[rachitagarwal]

Similar thing happened with my Suzuki Access last year. The scooter would start most of the times in a single attempt but sometimes it just refused. After numerous visits to the Service centre it came out to be some carbon deposit in the cylinder channels which carries oil to engines head. Because of lack of oil the compression wouldnt build up and hence it just refuses to start , but in my casethe kick becomes little loose and the vehicle would start after kicking like 20-25 times ! After starting the engine would run normally without sounding erratic or getting overheated so i assumed the oil was circulating properly around the piston and valves.

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by hellmet

The explanation to this from the battery guy was that even the kick is partially powered by the battery on scooters that come with push-button-start.

I mentioned this possibility to wifey and her immediate response was, "Then why does our ScootyES start always at the first kick, even though there is no battery in it?"

Set me thinking. When the battery died in the ES, we just chucked it out and never bothered putting a new one, since the kick-start was not only 100% reliable, but very easy to use too.

Anyway, I have decided to replace the battery in the Pep+ just to have a fallback option. Looked up Amaron on batterywale.com and the 24month replacement warranty model is available at Rs1239, while the 30-month model costs Rs1476. If you give the old battery, there is a further reduction of Rs100 on above prices.

[kutoos]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

We have a 2010 Scooty Pep+ that has done around 8K kms

Please don't Say it's a red color one.

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

Eg.Couple weeks back, I had to go to town for some errand. The bike started at first kick itself

When you push the button to start, does the scooty show signs of coming to life or you just hear the metallic motor noise?

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

What could be the problem here & what to look for ?
- Spark-plug issue ?
- Any impurities in fuel ?
- Anything to do with the throttle cable ?

I had the same similar experience, I own a Red 2010 Pep+ model, which is very sparingly used ( approximately 2K Kms till date). Quite frequently it refused to start using the push button and a couple of times i had to call the service guys over to my home because both the push button/Kicker did not start the vehicle.

The mechanics advised changing the bendx motor (Which i later came to know is the starter motor), You can try servicing this motor and see if it helps as it worked fine for me. I did not change the motor but asked them to service the same.

These days with two cars, the scooty is rarely used, and always i use the kick start lever to start the vehicle.

I'll be servicing this vehicle in the next month and will update you with the Gyaan i get from the TVS SA's.

Cheers

[supremeBaleno]

^^^ It is indeed a red color bike. While I am not a fan of red, Dad seems to like the color. He chose red color for the Yamaha Ray-Z also that we bought last month.

Well, the battery is 4 years old and erratic in performance. Eg. last week I used the bike a few times just to see if the not-starting issue pops up, and alternated between kick-start and button-start. And most of the time, button-start worked, except for a rare instance when it whined, but the subsequent tries brought the engine to life.

[DWind]

SB!,
Last month I had given my wife's Scooty Streak (has the same mechanicals as Pep+) for service which included replacing the battery. The earlier battery was totally gone and wifey had not used the vehicle much (she uses it for office commute but was on maternity leave for 7 months). Last week, even after change in battery the vehicle one fine day refused to start kick start or ES. The starter motor would crank but the engine would not fire-up. I tried various DIY troubleshooting on the bike including inspecting the spark plug as I did not want to push the bike from my home (Bollineni Hillside) till the nearest mechanic. Finally had to do lug it and the mechanic too tried different steps to start. The problem was due to corroded fuse contact. The fuse was fine as well and we did not suspect it first until the mechanic tried to short the contact again and engine finally cranked up. Please do check if that is the issue.

[supremeBaleno]

Thanks, DWind. Will have a look at the fuse-contacts for any corrosion.

Last weekend being a long 3-day one, I had a good chance to check out the bike myself. Took it out for some short errands (5-6 kms) in the neighborhood and no issues at all with starting (kick and button-start). Neither did the bike switch off while running or had any issues with accelerating. Wifey was not amused by the bike behaving as if it has no issues.

Then on Friday evening, I have to ride down to Kollam town (7km away) and take the Pep+. Have done just about a km when the engine switches off - just like that.
Kick start brings it back to life, but seems a little lethargic - so I accelerate while keeping the rear brake engaged & it seems to become ok, only to switch off a 100m away.
My confidence is gone now and I return home and take the CBR instead.

Meanwhile the beep-warning (for side-stand engaged) remained on continously and was becoming a pain. The mechanic pulled at some wire near the side-stand which silenced the beep - now does not come on even when side-stand is engaged, but better than being on always.

[supremeBaleno]

A long-pending update :
The OE battery was on its last legs and even after a charge-cycle, it was not fully reliable. So, in end-Nov, I finally exchange it for a new Amaron battery and since then there have been no issues with the Pep+ (thankfully). Wifey is happy that the push-button start works flawlessly. No issues with engine switching off by itself or anything.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

A long-pending update :
The OE battery was on its last legs and even after a charge-cycle, it was not fully reliable. So, in end-Nov, I finally exchange it for a new Amaron battery and since then there have been no issues with the Pep+ (thankfully). Wifey is happy that the push-button start works flawlessly. No issues with engine switching off by itself or anything.

That's good news for the Pep+.

How much did the battery cost and what rating did you get??

