[Red Liner]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

Array I do wear mx boots - acerbis X pro V something. I meant something with a hinged ankle like the sidis you mentioned.

I wear a size 43 44 depending on boot brand so a 46 would be too big on me I think

Need that hinge to prevent lateral flex. And a stop to prevent hyper extension. 35k for a mechanical pivot

Yup, 46 is Bigfoot territory.

[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by Red Liner

On this very trail below, post this section, I had a pretty bad nasty fall and wrecked my arm. Lesson learnt, hopefully.

Hope there are no serious injuries.

BTW, those RVM's remind me of the stock ones my CT100B came with, never was a fan of the shape, which was why I'd changed them even before the odo turned 1k.

Get Well Soon, Ride Safe.
A.P.

[drt_rdr]

Originally Posted by Red Liner

For all those still considering mx boots, give this video a watch.

This guy wasn't even riding the bike. Thats how fragile our feet are.

Why go that far? Just walking on bangalore footpaths at night is dangerous enough to need hinged MX boots.

Jokes aside, the risks and benefits are obvious. Not just for shoes, but safety equipment in general. The decision just comes down to the kind of risks you're willing to live with.

I mean there's always chances that things can go very wrong even on your daily commute to work or your trip to the local grocery store on your scooter. We've all seen and heard enough of such stories but do we ever go ATGATT on our scooters to the local market to haggle for apple and aloogedde?

Safety equipment can't substitute for mental alertness, body awareness, understanding of the activity and our own abilities, and working to improve them. This is the precursor to safety equipment. Just wearing gear may even encourage more risk taking since often people come under the illusion of being very safe as long as they're underneath some stylish biking goods.

Besides, shopping for equipment becomes a trip down the rabbithole at some point and the entire activity one big moneysink. I mean is my 5000 rupee ordinary thermoplastic helmet good enough for going 50kmph on dirt? Shouldn't I get one of those 15000 rupee helmets with the MIPS liner? Or better yet, one of those 50000 rupee helmets with the molecular armor or something? And I'm supposed to replace these things every now and then.

All said, yeah, I should buy the shoes. I mean I've already spent about 2\3rds the price of my bike or more on safety equipment. Might as well spend a bit more and make it match.

[Urban_Nomad]

Originally Posted by drt_rdr

Jokes aside, the risks and benefits are obvious. Not just for shoes, but safety equipment in general. The decision just comes down to the kind of risks you're willing to live with

Safety equipment can't substitute for mental alertness, body awareness, understanding of the activity and our own abilities, and working to improve them

...one big moneysink

With any motorcycle gear that I buy, it boils down to 3 main factors besides safety (that one's a given):

- my budget
- comfort : simple definition is that when I ride, the gear must disappear from my thought and not get in the way of riding
- like you said, acceptable risk

Now take the example of what you have employed as choice of footwear for your rides - hiking boots. Ask yourself, is that acceptable risk? Parallely, take my example. I wear Mx boots but pretty basic ones. They've saved me from injuries that should have left my feet a bloody mangled mess. Think smacking your toe head on into a rock (that was covered in moss and grass and was practically invisible) at around 30ish kph. All I got was a blacked out toe nail. How do you think your hikers will fare?

Now, would a 35k rupee Tech 7 with a dual hinge, or maybe even a 45k rupee Tech 10 with an inner bootie be a better choice? Hell yes!! Do I feel I really need it? Well, not while I have these boots. They are comfortable and provide good protection

You're right about this being a major money sucking abyss, but as long as you are within the above 3 parameters, you should be ok

Example - when I was looking for a Mx helmet and shortlisted the scorpion vx16, here's what I wanted from the helmet:

- lightweight : I had seen my friends leatt 5.5 and was amazed at how light that thing was. Sub 1200 grams. I wanted that. scorpion gave me that
- safety rating - ece is fine for motogp guys. Should work for me too... check
- wanted to spend around 10k, stretchable to 15 if a really good deal on a really good helmet came along. This cost me 11.5k shipped... check

And that's it. I now have a helmet I love and wear every ride. Now would a 50k Arai be a better pick? Maybe. But why should I fret about what the higher spectrum is when i have all my boxes checked? And on a side note, my cheapo 5k fox helmet did protect my noggin when I landed straight on the left side of my head on the tarmac (this was a high side at a little over 60 kph - my latest crash)

And your example of "best protection is skill" is kinda rhetorical. Of course you should work on improving your skill. What does that have to do with gear? It's like people coming out to defend Maruti for their tin can cars saying - best safety is a safe driver. I mean c'mon

Back to boots, your hikers arent helping you mitigate any risk. The protection factor is close to zero for any offroading. If you ride dirt (and your handle suggests that you definitely do), you gotta have mx boots. Now dont go for the most expensive one. Try and look around for deals. Are if you can buy one used... there are some great deals to be had. Example - I recently came across someone selling their barely used (couple rides at best) brand spanking new Tech 7 boots for 18k. I'm very sure that with my haggling I could bring it down to 15k no doubt. But they weren't my size (size 45. I'm a 43 in alpinestars). So use your network and search around. There are great deals to be had.

