[b16h22]

Originally Posted by scarecrow

@ b16h22 - one note a caution - one good mechanic in Pune who services my bike mentioned that the EBC brake pads will wear out your disc faster as its more coarse. When i mentioned about the EBC brake pads, he suggested to wait for the new brake pads i.e. in the 2016 version as these are supposed to have been improved + the squealing issue has been eliminated.

Still awaiting the new part stocks to check this out in person though.

Yes, I'm aware of that. These pads are much more resistant to fade and harder than stock pad material. It'll eat up the rotors much faster

[nasirkaka]

continuing on the brake topic, When i switched from classic 500 to 390, i was so so happy with how the duke braked. Now at 34000 kms the brakes dont inspire such confidence. This feeling is further re-enforced as i have been riding the versys 650 for last few days and in comparison the 390's brakes feel like wood. Could it be matter of old and now? If i remember correctly, last service is when the pads where replaced. What other alternatives i can look at? I am due for next service soon and would like to improve on the braking part. Also, which is a decent adjustable levers brand i can go for?

Another question: i feel my 390 is become very rough with lots of clatter from the engine and requires an overhaul. Which would be a good and reliable place in Bangalore where i can get the overhauling done? All the services have been done at Autoservice so far.

[timuseravan]

Originally Posted by nasirkaka

continuing on the brake topic, When i switched from classic 500 to 390, i was so so happy with how the duke braked. Now at 34000 kms the brakes dont inspire such confidence. This feeling is further re-enforced as i have been riding the versys 650 for last few days and in comparison the 390's brakes feel like wood. Could it be matter of old and now? If i remember correctly, last service is when the pads where replaced. What other alternatives i can look at? I am due for next service soon and would like to improve on the braking part. Also, which is a decent adjustable levers brand i can go for?

Another question: i feel my 390 is become very rough with lots of clatter from the engine and requires an overhaul. Which would be a good and reliable place in Bangalore where i can get the overhauling done? All the services have been done at Autoservice so far.

Are you sure an Engine overhaul is needed at just 34k km?
Has your chain/sprocket been replaced recently? I noticed a big difference in clatter after replacing the chain.

Regarding the brake, the first culprit is bake pads. But if they have been replaced, you can try for master cylinder rebuild?

[ArizonaJim]

Originally Posted by nasirkaka

continuing on the brake topic, When i switched from classic 500 to 390, i was so so happy with how the duke braked. Now at 34000 kms the brakes dont inspire such confidence. This feeling is further re-enforced as i have been riding the versys 650 for last few days and in comparison the 390's brakes feel like wood. Could it be matter of old and now? If i remember correctly, last service is when the pads where replaced. What other alternatives i can look at? I am due for next service soon and would like to improve on the braking part. Also, which is a decent adjustable levers brand i can go for?

Another question...

You did not say how many km you have traveled on your 390 after the brake pads were replaced (assuming they have been changed).

If you haven't ridden very far using the new pads, perhaps they haven't truly broken in yet.

Some people (and mechanics) seem to think installing new brake pads is simply a matter of popping out the old and inserting the new and saying the job is done.

While changing pads is relatively easy there are a few things that must be done before saying the job was done right.

First, the brake pads as received from the factory need to have the wear surface lightly sanded to remove all of the "factory new" finish that is often present. This should be done before the pads are installed.

Second, the faces of the brake disk need to be roughened a bit to remove the glaze that has developed on them.

Take a good look at both sides of the brake disk on your motorcycle.
If it is shiny with light circular irregularities on it, it cannot "wear in" the new brake pads so they will conform to its exact shape.

Until the surfaces of the pads do conform exactly to the surfaces of the disk, the braking will be minimal.

To correct this condition, find some really rough sandpaper.
Using this sandpaper, sand both faces of the disk using a "towards the axle", "away from the axle" motion.
When you finish, both sides of the disk will have some very noticeable scratches extending entirely across the faces.

If you have new brake pads, this is actually a good thing and don't worry. After riding a few hundred km, the scratches will be worn away.

What is more important, the scratches will lightly wear the faces of the pads so that they will not have their factory finish and they will shape themselves to exactly conform to the shape of the disk.

While your busy sanding the disk faces, it is a good idea to thoroughly wash both of them with disk brake cleaner. If you don't have any disk brake cleaner, rubbing alcohol or better yet, denatured alcohol can be used.

Under NO CIRCUMSTANCES should you use petrol, diesel fuel, coal oil or any fluid that might contain any type of oil like material to clean the disk.

While your washing the disk faces, rotate the wheel so that some of the alcohol will cover the brake pad faces.

