[Shonith]

Originally Posted by drt_rdr

^^ I was thinking the same thing. At near 200 kgs, this bike looks like it won't really as compete in terms of speed and agility with the CB300R or Duke 390, all the while demanding more money upfront.

My thoughts are the same I feel like this will be more theme based than function as an agile bike. I remember watching zig wheels video on this bike, they claimed it to weigh 190kgs. I wonder how the weight went up.

I am also curious to know if this bike actually has a low center of gravity. That battery pack looks like a vertical stack.

Also I feel belt drive would be best suited for EVs, chain noise would be very prominent after a few 1000kms.

[DarthVeda]

People are always worried about the high upfront cost of EV, but they don't blink an eye when they spend lakhs of rupees on fuel every year and thousands of rupees every year on maintenance.

[WhiskeyTangoFox]

Originally Posted by DarthVeda

People are always worried about the high upfront cost of EV, but they don't blink an eye when they spend lakhs of rupees on fuel every year and thousands of rupees every year on maintenance.

I agree, but coming from a person who has an EV, one can get away with getting an EV Scooter, primarily because the use case is majorly within the city. But with a motorcycle, I assume people would want to take it onto the highway as well, for which although this can cover some amount of distance, the lack of CCS Charging capability makes it a dead weight on that front, unless ultraviolette plans to set up its own chargin infrastructure along the highways.

[aashishnb]

Originally Posted by anilupadhya

Interesting. I'm confused now.

Attached are the 2019 and 2021 notifications from the fame2 website. There is a change to clause 20 and 21 of the 2019 notification in 2021. however there is no change to Annexure 2.

Could be a difference between ex-factory and ex-showroom. Ex-factory could be construed price excluding GST, etc. and definitely excludes dealer margin, transport cost (if borne by dealer / charged separately) etc.

Ex-showroom is what you as a customer pays and includes GST, dealer margin, etc.

[aneesh2M]

A good product I must say, but is Indian consumer ready to pay such a price for an electric motorcycle yet? I doubt.

[amvj]

Ultraviolette created a bold new product where the existing industry behemoths are afraid of. This needs to be applauded. This product might sell in the Europe where people are not much cost conscious.

Here our market is very unforgiving. Anything above 2 to 2.5L is a tough sell. Even Honda is struggling to sell CB300R which is around 3.5L on-road Bangalore.

The major pain points of this bike are the initial very high costs and limited range. 118 and 171 odd kilometers range in ballistic mode make the motorcycle useless for touring. If the company themselves claim these low figures then the actual range could be even lesser in real world conditions. Also the battery will reduce the charge holding capacity as it age. If this is primarily meant for the city, why not use much cheaper Ather ?

Sales performance of bikes less than 5L

[Pretorian]

UV, please try a few recreational variants as well, like dirt or trial formats, kids are loving the flexibility of removal batteries in their stacyc, some for us adults too

[Shubham220]

Originally Posted by Senotrius

At that price this should literally be the fastest Indian with respect to outright acceleration. Why is it that electric vehicles with lots of torque on paper fare poorly on this. With 95nm this bike should go 100 in 3 seconds or something (if they were able to use that)

Agreed with your point that this should have been the fastest accelerating Indian motorcycle given it makes 95Nm which is similar to the Hypermotard 950. Although the latter manages a sub 3.5sec 0-100 sprint time this one takes a lot more time. What is the use of all the torque on paper when it is not usable on the road?

[drt_rdr]

Originally Posted by Shonith

My thoughts are the same I feel like this will be more theme based than function as an agile bike. I remember watching zig wheels video on this bike, they claimed it to weigh 190kgs. I wonder how the weight went up.

I remember reading somewhere they switched suppliers or switched out the design on certain components on the production model. ~10 kg is a hefty increase though. Could also be that they'd have needed to add a few extra bits to the production model, mirrors and a saree guard at the very least.

Originally Posted by Shubham220

Agreed with your point that this should have been the fastest accelerating Indian motorcycle given it makes 95Nm which is similar to the Hypermotard 950. Although the latter manages a sub 3.5sec 0-100 sprint time this one takes a lot more time. What is the use of all the torque on paper when it is not usable on the road?

I think this is the same kind of measurement as ICE engine power and torque stats. What you see on the spec sheet is what's measured at the crank. What you get at the wheel is usually a few power and torque numbers less depending on how efficient the drive train is at minimizing losses.

The 95nm thing is probably an electric motor's equivalent of measuring at crank of an ICE. Knowledgeable people, please chip in.

