[subincb]

Looks like they may be working on a motocross version. RE could be working on a totally different configuration as 30bhp is low for 450cc mx bikes, the cooling requirement is much higher and gear ratio totally different for mx. And generally around 110-115kg. May be they started working on motocross as it's still in nascent stage in India and to make use of the first come advantage on 450 segment

Dakar maybe too early for RE without some international partners. Rally replicas as I know cannot be compared to even mx bikes.

[DesertLynx34]

Originally Posted by maskebail

Spotted this in the video posted by CS Santosh, this frame shows a different exhaust compared to other shots, is the video being shot with multiple bikes? Test mules or custom built offroader ?

Possibly two different bikes, or it could even be the same. I think there aren't any indicators on the bikes too, so they're just testing around in the facility.

Also developing a brand new engine to replace a fairly recently developed engine without bring in some significant changes doesn't make sense. Also with the Dakar rumours the engine ought to be performance oriented, which is not the norm for RE. But with the Himalayan, when it was launched, they turned a new page, so with this upgrade they're aiming to continue that journey. Well, hopefully.

[NTab]

Originally Posted by subincb

Looks like they may be working on a motocross version. RE could be working on a totally different configuration as 30bhp is low for 450cc mx bikes, the cooling requirement is much higher and gear ratio totally different for mx. And generally around 110-115kg. May be they started working on motocross as it's still in nascent stage in India and to make use of the first come advantage on 450 segment

Dakar maybe too early for RE without some international partners. Rally replicas as I know cannot be compared to even mx bikes.

This is definitely not a 30bhp bike. It will be somewhere around ~40bhp. RE is known for not over stressing their engine, and hence they don’t extract the maximum power out of them. For eg, just adding a modified TEC camshaft lands Himmy in the 27-28bhp ballpark, which is quite significant. So if RE is planning to go to Dakar, extracting 55-60bhp from a liquid cooled 450 engine isn’t a tough task. As for weight, shredding it down to 130kgs isn’t also difficult with all those super strong aluminium alloys and carbon fibre. If they go for Dakar build, that will be a completely different bike which will only share the engine and frame, and that too will be tuned and built differently.

[subincb]

Originally Posted by NTab

This is definitely not a 30bhp bike. It will be somewhere around ~40bhp. RE is known for not over stressing their engine, and hence they don’t extract the maximum power out of them. For eg, just adding a modified TEC camshaft lands Himmy in the 27-28bhp ballpark, which is quite significant. So if RE is planning to go to Dakar, extracting 55-60bhp from a liquid cooled 450 engine isn’t a tough task. As for weight, shredding it down to 130kgs isn’t also difficult with all those super strong aluminium alloys and carbon fibre. If they go for Dakar build, that will be a completely different bike which will only share the engine and frame, and that too will be tuned and built differently.

Just by generating 50-60 bhp out of an engine is not going to be enough for dakar. I had ttr660, wr450f and still own 525exc producing around 50bhp but none can compete or survive even for a day in Dakar. And these bikes itself are not comparable to anything RE has ever built.

With same engine it will be impossible to compete. Most if not all dakar engines are rally purpose built ones. They don't share even common design to commercial ones. Exception is ktm 450 rally replicas which is purpose built ones available commercially but they make very limited number every year.

[NTab]

Originally Posted by subincb

Just by generating 50-60 bhp out of an engine is not going to be enough for dakar. I had ttr660, wr450f and still own 525exc producing around 50bhp but none can compete or survive even for a day in Dakar. And these bikes itself are not comparable to anything RE has ever built.

With same engine it will be impossible to compete. Most if not all dakar engines are rally purpose built ones. They don't share even common design to commercial ones. Exception is ktm 450 rally replicas which is purpose built ones available commercially but they make very limited number every year.

Most of the bikes in Dakar produce close to 60bhp.
Ttr660, and 525exc can not compete even anyone build them up for Dakar because of engine cc restrictions. Regarding WR450F, that is a dirt bike. None of them can survive because they are not build to survive the rally. Competing in Dakar and dominating it is a completely different thing. Hero also competed in Dakar, Hero 450RR(not a Hero bike though), TVS also has came up with their own version of rally bike, RTR450FX. Correct me if I am wrong but KTM is not the only exception, Honda CRF450 Rally is based on CRF450X/L(X is not street legal but L is).

May be RE will not race, or may be they will, only time will tell. But simply dismissing this one the basis that RE hasn’t produced anything like that is not right.

Let’s agree to disagree. Peace out.

[subincb]

Originally Posted by NTab

Most of the bikes in Dakar produce close to 60bhp.
Ttr660, and 525exc can not compete even anyone build them up for Dakar because of engine cc restrictions. Regarding WR450F, that is a dirt bike. None of them can survive because they are not build to survive the rally. Competing in Dakar and dominating it is a completely different thing. Hero also competed in Dakar, Hero 450RR(not a Hero bike though), TVS also has came up with their own version of rally bike, RTR450FX. Correct me if I am wrong but KTM is not the only exception, Honda CRF450 Rally is based on CRF450X/L(X is not street legal but L is).

May be RE will not race, or may be they will, only time will tell. But simply dismissing this one the basis that RE hasn’t produced anything like that is not right.