By removing all traces of any lubricant that may be on the disk or pads you will greatly increase the brakes ability to stop the motorcycle.

[nasirkaka]

Originally Posted by timuseravan

Are you sure an Engine overhaul is needed at just 34k km?
Has your chain/sprocket been replaced recently? I noticed a big difference in clatter after replacing the chain.

Regarding the brake, the first culprit is bake pads. But if they have been replaced, you can try for master cylinder rebuild?

By overhaul i meant a thorough inspection of the engine and replace parts if necessary. There is lot of clatter from the engine which i cannot differentiate and need an expert to diagnose. To my untrained ear, it does not sound like slapping, also not smoke, etc from the engine, so i guess piston,rings, cylinder should be ok, however not sure. Could it be the valves? The LHS side cover was opened a couple of time to replace and re-work on the rotor coil, since then the bike is been somewhat different. Not as crisp as the days before that. So need an expert who can spend some quality time on the bike and get to the bottom of issues. Can can afford to stay away from the bike for longer time, if required, as i have got another bike.
Am running on 2nd set of chain and sprocket, cant recollect exactly when the first was replaced, but its surely been a while. I try and take good care of the chain, cleaning, lubing and adjusting it regularly.

You did not say how many km you have traveled on your 390 after the brake pads were replaced (assuming they have been changed).

Thanks Jim, Brake pads are surely not new and i am not really sure if it was replaced during last service about 6000 kms back. I have a feeling the rear was replaced, not sure though. Will try and relook at the brake pads keeping all the points you have suggested. need to locate a good service place where people listen to customers, else usually its very run-of-the-mill at regular authorized service place.

Will check with Greasehouse from indimotard.

[timuseravan]

Originally Posted by nasirkaka

By overhaul i meant a thorough inspection of the engine and replace parts if necessary. There is lot of clatter from the engine which i cannot differentiate and need an expert to diagnose. To my untrained ear, it does not sound like slapping, also not smoke, etc from the engine, so i guess piston,rings, cylinder should be ok, however not sure. Could it be the valves? The LHS side cover was opened a couple of time to replace and re-work on the rotor coil, since then the bike is been somewhat different. Not as crisp as the days before that. So need an expert who can spend some quality time on the bike and get to the bottom of issues. Can can afford to stay away from the bike for longer time, if required, as i have got another bike.
Am running on 2nd set of chain and sprocket, cant recollect exactly when the first was replaced, but its surely been a while. I try and take good care of the chain, cleaning, lubing and adjusting it regularly.

My SVC recommends to replace the chain and sprocket every 12-15k km. I too take good care of the chain but after 15k km the chain stretch is too much at too many places to be able to adjust accurately.
I would suggest to go for chain replacement and then see if the clatter persists. My bike runs much smoother post the replacement.

[gthang]

Originally Posted by nasirkaka

390's brakes feel like wood. Could it be matter of old and now? If i remember correctly, last service is when the pads where replaced.

Hi there.

If you are able to brake, but just feels less efficient, and no feedback, chances are you have a hydraulic fluid issue.

Any water/air ingress and/or brake dust contamination will alter the ideal non-compressible hydraulic system.

You will be able to build pressure, but the compressible contaminants will take away the feel.

I would recommend a brake fluid flush, which is usually the cheapest fix, first.

Cheers

Ride Safe.

[Urban_Nomad]

Originally Posted by gthang

If you are able to brake, but just feels less efficient, and no feedback, chances are you have a hydraulic fluid issue.

Absolutely agreed! For most of us, brake fluid is a fill it, shut it forget it affair

Depending on your riding, changing brake fluid should be an annual affair at least. I too was experiencing some sponginess in brakes and a flush pretty much set it right. Great way for noobs like me to get their beak wet with the DIY stuff too

[ff1609]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

Hey bud. Glad the new pads are working out for you. But they are quite steep @ 1800 INR. OEM ones cost like 2-300 bucks I think

You are right, they used to cost 2-300 bucks, Bajaj has recently increased prices for most KTM spares and the front pads now cost Rs. 720. RVMs also cost twice as much as they used to.

[unk9ja]

Sometime ago, a couple of Bhpians had approached me for the paddock stand which was rolled out by an admin in the Kriegers group of Bangalore chapter and was put up here. A couple of Bhpians have off late contacted him for the paddock stand due to which this post has come up.

The fabricator who had extended his support has shut shop and has relocated in search a greener pasture, hence it is now impossible for the man to support the group with any requests. So he has shared his drawing and some snaps which might help us in a long way if someone decides to use the DIY method.

I am enclosing the photos and the drawing herewith for anyone who wish to do it themselves. The credit for this goes entirely to the good soul who does not want to be addressed here.

