[Rob UK]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

Sure. And some more diligent searching will, I'm sure, throw up some more.

Question is what is mainstream. And why.
And if we accept the importance of central plug placement, where does this engine of RE stand. (I maintain that this engine will not land up with a single central plug. Do you? Pls. note the use of 'central' cam, which is what this RE engine is). Will observe its evolution. Breath will not be bated!


Actually would be great if a knowledgeable auto journalist would interview the tech team. (When hopefully they won't pull stunts like 'oil cooled engine').

Regards
Sutripta

I haven't seen much detail of the Enfield design, so I do not know where the plug is, but I suppose it would be possible to put the plug at an offset by placing it between the smaller pair of valves (exhaust side).

Even if that is the solution - why does it matter? How much difference do you believe it will make? A Ducati 1299 has a central plug, but also has a 116mm bore and revs to peak power of 205bhp at 11,500rpm. If there is enough time for the ignition flash to travel nearly 60mm to the edges of the combustion chamber on that bike at 11,500rpm, just how much difference do you think offsetting the plug in a much smaller lower revving cylinder would make? I suspect the answer is "tiny".

However, the benefits of SOHC - ability to push the engine forward in the frame to increase front wheel loading, the reduction in weight, improved weight distribution top to bottom and reduced production costs are much more likely to be tangible?

Harris Performance who Enfield bought out for R&D are not novices - they have built race engines for Yamaha and run the factory Suzuki World Superbike team. When a foreign company is good enough for 2 of the Japanese "big 4" to contract work out to them, then I am inclined to suspect they know what they are doing, but time will tell - I just want to ride one

[grplr02]

...aaanddd ... new Interceptor 650 with chrome tank spotted. RE, please make this an option!

https://www.rushlane.com/royal-enfie...-12254320.html

[tharian]

I was watching the unveil of the twins at Rider Mania 17' yesterday in Goa and the crowd was asking launch date and prices of the bikes.

Sid Lal did mention that the bikes should be out mid next year.

As for the prices he said, it will be priced in a way that the existing Enfield owners can go to the next step which is the twin and it wouldn't be 2-3 steps above the singles, in terms of price. He was referring to the 350cc bikes.

Also to note is that he mentioned that these bikes will be the exact same bikes that are sold in other markets and there won't be any changes.
The bikes are already in full production too.

[rakesh_r]

Originally Posted by tharian

I was watching the unveil of the twins at Rider Mania 17' yesterday in Goa and the crowd was asking launch date and prices of the bikes.

Sid Lal did mention that the bikes should be out mid next year.

As for the prices he said, it will be priced in a way that the existing Enfield owners can go to the next step which is the twin and it wouldn't be 2-3 steps above the singles, in terms of price. He was referring to the 350cc bikes.

Also to note is that he mentioned that these bikes will be the exact same bikes that are sold in other markets and there won't be any changes.
The bikes are already in full production too.

I did like the interceptor, the big question is why haven't they started the bikes during both the events. Why do they keep playing the video clip for the sound? Sid Lal keeps dodging the question and starts playing the clip instead. What's cooking?

[tharian]

Originally Posted by rakesh_r

I did like the interceptor, the big question is why haven't they started the bikes during both the events. Why do they keep playing the video clip for the sound? Sid Lal keeps dodging the question and starts playing the clip instead. What's cooking?

Yes, I noticed too.

Probably because these are just display bikes and not wired. He said there is no key on the bike to start it.

The fully built bikes may be on testing still.

[sukiwa]

Images from unveil of bikes at RE event, source RE website.

[ashwin1224]

Originally Posted by sukiwa

Images from unveil of bikes at RE event, source RE website...

Wow that chrome Interceptor looks AMAZING! I am sure RE wont have any problem moving these off their shelves.

[rascalangel]

Originally Posted by tharian

Yes, I noticed too.

Probably because these are just display bikes and not wired. He said there is no key on the bike to start it.

The fully built bikes may be on testing still.

Thats so lame.. I was eagerly waiting for the event hoping to hear the engines live for the first time. Bigger disappointment to the participants of the event i guess.

[naturaldisaster]

Originally Posted by tharian

I was watching the unveil of the twins at Rider Mania 17' yesterday in Goa and the crowd was asking launch date and prices of the bikes.

Sid Lal did mention that the bikes should be out mid next year.

As for the prices he said, it will be priced in a way that the existing Enfield owners can go to the next step which is the twin and it wouldn't be 2-3 steps above the singles, in terms of price. He was referring to the 350cc bikes.

Also to note is that he mentioned that these bikes will be the exact same bikes that are sold in other markets and there won't be any changes.
The bikes are already in full production too.

Though this sounds like really good news, there could be dark shadows looming. A new bike, with new technology, built the same as export bikes (which would be sold at a hefty premium,) priced 'affordable' by 350 upgrade standards in india? Why would the company want to do that?

[tharian]

Originally Posted by naturaldisaster

Though this sounds like really good news, there could be dark shadows looming. A new bike, with new technology, built the same as export bikes (which would be sold at a hefty premium,) priced 'affordable' by 350 upgrade standards in india? Why would the company want to do that?