Originally Posted by DarthVeda

People are always worried about the high upfront cost of EV, but they don't blink an eye when they spend lakhs of rupees on fuel every year and thousands of rupees every year on maintenance.

No questions about which bike will come out to be cheaper to own in the long run. But from the perspective of outright cost to performance, it looks like the F77 still needs to do much to catch up with the likes of the CB300R, Duke 390. No need to mention, in terms of convenience and versatility of usage at this particular point in time, ICE wins.

[Shubham220]

Originally Posted by drt_rdr

I think this is the same kind of measurement as ICE engine power and torque stats. What you see on the spec sheet is what's measured at the crank. What you get at the wheel is usually a few power and torque numbers less depending on how efficient the drive train is at minimizing losses.

The 95nm thing is probably an electric motor's equivalent of measuring at crank of an ICE. Knowledgeable people, please chip in.

Maybe that's the case even with electric motors but these losses apply to IC engines as well. And even if we account for transmission losses to be 12-15%, the torque at the wheel should be still 80nm which is enough. The Apache 310RR which has 27.x torques still manages a 0-60 time quicker than the f77.

[RT13]

Originally Posted by DarthVeda

People are always worried about the high upfront cost of EV, but they don't blink an eye when they spend lakhs of rupees on fuel every year and thousands of rupees every year on maintenance.

True as a generalisation but imo, it depends on the positioning. The very reason an Ather sells at a pricepoint that’s 2-2.5x the price of a pretty decent ICE scooter is exactly that - good performance at a premium but more importantly savings over the long term for similar usage patterns.

However, with this, it’s an entirely different ballgame. An electric motorcycle that’s designed and positioned and priced as a performance vehicle will be compared to a similar motorcycle. Unfortunately, many motorcycle riders, particularly those willing and wanting to lay down north of 4 big ones, will want a decent range to go with their performance. It’s hard to imagine that this will be compared to a Splendor or a Victor or even a Meteor or a Hunter. It’s specs and design and positioning (not to mention price) basically say performance but it’s range effectively says it’s at best a long commuter. I mean a full throttle blast from many parts of Bangalore to Nandi and back apparently will induce some range anxiety. And nobody is going to want to buy this and pootle along at 60. What’s the point of that? This an unfortunate limitation imo. It’s stuck in no man’s land.

On a separate note, from a psychological (and arguably financial perspective), of course people are wired to pay less up front and more spread out over time. There’s a reason why EMIs, credit, BNPL and so on have so many more takers than people willing to pay cash up front. We’re conditioned to it and frankly it works for most people from a personal accounting and cultural POV. Nothing surprising about that at all.

[gaurav_3000ad]

I think they should have taken a leaf out of Mahindra’s book and launched with killer introductory prices and subsequently jack them up. In the meantime ride a good wave of positive publicity and word of mouth.

Instead they decided to go the Toyota route with pricing sans the perception of quality, ruggedness, and decades of experience.

[DarthVeda]

The bike does support DC fast charging, though the plug type isn't CCS, which is a bit unfortunate. I am not sure what the plug type is, the spec given is protocol for fast charging not the pin type.

Looking at the spec sheet and estimates of Range, needs to be seen if 50wh/km or lower consumption can be maintained on highway speeds. Will know after a test drive. I have paid the 15k for now and went for the Laser edition.

[amey027]

Originally Posted by drt_rdr

^^ I was thinking the same thing. At near 200 kgs, this bike looks like it won't really as compete in terms of speed and agility with the CB300R or Duke 390, all the while demanding more money upfront.

---

Wonder what the price comes to after the government subsidy. Anyway, lost interest after looking at the weight spec and seating position. They've done up the aesthetics amazingly though. The contours, the stance, the choice of colours... all very
well done. Loved the bluish grey.

There are no government subsidies on this. They only apply if the ex-factory price pre-GST is less than 1.5 lakh. At 4.5L and a real world range of may be 200km maximum, buying this is a waste of money. You can get a 200cc motorcycle for less than half the price if all you need is a performance commuter.

On the other hand, it's a perfect commuter for the A2 license holders in Europe. And to me that's their main market looking the investor portfolio

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by DarthVeda

The bike does support DC fast charging, though the plug type isn't CCS, which is a bit unfortunate. I am not sure what the plug type is, the spec given is protocol for fast charging not the pin type.

Looks like it's a CCS2 charge port, from an old report I could find, unless they have changed something in between. With CCS2 the bike can be used for long distances, only issue they will be competing with cars.


https://www.drivespark.com/amphtml/t...re-029916.html