[b16h22]

Rode a 2015 dec D390 today. Honestly i was not expecting it to be this much different from my 13 dec model. Everything has a light feel to it. The engine note was much quieter, vibrations were negligible, and amazingly light clutch action. But it lacked a bit of enthusiasm in first gear acceleration.
But now my suspicions about my front brakes being not up to the mark is making sense. The 15 bike has a ridiculously less lever travel compared to mine. The bite was comparable but in my bike the levers touch my fingers under full braking. Last time i told the svc to bleed the system they made it even worse.

[ArizonaJim]

It really sounds like the brakes on your '13 motorcycle need to have the brakes properly bled. Notice the word "properly".

For the brakes to be at their best, every tiny bubble of air must be removed from the system. Just one small bubble of air can and will compress as the fluid pressure increases and result in a spongy, squishy feeling on the brake lever as well as causing the lever to move much further than it should when you brake.

With regular motorcycles without ABS this is a rather straight forward process.
Add fluid to the master cylinder. Attach a piece of clear vinyl tubing to the bleed valve on the caliper and put the open end of it below the surface of some brake fluid in a cup or jar. This prevents air from re-entering the hydraulic area.

Then, slightly open the bleed valve on the brake caliper no more than one turn after applying pressure to the brake lever. Close the bleed valve and release the pressure on the brake lever.
(If you did as I suggested and put the bleed tube below the fluid level in a cup or glass, you can eliminate closing the bleed valve before releasing the brake lever.)

Keep an eye on the fluid level in the master cylinder and refill it often. It must always have at least 10mm (or more) of fluid in it to prevent sucking air into the system.

This needs to be repeated until all traces of air (as seen in the lower vinyl tubing) have been removed from the system and it will often take at least 2 master cylinder fillings to totally flush out all of the air.

The ABS brake system adds a bit of difficulty to the process.

Because the ABS "pump" is added and it is a part of the hydraulic system, air can find its way into the area at the piston on the pump.

This branch to the pump is not in a direct line between the master cylinder and the brake caliper so if any air at all has found its way into this ABS area it can be difficult to get out.

There is no special process here except to say, a vacuum pump designed to bleed brake systems does a better job than the hand lever squeezing method described above.

All is not lost with the hand lever method though. Just plan on pumping at least 3 master cylinder fluid fillings thru the system. Four or five fillings is even better.

When you think your done, tighten the bleed valve, fill the master cylinder and try the brake lever.

If it feels hard and does not compress, your done.
If it still feels spongy and has a lot of travel, start over and bleed the system again. Chances are, the ABS branch of the hydraulic system still has some air in it.

I have seen mentioned that some ABS systems require a computer hook up to reset them after bleeding.
This may be true or not true. I cannot say.
I can say one thing about it though.

If all of the trapped air in the system is removed, the brake lever will be firm without any spongy feeling. Lack of some computer re-calibration will not change this.
The anti-lock feature might not work but the brakes should work as well as the day they were made for normal riding.

Other things to keep in mind:

Cleanliness is an absolute necessity. The smallest speck of dirt can cause a total failure of the brake system if it gets into the fluid or the master cylinder.

NEVER shake the fluid container before or during the time you are adding fluid. Shaking the fluid can introduce air molecules into the fluid and these will become bubbles later. Any bubbles will get you back to zero and you will need to re-bled again.

Use NEW fluid of the correct type. Old fluid will often absorb moisture out of the air and this can corrode the aluminum parts.

You can mix type 3 and type 4 fluid without harm but leave the type 5 fluids on the shelf unless your brake system says to use it.

Protect ALL painted surfaces. Brake fluid is an excellent paint remover and a drop can quickly eat away your motorcycles paint.

[alias]

hi Team,

has anyone tried speed 97 on Duke 390 and if yes what are the effects.

Regards,

[Kameshwar]

Originally Posted by b16h22

Rode a 2015 dec D390 today. Honestly i was not expecting it to be this much different from my 13 dec model. Everything has a light feel to it. The engine note was much quieter, vibrations were negligible, and amazingly light clutch action. But it lacked a bit of enthusiasm in first gear acceleration.
But now my suspicions about my front brakes being not up to the mark is making sense. The 15 bike has a ridiculously less lever travel compared to mine. The bite was comparable but in my bike the levers touch my fingers under full braking. Last time i told the svc to bleed the system they made it even worse.

If you are in or around Pune, I recommend speaking to Rohan at marketyard KTM. The guys over there are very good with service if you communicate what you want clearly with them. Try this out if you are close by or visiting Pune.

[Kameshwar]

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