But bottomline, dont live under the illusion that your current footwear will do you any good in case of an untoward incident. There is no risk mitigation here

Gotta start that off road specific riding gear thread soon. It's definitely time

[Red Liner]

I agree with urban. We seem to live in a fools paradise that nothing will ever happen to us. Its actually an alternate reality that our brain creates to ensure we don't die of anxiety and panic attacks while walking on a foot path in Bangalore.

Always buy the best gear you can afford is my mantra. I know guys who will spend a crazy amount of money on the best road tyres, exhaust, aux lights, you name it, but completely cheapen out on riding gear.

Good riding gear is also very comfortable. I do see that it adds to the overall experience of getting out there and having fun, whether it's in the dirt or on the road.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

With any motorcycle gear that I buy, it boils down to 3 main factors besides safety (that one's a given):

- my budget
- comfort : simple definition is that when I ride, the gear must disappear from my thought and not get in the way of riding
- like you said, acceptable risk

Broken a couple of metatarsals wearing the DMS's on the left once in the rains when a friend and I were racing our LB 500s in red muddy slush in the hills outside Poona and both of us went down. Funnily (not at the time) in the ditch on either side of the off-road track, both under our bikes, abusing each other furiously (in Punjabi obviously, me being a bawa and him a surd) because neither of us was able to free himself to come and pick the bike off the other.

As it happens, the left foot was twisted and pinned against the ground by the rigid footrest and all 190 kilos of Bullet on top. Was hobbling in a walking cast for 4 weeks after that.

Cheers, Doc

[drt_rdr]

Hey, how did this become about me and my hiking boots all of a sudden?

Originally Posted by Red Liner

We seem to live in a fools paradise that nothing will ever happen to us.

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

But bottomline, dont live under the illusion that your current footwear will do you any good in case of an untoward incident. There is no risk mitigation here

Don't get me wrong here, I'm neither defending my hikers nor advocating them. Just making a general statement. I've banged my shin on the footpeg while just sitting on my idling bike... and much more. My illusions have been dispelled years ago. It's just a question of practicality now. But point taken, gonna look for a pair that suits my needs.

And your example of "best protection is skill" is kinda rhetorical. Of course you should work on improving your skill. What does that have to do with gear? It's like people coming out to defend Maruti for their tin can cars saying - best safety is a safe driver. I mean c'mon

Eh? I did not say that, nor did i imply it. If i did, I would be riding around in the finest white dhotis and banians from Ramraj Textiles and some stylish kohlapuri chappals, instead of the 10 odd kilos of stuff from forcefield, klim etc.

My point was simply this: Risk mitigation is a function of more than just wearing the right safety equipment.

Safety gear is just one part of it and you are not at all safe by just wearing gear and putting basic precautions and training on the backburner. IMO, safety gear is to be treated as the last resort to save you from trouble. Your first line of defence needs to be your physical and mental faculties. Not just technique and reflexes, but also physical fitness, general awareness, and perhaps a healthy amount of fear.

Also, risk itself means different things to different people. For example:
> A novice may consider hopping off a footpath risky ("OMG, I almost lost my balance and died, good thing I was wearing my crotch armor that saved me from a fractured tailbone, but now I need to get my leaking engine case fixed, shit I'm never taking such big risks in life again"). On the other hand, a seasoned rider may consider wheelie hopping over a foot high rock and hopping back down on any given Tuesday as barely risky.

> A competition rider willingly puts himself in more risk more often than a non-competitive enthusiast. His perspective of risk is often exaggerated compared to an average guy.

> A guy riding a lighter bike tends to have more freedom compared to someone riding a heavier bike who'd undoubtedly have to stretch himself and take risks to ride the same way. Same goes for someone who rides a purpose built bike compared to riding a roadbike offroad.

A lot of risk also comes from negligence or recklessness on part of the rider. Of course I'm not gonna claim safe and preemptive riders don't make mistakes or be caught unawares by out-of-the-blue shit. But IMO, that's the eventuality that safety equipment is meant for though.

But fact of the matter is many of the risk factors can generally be lessened or nullified by training for technique and awareness.

[jaymanrides18]

Since we're on the topic of gear (or were, pardon my absence), safety features are KEY to more confident riding.
I used to have the Thor Sector Hype helmet, fairly basic mx helmet - I honestly just got it cause it looked cool (and it did) but within a year, a year and a half - the helmet's cushioning lost its grip on my face. The lid would wobble on my head and off road riding is nothing if it's wobbly.
So instead of importing the lining for this helmet, I bought something that I can replace the lining of domestically, the Scott 550. Scott has all parts shipping to India and if this were to happen again, I can just get it replaced.