Let’s agree to disagree. Peace out.

I do agree too RE may race and definitely wish to see them but not with an engine they are making for normal adventure class motorcycle.

I mentioned all those bike as they are the closest bikes to rally class yet they cannot survive.

[shortbread]

Now that the Bajaj/Triumph and Hero/HD have launched their bikes, the ball is in RE's court for the upcoming 450cc platform and line-up of bikes. What everyone will be eager to know if the specs of the new 450 motor. Also it will be interesting to see how RE plays this, whether they'll continue to charge a premium or go in for a price war?

[harsh_66328]

Not very much into Bollywood movies but couldn't help to notice the 450s being featured in the Jawan trailer. Apologies if I am mistaken.
The headlight design seems slightly different when compared to the one in CS Santosh's video. Maybe some mild design changes might have happened since the shoot.

[sukiwa]

Originally Posted by harsh_66328

Not very much into Bollywood movies but couldn't help to notice the 450s being featured in the Jawan trailer.

May be or may be not. Movie releases on 7th September 2023, is launch of Himalayan 450 closer to that date?
I only recollect one instance of movie & vehicle release, Swift in 2005. Maruti Suzuki Swift was launched few days before movie release Bunty aur Bubli.

[shyamg28]

Originally Posted by harsh_66328

Not very much into Bollywood movies but couldn't help to notice the 450s being featured in the Jawan trailer. Apologies if I am mistaken.
The headlight design seems slightly different when compared to the one in CS Santosh's video. Maybe some mild design changes might have happened since the shoot.
Attachment 2474071

That looks like the Yezdi Adventure to me

[rakesh_r]

Originally Posted by shyamg28

That looks like the Yezdi Adventure to me

Yup, you can make it out from the exhaust on the two bikes on the right.

[harsh_66328]

Originally Posted by shyamg28

That looks like the Yezdi Adventure to me

You are absolutely right! These indeed are Yezdis. Don't know how I missed it. My bad.

[aviator1101]

Originally Posted by shortbread

Now that the Bajaj/Triumph and Hero/HD have launched their bikes, the ball is in RE's court for the upcoming 450cc platform and line-up of bikes. What everyone will be eager to know if the specs of the new 450 motor. Also it will be interesting to see how RE plays this, whether they'll continue to charge a premium or go in for a price war?

The HD-Hero 440 and Bajaj-Triumph's Speed 400 are sort of competition to each other. The baby HD and Triumph Speed 400 will hardly pose any threat to the Himalayan 450. It's the Scrambler 400x which might be of concern, if at all any, to RE's new offering.
And even that will hardly be any competition, because the customer base for Triumph and RE will be different. And Triumph, even with Bajaj holding it's hand, is no match to the widespread service network that RE has established over a period of time. RE is undeniably cheap and easy to maintain. Nobody would like to get stuck with a premium bike at a remote location and depend on the RSA. RE can be repaired almost literally anywhere from Ladakh to Kanyakumari.
So the REH 450 vs Triumph Scrambler 400x war is over even before it began.
Yes, pricing will be affected but then RE products have always been VFM, haven't they?

[shortbread]

Originally Posted by aviator1101

The HD-Hero 440 and Bajaj-Triumph's Speed 400 are sort of competition to each other. The baby HD and Triumph Speed 400 will hardly pose any threat to the Himalayan 450. It's the Scrambler 400x which might be of concern, if at all any, to RE's new offering.
And even that will hardly be any competition, because the customer base for Triumph and RE will be different. And Triumph, even with Bajaj holding it's hand, is no match to the widespread service network that RE has established over a period of time. RE is undeniably cheap and easy to maintain. Nobody would like to get stuck with a premium bike at a remote location and depend of the RSA. RE can be repaired almost literally anywhere from Ladakh to Kanyakumari.
So the REH 450 vs Triumph Scrambler 400x war is over even before it began

I know the strengths and market dominant position of RE, no doubts there. Nonetheless RE's management would view every new X440 or Speed 400 as a sale lost, there is no room for complacency.

I am not saying the new Himalayan will be competing with the X440 or Speed 400. What I am trying to say is future models based on the new 'K' platform (on which the new Himalayan 450 will be based) will be rivalling the recently launched competition. The 'K' platform will lead to a new line up of liquid cooled bikes.

Just like what RE has done with the 'J' platform that underpins the Meteor, Classic, Hunter and the upcoming new Bullet 350. There are a lot of commonalities of parts to drive in the efficiencies and the scale of the ‘J’ platform, yet there will be an attempt to give each model a differentiated character and persona.

Similarly RE will have a line-up of liquid cooled bikes for launch based on the 'K' platform, first of which is the Himalayan 450.

[Proxima]

Originally Posted by shortbread

I know the strengths and market dominant position of RE, no doubts there. Nonetheless RE's management would view every new X440 or Speed 400 as a sale lost, there is no room for complacency.

I really like Eicher (parent of RE) as a company but for now, a lot of people think that their dominant position is under threat. A quick glance at their stock price (compared to Hero and Bajaj) will confirm that stance. I for one think that their products have improved in leaps and bounds and if they continue down that path, their dominant position will continue.