[supremeBaleno]

It was the 5Ah Amaron ABR-PR-12APBTX50 and cost Rs1200 (with the old battery given to them).
For 0-24 months, there is free replacement warranty. For 25-48 months there is Pro-rata warranty on buying a replacement.

[hellmet]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

A long-pending update :
The OE battery was on its last legs and even after a charge-cycle, it was not fully reliable. So, in end-Nov, I finally exchange it for a new Amaron battery and since then there have been no issues with the Pep+ (thankfully). Wifey is happy that the push-button start works flawlessly. No issues with engine switching off by itself or anything.

Well, I told you so

[supremeBaleno]

^^^Yes, you did. And for some 4 months all was well. And then again started having issues with the engine just dying without any reason or warning. After that it would start, but feel like engine will die anytime. In such situations, wifey says she will ride very slowly without accelerating and would be OK. I, on the other hand, would accelerate hard, while simultaneously grabbing the brakes and would be OK.

Anyway, mentioned this to the mechanic while getting it serviced and he said it is the spark-plug to blame. Replaced it and since then (a week ago), things are again OK.

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

Anyway, mentioned this to the mechanic while getting it serviced and he said it is the spark-plug to blame. Replaced it and since then (a week ago), things are again OK.

I guess I spoke too early. After the spark-plug change and service, things were OK for few weeks, after which the issue recurred - once when my wife was riding and couple of times with me.

Issue sequence as below :
1) You are riding along and suddenly the engine dies. Just like that.
2) You try the electric-starter and engine does not come to life.
3) Try the kick-start, engine comes on, but will die immediately.

After this, what I do is revv the engine with brakes pressed and ride back home. If I reduce the accelerator input, it feels like the engine will again switch off. Not only is it counter-productive to revv & brake at the same time, it is bad riding.

In contrast, what my wife says she does in such a situation is : Kick start the bike, ride slowly (without revving the engine) & limp back home. Will try this & see the next time the bike dies.

The odd thing is that there is no knowing when this issue will happen. And no way to replicate it for the mechanic.

For a bike that is just a few years old and done only about 10K kms, it's a pain to see such issues. In contrast, my CD-100 was trouble-free for so many years, needing only an engine-oil change every 3K kms. Nothing like the Japs when it comes to a reliable and trouble-free experience.

[supremeBaleno]

From an occasional annoyance, this issue (mentioned in previous post) became all too frequent. So much that my wife was exasperated enough to ask to have the bike thrown away and a better one brought in as replacement.

So back to the mechanic last weekend. This time he did 2 things (listing for anyone who has similar issue) :
- increased the idling rpm. Not too much, but a wee bit (to address the engine dying issue I guess)
- tightened the battery terminals (to possibly address the issue with electric starter not working, while kick-start does).

And asked to come back if the issue still persists. Given that the issue has not yet been seen in the 3 days since, that was possibly the best Rs20 I spent in a long time.

P.S.: My wife "thinks" or rather is sure that the issue is due to the Accelerator cable. While I don't know if this is true, I would like to get the cable changed. For a different reason though - does not feel smooth, needs effort to wring the handle.

[ArizonaJim]

When an engine is running happily along and it suddenly dies, most often, the cause is an electrical issue.
Any connector in an electrical circuit can become loose or corroded and if this happens it often will work just fine and suddenly will quit.
The slightest vibration can cause a loose or corroded connection to stop conducting power or to re-establish conductivity and work fine (for the moment).

It might be a good idea to check (once again) the fuses and their connections. In fact, it might be best to just replace all of the fuses with new ones. (The new fuses must be the same amperage rating as the old ones.) I have seen several examples of fuses that looked good but they had an internal break that sometimes carried electricity and sometimes would quit.

Check the electrical connectors where the wiring harness plugs into the ignition switch by moving them. They should be tight and resist movement. If they are easy to move, unplug them and then plug them back in. That will often create a new, clean contact between the wire and the terminal.

Also, check the wires that are connecting any part of the engine to the rest of the scooter. A loose or corroded connection at any of these (assuming there are more than one) can cause the problem your seeing.

Batteries will slowly discharge even when they are not being used. It also takes some time to recharge them so, when you get your scooter running in a trustworthy manner I suggest that you take it for a few long rides. A 5 km ride is not long enough to really recharge the battery.

Good luck.

[supremeBaleno]

Thanks, ArizonaJim !!!
Your suggestion of checking the fuses, cconnections, connectors makes sense. Will add it to my to-do list.

Regarding doing long rides to get the battery charged, I did not see much scope till yesterday. But today had to travel some 40kms and since I was alone did not want to take the car and thought of opting for PTS. Then remembered this and went on the Scooty.

No engine-dying all through the 40km journey, though it seemed at times like the engine was not smooth. With today being a holiday, traffic was sparse and I puttered along at 50kmph, occasionally going to 60kmph after which the speedo shows redline. As mentioned earlier, it is not easy/smooth to wring the accelerator - is this something a change in A-cable will fix or just some oiling somewhere is enough ?

BTW the 30km highway and 10km state-highway journey took me the same 50 odd mins that it takes via car or my CBR250, which shows how big a leveller bad/narrow roads and traffic can be. A Sumo overtook me at speed at start of the journey and some 20kms later, I pulled alongside it.