I spent 12k buying an imported helmet that costs 7k now on Indian Racing Bazaar. Dumb.
I spent 15k buying a Scott helmet with MIPS and Conehead tech at a discount from the original price tag of 22k with everything replaceable AND available. Not dumb.

Now I don't have to worry about going head first through a bush cause my helmet wouldn't sweep back (I wouldn't advise that, pick a better line lol) and I don't worry about my torn ACl or my damaged ankle meniscus thanks for Leatt Z Frame braces (their cheapest) and Alpinestars Tech 7 boots which I got from Australia. Better gear inspires better riding.

Invest in better gear, it'll do you good!

[nitinkbhaskar]

So I attended the dirt riding session at Big Rock Dirt Park (Kolar Facility). Apparently, I had booked ADV riding session but due to some unforeseen circumstances that got cancelled and I had to make do with this one. However, it turned out that I was the only trainee for the day and hence I asked zillion questions without any hesitations . Also, I was able to ride the Honda CRF 230 F, which is a great little machine !!

The trainer was Bhima who has more than 5 years of experience in dirt riding. Nice folk and a great teacher. The overall training was divided into following sections:

1. Practicing at the flat course - Sitting posture, Cornering techniques, Saddling, Long vision, Elbows up etc.
2. Circuit run at the track - Implementing above techniques on the track
3. Trail ride - Going through a trail with mud/slush, gravel, big craters, huge inclines etc.
4. Circuit run replay at track - Implement the techniques on own bike (310 GS)

Some shots from the session:



Boots are provided for the training session



Bikes of the day. Impulse -> Trainer / Honda -> Trainee / 310 GS -> Own bike



Flat track to learn the basics



Revving the little Honda on track. I took off my riding jacket as it was too hot and also it was not really required. Bhima provided me the elbow pads for just in case situations



Decent track humps



Riding my own bike



Other bikes in washing bay



Funky clock within a rim



Me on the right with the trainer - Bhima

Some fun facts:

1. The property is owned by CS Santosh's father

2. Usually we service our bikes based on KMs or time interval (in months). However, the dirt bikes are serviced based on hours of operations. Apparently, majority of the bikes are service (engine oil, air filer and oil filter) after every 3 hours. Spark plugs etc are changed every 15-20 hours and engine components are replaced every 100 hours.
The Honda which I rode is more abuse friendly and is serviced post 6 hours.

3. Though the facility is owned by BRD. The trail section falls under village area and we may encounter villagers / animals. Hence, the trainees are instructed to ride slow.

Overall it was a taxing session and I was really exhausted at the end of it. Picked up the basics and now would practice them.

Only thing is where do I find a dirt playground near Whitefield to do all this ? Any pointers guys ?

[Urban_Nomad]

Was able to go exploring and found an absolutely kickass trail with a friend. Also, the xpulse rear shock install on the Duke is finally done. This setup is perfect! The stock rear would bottom out often and was very "crashy". This feels like it should have been on the bike since day one

The trail was extremely technical. My friend, who is a rally veteran and a raid podium finisher, mentioned that this trail is a lot like the first few stages of the Raid

Best Tuesday EVER!!

[ashwinprakas]

Originally Posted by nitinkbhaskar

Also, I was able to ride the Honda CRF 230 F, which is a great little machine !!

Have you ridden a ImpulZMA?

If so could you give a comparo, mostly interested to know the engine performance as the ZMA's motor was derived from the CRF230, only difference being fueling and the gearbox.

If you know more details pertaining to the carb used then it would also be of help, the ZMA is fueled by a Keihin CVK30.

[nitinkbhaskar]

Originally Posted by ashwinprakas

Have you ridden a ImpulZMA?

Unfortunately No.
I have not ridden ImpulZMA. Hence, can't be of any help to you.

[shyamg28]

Originally Posted by nitinkbhaskar

Only thing is where do I find a dirt playground near Whitefield to do all this ? Any pointers guys ?

Sounds like fun! I would love to try a session some day.

In Whitefield there is a playground I've seen people learning to drive on occasion: https://maps.app.goo.gl/eToDWcD68XpRQHqp8

Towards Kadugodi, there is this ground too: https://maps.app.goo.gl/67Y5gLpB3aju1bZg6

[nitinkbhaskar]

Though I know that we should post our pics or videos, but couldn't resist sharing this here. Let's have some thing to keep this thread going

The guys are having absolute blast in the below videos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojYKHSyw_1I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I22ncOk2tXI

P.S : Mods if this is inappropriate for this thread please delete.

[nitinkbhaskar]

Found this another gem.
This time its T7 from Yammy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDxBGc9TD4c