390 for example runs so hot in city commutes (I own one).
- A bike with higher compression ratio is also difficult to kick-start/ push-start (even in 2nd gear)

Thanks for the explanation, makes sense.

- Agree, it holds the record of the only liquid cooled motorcycle in my experience to have overheated and stalled. The first rides at least mentioned that no significant heat was felt in city riding so I expect better cooling from the Karizma.

- Thanks for this, I had no clue, quite valuable. A Bosch C3/C7 should be sold as a part of the package.

[John316_WRC]

Originally Posted by am1m

More than the Karizma, I always thought the CBZ was the ground-breaking bike from HH. Those disc brakes, great handling and 150cc were all ahead of their time back then. Just like the original P150.

Couldn't agree more! For me it was the CBZ too.
Hero should launch the CBZ (in a naked street fighter avatar) and take the battle to the Dukes and the Yammies.

The old Karizma although exciting, always felt under-tyred and something always felt off in terms of design balance. Glad the new one looks very good.

[Akilan1597]

am I the only one noticing the difference in seat between the older karizma and xmr? As the engine gets bigger and better, the seat gets smaller and smaller. how is a split seat better than the nice single piece seat like the zmr? I wish the find a way to drop this engine in xpulse 200T.

[wheelspinner]

I had reliability issues with all the newer Heros I owned. Specifically the Fi engine. Been using Splendor old carb for 20 years and it starts with a single kick, never shuts off in busy traffic. But the recent ones are giving me a lot of trouble. Would think twice before paying this much for a newer Hero bike!

[VishJ]

There was a quick ride review in Power Drift channel and he mentioned about the bike having vibes at 50 kmph and become very pronounced at 70 kmph. Hope there will be an extensive review explaining the performance and smoothness of the new engine.

[pranavshet]

Originally Posted by VishJ

There was a quick ride review in Power Drift channel and he mentioned about the bike having vibes at 50 kmph and become very pronounced at 70 kmph. Hope there will be an extensive review explaining the performance and smoothness of the new engine.

Powerdrift was the only channel that had complained about the same. None of the other reputed journalists have complained about the same. Also, Varun Painter's review felt incomplete. Just 5 minutes video.

Rishad from Autocar has given a proper review.

More or less most of the reviewers have appreciated the new engine.

So all we need is a thorough RoadTest.

[RD150]

Originally Posted by pranavshet

Powerdrift was the only channel that had complained about the same. None of the other reputed journalists have complained about the same. Also, Varun Painter's review felt incomplete.

His excitement while reviewing the bike was definitely questionable. He kept repeating the cons and ignored to talk much on the pros.

Also nowadays Powerdrift and Zigwheels reviews seem to be slightly biased towards Royal Enfields.

[Oldschool guy]

When the Karizma was launched, millennials knew its value. We had stories to tell.

Even though I didn't own one, I had memories of riding my friend's first-gen Karizma. Later with the R15 we thought the Karizma was not a sports bike and later, with the upgrades, Hero went the other way.

The new bike might be good in perspective, but it doesn't give you that "legend" feeling and I don't understand what Hero's marketing team is thinking. The new youth would not be inclined towards it as there are other options. Hero should have thought of targeting millenials as they have a special place in their hearts for the Karizma. The design should be like the first-gen with a new engine or even the old engine (if they could use the Honda 225 air-cooled unit which was a gem).

The new design is good, but too busy and not giving a "legend" feeling. I could see this will be one more flop from Hero considering targeting millennials. Wrong product positioning by Hero's marketing.


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