Beats me, but who is complaining.

Maybe there are looking for numbers and not exclusivity.
I know for a fact that once their sales increased after the Classic became a hit, their priority was increasing the sales month on month.

Probably they want to give the masses a twin which no other company has managed to do.
Either ways , good for us.

[hothatchaway]

Originally Posted by tharian

As for the prices he said, it will be priced in a way that the existing Enfield owners can go to the next step which is the twin and it wouldn't be 2-3 steps above the singles, in terms of price. He was referring to the 350cc bikes.

Also to note is that he mentioned that these bikes will be the exact same bikes that are sold in other markets and there won't be any changes.
The bikes are already in full production too.

The 350cc classic is around 1.5l OTR in Bangalore. If the parallel twin isnt priced even at 2x of that, I wonder what is going to roll off the production lines. A very rough comparo - even if its not in the same category - a single cylinder R15 is around 1.4 L in Bangalore while the parallel twin R3 is ~ 3.8l when the latter does not have the same race bred deltabox frame which its smaller sibling gets, let alone the crap tyres which come with the latter.

A product needs to be priced competitively, but not at the cost of cutting every conceivable corner.

[Beco]

Originally Posted by hothatchaway

The 350cc classic is around 1.5l OTR in Bangalore. If the parallel twin isnt priced even at 2x of that, I wonder what is going to roll off the production lines. A very rough comparo - even if its not in the same category - a single cylinder R15 is around 1.4 L in Bangalore while the parallel twin R3 is ~ 3.8l when the latter does not have the same race bred deltabox frame which its smaller sibling gets, let alone the crap tyres which come with the latter.

Are R3s sold in India from CKD units? If no, then this is an interesting comparion.

The current Conti GT is priced 2.35 ex-showroom. With parallel twin and as flagship product it will be most likely not below 3.5.

With 3.5 ex-showroom, the on-road pricing will be more than 4.0 plus. Just speculating.

For a RE of such kind, personally, I'll be happy to have it under 3.5. Anything excess of 4.5 will be strict turn-off for me.

[saargoga]

Originally Posted by naturaldisaster

Though this sounds like really good news, there could be dark shadows looming. A new bike, with new technology, built the same as export bikes (which would be sold at a hefty premium,) priced 'affordable' by 350 upgrade standards in india? Why would the company want to do that?

Only thing looks new in this bike is petrol tank and engine rest of it looks to be taken straight from current Continental GT with some modifications.

An technologically simplified twin makes it case for being proportionally cheaper for production. Thus giving RE room to price it in a place that will aspire people to go a step or two higher simply to fill up volumes. One needs to look at the volumes of harley's cheapest to understand that's where RE wont be pricing it.

While continental GT was step up platform it was not significant and they are leveraging this step up by adding another step up in engine and ride style. I always see this possible anything around 3 or so will be a good place to sell in decent volumes.

Its not like adding another piston makes the production twice costlier good thing is they said it in one of the videos they understand their strong point and make it their strategy and that was to be maker of simple classic retro bikes and leverage the cheaper production cost leverage, much like what bajaj does with their bikes.

[naturaldisaster]

Originally Posted by saargoga

Only thing looks new in this bike is petrol tank and engine rest of it looks to be taken straight from current Continental GT with some modifications.

An technologically simplified twin makes it case for being proportionally cheaper for production. Thus giving RE room to price it in a place that will aspire people to go a step or two higher simply to fill up volumes. One needs to look at the volumes of harley's cheapest to understand that's where RE wont be pricing it.

While continental GT was step up platform it was not significant and they are leveraging this step up by adding another step up in engine and ride style. I always see this possible anything around 3 or so will be a good place to sell in decent volumes.

Its not like adding another piston makes the production twice costlier good thing is they said it in one of the videos they understand their strong point and make it their strategy and that was to be maker of simple classic retro bikes and leverage the cheaper production cost leverage, much like what bajaj does with their bikes.

Point about production costs noted. My fear is that they are making a common product for all markets. Let me explain:

If i make a product which costs 'X' and i sell it for 'Y' in 'Market-1' and 'Y+20' in 'Market-2'. My quantity forecasts for 'Market-1' would have to be really promising so as to stop me from selling all 'X' costing products in the 'Market-2' and making more money.

Unless... the product being sold in 'Market-1' does not cost 'X' but lesser due to parts binning. Just the case as in in current RE models (or is my opinion at least.)

Then we have common bike in all markets but the reliability in India is again

[anand.shankar]

I dont understand why many are predicting a >4L Sticker price. To start with the CGT535 is overpriced, let leave that aside for now. The Engine might be new, not really a load of new tech on it, on top of the 535, it jut gets an extra cylinder and a Piston and associated parts to run it, and may be a bigger Oil sump. No liquid cooling or LCD dash or USD fork or any unnecessary gizmos. Other than to recover whatever R&D costs, assembly line costs they have invested, there isnt much Metal or Electronics being added to the bike.

3.25L (Interceptor) - 3.5L (GT) Ex showroom sounds sensible.