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Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR Yes that is the official reply I received from the management. We were informed that a rear guard will be offered as an accessory, but a pillion footrest is not.
But looking at some of the other pictures online (after Hemanth was informed at the TD event on this being an accessory) - looks like the rear guard has a footrest along with it. So either the management is wrong, or some of the product shots are wrong. Guess we will need to find out! ![Smile](https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.png) |
Isn't a saree guard mandated by RTO. The chassis design and the ABS plastic Body would pose a challenge in designing a good resting fixture without taking the chassis as anchoring element.
The Grab rail having too much of play is possibly due to not getting good anchoring support from the chassis.
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Originally Posted by amey027 As much I am impressed by the on-paper specs, I'll always steer clear of both products primarily because they have the Ola badge.
Not sure how many people here actually work in the Auto industry, but Ola's reputation isn't great. Bhavish is an ambitious business person, but he doesn't understand hardware tech and automobiles are some of the most complex out there.
1. The scooters aren't designed for the Indian environment and have undergone little mechanical modification. So long term reliability is a huge question (Industry Insider Gossip: Their chassis cracked during abuse track testing)
2. Ola doesn't have a strong engineering/product/quality team. People compare them to Ather, but Ather is run by some of the best product people in the country. Their co-founders themselves come from a strong engineering background. There's a huge difference
3. Adding to the above point, Ather knew their 1st Gen product (450) was buggy and hence limited themselves to only 1 city and a few thousand deliveries. Once they resolved all bugs in the 2nd Gen product (450X), they are scaling across the country. Ola has bugs, as seen in most reviews posted online but are still planning to launch aggressively. That's a stupid thing to do
4. Coming to the important bits: Battery & Motor. Neither are liquid cooled because neither were designed for Indian ambient conditions. Good luck operating in 40 degree in the summer. Ather has a fan cooled Motor and pseudo liquid cooled battery pack
5. Pricing: All these are introductory prices only. Their battery size is approx 4kWh compared to Ather's 2.8 kWh. That's almost 1.5 times, additionally the motor is bigger as well. Yet, they are pricing lower than Ather by 20k. Ather is just earning some profit on unit sales. So unless Ola is planning to sell their scooter at 50% loss perpetually, expect a steep price rise over the next 2 years.
6. One issue observed in test runs was the initial lag in throttle response. That's not something you can fix via OTA. That lag exists because motor is designed to cut-off if brakes are applied, similar to all the Chinese scooters. In ICE scooters, engine doesn't cut-off when brakes are applied, just goes into idling. All the electric scooters in India have this issue except Ather, because they replicated the ICE behaviour. (Motor doesn't turn off completely even if brakes are applied). Unless Ola can redesign their throttle and write a new firmware for their motor control, this issue is here to stay. They can minimize it, but let's see.
I really hope Ola can somehow pull through so there's some genuine competition in the EV industry. But the sensible side of me is 99% sure they will fail. |
You make some passionate and bold statements some of them I am in agreement.
For 1 and 2 of your points Not designed for India and Good Tech resources to handle:
Hope your industry gossip is not true as too many people would be using them and fundamental chassis issues cropping up would spell disaster. Its high time the government brings in some kind of protocol which makes Manufacturers spell out Test data and specs which give information on various parameters like Load carrying, Safety and reliability. This can be scrutinized and a minimum requirement bar can be set. The fact that Ola ran away laughing with so many Bookings without having a product that was certified to a certain extent in the indian Market shows how robust our Automobile regulations are.
The Etergo scooter was conceptualized in 2015 and it took the bunch of highly talented Dutch engineers( A couple of Indians also were part) 3 years to get to a proper working prototype. If you follow the Etergo Appscooter videos on Youtube, you get a sense of it.
They struggled to get funds flowing from investors due to strict regulations and were almost bankrupt due to lack of business acumen and the corona pandemic. Ola bought them in 2020 at a cheap price including the Talent also which I suspect are still part of the design Team. If the design team are there, we can be sure that some good solutions will come sooner as these are mechanical challenges which need some expertise especially the electric motor cooling issues and also the Performance related reliability issues of the parts. The Chassis and Suspension would be tested to the limit as well.
Point 3 : Ather handled its bugs well with less exposure initially and Ola going global with the bugs.
It does appear so and we hope the issues which are predominantly software related are taken care of. Ola is rushing things and there is no doubt about it Bhavish needs to wake up and not make blockbuster announcements and promises. I really feel for the Ola design/engineering folks who have to deal with crazy targets. Whether they are upto it or not we will know soon.
4 Battery and Motor:
Ola opting to go for Performance benchmarks might have exposed the design and reliability limitations of the battery and motor. Hope the Etergo folks are still there to come up with solutions.
5 Current Pricing and Future Price increase:
They may have wafer thin margins and may increase prices later. They have advantage of volumes to help them keep it viable. The projections are quite adventurous and a failure to get consistent bookings would have big implications.
6 Throttle response:
I believe this can be handled through software unless the Throttle sensors have an inherent delay. I would hazard a guess its mostly software related than hardware. Wondering what tech they have Throttle drive by wire, Cable or any other sensor driven.
99% failure prediction is too much. I am confident they will pull it off provided most of it is software and they are quick to handle mechanical issues with recall if necessary.
They can delay by a month if required and give the Media people another refined product if they have to take us into confidence. This wont definitely happen as the Investors would be breathing down their neck to show some numbers. That's how capitalism works.
If any of you is curious to know some background to this Etergo Scooter to Ola scooter transition saga, please read the below article. Feel sorry for the Etergo guys how it panned out for them. We are the beneficiaries at the end and hope the initial hard work put by these folks doesn't go to waste.
https://inc42.com/features/olas-eter...gry-investors/
Check the pics where the center stand is there and hope Ola guys provide it as an accessory. Does it affect ground clearance and Heat dissipation
![EEK!](https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/images/smilies/eek.png)